Obama Voters, The Real Failures

[Jackson]

Doesn't put boots on the ground or rely on a 10 year commitment. He can stop the bombing on a moment's notice. And he probably will when people stop caring.

In other words, his "coalition of forces" to go after the EVIL ISIL was just another political move. He'll stop the bombing and leave any coalition members hanging once people "stop caring". That sounds like the Obama we all have learned to know, love and respect!

And this is a bad thing, why?

frankly, we are still in Afghanistan after 13 years, no closer to our goal now than we were then.

Hey, you guys want a war, that's fine. Let's have a war.

Let's actually DECLARE war, institute a draft to build up an army and raise taxes to pay for it. If that's what you guys want to do, put your money where your mouth is.

If the IRaqis and Syrians don't see beating ISIL as a big priority, why should we?

Because he he tells his coalition members and the American people he will destroy ISIS. He sells the idea to coalition members who get the backing from their people. They make a commitment just as we did.

Then Obama gets weak kneed because he's driven by polls and pulls out, leaving his coalition without the US forces to continue the fight with them. He lets down allies in a fight he committed to, to get them on board originally. That's what is wrong with his foreign policy all along. No country can depend on him.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Yawn, I was in the Army at the last stage of the Cold War and we convinced ourselves the Russians were these horrible bogymen...

And they really weren't. The "Evil Empire" just happened to be a group of poor countries that were probably just as scared of us as we were of them.

Maybe you need to stop reading Reverand Moon's version of history.

I just posted facts.

You, an update on your hallucinations.

Look, I know you are a card-carrying Moonie and stuff, but the rest of us aren't still obsessed about the mean old Communists.

Call me silly...but it irritates me when a particular group is known for mass murder, 100 million slaughtered, and some.....you......shrug it off.

And new research suggests that these numbers are conservative in the cases of Stalin and Mao who may have been responsible for more than 60 million deaths each.

So.....what does that make you, ignorant, or a fool?

 

[candycorn]

Doesn't put boots on the ground or rely on a 10 year commitment. He can stop the bombing on a moment's notice. And he probably will when people stop caring.

In other words, his "coalition of forces" to go after the EVIL ISIL was just another political move. He'll stop the bombing and leave any coalition members hanging once people "stop caring". That sounds like the Obama we all have learned to know, love and respect!

And this is a bad thing, why?

frankly, we are still in Afghanistan after 13 years, no closer to our goal now than we were then.

Hey, you guys want a war, that's fine. Let's have a war.

Let's actually DECLARE war, institute a draft to build up an army and raise taxes to pay for it. If that's what you guys want to do, put your money where your mouth is.

If the IRaqis and Syrians don't see beating ISIL as a big priority, why should we?

Because he he tells his coalition members and the American people he will destroy ISIS. He sells the idea to coalition members who get the backing from their people. They make a commitment just as we did.

Then Obama gets weak kneed because he's driven by polls and pulls out, leaving his coalition without the US forces to continue the fight with them. He lets down allies in a fight he committed to, to get them on board originally. That's what is wrong with his foreign policy all along. No country can depend on him.

A simple yes or no please.

Do you want to send American ground troops back into Iraq?

 

[Bfgrn]

You understand that doesnt prove anything, right?
btw we can fact check Factcheck.org here:
Health Care Summit Squabbles
They were completely wrong. Lamar Alexander was right. Premiums have risen substantially as a result of Obamacare.

Premiums HAD risen substantially BEFORE the ACA. As a matter of FACT it was substantial increases like a 39 percent rise sought by Anthem Blue Cross in 2010 that helped give impetus to the law. Increases before the ACA were out of control.

Obamacare Premium Hikes Relatively Modest, Non-Partisan CBO Says

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The average premium for an Obamacare benchmark plan will rise slightly in 2015 and increase about 6 percent a year during the rest of this decade, the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office (CBO) said on Monday in a report the White House trumpeted as proof its healthcare reform was working.

Obamacare marketplace plans are available over a range of quality levels, from lower-cost "bronze" coverage to top quality "platinum" plans. The CBO report looked at mid-tier "silver" plans that are used as benchmarks in determining how much federal money consumers can receive under the law to help cover insurance costs.

