Universal Healthcare - will not work in the US

[Brain357]

You can move. We can do it all day, but you are losing. A sick person cant do their plumbing, probably can’t work, maybe can’t eat. The base to do most things is being healthy. Your comparisons are silly.

Move? Sell my house and move? How long does that take? No. I have to pay for someone to come and fix the heat immediately and fix the plumbing immediately. Those who are sick CAN get care. No hospitals ever deny care.

And they can go bankrupt too. Those uninsured help increase costs for everyone else, I want people to be healthy so they can take care of themselves. So they can work.

If they work they can get insurance through their employer or through the ACA.

If they can afford it. And thats a big if in this country. Many working can’t.

And those we should help. Why throw 150mil who can afford it off their plans? Also why can I not get free plumbing? Without heat I can die in the winter time?

Choose to rent and they will handle your plumbing,

 

[Richard-H]

The primary problem with healthcare in the U.S. is the cost.

1. Medical Professionals, especially Doctors, are charging WAY out of scale for their services as compared with the average American incomes.
2. The cost of prescription drugs is outrageous.
3. The cost of Medical equipment is outrageous.
4. The cost of Malpractice insurance is outrageous due to frivolous lawsuits
5. Healthcare insurance profits & administrative costs is outrageous.
6. The quality of healthcare is mediocre for the majority of Americans
7. The cost of medical education is outrageous.

I'm the first to say that doctors SHOULD be the highest paid people in our society. They should enjoy the best quality of life our society can provide, but when they have to compete against billionaires - corp execs & financial industry managers - that give themselves outrageous salaries & bonuses - for luxury items, doctors feel that it's justified to charge what are outrageous prices for their services. The more grossly overpaid people there are the higher the cost of luxury items.

Anyway, until the free market finds some way to correct these 7 issues, we will have on ongoing economic crisis caused by the entire healthcare industry - not just the insurance companies.

I doubt that we will have any other alternative except socialization.

You made my point in the OP. You just bored us to death doing it.

No. I contradicted your OP.

Sorry if you don't have the attention span to read a whole 4 paragraphs.

 

[Brain357]

Our system sucks and repubs have nothing to offer. We will likely get universal healthcare eventually. Other countries have shown it can be much cheaper.

That comment is simply stupid.

If it were cheaper...we'd be there.

There is no question it is cheaper. Our healthcare is the most expensive in the world.

It is the best in the world. I agree that our system is broken because of numerous administrator costs and such.

We don’t rank the best. But the care is good, the cost is huge. I’m open to ideas. But markets don’t work for healthcare. So universal seems to be the only answer.

Actually, markets do work for healthcare. Not every doctor is just as competent, not every treatment is just as tremendous for every illness. Considering the facts that medical equipment and tremendous doctors are limited resources, how would you suggest rationing them?

In a "universal" system, where everyone has the same coverage and there is no private coverage, how do you determine who gets to have their surgery done by the Harvey Cushings or Ben Carsons of America, and who has to go to see the Nick Rivieras and Vincent Boombatzes?

Markets do not work. Nobody in an ambulance has ever called around for the best deal.

 

[Richard-H]

Wrong again. That is OUR problem.

If you feel it's a problem now, you're in for a truly fun time.
Bloomberg - Are you a robot?

Ummm, You do know your article only reinforces the data that shows Medicare for All would be cheaper than our current system.

You did read your own link, right?

Cheaper for whom? Not for me. My insurance is very good and very affordable. Get out of this thread with your noise pollution.

My insurance is included in my taxes. I pay NOTHING out of pocket, except an annual copay of $100 for drugs. If I'm poor, I can even apply to have that waived.

Yep, life is wonderful in Canada...dumbass.
'Free' Health Care in Canada Costs More Than It's Worth

Canada is a Democracy. If Canadian healthcare is so terrible, why don't the Canadian people choose to privatize it?

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

Move? Sell my house and move? How long does that take? No. I have to pay for someone to come and fix the heat immediately and fix the plumbing immediately. Those who are sick CAN get care. No hospitals ever deny care.

And they can go bankrupt too. Those uninsured help increase costs for everyone else, I want people to be healthy so they can take care of themselves. So they can work.

If they work they can get insurance through their employer or through the ACA.

If they can afford it. And thats a big if in this country. Many working can’t.

And those we should help. Why throw 150mil who can afford it off their plans? Also why can I not get free plumbing? Without heat I can die in the winter time?

Choose to rent and they will handle your plumbing,

Choose a strong employer and they will cover your insurance. Hell, I hear Home Depot has very good insurance.

