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Are the Obamas the first family in the White House to enjoy Thanksgiving dinner there? Did Nancy microwave some turkey roll for Ronny, or was there staff present to accommodate their needs?Foxy Foxy Foxy, why does it always have to morph into the political? This is not a political thread. Sheesh, can we not give it a rest for one thread?
A vocal 5.88% -- arguing just to argue. SMH...
Meaning that once again you've got nothing but fuzzy ideology to support your argument. You are the one who presumes to judge those who pursue profit.
And I am not making this a political thread. I am expressing my conviction that those of you who would blame/accuse/judge a business owner for pursuing profits and those of you who would blame/accuse/judge a business owner for requiring employees to work on a holiday claim to be making those judgments out of some sense of moral imperative that it is evil to pursue profits or pay people to work on Thanskgiving.
But you won't find fault with the Obamas who will require THEIR staff to work on Thanksgiving in order to provide his and her majesty and the princesses with a traditional Thanksgiving Dinner. Which is hypocritical.
And you won't see that it is the shitty economy and the requirements of things like Obamacare, the most corrupt program the government has ever forced upon us, that has put a large percentage of the work force in a position that they covet extra hours and extra pay, even on Thanksgiving, and those eeeeeeevil business owners are not being cruel to their employees. Which is a blatant failure of failing to see the forest for the trees.
The White House staff. Firefighters. Hospital workers. Broadcasters. Policemen. Our military.Are the Obamas the first family in the White House to enjoy Thanksgiving dinner there? Did Nancy microwave some turkey roll for Ronny, or was there staff present to accommodate their needs?Meaning that once again you've got nothing but fuzzy ideology to support your argument. You are the one who presumes to judge those who pursue profit.
And I am not making this a political thread. I am expressing my conviction that those of you who would blame/accuse/judge a business owner for pursuing profits and those of you who would blame/accuse/judge a business owner for requiring employees to work on a holiday claim to be making those judgments out of some sense of moral imperative that it is evil to pursue profits or pay people to work on Thanskgiving.
But you won't find fault with the Obamas who will require THEIR staff to work on Thanksgiving in order to provide his and her majesty and the princesses with a traditional Thanksgiving Dinner. Which is hypocritical.
And you won't see that it is the shitty economy and the requirements of things like Obamacare, the most corrupt program the government has ever forced upon us, that has put a large percentage of the work force in a position that they covet extra hours and extra pay, even on Thanksgiving, and those eeeeeeevil business owners are not being cruel to their employees. Which is a blatant failure of failing to see the forest for the trees.
What difference does it make what other first families did? The principle is the same is it not? If it is evil for a business owner to deprive his employees of a traditional Thanksgiving when he chooses to open on Sunday, how is it any different for Obama's staff? Is he not depriving his staff of a traditional family Thanksgiving?
If you are going to judge people, at least use the same principle to judge all.
The White House staff. Firefighters. Hospital workers. Broadcasters. Policemen. Our military.Are the Obamas the first family in the White House to enjoy Thanksgiving dinner there? Did Nancy microwave some turkey roll for Ronny, or was there staff present to accommodate their needs?
What difference does it make what other first families did? The principle is the same is it not? If it is evil for a business owner to deprive his employees of a traditional Thanksgiving when he chooses to open on Sunday, how is it any different for Obama's staff? Is he not depriving his staff of a traditional family Thanksgiving?
If you are going to judge people, at least use the same principle to judge all.
These and dozens more represent occupations that have no days off. Holidays are scheduled and accommodations are made.
The issue is, should Thanksgiving become a "retail event"? Retailers are opening on that holiday not because it is essential for their operations, but because they can gin up business on a day that was, here to fore, a holiday with time off.
When the great steel mills flourished up and down the valley, they could not suspend operations for any holiday, including Christmas. But accommodations were made and schedules were drawn up to minimize the staff and more than amply pay those who chose to work. But today, Macy's wants to open shop just to create more business for themselves, and consequently more holiday mania.
No one believes that no one should work on Thanksgiving. But should Thanksgiving be turned into President's Day when precious little time is taken to honor Presidents, but reams of paper are used to advertise mattress sales. Can Thanksgiving be the one spot in the holiday season exempt from the intrusion of trumped up retail promotion?
I bet a lot of folks who signed on at Macy's thought they had a job where they would not have to work Thanksgiving. But now what? Should they quit? Because there are so many jobs out there?The White House staff. Firefighters. Hospital workers. Broadcasters. Policemen. Our military.What difference does it make what other first families did? The principle is the same is it not? If it is evil for a business owner to deprive his employees of a traditional Thanksgiving when he chooses to open on Sunday, how is it any different for Obama's staff? Is he not depriving his staff of a traditional family Thanksgiving?
If you are going to judge people, at least use the same principle to judge all.
These and dozens more represent occupations that have no days off. Holidays are scheduled and accommodations are made.
