To those saying flipping burgers or dunking fries deserves 15.00 per hour...

[usmcstinger]

No one makes you work at low paying jobs. You make that choice.

 

[Thinker101]

Paying a person an agreed upon wage for an agreed upon job is not stealing.

No one is forcing anyone to work for them

That would be true if the alternative weren't starving.

So, let's do it this way. Everyone gets a guaranteed income, and then the One Percent can negotiate for any labor they want done beyond that.

Works for me.

Sure does, until that $5 burger you just flipped starts selling for $10-$12, then you'll be back to pissing and moaning.

This has been gone over many, many times. To get people at $15 an hour means that the average cost of a MickeyDs meal goes up, at the most, a quarter.

Sure, at most a quarter, if 80% of the workers become automated robots.

No, if they simply raised the price of the average meal, it could result in much higher wages.

That's exactly what I was trying explain, the price of the average meal would go up, up enough to cover the increased hourly rate.

 

[Thinker101]

That would be true if the alternative weren't starving.

So, let's do it this way. Everyone gets a guaranteed income, and then the One Percent can negotiate for any labor they want done beyond that.

Works for me.

Sure does, until that $5 burger you just flipped starts selling for $10-$12, then you'll be back to pissing and moaning.

This has been gone over many, many times. To get people at $15 an hour means that the average cost of a MickeyDs meal goes up, at the most, a quarter.

Only in the most simplistic and imaginary scenarios.
If burger baggers got 15 an hour then everyone who makes less than 15 an hour would also get a raise to 15 an hour.

So basically the prices for everything a fast food place needs to run from the paper bags, napkins, straws, cleaning supplies, bread, meat, pickles, onions etc will rise as all those distributors raise the pay of everyone making less than 15 an hour. On top of that the employer's share of payroll taxes will rise, their workman's comp tax will rise, their state and federal unemployment taxes will rise, their business liability insurance will rise.

You obviously don't realize that running a business involves far more than just employee salary

Not to mention the folks making $20/hour would need to be raised to $30/hour, etc, etc.

Why?

Why?? WTF!? Let's say the guy next to you is currently making $18/hour and you're making $8/hour. You get a raise, basically doubling your hourly rate...do you really think the guy making the $18/hour will just sit there and not expect a similar raise. How fricken old are you?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

When the poor steal, they are taking property from a rightful owner of that property. The rich don't do that.

No, they are stealing their creativity, labor, time and soul...

That's kind of worse, since those things can't be replaced. Property can.

No, those people offer their creativity, labor, time and soul.

I think there are very few people who would say they make enough for the work they do including myself. But as I've said repeatedly, your labor is only worth as much as your employer can pay another person to do the same quality of work as you do. That's why minimum wage jobs pay what they do. Those are jobs that are easily filled because the employers have no problem getting people to work for that money. That being the case, could you tell me why they should pay more?

 

[SobieskiSavedEurope]

Why does flipping American jobs to China, and Mexico as a CEO deserve 200 dollars an hour?

 

[Thinker101]

Why does flipping American jobs to China, and Mexico as a CEO deserve 200 dollars an hour?

Let's see, lower wages, lower taxes, much fewer regulations...need more?

 

[SobieskiSavedEurope]

Why does flipping American jobs to China, and Mexico as a CEO deserve 200 dollars an hour?

Let's see, lower wages, lower taxes, much fewer regulations...need more?

This benefits America, how?

 

[Thinker101]

Why does flipping American jobs to China, and Mexico as a CEO deserve 200 dollars an hour?

Let's see, lower wages, lower taxes, much fewer regulations...need more?

This benefits America, how?

Most business are not in business to benefit America.

 

[SobieskiSavedEurope]

Why does flipping American jobs to China, and Mexico as a CEO deserve 200 dollars an hour?

Let's see, lower wages, lower taxes, much fewer regulations...need more?

This benefits America, how?

Most business are not in business to benefit America.

Then F them.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

There are alternatives to starving. Getting a better paying job is one of them. In order to do that you need to learn how to do work that you can take with you to any job in that field.

We have Adjunct Professors on Food stamps, buddy, in the last recession. The idea you are going to "learn" your way to a better job is just fucking silly.

How many freshly minted Bachelor Degrees are working at Starbucks for tips?

Probably more than you think. You are talking to a guy who's niece graduated college with a biology degree. Seven years later and she's still waiting tables, and she was damn near a straight A student.

The problem people have is they try to get into careers where there are very few jobs around. My nephews wife is a good example. She was talked into taking advertising in college. She works at a bank today not advertising anything.

When I was younger and decided to make a move in life, the first thing I did was grab the Want Ads and look into the field I was taking into consideration. Column after column of job openings and some pretty attractive salaries. You're always in demand, you can live anywhere you want, and there are jobs even in the worst economic times.

 

[Thinker101]

There are alternatives to starving. Getting a better paying job is one of them. In order to do that you need to learn how to do work that you can take with you to any job in that field.

