Silencing Abortion Protesters: Should the time fit the crime?

[AllieBaba]

A child is viable at 20 weeks.

Abortions take place much later than that, legally.

 

[AllieBaba]

And it's alive in it's mother's womb long before that, evidenced by the fact it has a beating heart and nervous system.

Our newest whacko member is nothing more than another rhetoric spewing nutjob, who has jumped in with both feet assuming we haven't heard this crap before from other spastic newbies who come here looking for free psych evals and ooohs and ahhhhs at what they mistakenly think is their brilliance and originality.

 

[JD_2B]

What difference does it make if the woman was raped or had consensual sex? All in all, these pro lifers who claim that rape is a "good enough" reason to abort (which they call murder in cases involving consensual sex)- only seem to want to see a woman being injured in some way, no matter how you cut it. Most pro lifers with this mindset are misogynists, I think.

I mean- they don't call a rape victim who had an abortion, a murderer- because she had been hurt by the rape- so that's good enough for them, and they can be "merciful" in their very un-christian way, by allowing her an abortion and not calling her, in particular, a murderer.. Also they themselves apply a lower value to fetuses that are the result of rape- they clearly think that "murdering" a "baby" is okay in one instance, and not in another. The mindset is totally inconsistent and lacking all logic..

Then you get to the women who chose to have sex- and whether they have a boatload of children already or not- having an abortion just because they do not wish to be pregnant again is somehow considered "murder", and in this case NOT okay?

The only way pro lifers are ever truly satisfied is if they are hating women.. Thats what it is all about!!

Its sick.. and ps- I am not surprised that one of these sickos has decided to hop onto this forum, no doubt after finding all of my posts, as an obvious way of showing off her own power and control issues, or should I say stalker and lack of self control issues?? LOL!!

Whatev... I don't mind- Come on, AllieBaba, and post some more.. I'm used to dealing with antisocial personalities, lady! Like I said- bring it. Abuse away- I am untouchable to you.

 

[JakeStarkey]

 

[Yukon]

JD,

I agree with you completely. Thanks you for psoting something rational. These lunatics just don't understand that abortion is the legal, God given, right of evey woman in a free and democratic society.

This guy killed two people, this abortion protester, and a grocer. He should spend the rest of his life in prison! How can you say "a light jail sentence"? Did you even read the article you posted???

 

[frazzledgear]

I'd say a relatively light sentence should be the punishment---the time spent in jail, when a citizen is found guilty of silencing hateful protesters who poison the minds of little children. Do you know what I am talking about?

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/12/us/12slay.html

Ya be outraged and defiant that some doctor was murdered and demand the highest price, but hey this guy was just a protester, fuck him, right? Now where is Jillian to tell us how both sides oppose murder and mayhem?

And your opinion is just that JUST an opinion. Millions disagree with your opinion, but you do not mind if they get murdered, right? Unbelievable. You are one sick puppy.

GySgt - have you asked how can any pro-abortion person can claim they oppose murder and keep a straight face while making that dumb claim? Hard to believe any of them can be stupid enough to believe there is no killing involved in an abortion. Or when a pro-abortionist claims to oppose murder, they weren't talking about the murder of unwanted children?

Information is knowledge, right? So what do pro-abortionists really oppose about people seeing those graphic pictures? Offensive to their sensibilities to be confronted with what that unwanted child looked like before and after or what? For those who believe in abortion, surely those pictures of the reality of an abortion would be something that PROVED the "righteousness" of your opinion, right? Those pictures prove the righteousness of MY position -so why don't pictures of REALITY proves the righteousness of YOUR position then?

If they don't, then the problem isn't with the pictures but with your belief system.

I assume you pro-abortionists also know it was Democrats who favored slavery and in fact WERE the slave owners. Proud of it and vigorously defended it. And Democrats used the very same tactics to try and marginalize all those who spoke out against slavery as they still use to this day against those who dare to speak out and oppose Democrat positions they consider to be an abomination, immoral and criminal.

Doesn't it give you pro-abortionists ANY pause that it is your party that ends supporting the most lethal, immoral and abominable positions around -both in the past and today? It doesn't matter if we are discussing slavery; abortion; euthanasia; the creation, killing and harvesting of human embryos like a crop or dehydrating the severely brain damaged to death. If it involves exploiting or killing other human lives that YOU don't own but is done for personal benefit, personal gain or just plain convenience - we can always count on Democrats being right there insisting it is their "right" to do so. Just don't show them any pictures of what their personal opinions put into practice actually look like. Because if you do, they will insisting displaying those pictures of reality makes YOU the "nutjob".

