Zone1 Mormons are fine, but I have to call BS on the golden plates story.

[onefour1]

Not according to the Mormons I know. They say that they Bible has been mistranslated and they teach that Jesus and Satan are brothers.

Yes, we believe that Jesus and Satan were brothers. If Lucifer fell from heaven, then what was Lucifer before he fell? We believe that Jesus is the firstborn of all the spirit children of God. We believe that all mankind existed before the foundation of this world and we were all children of God the Father and brothers and sisters of Jesus Christ. He is our Elder Brother in the spirit. Lucifer was also a son of God the Father and a brother of Jesus Christ. But he rebelled against the Father and started the war in heaven (see Rev. 12). 1/3 of all the hosts of heaven sided with Lucifer and became his angels. Thus Lucifer was cast out of heaven along with his followers, and he was renamed Perdition, Satan, and the Devil. He and his followers were all the offspring of our Father in Heaven but have lost their salvation for coming out in open rebellion against God. They were cast out of heaven into the earth and the war that was in heaven goes on even today here on earth. Satan is trying to make us also fall from the grace of God and be damned just as he and his follower are damned.

There are some verses that over the few thousand years of compilation and translation were mistranslated but overall we believe that the majority of the Bible is the word of God and we consider it part of our canon of scripture.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Believes an illiterate man was given stone tablets by God and read them.

Balks at Golden plates.

It makes a lot of sense, if you don't think about it.

 

[onefour1]

and who is the mother of the angels?

In the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints we believe that we also have a Mother in Heaven. The Father and Mother are the parents of our spirits. We are literally the offspring of God as the BIBLE teaches:

Acts 17:
28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.
29 Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man’s device.

Hebrews 12:9
9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?

1 Corinthians 11:11
11 Nevertheless neither is the man without the woman, neither the woman without the man, in the Lord.

Angels are nothing more than children of God who are called to be messengers.

 

[onefour1]

Believes an illiterate man was given stone tablets by God and read them.

Balks at Golden plates.

It makes a lot of sense, if you don't think about it.

Makes alot of sense when you realize that God is capable of doing miracles.

 

[Zebra]

Yes, we believe that Jesus and Satan were brothers. If Lucifer fell from heaven, then what was Lucifer before he fell? We believe that Jesus is the firstborn of all the spirit children of God. We believe that all mankind existed before the foundation of this world and we were all children of God the Father and brothers and sisters of Jesus Christ. He is our Elder Brother in the spirit. Lucifer was also a son of God the Father and a brother of Jesus Christ. But he rebelled against the Father and started the war in heaven (see Rev. 12). 1/3 of all the hosts of heaven sided with Lucifer and became his angels. Thus Lucifer was cast out of heaven along with his followers, and he was renamed Perdition, Satan, and the Devil. He and his followers were all the offspring of our Father in Heaven but have lost their salvation for coming out in open rebellion against God. They were cast out of heaven into the earth and the war that was in heaven goes on even today here on earth. Satan is trying to make us also fall from the grace of God and be damned just as he and his follower are damned.

There are some verses that over the few thousand years of compilation and translation were mistranslated but overall we believe that the majority of the Bible is the word of God and we consider it part of our canon of scripture.

strange …

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Makes alot of sense when you realize that God is capable of doing miracles.

But not golden plates, apparently.

That's just a bridge too far.

Makes sense, if you throw logic out the window.

And miracles don't happen, sorry.

 

[ActionJackson]

I do!

I've been a member all my life and I can tell you that our canon of scripture includes the Bible.

Bible
Book of Mormon
Doctrine and Covenants
Pearl of Great Price

View attachment 937739

Nevertheless ... the Mormons I've been associated with put more stock in the Book of Mormon and they routinely say that the Bible is only as good as it's translaters and that it's lacking.

But if they actually believed what the Bible says then they would understand that they are NOT to "add to the prophecies written" in the Bible.

 

[tyroneweaver]

I've read a fair amount on the various major religions and I have to say, the story of Angel Moroni and the Golden Plates is the most suspect of all the stories I've read. Is there a Mormon out there who can better explain or defend why he or she believes these plates exist and were given to the Prophet Joseph to transcribe the Book of Mormon? This is not a knock on Mormons I have friends who are Mormons and they are very nice people and do lots of good things in the community and have good families. It's the Golden Plates story that just sounds like pure fantasy to me.