We have Adjunct Professors on Food stamps, buddy, in the last recession. The idea you are going to "learn" your way to a better job is just fucking silly.

How many freshly minted Bachelor Degrees are working at Starbucks for tips?

Probably more than you think. You are talking to a guy who's niece graduated college with a biology degree. Seven years later and she's still waiting tables, and she was damn near a straight A student.

The problem people have is they try to get into careers where there are very few jobs around. My nephews wife is a good example. She was talked into taking advertising in college. She works at a bank today not advertising anything.

When I was younger and decided to make a move in life, the first thing I did was grab the Want Ads and look into the field I was taking into consideration. Column after column of job openings and some pretty attractive salaries. Your always in demand, you can live anywhere you want, and there are jobs even in the worst economic times.

As long as that demand wasn't in flipping burgers you're good.

 

[initforme]

In the end why do people!e choose to eat mcdonalds? I say do a blood test and if you have that slop in your system you pay higher insurance rates because its toxic and drives up medical costs. We think illegal drugs are killing people? That food slowly kills. Uneducated people eat it. Wise folkj never touch it.

 

[Skull Pilot]

I have never read the bible

I am not a religious person at all

and to quote Treebeard, "I am on nobody's side because nobody is on my side"



And you now have to quote where I said the adjudicated mentally ill should be able to own firearms. And good luck with that one

IMO no one who has ever been convicted of a crime should be able to own a firearm. That said people like me who will pass every background check you can think of should be able to own whatever and as many firearms as they want.

Anyone convicted of any crime while in possession of a firearm should get a minimum mandatory 25 year sentence with no parole. Those who commit a violent crime while in possession of a firearm should get life. But you don't want to punish the actual criminals

In other words, you don't agree with the foundational principles upon which this Republic was founded. You think God don't love you so you love the concept of a God / government. You want different classes of citizens, no unalienable Rights, and the perfect Nanny State. Got it.

If you abuse the rights you have by bringing harm to others you should be punished. The best way to punish people who commit crimes and harm other is to deny them the rights and privileges of those who do not commit crimes and harm others

But I suppose you're one of those idiots who say they would let a convicted child molester babysit their kids because everyone deserves a second chance, right?

So you presuppose I'm an idiot?

Well, IF the government were doing their job, child molesters would not be allowed back onto the streets.

Since you DO have a problem with some Rights, let me assure you, this nation was built upon the premise that some Rights are unalienable... that is, above the reach of government. When people commit crimes, they are removed from society and punished along with the hope that prison reformed / rehabilitated that individual.

That's a separate issue, but we need to invest in rehabilitation and if people cannot be rehabilitated, you don't put them back into society.

Do you practice what you preach? Would you hire a convicted child molester to watch your kids? Would you want a convicted embezzler to handle your portfolio? If you would then you would want a person convicted of a violent crime with a firearm to be able to own as many firearms as he wants.

And we have no obligation to rehabilitate pieces of shit who choose to abuse their rights by victimizing others.

In all honesty, I hire people based upon recent performance. IF someone is a child molester, they are supposed to be put to death.

IF a convicted embezzler were to be rehabilitated, then yes I would give them a job. The problem we have is that we do not rehabilitate people who are incarcerated. And YES, it is our job to do so. You don't send dangerous people back into society and expect that they will just start being normal. That's the most irresponsible attitude one can imagine when you ignore that reality.

So you would hand your portfolio over to a convicted thief simply because he promises not to steal other people's money again?

Yes you are an idiot.

 

[Skull Pilot]

That would be true if the alternative weren't starving.

So, let's do it this way. Everyone gets a guaranteed income, and then the One Percent can negotiate for any labor they want done beyond that.

Works for me.

Sure does, until that $5 burger you just flipped starts selling for $10-$12, then you'll be back to pissing and moaning.

This has been gone over many, many times. To get people at $15 an hour means that the average cost of a MickeyDs meal goes up, at the most, a quarter.

Only in the most simplistic and imaginary scenarios.
If burger baggers got 15 an hour then everyone who makes less than 15 an hour would also get a raise to 15 an hour.

So basically the prices for everything a fast food place needs to run from the paper bags, napkins, straws, cleaning supplies, bread, meat, pickles, onions etc will rise as all those distributors raise the pay of everyone making less than 15 an hour. On top of that the employer's share of payroll taxes will rise, their workman's comp tax will rise, their state and federal unemployment taxes will rise, their business liability insurance will rise.

You obviously don't realize that running a business involves far more than just employee salary

Not to mention the folks making $20/hour would need to be raised to $30/hour, etc, etc.

Why?

Because by the wage of everyone making less than 15 an hour to 15 an hour will result in everything costing more and the purchasing power of everyone making more than 15 an hour will be lessened.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Works for you because you want to get paid for not working. You are more than happy to have money taken from others and given to you

I for one would rather pick up dog shit for a penny a pile than go on the dole.

sure you would.