Next....

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

The primary problem with healthcare in the U.S. is the cost.

1. Medical Professionals, especially Doctors, are charging WAY out of scale for their services as compared with the average American incomes.
2. The cost of prescription drugs is outrageous.
3. The cost of Medical equipment is outrageous.
4. The cost of Malpractice insurance is outrageous due to frivolous lawsuits
5. Healthcare insurance profits & administrative costs is outrageous.
6. The quality of healthcare is mediocre for the majority of Americans
7. The cost of medical education is outrageous.

I'm the first to say that doctors SHOULD be the highest paid people in our society. They should enjoy the best quality of life our society can provide, but when they have to compete against billionaires - corp execs & financial industry managers - that give themselves outrageous salaries & bonuses - for luxury items, doctors feel that it's justified to charge what are outrageous prices for their services. The more grossly overpaid people there are the higher the cost of luxury items.

Anyway, until the free market finds some way to correct these 7 issues, we will have on ongoing economic crisis caused by the entire healthcare industry - not just the insurance companies.

I doubt that we will have any other alternative except socialization.

You made my point in the OP. You just bored us to death doing it.

No. I contradicted your OP.

Sorry if you don't have the attention span to read a whole 4 paragraphs.

Nope. You did not. You said MDs should be the highest paid people. We agree. Under UH that would not be the case.

Run along now, loser.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

That comment is simply stupid.

If it were cheaper...we'd be there.

There is no question it is cheaper. Our healthcare is the most expensive in the world.

It is the best in the world. I agree that our system is broken because of numerous administrator costs and such.

We don’t rank the best. But the care is good, the cost is huge. I’m open to ideas. But markets don’t work for healthcare. So universal seems to be the only answer.

Actually, markets do work for healthcare. Not every doctor is just as competent, not every treatment is just as tremendous for every illness. Considering the facts that medical equipment and tremendous doctors are limited resources, how would you suggest rationing them?

In a "universal" system, where everyone has the same coverage and there is no private coverage, how do you determine who gets to have their surgery done by the Harvey Cushings or Ben Carsons of America, and who has to go to see the Nick Rivieras and Vincent Boombatzes?

Markets do not work. Nobody in an ambulance has ever called around for the best deal.

And many ambulance companies are going out of business for that reason. System is broken. They have to pick you up but you don't have to pay them.

 

[Polishprince]

That comment is simply stupid.

If it were cheaper...we'd be there.

There is no question it is cheaper. Our healthcare is the most expensive in the world.

It is the best in the world. I agree that our system is broken because of numerous administrator costs and such.

We don’t rank the best. But the care is good, the cost is huge. I’m open to ideas. But markets don’t work for healthcare. So universal seems to be the only answer.

Actually, markets do work for healthcare. Not every doctor is just as competent, not every treatment is just as tremendous for every illness. Considering the facts that medical equipment and tremendous doctors are limited resources, how would you suggest rationing them?

In a "universal" system, where everyone has the same coverage and there is no private coverage, how do you determine who gets to have their surgery done by the Harvey Cushings or Ben Carsons of America, and who has to go to see the Nick Rivieras and Vincent Boombatzes?

Markets do not work. Nobody in an ambulance has ever called around for the best deal.

Most medical care isn't done on an emergency basis. Most of the time you call for an appointment at a mutually convenient time.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

If you feel it's a problem now, you're in for a truly fun time.
Bloomberg - Are you a robot?

Ummm, You do know your article only reinforces the data that shows Medicare for All would be cheaper than our current system.

You did read your own link, right?

Cheaper for whom? Not for me. My insurance is very good and very affordable. Get out of this thread with your noise pollution.

My insurance is included in my taxes. I pay NOTHING out of pocket, except an annual copay of $100 for drugs. If I'm poor, I can even apply to have that waived.

Yep, life is wonderful in Canada...dumbass.
'Free' Health Care in Canada Costs More Than It's Worth

Canada is a Democracy. If Canadian healthcare is so terrible, why don't the Canadian people choose to privatize it?

The wealthy in Canada use private health. The middle class and poor just live with it and bitch.

 

[Thinker101]

If you feel it's a problem now, you're in for a truly fun time.
Bloomberg - Are you a robot?

Ummm, You do know your article only reinforces the data that shows Medicare for All would be cheaper than our current system.

You did read your own link, right?

Cheaper for whom? Not for me. My insurance is very good and very affordable. Get out of this thread with your noise pollution.

My insurance is included in my taxes. I pay NOTHING out of pocket, except an annual copay of $100 for drugs. If I'm poor, I can even apply to have that waived.

