The Paris Agreement

[buckeye45_73]

was a joke. Thank God for Trump

Germany will fail 2020 climate goals, now eyes 2030 target

 

[jc456]

was a joke. Thank God for Trump

Germany will fail 2020 climate goals, now eyes 2030 target

gotta love cheap reliable energy.

 

[Confounding]

Solar energy improves every year. In the end I'm pretty sure getting energy from direct sunlight will prove more effective than getting it from ancient animal goo that got it from eating plants that got it from sunlight. Why not see how good we can make the technology before you take a giant shit on it?

 

[NightFox]

Solar energy improves every year. In the end I'm pretty sure getting energy from direct sunlight will prove more effective than getting it from ancient animal goo that got it from eating plants that got it from sunlight

It's mostly ancient plant goo but who's counting.

. Why not see how good we can make the technology before you take a giant shit on it?

I don't think that's the approach being pursued, it's not a one or the other question, it's a question of being realistic as to when alternatives (solar, wind, fission, fusion, geo, etc..,) are developed enough and have large enough economies of scale to be market competitive with fossil fuels. Governments are being shown to be incompetent at predicting such timelines and their "mandates" just end up being so much pointless noise, as evidenced by this news from Germany.

 

[Claudette]

I agree.

Believe me if solar power were viable every one in Florida would be using it. Arizona would as well.

Wind power was proven to be unusable as well. T. Boone Pickens tried to find some way to make it affordable and couldn't.

Yup Govt. are incompetent and "timelines" are meaningless.

 

[Confounding]

It's mostly ancient plant goo but who's counting.

A lot of it came from primitive ocean animals too, but whatever; your observation doesn't change my point. Some of the timelines are unrealistic. I think a lot of people don't understand just how much energy we use and how much of it comes from fossil fuels. The percent that comes from alternative energies is going down in recent years as Africa, India and other places start developing more and using more energy. However I am not opposed to using government funds to expedite research that could really help humanity in the end.

 

[Manonthestreet]

So far solar is welfare for the rich paid for by the poor

 

[buckeye45_73]

Solar energy improves every year. In the end I'm pretty sure getting energy from direct sunlight will prove more effective than getting it from ancient animal goo that got it from eating plants that got it from sunlight. Why not see how good we can make the technology before you take a giant shit on it?

We aren't taking a shit on it.....it sounds great. We don't like being forced to use expensive and inefficient energy when we don't have to. If they make it to where I can afford it, I'm on board, until then, quit shoving it down our throats.

 

[Confounding]

Solar energy improves every year. In the end I'm pretty sure getting energy from direct sunlight will prove more effective than getting it from ancient animal goo that got it from eating plants that got it from sunlight. Why not see how good we can make the technology before you take a giant shit on it?

We aren't taking a shit on it.....it sounds great. We don't like being forced to use expensive and inefficient energy when we don't have to. If they make it to where I can afford it, I'm on board, until then, quit shoving it down our throats.

Would you support the government spending some money on research to expedite its growth?

 

[buckeye45_73]

Solar energy improves every year. In the end I'm pretty sure getting energy from direct sunlight will prove more effective than getting it from ancient animal goo that got it from eating plants that got it from sunlight. Why not see how good we can make the technology before you take a giant shit on it?

We aren't taking a shit on it.....it sounds great. We don't like being forced to use expensive and inefficient energy when we don't have to. If they make it to where I can afford it, I'm on board, until then, quit shoving it down our throats.

Would you support the government spending some money on research to expedite its growth?

Not really, the government has a really bad track record with spending money. not only do we not have the money, no one ever holds people accountable.

 

[Confounding]

Solar energy improves every year. In the end I'm pretty sure getting energy from direct sunlight will prove more effective than getting it from ancient animal goo that got it from eating plants that got it from sunlight. Why not see how good we can make the technology before you take a giant shit on it?

We aren't taking a shit on it.....it sounds great. We don't like being forced to use expensive and inefficient energy when we don't have to. If they make it to where I can afford it, I'm on board, until then, quit shoving it down our throats.

Would you support the government spending some money on research to expedite its growth?

Not really, the government has a really bad track record with spending money. not only do we not have the money, no one ever holds people accountable.

The problem is when it comes to fledgling technologies the private sector is not very helpful because they're not yet profitable. Nobody wants to start selling a product that needs development and isn't going to make them money.