 

[Megan_Fad]

The fact that you so conveniently think it is ok for a so called fetal "human" to be "murdered" to save the mother's life, or to save the woman from emotional distress, as a result of a rape, or incest, tells me that picking and choosing is your specialty. <wink>

Actually, there is a different between &#8220;picking and choosing&#8221; when a woman had no choice in the matter of conceiving a child because she was raped and you picking and choosing who you consider to be &#8220;pro choice&#8221; just so you can prove your point on a message board. Somehow you equating my opinion on rape with your hypocrisy on an internet forum makes me want to puke. I suppose to some people internet stupidity and rape are the same thing&#8230;or something&#8230;sure.

Thanks for the reminder, but little missy, you are at an age when your friends tend to hold the strongest influence over you, including the development of your thoughts and feelings, and development of political opinions. It was not a big leap- you admitted to being a high schooler.

Although I can appreciate your &#8220;educated guess&#8221;, you might want to keep your day job and give up the crap psychology. Just because some textbook somewhere says that &#8220;friends&#8221; will influence adolescents the most still does not mean that I was talking about my &#8220;friends&#8221;. You should stop grasping at straws. Maybe the next website you paruse should be about logic and how one thing does not always equate to another.

Troll.. And I would like to call you another name, but since you are practically still in diapers, and probably have never even driven a motor vehicle before, much less experienced adulthood for what it is, I will go easy on you this time.

Ah, so because I disagree with you, it simply MUST be due to my age not not because you're full of crap? Nicely played...

Troll.. Nanny nanny boo boo back at cha..

Wow...maybe I should keep track of how many times you are going to call me a troll for not seeing things your way...

It is a woman's pregnancy- she owns her uterus, and therefore she controls it.

Until she wants child support then it is the "man's" fault...ooops was I not supposed to say that? Sorry....

My body is my temple, and I will care for it as I see fit. I am the master of my bodily domain.. The queen of this fortress.. the dictator of my land

Which means when you don't want to have a child but participate in behavior with that end result, it is YOUR fault...I am with you so far...

and I have many duties that I have to take responsibility over, for the safety and well being of this body- fiduciary, emotional, physical, and spiritual, of course. Legalized abortion on demand is helpful-

This is exactly what I have been saying. Many women see abortion as a way to "erase" their responsibility of having to care for a child they were too irresponsible to avoid making. I knew that already.

this way, if I get pregnant and do not want to be that way, I do not have to do a belly flop off of a high dive to end the pregnancy, and possibly hurt myself in the process. Thank GOODNESS! Yaaay!

Seems to me it is much more practical to simply avoid getting pregnant to begin with. That way somewhere down the road a person does not have to be born and live with the thought that they were a botched abortion.

That is so true.. Lets go a step further with it, then and stop treating people with HIV, chlamydia, Toxic shock syndrome, or even labor complications. They made their beds, now they are going to lie in them. Further on- we could refuse treatment to firefighters who got burns on the job, and cops who got shot, right? Consent to a potential problem = consent to having to lose the right to get that problem treated, in your mind anyways. /Sarcasm

Actually, sarcasm only works if you are not making a false analogy. You are comparing apples to oranges, which seems to be the only way you can make an argument...well, that and talking down to me from your high horse which you seem to feel entitled to based solely on my age

Good.. I just hope that being a free thinking, intelligent individual allows you to expand your thinking outside of the little box it seems to currently be stuck in.. I think you are capable of it. With time, you will mature and see that there is more than one way to be narrow. When you see that, you will broaden out more, and hopefully, not retain this narrow way of thinking. Good girl..

I kind of like the way that when some people disagree with others, they always blaim them of "being inside the box". Oh and the other is calling them "closed minded". I hate to break it to you, you are stuck in a box just as much as anyone who is "pro life", it is just that your box is a diffrent color, but it is still a box.

Ah but someone did- The attorneys representing Norma McCorvey in Roe V Wade, actually.. and in all this time, the "pro life" group has yet to find an effective artificial uterus that is affordable and effective to full term.. And these same pro lifers, as I stated before, and am now repeating ad nauseum, still have not figured out how to actually support life.. I mean, newborn- adult life, of course.. So whatever they have been doing for the past 30-40 years hasn't made a hill of beans difference besides making it harder and harder for women to abort, and also harder and harder for them to be treated fairly and justly if they do not abort and require the use of public assistance programs.

That has absolutely nothing to do with finding a BETTER solution to the problem, which was the actual spirit of my comment, but I think you knew that.

And I have to again argue that getting pregnant is not a "womans mistake". It is a biological certainty for anyone menstruating, (for 25-35 years), who also has an active, healthy sex life.

So you admit that women know what is going to happen...seems to me that if you know it is going to happen, perhaps more effort should be focused on preventing it to happen in the first place.

