Obama's right Cheney is wrong...

[Annie]

Annie, are your making up strawmen?

Hezbollah is not "out of Lebanon." But their influence decreased after Obama's speech.

Obama has done more to defeat extemism than any other American because he is smart. He knows we are in a political war, that can only be won by the muslims themselves.

Links to your claims? There's nothing there to back you up that I've seen. Contrarily they are so entrenched now, within the past year, the revolution is dead.

 

[Chris]

Annie, are your making up strawmen?

Hezbollah is not "out of Lebanon." But their influence decreased after Obama's speech.

Obama has done more to defeat extemism than any other American because he is smart. He knows we are in a political war, that can only be won by the muslims themselves.

Links to your claims? There's nothing there to back you up that I've seen. Contrarily they are so entrenched now, within the past year, the revolution is dead.

I have linked this here many times. You need to do more reading.

But it is 3 in the morning, and I have to go to sleep.

Pakistan Taliban Seen As Threat By More Than 80% Of Population: Poll

Did Obama's Cairo Speech Change Everything? | The American Prospect

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Caught on a Civilian flight in US airspace. No choice but to try him in Federal Court. The only problem I have is the shyness the Administration had in deciding it REALLY was a terror attack.

 

[veritas]

Caught on a Civilian flight in US airspace. No choice but to try him in Federal Court. The only problem I have is the shyness the Administration had in deciding it REALLY was a terror attack.

What shyness? CNN had it on almost immediately that the WH considered it a terrorist attack. Just because Obama wasn't in front of cameras saying it forthwith, doesn't mean they didn't call it that at the get go.

You need more/better news sources.

 

[Xenophon]

This is the road that lead to 9/11 in the first place, treating terorism as a 'police' matter.

It does show that some people never learn.

 

[Diuretic]

You know that old saw about repeating failure? Cheney is locked into it. He is static interfering with the real picture.

Interesting how George Bush seems to be fairly quiet about contemporary issues but Cheney has a need to keep banging on.

So, who ran the White House under BushCheney?

BushCheney was a monumental failure in terms of the battle with extremists because it played to the gallery for political reasons instead of looking at dealing with the real causes.

The BushCheney boosters need to understand that their team failed. Failed in epic proportions. Whine all you like but the results are there. When it comes to election time the BushCheney boosters will be sorely aggrieved, yet again. Try to keep up, things change on a daily basis. Ignore the fool Cheney, let him rant and rave in his impotence.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

This is the road that lead to 9/11 in the first place, treating terorism as a 'police' matter.

It does show that some people never learn.

NO this is a matter of where , when and HOW captured. The Constitution is clear on what rights people have INSIDE the United States. And we already had the Bush team try this route, they lost. The Supreme Court ruled against them.

The Federal Courts are quite able to handle cases like this, they are after all in the Business to try people for crimes. BIG or small. There is NO REASON to claim the courts can not handle this case. It is in their jurisdiction and clearly falls to them to handle.

How ever we do not need liberal pea brains claiming terrorists captured outside the US should be tried by the Federal Court System. Again entirely different beast. A matter of where and how captured.

The people the Obama Administration are transferring to Federal Court from Gitmo are a HUGE problem. And it required that this Administration admit UP FRONT that it is nothing more than a Kangaroo Court. No matter the verdict those guys won't be set free. They can not get a "FAIR" trial as defined by our court system and our Constitution in Federal Court. They are right off the bat assumed guilty as evidenced by the Statements of the White House and the talking heads that even if found not guilty they won't be freed.

They were captured not by law enforcement but by spies and Military. Some were captured by foreign groups and delivered to the US military or spy system that initially held them.

No Miranda rights, no rights to an attorney when captured, no innocent till proven guilty, no speedy trial ensured. Further they were subjected to none Miranda interrogations without the right to a lawyer present.

All of those conditions can be ignored in a Military Tribunal, they can NOT be ignored in the Federal Court system. By technicality, in Federal Court those men MUST be turned loose.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

You know that old saw about repeating failure? Cheney is locked into it. He is static interfering with the real picture.