Government researchers concluded that the average annual premium of the second-lowest-cost "silver" plan would increase by only about 2.6 percent to $3,900 in 2015 from the current $3,800.

The cost would rise more rapidly to $4,400 in 2016 and about $6,900 in 2024. "Thus, premiums are projected to increase by about 6 percent per year on average from 2016 to 2024," the CBO report said.

The CBO also noted that its 2016 projection is 15 percent lower than its initial forecast in 2009.

more

Five facts about Obamacare and health premiums

Insurance premium growth has wiped out the last decade of wage growth. Overall, that middle-income family saw its income go up by $23,000, from $76,000 in 1999 to $99,000 in 2009 — not too bad. But rising health-care costs in the form of increased insurance premiums and co-pays, ate up nearly all of that. Factor in that spending, as a recent Health Affairs article did, and the average family only had $95 a month more in available income than it did a decade ago.

The Affordable Care Act has returned more than $1 billion in premiums to consumers in the form of insurance rebates. The health care law requires insurance companies to spend at least 80 percent of subscriber dollars on medical care. If they spend less than that, the difference must be made up in a rebate to insurance subscribers.
In 2011, the year that provision went into effect, health insurers sent out $1.1 billion in rebates to 12.8 million American households. They averaged $151 per household, with Vermont seeing the highest rebates (their average check was $807 in the individual market). Using the numbers from the Commonwealth Fund above, that would work out to a 1 percent decrease in premiums for the average family.


5. Regulators rejected or lowered at least 924 insurer rate hikes in 2010. While the federal government cannot reject rate hikes, regulators in 37 states do have that authority. The Government Accountability Office looked at how frequently regulators exercised that authority. It found that in 36 states, regulators had turned back over 900 rate increases. Colorado and Ohio overturned more than 100 each.

So, how'd they get 14 insurance companies to lower or withdraw their rates? They sat down and negotiated with the insurers. And it worked. "Officials from the California Department of Insurance told us that they negotiated with carriers to reduce proposed rates by 2 percentage points to 25 percentage points in 2010," the GAO report says. "These officials also told us that they negotiated with one carrier not to raise rates in 2010 although the carrier had originally proposed a 10-percent average increase in rates."

more

 

[PoliticalChic]

You understand that doesnt prove anything, right?
btw we can fact check Factcheck.org here:
Health Care Summit Squabbles
They were completely wrong. Lamar Alexander was right. Premiums have risen substantially as a result of Obamacare.

Premiums HAD risen substantially BEFORE the ACA. As a matter of FACT it was substantial increases like a 39 percent rise sought by Anthem Blue Cross in 2010 that helped give impetus to the law. Increases before the ACA were out of control.

Obamacare Premium Hikes Relatively Modest, Non-Partisan CBO Says

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The average premium for an Obamacare benchmark plan will rise slightly in 2015 and increase about 6 percent a year during the rest of this decade, the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office (CBO) said on Monday in a report the White House trumpeted as proof its healthcare reform was working.

Obamacare marketplace plans are available over a range of quality levels, from lower-cost "bronze" coverage to top quality "platinum" plans. The CBO report looked at mid-tier "silver" plans that are used as benchmarks in determining how much federal money consumers can receive under the law to help cover insurance costs.

Government researchers concluded that the average annual premium of the second-lowest-cost "silver" plan would increase by only about 2.6 percent to $3,900 in 2015 from the current $3,800.

The cost would rise more rapidly to $4,400 in 2016 and about $6,900 in 2024. "Thus, premiums are projected to increase by about 6 percent per year on average from 2016 to 2024," the CBO report said.

The CBO also noted that its 2016 projection is 15 percent lower than its initial forecast in 2009.

more

Five facts about Obamacare and health premiums

Insurance premium growth has wiped out the last decade of wage growth. Overall, that middle-income family saw its income go up by $23,000, from $76,000 in 1999 to $99,000 in 2009 — not too bad. But rising health-care costs in the form of increased insurance premiums and co-pays, ate up nearly all of that. Factor in that spending, as a recent Health Affairs article did, and the average family only had $95 a month more in available income than it did a decade ago.