There's documentation of those that handled the plates. I studied it, but I'm 75 and can't remember where its at
Ive read the Book of Mormon probably 30 times. It's a very spiritual Book.
It seams rather difficult for a person to makeup this story on their own
Mormons per say are not great at hermenuetics
here's a pretty quick answer to your question

Come Follow Me Week 8 – Doctrine & Covenants 14-17 “Stand as a Witness”

by Dan Peterson The witnesses of the Book of Mormon pose a real obstacle to any honest person who wishes to dismiss the claims of the Restoration. Let me first briefly summarize who the official witnesses were and what they claimed to have seen, and then explain why I believe them to represent a...

www.fairlatterdaysaints.org

 

[Seymour Flops]

I've read a fair amount on the various major religions and I have to say, the story of Angel Moroni and the Golden Plates is the most suspect of all the stories I've read. Is there a Mormon out there who can better explain or defend why he or she believes these plates exist and were given to the Prophet Joseph to transcribe the Book of Mormon? This is not a knock on Mormons I have friends who are Mormons and they are very nice people and do lots of good things in the community and have good families. It's the Golden Plates story that just sounds like pure fantasy to me.

It's a religious belief about a past event. Sure, it sounds far-fetched, but is it any more far-fetched than Moses and the stone tablets, for example?

If you were raised with the belief about the stone tablets, you would probably believe it or at least not call it pure fantasy. But if you grew up in a non Judeo-Christian religion and heard the stone tablets story later in life, you might well think, 'Sounds like Moses was in the mountains carving those tablets."

 

[onefour1]

Nevertheless ... the Mormons I've been associated with put more stock in the Book of Mormon and they routinely say that the Bible is only as good as it's translaters and that it's lacking.

But if they actually believed what the Bible says then they would understand that they are NOT to "add to the prophecies written" in the Bible.

We believe that not to "add to the prophecies written" interpretation is a false interpretation. The one most quoted from the book of Revelation only states that one should not add to or take from the Revelation of the book received from John. What that means is that one should not make changes to his particular revelation and not that no other revelation would ever be received. When John received the revelation, the Bible was not even compiled yet. So it doesn't have reference to the Bible. If you were to take it as you suppose, then adding other scripture (meaning other books of the Bible) to the Book of Revelation would have been wrong. Continuing revelation in the church of Jesus Christ is a true doctrine.

Matthew 16:
15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Bar-jona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Here Simon Peter tells Jesus that he knows that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God. Jesus then tells Peter that he is blessed because this knowledge was not revealed to him by flesh and blood but it was revealed to him by our Father in Heaven. It came to Simon Peter by direct revelation from God. Jesus then tells Simon Peter that upon this rock (the rock of revelation from God) he will build his church and because of this, the gates of hell will never prevail against it. Continuing revelation from God was to be the rock upon which the church of Jesus Christ was to be built.

 

[Robert W]

Nevertheless ... the Mormons I've been associated with put more stock in the Book of Mormon and they routinely say that the Bible is only as good as it's translaters and that it's lacking.

But if they actually believed what the Bible says then they would understand that they are NOT to "add to the prophecies written" in the Bible.

As good as it is translated. Bear in mind this about the Bible. It has the Jews part, or the old testament, plus it has the much later added part by Christians. We simply want to go by what happens to be true. That makes perfect sense.

 

[DGS49]

The golden plates had nothing to do with he "translation" of the BoM from "reformed Egyptian" to "King James English."

Joe Smith was not looking at the plates, but rather looking INTO HIS HAT when he dictated the text to O. Cowdery. The plates were someplace else altogether.

The whole story is so goofy (sorry for using esoteric scientific language) that it is simply too unbelievable to be explained in detail to a would-be convert. This is why converts are forced to go through months if not years is B.S. before they reveal the early details.

 

[Robert W]

Yes, we believe that Jesus and Satan were brothers. If Lucifer fell from heaven, then what was Lucifer before he fell? We believe that Jesus is the firstborn of all the spirit children of God. We believe that all mankind existed before the foundation of this world and we were all children of God the Father and brothers and sisters of Jesus Christ. He is our Elder Brother in the spirit. Lucifer was also a son of God the Father and a brother of Jesus Christ. But he rebelled against the Father and started the war in heaven (see Rev. 12). 1/3 of all the hosts of heaven sided with Lucifer and became his angels. Thus Lucifer was cast out of heaven along with his followers, and he was renamed Perdition, Satan, and the Devil. He and his followers were all the offspring of our Father in Heaven but have lost their salvation for coming out in open rebellion against God. They were cast out of heaven into the earth and the war that was in heaven goes on even today here on earth. Satan is trying to make us also fall from the grace of God and be damned just as he and his follower are damned.