But I bet you'll demand your Social Security when you retire.. and your medicare.

I have had money taken from me to fund the SS scam so you fucking right I will collect. Besides I have to enroll for medicare because no private health insurance will give me a primary policy after I retire. or when I start taking my SS benefits so I really have no choice

But unlike you I also am saving for retirement so I won't have to be completely dependent on the government.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Only in the most simplistic and imaginary scenarios.
If burger baggers got 15 an hour then everyone who makes less than 15 an hour would also get a raise to 15 an hour.

So basically the prices for everything a fast food place needs to run from the paper bags, napkins, straws, cleaning supplies, bread, meat, pickles, onions etc will rise as all those distributors raise the pay of everyone making less than 15 an hour. On top of that the employer's share of payroll taxes will rise, their workman's comp tax will rise, their state and federal unemployment taxes will rise, their business liability insurance will rise.

You obviously don't realize that running a business involves far more than just employee salary

again, you talk like these are bad things...

Yeah it's always a good thing when the cost of absolutely everything goes up and the purchasing power of most people decreases

 

[Skull Pilot]

When the poor steal, they are taking property from a rightful owner of that property. The rich don't do that.

No, they are stealing their creativity, labor, time and soul...

That's kind of worse, since those things can't be replaced. Property can.

They are paying for labor so not stealing
There is no such thing as a soul so stupid point

and if people want to develop their own ideas they are free to do so on their own without the facilities, salary, benefits and support staff being provided by an employer

 

[Skull Pilot]

Why does flipping American jobs to China, and Mexico as a CEO deserve 200 dollars an hour?

Let's see, lower wages, lower taxes, much fewer regulations...need more?

This benefits America, how?

A CEO is hired to benefit his company

get it?

 

[beagle9]

It's not a question of morality.


A businessman goes into business to make money. But, if he does not pay his employees, then the taxpayer picks up the tab. That difference between what the employer pays his / her employees and that money it takes for them to sustain themselves comes at a cost to you and I.

The employer isn't responsible for the employees family. :SHRUG:

Case in point:

Georgia has something called Peachcare for children. It's like Medicare, only for the children of those people on limited incomes. Now, who do you suppose gets the lion's share of that money? Blacks? Whites? Maybe the children of those "illegal aliens?" No. The group that is the largest recipients of Peachcare is the children of Walmart employees. Who comes in second? That would be the children of Publix grocery chain.

Walmart chief Doug McMillon, who made $25.6 million last year. In 2006 alone, Walmart donated $272.9 MILLION DOLLARS to charities:

Wal-Mart keeps spot as top corporate charity

So, while Walmart is donating this to charity, virtually NONE of it is coming out of the pockets of the BILLIONAIRE Waltons. The Waltons donate less than 1 percent of their own money to charities:

Report: Walmart's Billionaire Waltons Give Almost None Of Own Cash To Foundation

So, Walmart takes this money out of their corporate profits and gets great PR and lots of positive advertising while their employees live below the poverty level. AND, adding insult to injury, while the BILLIONAIRE Waltons are donating less than 1 percent of their income to charities, the average middle class American donates 6 percent of their income.

So what.

So, here is the deal:

Walmart counters and says that they pay competitive wages. What they don't tell you is that they are the largest retail operation of their kind and they, more or less, get to set that competitive wage. That insulting wage comes at a cost to taxpayers who foot the cost for the difference between what people have to have to sustain themselves and what they get in wages.

Again, the employer is not responsible for the employees family. :SHRUG:

If a corporation does not pay people an adequate wage, they should pay more in taxes. What I put on the table is a quid pro quo solution. The employer gets to choose. In the instant example, Walmart has been convicted of knowingly hiring subcontractors that used undocumented foreigners. They pay insulting wages. By contrast, the children of the employees of Aldi Grocery stores DO NOT qualify for Peach Care because Aldi pays above poverty level wages. Aldi hires Americans. Aldi should get a tax break and Walmart should be paying higher taxes. Both companies keep to get running their businesses as they always have and life goes on.

A corporation should pay what the employee is willing to work for. The fewer employees available to the corporation the higher the corporation will pay or the better benefits they will offer. More available employees, the less the corporation needs to pay. The issue we have now is too many employees, not enough business needing employees.

. So the liberal world and the corporate world just go hand in hand. The lib policies promote population explosion, and in that populous we have hundreds of thousands of generated cheap labor forces, and yep it was all being done with liberal style government help.

 

[Papageorgio]

In the end why do people!e choose to eat mcdonalds? I say do a blood test and if you have that slop in your system you pay higher insurance rates because its toxic and drives up medical costs. We think illegal drugs are killing people? That food slowly kills. Uneducated people eat it. Wise folkj never touch it.

Then we can charge higher rates for smokers, drinkers, those that do extreme sports, those that have one night stands, those with diabetes, those that are over weight and the list will go on and on.