Interesting how George Bush seems to be fairly quiet about contemporary issues but Cheney has a need to keep banging on.

So, who ran the White House under BushCheney?

BushCheney was a monumental failure in terms of the battle with extremists because it played to the gallery for political reasons instead of looking at dealing with the real causes.

The BushCheney boosters need to understand that their team failed. Failed in epic proportions. Whine all you like but the results are there. When it comes to election time the BushCheney boosters will be sorely aggrieved, yet again. Try to keep up, things change on a daily basis. Ignore the fool Cheney, let him rant and rave in his impotence.

Your IGNORANT rant is noted and put on the rubbish pile where it belongs, hopefully some one will come along and light the pile afire and clear the fumes of the stink of your idiotic claims.

 

[California Girl]

Obama has almost single handedly destroyed islamic extremist mythology.

The result has been the defeat of Hezbollah in the Lebanese elections, the Pakistani government attacking the Taliban's bases, and the near destruction of the government in Iran.

But the moronic right doesn't get it. There are one billion muslims in the world. Only the muslims can defeat islamic extremism.

Oh, wait. Were you serious?

 

[Sarah G]

58% Favor Waterboarding of Plane Terrorist To Get Information - Rasmussen Reports™

58% Favor Waterboarding of Plane Terrorist To Get Information
Thursday, December 31, 2009

Fifty-eight percent (58%) of U.S. voters say waterboarding and other aggressive interrogation techniques should be used to gain information from the terrorist who attempted to bomb an airliner on Christmas Day.

A new Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey finds that just 30% oppose the use of such techniques, and another 12% are not sure.

Men and younger voters are more strongly supportive of the aggressive interrogation techniques than women and those who are older. Republicans and voters not affiliated with either major party favor their use more than Democrats.

Seventy-one percent (71%) of all voters think the attempt by the Nigerian Muslim to blow up the airliner as it landed in Detroit should be investigated by military authorities as a terrorist act. Only 22% say it should be handled by civilian authorities as a criminal act, as is currently the case.

And Republicans continue to point to Rasmussen as a credible source knowing that they are about all good things Republican. Out of sync and outliar polling.

If it makes you feel better about who agrees with chickenhawk torture though...

 

[gautama]

Obama has almost single handedly destroyed islamic extremist mythology.

The result has been the defeat of Hezbollah in the Lebanese elections, the Pakistani government attacking the Taliban's bases, and the near destruction of the government in Iran.

But the moronic right doesn't get it. There are one billion muslims in the world. Only the muslims can defeat islamic extremism.

Pissy Chrissy, the Obamarrhoid Wonder states:

"Only the muslims can defeat islamic extremism."

Hmmmmm.....lets see now.

We could have defeated the Nazis by doing nothing because:

"Only the Nazis can defeat Nazis".

We could have defeated the Commies in the Cold War, by doing nothing because:

"Only the Commies can defeat Commies."

Let's elect Obamarrhoidal Idiots like Pissy Chrissy.....oh, wait. We already have those Idiots in power.

 

[PatekPhilippe]

Obama has almost single handedly destroyed islamic extremist mythology.

The result has been the defeat of Hezbollah in the Lebanese elections, the Pakistani government attacking the Taliban's bases, and the near destruction of the government in Iran.

But the moronic right doesn't get it. There are one billion muslims in the world. Only the muslims can defeat islamic extremism.

you and the members who thanked you in the quoted post are asleep at the switch. Your anti war liberal bravado is noted and it should be known that it is, in fact, meaningless at this point unless you are trying to relive your fucked up doper hippie days one more time before you die of a heart attack from all that KFC. People of the same mind as you are directly responsible for the situation that led up to 9/11. You are in good company...Janet Reno, Sandy Burglar, Richard Clarke and George Tenet among many....all blind to what was happening right under their noses.