The issue is, should Thanksgiving become a "retail event"? Retailers are opening on that holiday not because it is essential for their operations, but because they can gin up business on a day that was, here to fore, a holiday with time off.
When the great steel mills flourished up and down the valley, they could not suspend operations for any holiday, including Christmas. But accommodations were made and schedules were drawn up to minimize the staff and more than amply pay those who chose to work. But today, Macy's wants to open shop just to create more business for themselves, and consequently more holiday mania.
No one believes that no one should work on Thanksgiving. But should Thanksgiving be turned into President's Day when precious little time is taken to honor Presidents, but reams of paper are used to advertise mattress sales. Can Thanksgiving be the one spot in the holiday season exempt from the intrusion of trumped up retail promotion?
The 'shoulds' and 'oughts' are YOUR should and oughts. If you don't want to work holidays don't work where they open on the holidays.
I bet a lot of folks who signed on at Macy's thought they had a job where they would not have to work Thanksgiving. But now what? Should they quit? Because there are so many jobs out there?The White House staff. Firefighters. Hospital workers. Broadcasters. Policemen. Our military.
These and dozens more represent occupations that have no days off. Holidays are scheduled and accommodations are made.
The issue is, should Thanksgiving become a "retail event"? Retailers are opening on that holiday not because it is essential for their operations, but because they can gin up business on a day that was, here to fore, a holiday with time off.
When the great steel mills flourished up and down the valley, they could not suspend operations for any holiday, including Christmas. But accommodations were made and schedules were drawn up to minimize the staff and more than amply pay those who chose to work. But today, Macy's wants to open shop just to create more business for themselves, and consequently more holiday mania.
No one believes that no one should work on Thanksgiving. But should Thanksgiving be turned into President's Day when precious little time is taken to honor Presidents, but reams of paper are used to advertise mattress sales. Can Thanksgiving be the one spot in the holiday season exempt from the intrusion of trumped up retail promotion?
The 'shoulds' and 'oughts' are YOUR should and oughts. If you don't want to work holidays don't work where they open on the holidays.
The White House staff. Firefighters. Hospital workers. Broadcasters. Policemen. Our military.Are the Obamas the first family in the White House to enjoy Thanksgiving dinner there? Did Nancy microwave some turkey roll for Ronny, or was there staff present to accommodate their needs?
What difference does it make what other first families did? The principle is the same is it not? If it is evil for a business owner to deprive his employees of a traditional Thanksgiving when he chooses to open on Sunday, how is it any different for Obama's staff? Is he not depriving his staff of a traditional family Thanksgiving?
If you are going to judge people, at least use the same principle to judge all.
These and dozens more represent occupations that have no days off. Holidays are scheduled and accommodations are made.
The issue is, should Thanksgiving become a "retail event"? Retailers are opening on that holiday not because it is essential for their operations, but because they can gin up business on a day that was, here to fore, a holiday with time off.
When the great steel mills flourished up and down the valley, they could not suspend operations for any holiday, including Christmas. But accommodations were made and schedules were drawn up to minimize the staff and more than amply pay those who chose to work. But today, Macy's wants to open shop just to create more business for themselves, and consequently more holiday mania.
No one believes that no one should work on Thanksgiving. But should Thanksgiving be turned into President's Day when precious little time is taken to honor Presidents, but reams of paper are used to advertise mattress sales. Can Thanksgiving be the one spot in the holiday season exempt from the intrusion of trumped up retail promotion?
I haven't read all 50 pages of this, but I did go through a lot of it. Of course, I've forgotten most by now.
There are a number of reasons why Thanksgiving is not the same as it was in the past. To think it's simply a matter of businesses grabbing for money is oversimplifying, IMO. Not only are there many changes society has undergone to contribute to Thanksgiving losing prominence (or at least in the oft-repeated Norman Rockwell sense), but it implies that in the past, businesses were perfectly happy missing out on days of potential profit. I think that is unlikely; it is more likely that in the past, more businesses felt that opening on Thanksgiving would be a negative for them. That may have to do with there being more small businesses, with changes in communication (which allows for changes in advertising), with a shifting of the basis of the US economy from manufacture to service, etc. It's certainly something to discuss, but as with most things, far from a black and white issue.
Plenty of people are making this discussion political, and often in ways that don't necessarily apply. Is there a 50+ page thread, other than the CS or Tavern, where this isn't the case?
The poll question does not necessarily say anything about the current discussion. It merely asks if one will be shopping on Thanksgiving. I will not be shopping on Thanksgiving, but did not answer the poll. My reason for not shopping has nothing whatsoever to do with the holiday. I will, in fact, likely be at home alone on Thanksgiving and do nothing to celebrate at all. I believe that's what I did last year, and maybe the year before as well. I just rarely shop.
Oh, and f*** the Cowboys!
The reason businesses didn't open in the past is because very few people would come in.
Today grandma is on a cruise with her boyfriend, brother has gone skiing, the kids are with various fathers or mothers, mom and dad are in Palm Springs, the perfect day is shopping, lunch and a movie.