Maybe not for you.. But for everyone who chooses it- the current solution is one that a great many women and men are very grateful for.

That does not mean it is the right solution. A great many people are always grateful for the wrong reasons. All one has to do is watch the news to figure that out.

Yeah because having sex is something that is done only by the uneducated irresponsible vagrants of society and all.. lol..

That doesn&#8217;t actually seem to fit my statement at all. Makes me wonder if I proved a good point so you just kind of side stepped it there&#8230;

No way! Murder is wrong.. Abortion, thankfully, is not erasing a life.. Just providing a woman the freedom to not be pregnant anymore.

actually, by your own definition of abortion, it is erasing a life.

Again, again, again.. and again again.. If everyone who consented to doing something, knowing that there could be unwanted results, do we force them to have to live with the undesired outcome? Should all smokers with lung disease be left untreated? Should we burn down all of the rehabilitation clinics? Should we tell the scantily clad rape victims that they are SOL since they should have known better than to dress that way? Should we choose to not arrest men who kill their wives, the wives that chose to stick around for a lifetime of beatings? After all- they should have ALL seen it coming, right? I mean, what goes around comes around- I gotta give you that much..

It is nice to have analogies to argue your point. However the problem with analogies is they rarely talk about the exact issue at hand and they are easily set up to distract from the real issue being discussed. See, no matter what analogies you bring up, they are not this subject, this topic with these same consequences.

As for the rest of your post, please do not pray for me and do not quote the Bible at me. You see, just like your misguided venture at lumping me in with all other teenagers, you are lumping me in with all other pro-lifers. I do not consider myself Christian and I do not let the Bible form my opinions for me. Seems that now it is you who are thinking &#8220;inside the box&#8221;.

 

[JD_2B]

The fact that you so conveniently think it is ok for a so called fetal "human" to be "murdered" to save the mother's life, or to save the woman from emotional distress, as a result of a rape, or incest, tells me that picking and choosing is your specialty. <wink>

Actually, there is a different between “picking and choosing” when a woman had no choice in the matter of conceiving a child because she was raped and you picking and choosing who you consider to be “pro choice” just so you can prove your point on a message board. Somehow you equating my opinion on rape with your hypocrisy on an internet forum makes me want to puke. I suppose to some people internet stupidity and rape are the same thing…or something…sure.

If you truly believe that conception is a choice, based solely on the fact that a woman chooses to partake in love making, then maybe you are a troubled young woman, or maybe your parents taught you that sex is dirty or something. Sex is not dirty- it is wonderful, and an act that lovers very much enjoy sharing in. Also, I really do not know who ever told you that birth control is 100% effective, but I regret to inform you- they lied! It is anything BUT.

Thanks for the reminder, but little missy, you are at an age when your friends tend to hold the strongest influence over you, including the development of your thoughts and feelings, and development of political opinions. It was not a big leap- you admitted to being a high schooler.

Although I can appreciate your “educated guess”, you might want to keep your day job and give up the crap psychology. Just because some textbook somewhere says that “friends” will influence adolescents the most still does not mean that I was talking about my “friends”. You should stop grasping at straws. Maybe the next website you paruse should be about logic and how one thing does not always equate to another.

LOL Well as much as I enjoy discussing this subject with you, I also must say that you have a really crummy way of admitting that the misanthropes that you previously mentioned, are truly the people who are your friends.. And I never once said that these people were the same age as you are. I would be more inclined to think that the biggest social influence in your life are the trolls and flamers of this crappy message board... It does show in many of your posts (and flames and trollish comments, of course)

Ah, so because I disagree with you, it simply MUST be due to my age not not because you're full of crap? Nicely played...
Wow...maybe I should keep track of how many times you are going to call me a troll for not seeing things your way...

Oh quit playing the victim! You were being a troll. I call a spade a spade.. And it had nothing to do with your age, and everything to do with the content of those comments.

Until she wants child support then it is the "man's" fault...ooops was I not supposed to say that? Sorry....

Who is comparing apples and oranges now? A woman's uterus will NEVER belong to a man. It is HER choice to abort or not to abort/ birth or not to birth/ be on a certain birth control or not be on birth control/ sit in a hot tub for hours/ go jet skiing pregnant/ etc, etc, etc.. It is HER UTERUS, not the man's child support payments (which wouldnt even exist, because it is a pregnant woman) we are discussing here.

Which means when you don't want to have a child but participate in behavior with that end result, it is YOUR fault...I am with you so far...

Nope it is not a "womans" fault- and not a mans fault, I should add.. when you don't want to get pregnant. And to some, its less about getting pregnant than it is about the sheer length of time you have to actually BE pregnant that the problem is.