There are some verses that over the few thousand years of compilation and translation were mistranslated but overall we believe that the majority of the Bible is the word of God and we consider it part of our canon of scripture.

All of that is accurate.

Also on the plates translated by Joseph Smith. We LDS are populated by many lawyers, many historians and many scholars who all believe that the Golden plates existed and Joseph a young man translated them.

Also many Christians believe both the Jews Bible plus the much later Christian Bible.

 

[Robert W]

The golden plates had nothing to do with he "translation" of the BoM from "reformed Egyptian" to "King James English."

Joe Smith was not looking at the plates, but rather looking INTO HIS HAT when he dictated the text to O. Cowdery. The plates were someplace else altogether.

The whole story is so goofy (sorry for using esoteric scientific language) that it is simply too unbelievable to be explained in detail to a would-be convert. This is why converts are forced to go through months if not years is B.S. before they reveal the early details.

No idea what you are discussing. That is not in the history of our Church.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

No idea what you are discussing. That is not in the history of our Church.

But disgusting racism... that is.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

You two look silly arguing over Mormonism, considering AJ has been around you all his life, and may have been one when young,

 

[onefour1]

The golden plates had nothing to do with he "translation" of the BoM from "reformed Egyptian" to "King James English."

Joe Smith was not looking at the plates, but rather looking INTO HIS HAT when he dictated the text to O. Cowdery. The plates were someplace else altogether.

The whole story is so goofy (sorry for using esoteric scientific language) that it is simply too unbelievable to be explained in detail to a would-be convert. This is why converts are forced to go through months if not years is B.S. before they reveal the early details.

Joseph Smith translated the Book of Mormon by use of the Urim and Thummim.

 

[ActionJackson]

As good as it is translated. Bear in mind this about the Bible. It has the Jews part, or the old testament, plus it has the much later added part by Christians. We simply want to go by what happens to be true. That makes perfect sense.

The Bible is 100% God's "part." His will shall be done in Heaven and on earth. He's God!! Do you believe that He would allow His Word to be tainted, or do you think He's powerful enough to assure that His message is preserved for eternity?

Both Testaments are not only spiritually significant but also historically significant. It's His Story (history) from start to finish. From Creation to Christ's birth to His death and resurrection, all culminating with His return. It's not up to weak, frail, unrighteous, fallen man to determine which parts are true and which are false. We aren't free to pick and choose the parts we like and leave the rest by the wayside.

 

[ActionJackson]

We believe that not to "add to the prophecies written" interpretation is a false interpretation. The one most quoted from the book of Revelation only states that one should not add to or take from the Revelation of the book received from John. What that means is that one should not make changes to his particular revelation and not that no other revelation would ever be received. When John received the revelation, the Bible was not even compiled yet. So it doesn't have reference to the Bible. If you were to take it as you suppose, then adding other scripture (meaning other books of the Bible) to the Book of Revelation would have been wrong. Continuing revelation in the church of Jesus Christ is a true doctrine.

Matthew 16:
15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Bar-jona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Here Simon Peter tells Jesus that he knows that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God. Jesus then tells Peter that he is blessed because this knowledge was not revealed to him by flesh and blood but it was revealed to him by our Father in Heaven. It came to Simon Peter by direct revelation from God. Jesus then tells Simon Peter that upon this rock (the rock of revelation from God) he will build his church and because of this, the gates of hell will never prevail against it. Continuing revelation from God was to be the rock upon which the church of Jesus Christ was to be built.

Every offshoot of the Christian religion picks and chooses the portions of the Bible they like, while leaving the rest. I could start a new religion based solely on small portions of the Bible. I could add stuff I like and create my own set of rules, regulations, and laws, and I could make myself the boss. But then, that would make me a cultist.

 

[Crepitus]

I've read a fair amount on the various major religions and I have to say, the story of Angel Moroni and the Golden Plates is the most suspect of all the stories I've read. Is there a Mormon out there who can better explain or defend why he or she believes these plates exist and were given to the Prophet Joseph to transcribe the Book of Mormon? This is not a knock on Mormons I have friends who are Mormons and they are very nice people and do lots of good things in the community and have good families. It's the Golden Plates story that just sounds like pure fantasy to me.

Personally I don't think they are golden at all.

Solid Baloney is my guess.