The Affordable Care Act has returned more than $1 billion in premiums to consumers in the form of insurance rebates. The health care law requires insurance companies to spend at least 80 percent of subscriber dollars on medical care. If they spend less than that, the difference must be made up in a rebate to insurance subscribers.
In 2011, the year that provision went into effect, health insurers sent out $1.1 billion in rebates to 12.8 million American households. They averaged $151 per household, with Vermont seeing the highest rebates (their average check was $807 in the individual market). Using the numbers from the Commonwealth Fund above, that would work out to a 1 percent decrease in premiums for the average family.


5. Regulators rejected or lowered at least 924 insurer rate hikes in 2010. While the federal government cannot reject rate hikes, regulators in 37 states do have that authority. The Government Accountability Office looked at how frequently regulators exercised that authority. It found that in 36 states, regulators had turned back over 900 rate increases. Colorado and Ohio overturned more than 100 each.

So, how'd they get 14 insurance companies to lower or withdraw their rates? They sat down and negotiated with the insurers. And it worked. "Officials from the California Department of Insurance told us that they negotiated with carriers to reduce proposed rates by 2 percentage points to 25 percentage points in 2010," the GAO report says. "These officials also told us that they negotiated with one carrier not to raise rates in 2010 although the carrier had originally proposed a 10-percent average increase in rates."

more

"Premiums HAD risen substantially BEFORE the ACA."

A lie, just like all the other lies you bought like they were on sale.

Increases in healthcare expenditures:

2003 8.6%
2004 6.9%
2005 6.5%
2006 6.7%
2007 6.1%
Compare to 10.5% in 1970 and 13% in 1980
http://spectator.org/archives/2009/06/08/downgrading-american-medical-c/print

 

[JoeB131]

[

Because he he tells his coalition members and the American people he will destroy ISIS. He sells the idea to coalition members who get the backing from their people. They make a commitment just as we did.

Then Obama gets weak kneed because he's driven by polls and pulls out, leaving his coalition without the US forces to continue the fight with them. He lets down allies in a fight he committed to, to get them on board originally. That's what is wrong with his foreign policy all along. No country can depend on him.

Why should we expect other countries to fight wars on our behalf?

If the war is in our interest, we should do the things I mentioned. Draft, Tax, arrest dissenters, ration consumer goods. If you are going to have a war, have a fucking war.

If in a year, we are still bogged down there, you Wingnuts who were crying for war now will be the first ones screaming that Obama has gotten us stuck in this.

 

[JoeB131]

[



"Premiums HAD risen substantially BEFORE the ACA."

A lie, just like all the other lies you bought like they were on sale.

Increases in healthcare expenditures:

2003 8.6%
2004 6.9%
2005 6.5%
2006 6.7%
2007 6.1%
Compare to 10.5% in 1970 and 13% in 1980
http://spectator.org/archives/2009/06/08/downgrading-american-medical-c/print

You realize that is something like twice or three times the inflation rate, right?

13% in 1980 sounds bad, until you realize, yeah, that's the inflation was 13.5%.

2003 the inflation rate was 2.3%, but premiums went up 8.6%.

Historical Inflation Rates 1914-2014 US Inflation Calculator

 

[PoliticalChic]

[



"Premiums HAD risen substantially BEFORE the ACA."

A lie, just like all the other lies you bought like they were on sale.

Increases in healthcare expenditures:

2003 8.6%
2004 6.9%
2005 6.5%
2006 6.7%
2007 6.1%
Compare to 10.5% in 1970 and 13% in 1980
http://spectator.org/archives/2009/06/08/downgrading-american-medical-c/print

You realize that is something like twice or three times the inflation rate, right?

13% in 1980 sounds bad, until you realize, yeah, that's the inflation was 13.5%.

2003 the inflation rate was 2.3%, but premiums went up 8.6%.

Historical Inflation Rates 1914-2014 US Inflation Calculator

1. Don't change the subject. I proved that it was a lie to claim that Healthcare costs were increasing prior to ObamaCare.

They were falling.



2. For purposes of comparison:
Tuition at private colleges and universities has increased anywhere from 5% to 13% every year since 1980. "
The Cost of a College Education

 

[The Rabbi]

You understand that doesnt prove anything, right?
btw we can fact check Factcheck.org here:
Health Care Summit Squabbles
They were completely wrong. Lamar Alexander was right. Premiums have risen substantially as a result of Obamacare.