Furthermore- what exactly are you debating? Pregnancy itself, unwanted pregnancy, or abortion? Because it sounds to me that you want to pin the entire "blame" of having a working and healthy uterus combined with ONE highly motive and healthy sperm, solely on the woman. See- being pro-choice- I try to educate people about remedies that men can also take that are overall safe and don't cost an arm and a leg- like taking long hot baths. If a man takes a hot bath for 35-45 minutes a day for a few weeks, and then continues the routine a few days a week after that, the heat alone will destroy the vast majority of the sperm, and make the remaining sperm lose motility. This technique reduces a male's sperm count to approx. 3 million- and a low sperm count is considered about 10 million. The only downside to this is that it MAY (this is being researched) cause the DNA to be altered in the remaining sperm, so a pregnancy may end up in a very unhealthy/deformed ZEF.

This is exactly what I have been saying. Many women see abortion as a way to "erase" their responsibility of having to care for a child they were too irresponsible to avoid making. I knew that already.

LOL!! You and your blame game tactics.. When will you ever realize that women are not all a bunch of dumb retards with zero capacity to make their own responsible decisions?? Again, very misogynistic of you..

Seems to me it is much more practical to simply avoid getting pregnant to begin with. That way somewhere down the road a person does not have to be born and live with the thought that they were a botched abortion.

Sure seems that way- but the statistics on abortion do not lie.. It is not a perfect system, our birth control methods, but they do help somewhat. The best thing you can do is to educate the ill informed about how babies are made, and how to help avoid getting themselves pregnant, if they are not ready for that. This will at least reduce the number of abortions that an individual requires.. and you educating them would make all the difference in their life.

Actually, sarcasm only works if you are not making a false analogy. You are comparing apples to oranges, which seems to be the only way you can make an argument...well, that and talking down to me from your high horse which you seem to feel entitled to based solely on my age

My analogies are just fine- they are made to illustrate a point. Point being- if you are going to apply that logic of "well you knew what could happen, so now you have to live with it, without treatment"- to every other situation that a person was aware of a possible undesirable end result.. Again, this had nothing to do with your age. I do not understand why you keep bringing that up..

I kind of like the way that when some people disagree with others, they always blaim them of "being inside the box". Oh and the other is calling them "closed minded". I hate to break it to you, you are stuck in a box just as much as anyone who is "pro life", it is just that your box is a diffrent color, but it is still a box.

Nah.. I was pro life before.. When I was your age, in fact. Then after my mom found out she had cancer, I found out I was pregnant. I decided to abort. I then realised that pro choice was my new stance on abortion. I am very relieved that the option was available. I needed to be there for my mother.. And I was 18, and not ready for a kid. Once I turned 21 I had a kid, and he is now 10 yrs old. I am glad I waited until I wanted a child, when the timing was better. Oh and I did get temporarily swayed by some rotten pictures of decomposing 3rd trimester abortion pictures, which were actually stillbirths.. and some other pictures by Priests for life, who incidentally do not label their photos properly, gestation wise, which is very misleading. Anyways, after this stint of being pro life for maybe a year again (and only because I had an emotional knee jerk reaction to those images and lies) somebody made me realize that I do still appreciate not completing that first pregnancy. So, I got smart and came back to the winning team- the pro choice team. Being on the pro life side for that time, also made me realize just how much of their arguments are emotive and not fact based- and are ploys for power and control.
Tell me I am still thinking inside of a box, now, little miss muffett...

That has absolutely nothing to do with finding a BETTER solution to the problem, which was the actual spirit of my comment, but I think you knew that.

Actually it had everything to do with finding a better solution- because none of those life saving things are pushed for by the pro life side, as a majority.. but I think YOU knew that.

So you admit that women know what is going to happen...seems to me that if you know it is going to happen, perhaps more effort should be focused on preventing it to happen in the first place.

<sigh> are we walking in circles here??? In 35 years of menstruation, you still do not give anyone any leeway for a sperm not getting caught by the IUD, the Pill, the Condom, etc.. ??? My, you are rigid..

No way! Murder is wrong.. Abortion, thankfully, is not erasing a life.. Just providing a woman the freedom to not be pregnant anymore.

actually, by your own definition of abortion, it is erasing a life.

No its not.. I said abortion is the termination of a pregnancy.. BIG difference there. You can re-read my original post again, if you would like, where I explained the meaning of the word "abort"- to end, and since all abortion does is to legally end a pregnancy- then no life is harmed in the process. Only potential. And YOU surely have the potential to be a doctor or a cop or something- but that potential does not make you a doctor now, does it?