 

[NightFox]

It's mostly ancient plant goo but who's counting.

A lot of it came from primitive ocean animals too, but whatever; your observation doesn't change my point. Some of the timelines are unrealistic. I think a lot of people don't understand just how much energy we use and how much of it comes from fossil fuels. The percent that comes from alternative energies is going down in recent years as Africa, India and other places start developing more and using more energy.

That's only natural since "alternatives" are not yet practical for developing economies, they're not about to forgo economic development just because first world nations have decided that fossil fuels aren't fun anymore.

However I am not opposed to using government funds to expedite research that could really help humanity in the end.

More corporate welfare and cronyism? We have plenty of that and the end result has been to stifle innovation and reinforce entrenched interests.

Competition and profit motive is the secret sauce to get to where you say you want to go not politics, how do you think we transitioned from a muscle powered economy to a fossil fuel powered one? it wasn't government direction of capital investment and market manipulation, if that was left up to government we'd still be riding around on horses. Private enterprise is perfectly capable of mass market alternatives that are competitive if government stays out of their way and lets the market function without interference.

 

[buckeye45_73]

Solar energy improves every year. In the end I'm pretty sure getting energy from direct sunlight will prove more effective than getting it from ancient animal goo that got it from eating plants that got it from sunlight. Why not see how good we can make the technology before you take a giant shit on it?

We aren't taking a shit on it.....it sounds great. We don't like being forced to use expensive and inefficient energy when we don't have to. If they make it to where I can afford it, I'm on board, until then, quit shoving it down our throats.

Would you support the government spending some money on research to expedite its growth?

Not really, the government has a really bad track record with spending money. not only do we not have the money, no one ever holds people accountable.

The problem is when it comes to fledgling technologies the private sector is not willing to help them grow because they're not yet profitable. Nobody wants to start selling a product that isn't going to make them money.

Kind of....you could do incetives on taxes and such. Drug companies spend a billion per drug.......but then people get pissed that only the rich can afford it for a while......if you're ok with that, then we're in good shape.

 

[Confounding]

More corporate welfare and cronyism?

How do we expedite the growth of technology that is not yet profitable and therefore has no place in the private sector?

 

[NightFox]

More corporate welfare and cronyism?

How do we expedite the growth of technology that is not yet profitable and therefore has no place in the private sector?

Why do you need to "expedite" technology that is NOT YET PROFITABLE? Do you think the energy sector is just sitting around twiddling its thumbs waiting for government hand outs to do R&D ? Or do think perhaps that they understand that fossil fuels are a finite resource subject to diminishing returns?

When alternatives are competitive then demand and supply will follow, private enterprise doesn't need crony capitalism and market manipulation at the hands of politicians and bureaucrats to accomplish it.

 

[buckeye45_73]

More corporate welfare and cronyism?

How do we expedite the growth of technology that is not yet profitable and therefore has no place in the private sector?

It happens, private sector does R&D all the time.
For example cars and planes were made
or personal computers. Intel created the integrated circuit in the 1968, which led to smaller computers, which became personal computers.
so the govt does fund some projects, but many are also done in the private sector.
In Denver they heavily advertise solar power panels on radio.
The main issue, is the tech is not cheap enough for the average person, solar is still a rich man's game, it's gonna take time.

 

[Confounding]

Why do you need to "expedite" technology that is NOT YET PROFITABLE?

It shows a lot of potential and could really help humanity.

Do you think the energy sector is just sitting around twiddling its thumbs waiting for government hand outs to do R&D ?

No, but research and development money helps a lot and creates incentive to get involved in it.

When alternatives are competitive then demand and supply will follow

Research and development will make the alternatives competitive more quickly.

 

[Confounding]

It happens, private sector does R&D all the time.

Do you think money from the government and more incentive to work with alternative energies will have no impact on the speed of development?

 

[buckeye45_73]

It happens, private sector does R&D all the time.

Do you think money from the government and more incentive to work with alternative energies will have no impact on the speed of development?

It might, it might not....but if the govt has grants, that's fine....the only thing though is we need accountability......if you figure out how to do that ,we have a deal

 

[Confounding]

the only thing though is we need accountability......if you figure out how to do that ,we have a deal

Cronyism is a serious problem in this country. I'm not exactly sure what the solution to that is, but I'm willing to work with what we've got to see solar and other technology develop more quickly.