Premiums HAD risen substantially BEFORE the ACA. As a matter of FACT it was substantial increases like a 39 percent rise sought by Anthem Blue Cross in 2010 that helped give impetus to the law. Increases before the ACA were out of control.

Nice way of deflecting.
Obama never tried to compromise on any issue. IN a sense he couldnt because he kicked the whole project to Congressional Democrats. But even where he could it wasnt going to happen.
And the increase by Anthem in 2010 was in anticipation of Obamacare, which was passed that year.

 

[Wildman]

Only in you tiny little parrot brain...

>>>>>>>>>>>
wait a minute there, i once had a parrot and she was smarter, more intelligent than any libtard i ever knew or spoke to.

 

[Bfgrn]

You understand that doesnt prove anything, right?
btw we can fact check Factcheck.org here:
Health Care Summit Squabbles
They were completely wrong. Lamar Alexander was right. Premiums have risen substantially as a result of Obamacare.

Premiums HAD risen substantially BEFORE the ACA. As a matter of FACT it was substantial increases like a 39 percent rise sought by Anthem Blue Cross in 2010 that helped give impetus to the law. Increases before the ACA were out of control.

Obamacare Premium Hikes Relatively Modest, Non-Partisan CBO Says

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The average premium for an Obamacare benchmark plan will rise slightly in 2015 and increase about 6 percent a year during the rest of this decade, the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office (CBO) said on Monday in a report the White House trumpeted as proof its healthcare reform was working.

Obamacare marketplace plans are available over a range of quality levels, from lower-cost "bronze" coverage to top quality "platinum" plans. The CBO report looked at mid-tier "silver" plans that are used as benchmarks in determining how much federal money consumers can receive under the law to help cover insurance costs.

Government researchers concluded that the average annual premium of the second-lowest-cost "silver" plan would increase by only about 2.6 percent to $3,900 in 2015 from the current $3,800.

The cost would rise more rapidly to $4,400 in 2016 and about $6,900 in 2024. "Thus, premiums are projected to increase by about 6 percent per year on average from 2016 to 2024," the CBO report said.

The CBO also noted that its 2016 projection is 15 percent lower than its initial forecast in 2009.

more

Five facts about Obamacare and health premiums

Insurance premium growth has wiped out the last decade of wage growth. Overall, that middle-income family saw its income go up by $23,000, from $76,000 in 1999 to $99,000 in 2009 — not too bad. But rising health-care costs in the form of increased insurance premiums and co-pays, ate up nearly all of that. Factor in that spending, as a recent Health Affairs article did, and the average family only had $95 a month more in available income than it did a decade ago.

The Affordable Care Act has returned more than $1 billion in premiums to consumers in the form of insurance rebates. The health care law requires insurance companies to spend at least 80 percent of subscriber dollars on medical care. If they spend less than that, the difference must be made up in a rebate to insurance subscribers.
In 2011, the year that provision went into effect, health insurers sent out $1.1 billion in rebates to 12.8 million American households. They averaged $151 per household, with Vermont seeing the highest rebates (their average check was $807 in the individual market). Using the numbers from the Commonwealth Fund above, that would work out to a 1 percent decrease in premiums for the average family.


5. Regulators rejected or lowered at least 924 insurer rate hikes in 2010. While the federal government cannot reject rate hikes, regulators in 37 states do have that authority. The Government Accountability Office looked at how frequently regulators exercised that authority. It found that in 36 states, regulators had turned back over 900 rate increases. Colorado and Ohio overturned more than 100 each.

So, how'd they get 14 insurance companies to lower or withdraw their rates? They sat down and negotiated with the insurers. And it worked. "Officials from the California Department of Insurance told us that they negotiated with carriers to reduce proposed rates by 2 percentage points to 25 percentage points in 2010," the GAO report says. "These officials also told us that they negotiated with one carrier not to raise rates in 2010 although the carrier had originally proposed a 10-percent average increase in rates."

more

"Premiums HAD risen substantially BEFORE the ACA."

A lie, just like all the other lies you bought like they were on sale.