Anyone else notice the thread title is spelled incorrectly?
The White House staff. Firefighters. Hospital workers. Broadcasters. Policemen. Our military.What difference does it make what other first families did? The principle is the same is it not? If it is evil for a business owner to deprive his employees of a traditional Thanksgiving when he chooses to open on Sunday, how is it any different for Obama's staff? Is he not depriving his staff of a traditional family Thanksgiving?
If you are going to judge people, at least use the same principle to judge all.
These and dozens more represent occupations that have no days off. Holidays are scheduled and accommodations are made.
The issue is, should Thanksgiving become a "retail event"? Retailers are opening on that holiday not because it is essential for their operations, but because they can gin up business on a day that was, here to fore, a holiday with time off.
When the great steel mills flourished up and down the valley, they could not suspend operations for any holiday, including Christmas. But accommodations were made and schedules were drawn up to minimize the staff and more than amply pay those who chose to work. But today, Macy's wants to open shop just to create more business for themselves, and consequently more holiday mania.
No one believes that no one should work on Thanksgiving. But should Thanksgiving be turned into President's Day when precious little time is taken to honor Presidents, but reams of paper are used to advertise mattress sales. Can Thanksgiving be the one spot in the holiday season exempt from the intrusion of trumped up retail promotion?
That is a valid question. And I can appreciate that question.
But once you get into the judgmental aspect that those businesses who open on Sunday are somehow doing their employees a disservice and destroying family values in pursuit of profits, yadda yadda, you are into indefensible territory. You cannot know what the needs or motives of the employer are; what the needs or preferences of the employees are. Or why so many do seem to appreciate the opportunity to shop on that holiday.
To be nostalgic and wish people would observe Thanksgiving in the way you prefer to observe Thanksgiving is a valid wish.
To judge them because they do not, is not.
We don't stuff the turkey either....got to make sure it hits 180-85 in the deepest part of the breast. Don't eat the liver or heart either....these birds are packed full of steroids and antibiotics. Liver and kidneys collect the residue of what the bird ingests; it's like eating an oil filter.
Still the best is Stove Top but in the can not the box....there's a difference.....add some celery and it beats anything home-made I ever got.
Buy Zacky or Foster Farms, or some other Turkey that is free of that nonsense.
{Butterball Fresh Whole Turkeys are all natural, never frozen, gluten free, and raised without hormones on American farms, giving you the highest quality turkey for your holiday meal. }
Fresh Whole Turkey | Butterball®
We always get either a Willie Bird or a Diestel Farms turkey. I have a friend who has converted to Heritage Turkeys, but they are outrageously expensive, imo.
The White House staff. Firefighters. Hospital workers. Broadcasters. Policemen. Our military.
These and dozens more represent occupations that have no days off. Holidays are scheduled and accommodations are made.
The issue is, should Thanksgiving become a "retail event"? Retailers are opening on that holiday not because it is essential for their operations, but because they can gin up business on a day that was, here to fore, a holiday with time off.
When the great steel mills flourished up and down the valley, they could not suspend operations for any holiday, including Christmas. But accommodations were made and schedules were drawn up to minimize the staff and more than amply pay those who chose to work. But today, Macy's wants to open shop just to create more business for themselves, and consequently more holiday mania.
No one believes that no one should work on Thanksgiving. But should Thanksgiving be turned into President's Day when precious little time is taken to honor Presidents, but reams of paper are used to advertise mattress sales. Can Thanksgiving be the one spot in the holiday season exempt from the intrusion of trumped up retail promotion?
That is a valid question. And I can appreciate that question.
But once you get into the judgmental aspect that those businesses who open on Sunday are somehow doing their employees a disservice and destroying family values in pursuit of profits, yadda yadda, you are into indefensible territory. You cannot know what the needs or motives of the employer are; what the needs or preferences of the employees are. Or why so many do seem to appreciate the opportunity to shop on that holiday.
To be nostalgic and wish people would observe Thanksgiving in the way you prefer to observe Thanksgiving is a valid wish.
To judge them because they do not, is not.
"Indefensible terrotory" -- that's scary.
"My company right or wrong" huh? Doooooon't think it works that way.
Yes, business IS subject to judgement, like it or not. Is that some kind of heresy?
The reason businesses didn't open in the past is because very few people would come in.
Today grandma is on a cruise with her boyfriend, brother has gone skiing, the kids are with various fathers or mothers, mom and dad are in Palm Springs, the perfect day is shopping, lunch and a movie.
I'm probably going to go out, take a few pictures, do a little shopping. We have CHOSEN to wait until the end of the year and get together for a few days. Schedules and health being what they are, we just aren't able to drive for 12 hours, 6 hours each way, for the sake of one meal. People DO have choices. And it is not someone else's place to make MY choices. And I am not bringing about the death of any great tradition by not making myself sick driving for 12 hours for the sake of one meal.