Yep, life is wonderful in Canada...dumbass.
'Free' Health Care in Canada Costs More Than It's Worth

Canada is a Democracy. If Canadian healthcare is so terrible, why don't the Canadian people choose to privatize it?

Don't know, don't care, I don't live in Canada.

 

[Richard-H]

That comment is simply stupid.

If it were cheaper...we'd be there.

There is no question it is cheaper. Our healthcare is the most expensive in the world.

It is the best in the world. I agree that our system is broken because of numerous administrator costs and such.

We don’t rank the best. But the care is good, the cost is huge. I’m open to ideas. But markets don’t work for healthcare. So universal seems to be the only answer.

Actually, markets do work for healthcare. Not every doctor is just as competent, not every treatment is just as tremendous for every illness. Considering the facts that medical equipment and tremendous doctors are limited resources, how would you suggest rationing them?

In a "universal" system, where everyone has the same coverage and there is no private coverage, how do you determine who gets to have their surgery done by the Harvey Cushings or Ben Carsons of America, and who has to go to see the Nick Rivieras and Vincent Boombatzes?

Markets do not work. Nobody in an ambulance has ever called around for the best deal.

Exactly. People with serious health are in no position to 'shop around' for the best deal. The healthcare industry takes advantage of these people.

Instead of the usual competitive pricing, the healthcare industry uses 'Sticky pricing'!

 

[Polishprince]

If you feel it's a problem now, you're in for a truly fun time.
Bloomberg - Are you a robot?

Ummm, You do know your article only reinforces the data that shows Medicare for All would be cheaper than our current system.

You did read your own link, right?

Cheaper for whom? Not for me. My insurance is very good and very affordable. Get out of this thread with your noise pollution.

My insurance is included in my taxes. I pay NOTHING out of pocket, except an annual copay of $100 for drugs. If I'm poor, I can even apply to have that waived.

Yep, life is wonderful in Canada...dumbass.
'Free' Health Care in Canada Costs More Than It's Worth

Canada is a Democracy. If Canadian healthcare is so terrible, why don't the Canadian people choose to privatize it?

Once a system is set up like this, it is very difficult to disassemble. Even O'care, which is a limited socialized medicine scheme is like a bad penny as people start depending on the new, wasteful bureaucracy for jobs.

 

[Richard-H]

Ummm, You do know your article only reinforces the data that shows Medicare for All would be cheaper than our current system.

You did read your own link, right?

Cheaper for whom? Not for me. My insurance is very good and very affordable. Get out of this thread with your noise pollution.

My insurance is included in my taxes. I pay NOTHING out of pocket, except an annual copay of $100 for drugs. If I'm poor, I can even apply to have that waived.

Yep, life is wonderful in Canada...dumbass.
'Free' Health Care in Canada Costs More Than It's Worth

Canada is a Democracy. If Canadian healthcare is so terrible, why don't the Canadian people choose to privatize it?

Don't know, don't care, I don't live in Canada.

Then you shouldn't be part of this discussion.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

There is no question it is cheaper. Our healthcare is the most expensive in the world.

It is the best in the world. I agree that our system is broken because of numerous administrator costs and such.

We don’t rank the best. But the care is good, the cost is huge. I’m open to ideas. But markets don’t work for healthcare. So universal seems to be the only answer.

Actually, markets do work for healthcare. Not every doctor is just as competent, not every treatment is just as tremendous for every illness. Considering the facts that medical equipment and tremendous doctors are limited resources, how would you suggest rationing them?

In a "universal" system, where everyone has the same coverage and there is no private coverage, how do you determine who gets to have their surgery done by the Harvey Cushings or Ben Carsons of America, and who has to go to see the Nick Rivieras and Vincent Boombatzes?

Markets do not work. Nobody in an ambulance has ever called around for the best deal.

Exactly. People with serious health are in no position to 'shop around' for the best deal. The healthcare industry takes advantage of these people.

Instead of the usual competitive pricing, the healthcare industry uses 'Sticky pricing'!

Not necessarily. They rely on insurance reimbursement rates. I prefer free markets.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

Cheaper for whom? Not for me. My insurance is very good and very affordable. Get out of this thread with your noise pollution.

My insurance is included in my taxes. I pay NOTHING out of pocket, except an annual copay of $100 for drugs. If I'm poor, I can even apply to have that waived.

Yep, life is wonderful in Canada...dumbass.
'Free' Health Care in Canada Costs More Than It's Worth

Canada is a Democracy. If Canadian healthcare is so terrible, why don't the Canadian people choose to privatize it?