Increases in healthcare expenditures:

2003 8.6%
2004 6.9%
2005 6.5%
2006 6.7%
2007 6.1%
Compare to 10.5% in 1970 and 13% in 1980
http://spectator.org/archives/2009/06/08/downgrading-american-medical-c/print

Your link is dead, just like your brain... percentage OF WHAT?

 

[Bfgrn]

You understand that doesnt prove anything, right?
btw we can fact check Factcheck.org here:
Health Care Summit Squabbles
They were completely wrong. Lamar Alexander was right. Premiums have risen substantially as a result of Obamacare.

Premiums HAD risen substantially BEFORE the ACA. As a matter of FACT it was substantial increases like a 39 percent rise sought by Anthem Blue Cross in 2010 that helped give impetus to the law. Increases before the ACA were out of control.

Nice way of deflecting.
Obama never tried to compromise on any issue. IN a sense he couldnt because he kicked the whole project to Congressional Democrats. But even where he could it wasnt going to happen.
And the increase by Anthem in 2010 was in anticipation of Obamacare, which was passed that year.

Republican Ideas Included in the President's Proposal
It’s clear that the American people want health insurance reform. They aren’t interested in Democratic ideas or Republican ideas. They’re interested in the best ideas to reduce costs, guarantee choices and ensure the highest quality care.

They’re interested in ideas that will put them back in control of their own health care.

Throughout the debate on health insurance reform, Republican concepts and proposals have been included in legislation. In fact, hundreds of Republican amendments were adopted during the committee mark-up process. As a result, both the Senate and the House passed key Republican proposals that are incorporated into the President’s Proposal.

Review a few of the Republican initiatives included in legislation passed by Congress:

• Includes personal responsibility incentives: Allows health insurance premium to vary based on participation in proven employer wellness programs
  • (Sources: H.R. 3468, “Promoting Health and Preventing Chronic Disease through Prevention and Wellness Programs for Employees, Communities, and Individuals Act” (Castle bill); H.R. 4038, “Common Sense Health Care Reform & Accountability Act” (Republican Substitute bill); H.R. 3400, “Empowering Patients First Act” (Republican Study Committee bill); H.R. 3970, “Medical Rights & Reform Act” (Kirk bill), "Coverage, Prevention and Reform Act")
• Advances medical liability reform through grants to States: Provides grants to States to jump-start and evaluate promising medical liability reform ideas to put patient safety first, prevent medical errors, and reduce liability premiums.
  • (Sources: S. 1783, “Ten Steps to Transform Health Care in America Act” (Enzi bill); H.R. 3400, “Empowering Patients First Act” (Republican Study Committee bill); H.R. 4529, “Roadmap for America’s Future Act” (Ryan bill); S. 1099, “Patients’ Choice Act” (Burr-Coburn, Ryan-Nunes bill))
• Extends dependent coverage to age 26: Gives young adults new options.
  • (Sources: H.R. 4038, “Common Sense Health Care Reform & Accountability Act” (Republican Substitute bill); H.R. 3970, “Medical Rights & Reform Act” (Kirk bill))
• Allows automatic enrollment by employers in health insurance: Allows employee to opt-out.
  • (Sources: House Republican Substitute; H.R. 3400, “Empowering Patients First Act” (Republican Study Committee bill); “Coverage, Prevention, and Reform Act” )
• Mechanisms to improve quality.
  • (Sources: H.R. 4529, “Roadmap for America’s Future Act;” S. 1099, “Patients’ Choice Act;” H.R. 3400, Republican Study Group bill; S. 1783, “Ten Steps to Transform Health Care in America Act” (Enzi bill))

• Community Mental Health Centers. The President’s Proposal ensures that individuals have access to comprehensive mental health services in the community setting, but strengthens standards for facilities that seek reimbursement as community mental health centers by ensuring these facilities are providing appropriate care and not taking advantage of Medicare patients or the taxpayers.
  • (Source: H.R. 3970, “Medical Rights & Reform Act”) ref

 

[The Rabbi]

Yawn, inconsequential bullshit. First you say the GOP wouldnt negotiate with the Dems. Now you want to say the Dems included GOP proposals in Ocare.
The bottom line is not a single member of the GOP voted for it because they werent consulted.

 

[Ibentoken]

I'm positive the first woman President will be a success because h....um....ah.....well...um.