Now we have the same situation being built once again by the kneejerk reactionaries who went on an Apology Tour to the Middle East, turned FISA and the Patriot Act against our own people, accused the CIA of torture and declaring the War on Terror is over. Obama lives in the land of make believe. He thinks there is no war on terror and even avoids using the word as much as possible...only mentioning it when he's blaming Bush for something or needs to whip up support from his 22%'ers.

 

[gautama]

Thursday, December 31, 2009

FORMER VICE president Richard B. Cheney on Wednesday joined a Republican chorus criticizing the Obama administration's decision to charge alleged bomber Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab in federal court. Mr. Cheney and others argue that Mr. Abdulmutallab, who is accused of trying to down Northwest Flight 253 over Detroit on Christmas, should have been held as an enemy combatant and pumped for information, rather than read his Miranda rights and provided a lawyer. They further argue that the decision to shuttle him to federal court shows that President Obama is in denial about the dangers of terrorism.
This Story

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Dick Cheney's loose lips
*

*
Criminal or combatant?

This last claim has no merit. Just as it would be a mistake to approach all terrorist acts as a law enforcement challenge, so would it be imprudent to dispense with strong and available law enforcement tools, and to deal with all such incidents as acts of war. Recall that the Bush administration prosecuted shoe bomber Richard Reid in federal court for attempting to down a transatlantic flight using the same type of explosives allegedly found on Mr. Abdulmutallab. No one then questioned the Bush-Cheney administration's judgment or its resolve -- and rightly so.

The prospects for Mr. Abdulmutallab's prosecution are good. Multiple eyewitnesses can testify to the incident on the plane, and physical evidence, including the failed explosive device, has been recovered. If the case goes to trial, there is probably little danger that secret sources or methods will be exposed.
ad_icon

Yet part of the critics' argument is worthy of discussion. Mr. Abdulmutallab could have been detained without charge and interrogated outside of the constraints of federal rules to give the administration an opportunity to gather information in hopes of thwarting a future attack. The Supreme Court has acknowledged this authority, and the Obama administration has gone so far as to argue that Congress, through the 2001 Authorization for the Use of Military Force, gave the president the right to hold combatants indefinitely as long as a court of law rules that the initial detention was justified.

So why not bundle the Nigerian suspect to a secure location for intensive questioning by the CIA? First, because he already has been talking to authorities about his affiliation with al-Qaeda and the possibility of other attacks. Second, because he is no Khalid Sheik Mohammed -- he is not a seasoned al-Qaeda operator but a disturbed young man whom the group tried to use as cannon fodder.

Most important, the Bush administration's own experience has showed that holding suspects as enemy combatants creates more problems than it solves, because of the lack of due process and legal accountability. We have called for the creation of a national security court to govern presidential decisions to detain those who are too dangerous to release but against whom there is insufficient evidence to hold under federal criminal statutes. This authority could be valuable in interrogating those high up in a terrorist organization who are believed to possess significant operational information. It would be wasted on Mr. Abdulmutallab.

I have addressed the issues of this OP, America'sBlind's post in quite a few of my posts.

It seems obvious to me that it is ABSOLUTELY DISASTROUS to call our ISLAMOFASCISTIC TERRORIST ENEMY and the WAR against this TERRORISTIC RELIGIOUS FANATICAL SAVAGES as "Man Made Disaster" units or facilitators, and "Overseas Contingency Operations", respectively.......as our MARXIST Obami Salami's stooge Napolitansky did with much hoopla and fanfare on National TV......OUTLAWING the use of the terms "Terrorist" and "War on Terror".

We must abandon this IDIOTICALLY RIDICULOUS POSTURE of the MARXIST Obami Salami and his OBAMARRHOIDAL STOOGES who are in the throes of some PHANTASMAGORICAL DELUSION that we can PLACATE these ISLAMOFASCISTIC PSYCHOS by considering their, under the circumstances, BIZARRE and IMAGINARY "RIGHTS" more important than the lives of American Citizens.