Don't know, don't care, I don't live in Canada.

Then you shouldn't be part of this discussion.

LOL - you don't get to make this choice.

 

[Mindful]

Many bills from people you don’t know.

Many cheaper healthcare systems are ranked very well for service.

When push comes to shove the wealthy from other countries come here when they have a serious medical issues. Why is that do you think?

Didn’t rand Paul just go to Canada? I hear of our rich traveling to other countries all the time.

Did he? Canada is basically the 51st state. They don't have to pay for a military because they have us. I work with many from Canada who HATE their system due to long lag times to see a doctor.

Yes he did.

The Canadians I know prefer theirs. Much cheaper.

Then why if a Canadian needs a treatment, they come to the United States? Canadian Alex Trebec is suffering from pancreatic cancer, and is being treated here in America. As a senior subject, he'd still be waiting for his first appointment if he went to Saskatoon.

English people are known for seeking treatment in the United States, that just doesn't exist in the UK. And also doctors in the US, who are willing to "take the risk".

 

[Richard-H]

Ummm, You do know your article only reinforces the data that shows Medicare for All would be cheaper than our current system.

You did read your own link, right?

Cheaper for whom? Not for me. My insurance is very good and very affordable. Get out of this thread with your noise pollution.

My insurance is included in my taxes. I pay NOTHING out of pocket, except an annual copay of $100 for drugs. If I'm poor, I can even apply to have that waived.

Yep, life is wonderful in Canada...dumbass.
'Free' Health Care in Canada Costs More Than It's Worth

Canada is a Democracy. If Canadian healthcare is so terrible, why don't the Canadian people choose to privatize it?

Once a system is set up like this, it is very difficult to disassemble. Even O'care, which is a limited socialized medicine scheme is like a bad penny as people start depending on the new, wasteful bureaucracy for jobs.

If the Soviet Union could be desocialized, certainly the Canadian Healthcare system can be - EXCEPT for the fact that the Canadian people are very happy with it.

 

[Thinker101]

Cheaper for whom? Not for me. My insurance is very good and very affordable. Get out of this thread with your noise pollution.

My insurance is included in my taxes. I pay NOTHING out of pocket, except an annual copay of $100 for drugs. If I'm poor, I can even apply to have that waived.

Yep, life is wonderful in Canada...dumbass.
'Free' Health Care in Canada Costs More Than It's Worth

Canada is a Democracy. If Canadian healthcare is so terrible, why don't the Canadian people choose to privatize it?

Don't know, don't care, I don't live in Canada.

Then you shouldn't be part of this discussion.

This thread pertains to universal healthcare in the U.S., not in Canada. If Canada is used as an example then Canada is on the table. So...STFU.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

Cheaper for whom? Not for me. My insurance is very good and very affordable. Get out of this thread with your noise pollution.

My insurance is included in my taxes. I pay NOTHING out of pocket, except an annual copay of $100 for drugs. If I'm poor, I can even apply to have that waived.

Yep, life is wonderful in Canada...dumbass.
'Free' Health Care in Canada Costs More Than It's Worth

Canada is a Democracy. If Canadian healthcare is so terrible, why don't the Canadian people choose to privatize it?

Once a system is set up like this, it is very difficult to disassemble. Even O'care, which is a limited socialized medicine scheme is like a bad penny as people start depending on the new, wasteful bureaucracy for jobs.

If the Soviet Union could be desocialized, certainly the Canadian Healthcare system can be - EXCEPT for the fact that the Canadian people are very happy with it.

People in the SU are too but the wealthy ones go to private and cash pay hospitals. Their care is 10000x better than the state hospitals.

 

[Richard-H]

When push comes to shove the wealthy from other countries come here when they have a serious medical issues. Why is that do you think?

Didn’t rand Paul just go to Canada? I hear of our rich traveling to other countries all the time.

Did he? Canada is basically the 51st state. They don't have to pay for a military because they have us. I work with many from Canada who HATE their system due to long lag times to see a doctor.

Yes he did.

The Canadians I know prefer theirs. Much cheaper.

Then why if a Canadian needs a treatment, they come to the United States? Canadian Alex Trebec is suffering from pancreatic cancer, and is being treated here in America. As a senior subject, he'd still be waiting for his first appointment if he went to Saskatoon.

English people are known for seeking treatment in the United States, that just doesn't exist in the UK. And also doctors in the US, who are willing to "take the risk".

So? Many many Americans seek healthcare in Canada and other socialized countries. Far more than people seeking healthcare in the U.S.