 

[Bfgrn]

Yawn, inconsequential bullshit. First you say the GOP wouldnt negotiate with the Dems. Now you want to say the Dems included GOP proposals in Ocare.
The bottom line is not a single member of the GOP voted for it because they werent consulted.

Translation: you are confronted with FACTS that your dogma won't allow...roll out the right wing "yawn"

Republicans WERE consulted. And Obama tried very hard to include them in the debate. But Republicans LIED and used fear-mongering to destroy health care reform. I recall Senator Chuck Grassley standing before cameras promising the American people he would work with Max Baucus as co-chair of the Senate Committee on Finance to craft a bipartisan bill. THEN, he went home to Iowa and ignorantly claimed the bill would "pull the plug on grandma"

For God sakes man, former Bush speechwriter David Frum was fired by the American Enterprise Institute for revealing the TRUTH:

"At the beginning of this process we made a strategic decision: unlike, say, Democrats in 2001 when President Bush proposed his first tax cut, we would make no deal with the administration. No negotiations, no compromise, nothing. We were going for all the marbles. This would be Obama’s Waterloo – just as healthcare was Clinton’s in 1994."

THEN, we find out from Bruce Bartlett that AEI "scholars" had been ordered not to speak to the media on the subject of health care reform because they agreed with too much of what Obama was trying to do.

 

[The Rabbi]

Yawn, inconsequential bullshit. First you say the GOP wouldnt negotiate with the Dems. Now you want to say the Dems included GOP proposals in Ocare.
The bottom line is not a single member of the GOP voted for it because they werent consulted.

Translation: you are confronted with FACTS that your dogma won't allow...roll out the right wing "yawn"

Republicans WERE consulted. And Obama tried very hard to include them in the debate. But Republicans LIED and used fear-mongering to destroy health care reform. I recall Senator Chuck Grassley standing before cameras promising the American people he would work with Max Baucus as co-chair of the Senate Committee on Finance to craft a bipartisan bill. THEN, he went home to Iowa and ignorantly claimed the bill would "pull the plug on grandma"

For God sakes man, former Bush speechwriter David Frum was fired by the American Enterprise Institute for revealing the TRUTH:

"At the beginning of this process we made a strategic decision: unlike, say, Democrats in 2001 when President Bush proposed his first tax cut, we would make no deal with the administration. No negotiations, no compromise, nothing. We were going for all the marbles. This would be Obama’s Waterloo – just as healthcare was Clinton’s in 1994."

THEN, we find out from Bruce Bartlett that AEI "scholars" had been ordered not to speak to the media on the subject of health care reform because they agreed with too much of what Obama was trying to do.

David Frum speaks for Republicans? Getouttatown.
Youre a complete failure. You can't make a coherent argument and defend it to save your life. You throw crap out there that is only tangential to the argument and claim it proves your argument. It does not such thing. You are a waste of bandwidth.

 

[JoeB131]

[



1. Don't change the subject. I proved that it was a lie to claim that Healthcare costs were increasing prior to ObamaCare.

They were falling.

Um, no, "Falling" would mean they'd cost LESS than they did the y ear before. Not rising quite as fast as they were is not "Falling". It's "Increasing"

[
2. For purposes of comparison:
Tuition at private colleges and universities has increased anywhere from 5% to 13% every year since 1980. "
The Cost of a College Education

Here's the problem with that comparison. You can live without a college degree. Affordable health coverage, not so much.

 

[Bfgrn]

Yawn, inconsequential bullshit. First you say the GOP wouldnt negotiate with the Dems. Now you want to say the Dems included GOP proposals in Ocare.
The bottom line is not a single member of the GOP voted for it because they werent consulted.

Translation: you are confronted with FACTS that your dogma won't allow...roll out the right wing "yawn"

Republicans WERE consulted. And Obama tried very hard to include them in the debate. But Republicans LIED and used fear-mongering to destroy health care reform. I recall Senator Chuck Grassley standing before cameras promising the American people he would work with Max Baucus as co-chair of the Senate Committee on Finance to craft a bipartisan bill. THEN, he went home to Iowa and ignorantly claimed the bill would "pull the plug on grandma"

For God sakes man, former Bush speechwriter David Frum was fired by the American Enterprise Institute for revealing the TRUTH:

"At the beginning of this process we made a strategic decision: unlike, say, Democrats in 2001 when President Bush proposed his first tax cut, we would make no deal with the administration. No negotiations, no compromise, nothing. We were going for all the marbles. This would be Obama’s Waterloo – just as healthcare was Clinton’s in 1994."