 

[Misty]

Obama has almost single handedly destroyed islamic extremist mythology.

The result has been the defeat of Hezbollah in the Lebanese elections, the Pakistani government attacking the Taliban's bases, and the near destruction of the government in Iran.

But the moronic right doesn't get it. There are one billion muslims in the world. Only the muslims can defeat islamic extremism.

thanks to Obama;

"We've seen an increased number of arrests here in the U.S. of individuals suspected of plotting terrorist attacks, or supporting terror groups abroad such as Al Qaeda," Napolitano said in a speech in New York. "Home-based terrorism is here. And, like violent extremism abroad, it will be part of the threat picture that we must now confront."

 

[PatekPhilippe]

Obama has almost single handedly destroyed islamic extremist mythology.

The result has been the defeat of Hezbollah in the Lebanese elections, the Pakistani government attacking the Taliban's bases, and the near destruction of the government in Iran.

But the moronic right doesn't get it. There are one billion muslims in the world. Only the muslims can defeat islamic extremism.

thanks to Obama;

"We've seen an increased number of arrests here in the U.S. of individuals suspected of plotting terrorist attacks, or supporting terror groups abroad such as Al Qaeda," Napolitano said in a speech in New York. "Home-based terrorism is here. And, like violent extremism abroad, it will be part of the threat picture that we must now confront."

What Napolitano, the head moron in charge of the DHS, forgot to add was that she, in her infinite stupidity and incompetence, cannot do a thing about it.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Obama has almost single handedly destroyed islamic extremist mythology.

The result has been the defeat of Hezbollah in the Lebanese elections, the Pakistani government attacking the Taliban's bases, and the near destruction of the government in Iran.

But the moronic right doesn't get it. There are one billion muslims in the world. Only the muslims can defeat islamic extremism.

Pissy Chrissy, the Obamarrhoid Wonder states:

"Only the muslims can defeat islamic extremism."

Hmmmmm.....lets see now.

We could have defeated the Nazis by doing nothing because:

"Only the Nazis can defeat Nazis".

We could have defeated the Commies in the Cold War, by doing nothing because:

"Only the Commies can defeat Commies."

Let's elect Obamarrhoidal Idiots like Pissy Chrissy.....oh, wait. We already have those Idiots in power.

Al Qaeda is not a country, Corky.

jeezus

 

[gautama]

Thursday, December 31, 2009

FORMER VICE president Richard B. Cheney on Wednesday joined a Republican chorus criticizing the Obama administration's decision to charge alleged bomber Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab in federal court. Mr. Cheney and others argue that Mr. Abdulmutallab, who is accused of trying to down Northwest Flight 253 over Detroit on Christmas, should have been held as an enemy combatant and pumped for information, rather than read his Miranda rights and provided a lawyer. They further argue that the decision to shuttle him to federal court shows that President Obama is in denial about the dangers of terrorism.
This Story

*
Dick Cheney's loose lips
*

*
Criminal or combatant?

This last claim has no merit. Just as it would be a mistake to approach all terrorist acts as a law enforcement challenge, so would it be imprudent to dispense with strong and available law enforcement tools, and to deal with all such incidents as acts of war. Recall that the Bush administration prosecuted shoe bomber Richard Reid in federal court for attempting to down a transatlantic flight using the same type of explosives allegedly found on Mr. Abdulmutallab. No one then questioned the Bush-Cheney administration's judgment or its resolve -- and rightly so.

The prospects for Mr. Abdulmutallab's prosecution are good. Multiple eyewitnesses can testify to the incident on the plane, and physical evidence, including the failed explosive device, has been recovered. If the case goes to trial, there is probably little danger that secret sources or methods will be exposed.
ad_icon

Yet part of the critics' argument is worthy of discussion. Mr. Abdulmutallab could have been detained without charge and interrogated outside of the constraints of federal rules to give the administration an opportunity to gather information in hopes of thwarting a future attack. The Supreme Court has acknowledged this authority, and the Obama administration has gone so far as to argue that Congress, through the 2001 Authorization for the Use of Military Force, gave the president the right to hold combatants indefinitely as long as a court of law rules that the initial detention was justified.