Again, again, again.. and again again.. If everyone who consented to doing something, knowing that there could be unwanted results, do we force them to have to live with the undesired outcome? Should all smokers with lung disease be left untreated? Should we burn down all of the rehabilitation clinics? Should we tell the scantily clad rape victims that they are SOL since they should have known better than to dress that way? Should we choose to not arrest men who kill their wives, the wives that chose to stick around for a lifetime of beatings? After all- they should have ALL seen it coming, right? I mean, what goes around comes around- I gotta give you that much..

It is nice to have analogies to argue your point. However the problem with analogies is they rarely talk about the exact issue at hand and they are easily set up to distract from the real issue being discussed. See, no matter what analogies you bring up, they are not this subject, this topic with these same consequences.

If you only think in black and white, I suppose that would be your response to my very well illustrated analogies.

As for the rest of your post, please do not pray for me and do not quote the Bible at me. You see, just like your misguided venture at lumping me in with all other teenagers, you are lumping me in with all other pro-lifers. I do not consider myself Christian and I do not let the Bible form my opinions for me. Seems that now it is you who are thinking “inside the box”.

Oh youre not a Xian? OK- just seemed that all of your fundamentalist principles are so stemmed in those religious teachings and all..

But no problem. We can leave God out of this. =) PS- I think you are an awfully cute person, and I think that you could potentially be an awesome debater, if you just stop letting things get to you emotionally..

 

[Yukon]

Rape os a crime of convenience for little 'penis-teasers' to use when they go to far.

 

[brewerboy]

Rape os a crime of convenience for little 'penis-teasers' to use when they go to far.

Anyone ever tell you what a douche you are?

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

I'd say a relatively light sentence should be the punishment---the time spent in jail, when a citizen is found guilty of silencing hateful protesters who poison the minds of little children. Do you know what I am talking about?

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/12/us/12slay.html

Didn't I promise not to bust your balls anymore in a thread? I could have sworn I did

This OP sounds like a GIANT TROLL.

I think the killer of the anti-abortion guy should get the same sentance as the guy who killed Dr. Tiller.

 

[JD_2B]

Rape os a crime of convenience for little 'penis-teasers' to use when they go to far.

Yeah, thats it.. Rape is not forced sex- its just an excuse for having a bad morning after.. /sarcasm


But in reality- THAT comment, the one you just made- should really be a big concern to any women you are around regularly..

Rapists tend to be as misogynistic as you are.. Hating women for not wanting anything to do with them.. A vicious cycle that only gets worse- the less contact and confidence with women, the fewer women you talk to, and the more resentment you build up.. causing you to have even less contact, and what little contact you do have being hateful (even if it is not evident on the surface)- causing more resentment, and the cycle continues..

Do you enjoy looking at porn??? I ask because many woman haters turn to porn when they cant get the attention of an ACTUAL female.. LOL

 

[Father Time]

Do you enjoy looking at porn??? I ask because many woman haters turn to porn when they cant get the attention of an ACTUAL female.. LOL

Do you know logic? I ask because that statement reeks of an absolute lack of it.

The fact that rapists enjoy porn does not prove that porn causes rape or is a sign that someone might be a rapist. I'm sure all those rapists enjoyed sushi as well.

The number of people who view porn is in the millions, the amount of rape every year is a lot less than that and the number is a lot lower than it was a couple decade ago (despite the internet giving people access to free porn).

Bureau of Justice Statistics Violent Crime Rate Trends

Also porn is recommended by some sex therapists to spice up the lives of couples. There goes your asinine women hater theory.

 

[RadiomanATL]

I'd say a relatively light sentence should be the punishment---the time spent in jail, when a citizen is found guilty of silencing hateful protesters who poison the minds of little children. Do you know what I am talking about?

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/12/us/12slay.html

To summarize your position:

If someone kills another person whose political views you disagree with, they were doing a public service and should get a light sentence.

You are a complete fucking idiot.

 

[JakeStarkey]

My awesome obeisance to both Megan_Fad and JD_2B for their discussion above.

Yes, some women claim rape when in fact they are trying to escape the consquences of certain behavior that certainly was not rape. They need to be prosecuted fully if the intent is established that they tried to make a man or men take the fall for something she did consensually. They can have time to explain it to Butch down at the women's pen.

Yukon's post reeks of hatred of women, not just of false accusation.

A question: someone please give linkage to credible research that links the convicted rapist and his relationship to porn.

Finally, I think men and women who go to female strip clubs hate women, and go to debase women, thus somehow in a twisted way they are attempting to fell better about their own inadequacies as human beings.

 

[Father Time]

Finally, I think men and women who go to female strip clubs hate women, and go to debase women, thus somehow in a twisted way they are attempting to fell better about their own inadequacies as human beings.