So why not bundle the Nigerian suspect to a secure location for intensive questioning by the CIA? First, because he already has been talking to authorities about his affiliation with al-Qaeda and the possibility of other attacks. Second, because he is no Khalid Sheik Mohammed -- he is not a seasoned al-Qaeda operator but a disturbed young man whom the group tried to use as cannon fodder.

Most important, the Bush administration's own experience has showed that holding suspects as enemy combatants creates more problems than it solves, because of the lack of due process and legal accountability. We have called for the creation of a national security court to govern presidential decisions to detain those who are too dangerous to release but against whom there is insufficient evidence to hold under federal criminal statutes. This authority could be valuable in interrogating those high up in a terrorist organization who are believed to possess significant operational information. It would be wasted on Mr. Abdulmutallab.

One wonders how it is possible for someone sincerely interested in blocking our BLATANTLY OBVIOUS Islamofascist enemy by considering some semi-retarded Muslim youngster in getting all the explosives, and being financially equipped to carry out the Terrorist Agenda by booking flights, etc....AS AN ISOLATED EXTREMIST as our Home Security Genius Janet Napolitansky repeatedly claims.

MARXIST Obami Salami, and his Obamarrhoidal stooges are behaving as though they are in some sort of PC induced trance where these EXTREMELY WELL ORGANIZED RELIGIOUSLY MOTIVATED SAVAGE FANATICS i.e. Al QUEDA, whose network is connected to IRAN, in that though disparate, are UNITED IN THE AVOWED COMMON GOAL of DESTROYING AMERICA as the GREAT SATAN, and Israel, as the SMALLER VERSION of us.

THESE EXTREMELY DANGEROUS ORGANIZED RELIGIOUS FANATICS.....are MIS-IDENTIFIED by our LA LA LAND OBAMARRHOIDS as "ISOLATED EXTREMISTS" who are misguided "CRIMINALS" to be treated as such by giving them "RIGHTS" identical to those of delinquent American Citizens, with attendant lawyers who come between OTHERWISE DIRECT "FACE-TO-FACE" INTERROGATION, are MIRANDIZED, and the SUPPOSEDLY "speedy trial" of our Court System (which is usually dragged out for YEARS)......turned into Fan Fared Hoopla CIRCUS ACTS that give the TERRORISTS the platform to speechify their PROPAGANDA to their Allies around the World.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Al Qaeda Leader Behind Northwest Flight 253 Terror Plot Was Released by U.S.

Former Guantanamo Prisoner Believed Behind Northwest Airlines Bomb Plot; Sent to Saudi Arabia in 2007


Northwest Flight 253: al Qaeda Leader Behind Terror Plot Was Released by U.S. - ABC News

 

[JakeStarkey]

Obama has almost single handedly destroyed islamic extremist mythology.

The result has been the defeat of Hezbollah in the Lebanese elections, the Pakistani government attacking the Taliban's bases, and the near destruction of the government in Iran.

But the moronic right doesn't get it. There are one billion muslims in the world. Only the muslims can defeat islamic extremism.

No Chris, you fail to see the light on the train.

The train is bearing down on Annie as she points in the other direction.

 

[kyzr]

Obama has almost single handedly destroyed islamic extremist mythology.

The result has been the defeat of Hezbollah in the Lebanese elections, the Pakistani government attacking the Taliban's bases, and the near destruction of the government in Iran.

But the moronic right doesn't get it. There are one billion muslims in the world. Only the muslims can defeat islamic extremism.

No Chris, you fail to see the light on the train.

The train is bearing down on Annie as she points in the other direction.

....."Only the muslims can defeat islamic extremism"

Truer words were never spoken. It is entirely on muslims to stop terrorism.