Yes it can't possibly be that they enjoy looking at a naked women.
*facepalm*

 

[JD_2B]

Do you enjoy looking at porn??? I ask because many woman haters turn to porn when they cant get the attention of an ACTUAL female.. LOL

Do you know logic? I ask because that statement reeks of an absolute lack of it.

The fact that rapists enjoy porn does not prove that porn causes rape or is a sign that someone might be a rapist. I'm sure all those rapists enjoyed sushi as well.

Actually, it is THIS comment of YOURS that lacks logic, fella. See, I never once claimed that porn was causative of people committing sex offenses. I just asked the jerk a question. And yes- it is true that many men who cannot get the attention of a female will turn to porn. AND it is true that TED BUNDY, for example, started out with innocent voyeurism (magazines and such) and moved on to peeping, then then on to raping and killing. The fact that you are unaware of any of this stuff makes YOU ignorant- and ignorance, in and of itself, defies logic, in my book.

The number of people who view porn is in the millions, the amount of rape every year is a lot less than that and the number is a lot lower than it was a couple decade ago (despite the internet giving people access to free porn).

Actually the rape numbers have gone up. The methodology of these surveys are admittedly inconsistent- and do not include sexual assault- which is generally a plea bargain that a rapist might choose to use. Being raped is also a highly personal issue that many females do not choose to admit in front of family or friends who might be home at the time..

Source: The National Crime Victimization Survey (NCVS) Ongoing since 1972, this survey of households interviews about 147,300 persons age 12 and older in 82,900 households each year about their victimizations from crime.
Bureau of Justice Statistics Rape Trends

The 2008 surveys interviewed even fewer people-
Bureau of Justice Statistics Criminal Victimization, 2008
During 2008, 42,093 households and 77,852 individuals were interviewed twice for the NCVS.

(Who sits there and admits to being raped to a stranger- especially men? Also there is absolutely no telling how random the areas surveyed are, anyways. Sometimes the person in charge of it might pick places with better demographics and a lower known crime rate, just to make the numbers look better.. and considering that all these numbers only really started so plummet overall during the Reagan and G. Bush, Sr's Administrations, I would not doubt at all that some of it was a bit misconstrued.. I am sure that the numbers for the survey itself are accurate, but I do not believe that the numbers are acurate overall. Think about it, if the number of reported rapes has gone up by a third, and yet the rapes being reported to this program have gone down, then explain to me how these statistics somehow make it down to only 1.9 in a THOUSAND women or girls being raped??

Who are the Victims? | RAINN | Rape, Abuse & Incest National Network

7% of girls in grades 5-8 and 12% of girls in grades 9-12 said they had been sexually abused.

* 3% of boys grades 5-8 and 5% of boys in grades 9-12 said they had been sexually abused.
1998 Commonwealth Fund Survey of the Health of Adolescent Girls. 1998.

93% of juvenile sexual assault victims know their attacker.
* 34.2% of attackers were family members.
* 58.7% were acquaintances.
* Only 7% of the perpetrators were strangers to the victim.
U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics. 2000 Sexual Assault of Young Children as Reported to Law Enforcement. 2000.

Also porn is recommended by some sex therapists to spice up the lives of couples. There goes your asinine women hater theory.

Yep I know- I look at porn too. Never said a damn thing about porn causing people to fucking rape, you dillhole, so why dont you drop that already, lol!!!

 

[JD_2B]

My awesome obeisance to both Megan_Fad and JD_2B for their discussion above.

Yes, some women claim rape when in fact they are trying to escape the consquences of certain behavior that certainly was not rape. They need to be prosecuted fully if the intent is established that they tried to make a man or men take the fall for something she did consensually. They can have time to explain it to Butch down at the women's pen.

I agree- it does happen.. But it is not the primary reason that the VAST majority of rapists go to prison or even get accused of rape, so this argument is a genuine straw man argument. I dont even see how any of this relates to the topic at hand, because the issue we should be discussing is not why men rape or how very few women lie about being raped (which I guaran-fucking-tee you will dramatically increase, if abortion was legal only in cases of rape- LOL!!- We would just press charges later, and say we didnt know who it was. I really despise liars, but I would do it- if I needed an abortion, and I knew nobody would get in trouble, and the law only covered rape victims, anyways- a real long shot, in any case)

A question: someone please give linkage to credible research that links the convicted rapist and his relationship to porn.

OK- I am not going to blow you up with a bunch of inaccurate statistics, but How's this- a list of law firms and psychiatrists/ sex therapists websites that defend sex offenders, and child porn charges- or treat sex addicts, and list these things and charges together at the same time, on the sex offense against children pages, etc.. or the types of crimes that tend to be committed against sex addicts..
Who better to use as a statistical/ empirical data search on, than the lawyers who represent these scumbags and the therapists who try to get them into recovery?

Toms River Child Sexual Abuse Attorney | New Jersey Internet Luring Lawyer | Newark, NJ
"At the first indication that you are being investigated for child sexual abuse, contact an experienced sex crimes defense attorney. David T. Schlendorf is a former prosecutor and a New Jersey-certified criminal defense lawyer. He has experience providing aggressive defense to people charged with sex crimes including the following:

* Intrafamilial child sexual abuse including allegations against uncles, aunts, grandfathers, grandmothers, stepparents, stepsiblings or biological brothers or sisters
* Sexual abuse by neighbors
* Sexual assault by strangers
* Sexual abuse of children by clergy of any denomination
* Sexual abuse of students or summer campers by counselors or teachers
* Sexual harassment in the workplace or other circumstances
* Child pornography (production, distribution and/or possession)"

Sex Crimes Offenses Lawyer Nashville | Child Pornography Attorney Tennessee | Memphis Knoxville TN
"Like in many criminal prosecutions, search and seizure issues play an important role in the defense of child pornography and sex crimes cases. Often times, police seize computers or other potential evidence or force the collection of DNA."

On this site- Child abuse and child porn are listed on top of each other- and this firm only defends sex offenders- but apparently a lot of them get kiddy porn charges, it would seem-
New York Child Pornography Crimes Lawyer - The Law Offices of Brian D. Perskin

Both the state of Pennsylvania and the Federal Government actively investigate and prosecute Internet sex crimes, including online solicitation of a minor.We provide a tough defense against state and federal sex crimes charges, including:

* Child pornography: production/dissemination/possession
* Violation of local obscenity ordinances
* Sexual solicitation of a minor or online solicitation
* Sending sexually explicit materials to children
* Sex with a minor
* Rape, sexual assault, criminal sexual conduct

Oh and there is always this site here- maybe all the defense attorneys' advertising to accused (and repeat) sex offenders doesnt convince you, so lets hope these help you somewhat come to terms with reality:

SexHelp.com - Sex Addiction

"No single behavior pattern defines sexual addiction. These behaviors, when they have taken control of addicts' lives and become unmanageable, include: compulsive masturbation, compulsive heterosexual and homosexual relationships, pornography, prostitution, exhibitionism, voyeurism, indecent phone calls, child molesting, incest, rape and violence. Even the healthiest forms of human sexual expression can turn into self-defeating behaviors."

Anti-Pornography? You Should Be... - - - Articles - Treating Pornography Addiction
around 10% of all adults who engage in viewing pornography feel that they are addicted. These are self-reports of men and women who cannot stop viewing pornography. The consequences of pornography addiction (dependence) may not always be clear, but let me list a few consequences that I have personally observed.

* Separation and divorce
* Being unavailable to children
* Job loss
* A fiance ending the relationship
* An increased tendency to argue
* Lack of trust in relationships
* Sexually acting out

ObscenityCrimes.org
The word "pornography" comes from the Greek words "porno" and "graphia" meaning "depictions of the activities of whores." In common parlance, it usually means, "material that is sexually explicit and intended primarily for the purpose of sexual arousal."
As a clinical psychologist, I have treated, over the years, approximately 350 sex addicts, sex offenders, or other individuals (96% male) with sexual illnesses. This includes many types of unwanted compulsive sexual acting-out, plus such things as child molestation, exhibitionism, voyeurism, sadomasochism, fetishism, and rape. With several exceptions, pornography has been a major or minor contributor or facilitator in the acquisition of their deviation or sexual addiction.

Finally, I think men and women who go to female strip clubs hate women, and go to debase women, thus somehow in a twisted way they are attempting to fell better about their own inadequacies as human beings.

What? You've never watched Jerry Springer, when you needed to put things in perspective? LOL!! I get that you are trying to be sarcastic here, but in reality- it makes too much sense to actually be funny.. And replace "inadequacies as... " with "pornography withdrawals" and you will have hit the nail right on the head.

 

[Father Time]

Do you enjoy looking at porn??? I ask because many woman haters turn to porn when they cant get the attention of an ACTUAL female.. LOL

Do you know logic? I ask because that statement reeks of an absolute lack of it.

The fact that rapists enjoy porn does not prove that porn causes rape or is a sign that someone might be a rapist. I'm sure all those rapists enjoyed sushi as well.

Actually, it is THIS comment of YOURS that lacks logic, fella. See, I never once claimed that porn was causative of people committing sex offenses. I just asked the jerk a question. And yes- it is true that many men who cannot get the attention of a female will turn to porn. AND it is true that TED BUNDY, for example, started out with innocent voyeurism (magazines and such) and moved on to peeping, then then on to raping and killing. The fact that you are unaware of any of this stuff makes YOU ignorant- and ignorance, in and of itself, defies logic, in my book.

Yes I know, but insane people such as bundy can be set off by anything, one woman was triggered by a spider to drown her kids. In either case it's 1/millions. Insignificant.

Actually the rape numbers have gone up.

From a couple decades ago? Let's see 2008-.8 per 100,000 1980s lowest rape rate number was 1.7. Yes it's gone up from the past couple years but it appears to be a fluke from the general trend of the falling rate.

 

[JD_2B]

Do you know logic? I ask because that statement reeks of an absolute lack of it.

The fact that rapists enjoy porn does not prove that porn causes rape or is a sign that someone might be a rapist. I'm sure all those rapists enjoyed sushi as well.

Actually, it is THIS comment of YOURS that lacks logic, fella. See, I never once claimed that porn was causative of people committing sex offenses. I just asked the jerk a question. And yes- it is true that many men who cannot get the attention of a female will turn to porn. AND it is true that TED BUNDY, for example, started out with innocent voyeurism (magazines and such) and moved on to peeping, then then on to raping and killing. The fact that you are unaware of any of this stuff makes YOU ignorant- and ignorance, in and of itself, defies logic, in my book.

Yes I know, but insane people such as bundy can be set off by anything, one woman was triggered by a spider to drown her kids. In either case it's 1/millions. Insignificant.

Bundy wasn't truly insane- a bit of a psychopath, and a definite sociopath, yes- a misogynist, yes- but all the while, very charming, cunning, well educated, and yes- sane. Not since the early 1800s has "morally insane" even been the term to describe this pathology. Ugh that was a bad example on my part..

Please educate yourself on killer rapists.. (keyword sociopaths and antisocial personality disorder) - And keep in mind, sociopaths are a more common killer rapist- and my original Bundy example was obviously a bad one- Bundy was only one of of maybe 2 or 3 serial killers in history who was likely more of a sociopath than psychopath.. So I do see your point in using the word insane here- I don't discount that- but the point I was making was that rapists (date rape, even) tend to be sociopathic. OK I am backsliding here a little bit- LOL- Sorry.. Do forgive me. =) Lets get back on pure rapists- just consider the following..

Sociopath traits: Sociopath characteristics and realtionships with sociopaths | Jubave.com
3 Sociopath traits you must know

Lack of empathy

This sociopath trait is the one that differentiates sociopath the most. Often they will try to seem emphatic or act empathic but sociopaths never feel it. Not even a single &#8220;drop&#8221; of empathy. Also, this sociopath characteristic is perhaps most difficult to spot, as social norms do not require frequent displays of empathy. Crying during a movie is not something we usually do even if we feel like crying.

Emotional shallowness

This is another of those sociopath characteristics that are hard to spot at first glance. But there is a way to uncover this trait. Sociopaths tend to use emotional outbursts to their own advantage when manipulating ones they interact with, or should I say their victims. You can spot this sociopath characteristic by observing their behavioral patterns. This would require you to be in some kind of a relationship with a sociopath.

Manipulation

Manipulation as one of sociopath traits is closely tied with their view of the world and their place in that world. Sociopaths view the world differently. Other people are not subjects of their experience but rather objects. They play with other people as if other people are toys. They lie. They are prepared to undertake well structured plans to manipulate their victims. The ones that are at most risk are the ones in a relationship with a sociopath.

These sociopath characteristics are the most important ones, but there are many more. It&#8217;s very important to pay attention to somebody&#8217;s behavior in order to spot these most important sociopath behavioral traits.

More-
Profile of the Sociopath

Amazingly- even CPS workers (happened to stumble upon this- have a sociopathic self described CW worker that has been flaming me in another thread, so I thought it was amusing) tend to be sociopathic..not insane
CPS People fit the Profile of a Sociopath

Actually the rape numbers have gone up.

From a couple decades ago? Let's see 2008-.8 per 100,000 1980s lowest rape rate number was 1.7. Yes it's gone up from the past couple years but it appears to be a fluke from the general trend of the falling rate.

I see you did not even take a moment to glance at the statistics I posted.
A different survey showed that 7% of elementary kids reported to law enforcement as being sexually abused. 7% is, right there, 7.0 per 100, not 8/10ths of one per 100,000.

The study you posted is also only a phone call to 40,000 homes- and is not even acounting for actual reported cases, the way my study does. Yours is incorrect, and the DOJ should do something to amend that.