THEN, we find out from Bruce Bartlett that AEI "scholars" had been ordered not to speak to the media on the subject of health care reform because they agreed with too much of what Obama was trying to do.

David Frum speaks for Republicans? Getouttatown.
Youre a complete failure. You can't make a coherent argument and defend it to save your life. You throw crap out there that is only tangential to the argument and claim it proves your argument. It does not such thing. You are a waste of bandwidth.

Translation. You have NOTHING, so try to make the yawn bigger. David Frum speaks the truth. You just don't want to hear it. How MANY examples do you need?

 

[TemplarKormac]

You understand that doesnt prove anything, right?
btw we can fact check Factcheck.org here:
Health Care Summit Squabbles
They were completely wrong. Lamar Alexander was right. Premiums have risen substantially as a result of Obamacare.

Premiums HAD risen substantially BEFORE the ACA. As a matter of FACT it was substantial increases like a 39 percent rise sought by Anthem Blue Cross in 2010 that helped give impetus to the law. Increases before the ACA were out of control.

Obamacare Premium Hikes Relatively Modest, Non-Partisan CBO Says

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The average premium for an Obamacare benchmark plan will rise slightly in 2015 and increase about 6 percent a year during the rest of this decade, the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office (CBO) said on Monday in a report the White House trumpeted as proof its healthcare reform was working.

Obamacare marketplace plans are available over a range of quality levels, from lower-cost "bronze" coverage to top quality "platinum" plans. The CBO report looked at mid-tier "silver" plans that are used as benchmarks in determining how much federal money consumers can receive under the law to help cover insurance costs.

Government researchers concluded that the average annual premium of the second-lowest-cost "silver" plan would increase by only about 2.6 percent to $3,900 in 2015 from the current $3,800.

The cost would rise more rapidly to $4,400 in 2016 and about $6,900 in 2024. "Thus, premiums are projected to increase by about 6 percent per year on average from 2016 to 2024," the CBO report said.

The CBO also noted that its 2016 projection is 15 percent lower than its initial forecast in 2009.

more

Five facts about Obamacare and health premiums

Insurance premium growth has wiped out the last decade of wage growth. Overall, that middle-income family saw its income go up by $23,000, from $76,000 in 1999 to $99,000 in 2009 — not too bad. But rising health-care costs in the form of increased insurance premiums and co-pays, ate up nearly all of that. Factor in that spending, as a recent Health Affairs article did, and the average family only had $95 a month more in available income than it did a decade ago.

The Affordable Care Act has returned more than $1 billion in premiums to consumers in the form of insurance rebates. The health care law requires insurance companies to spend at least 80 percent of subscriber dollars on medical care. If they spend less than that, the difference must be made up in a rebate to insurance subscribers.
In 2011, the year that provision went into effect, health insurers sent out $1.1 billion in rebates to 12.8 million American households. They averaged $151 per household, with Vermont seeing the highest rebates (their average check was $807 in the individual market). Using the numbers from the Commonwealth Fund above, that would work out to a 1 percent decrease in premiums for the average family.


5. Regulators rejected or lowered at least 924 insurer rate hikes in 2010. While the federal government cannot reject rate hikes, regulators in 37 states do have that authority. The Government Accountability Office looked at how frequently regulators exercised that authority. It found that in 36 states, regulators had turned back over 900 rate increases. Colorado and Ohio overturned more than 100 each.

So, how'd they get 14 insurance companies to lower or withdraw their rates? They sat down and negotiated with the insurers. And it worked. "Officials from the California Department of Insurance told us that they negotiated with carriers to reduce proposed rates by 2 percentage points to 25 percentage points in 2010," the GAO report says. "These officials also told us that they negotiated with one carrier not to raise rates in 2010 although the carrier had originally proposed a 10-percent average increase in rates."

more

"Premiums HAD risen substantially BEFORE the ACA."

A lie, just like all the other lies you bought like they were on sale.

Increases in healthcare expenditures:

2003 8.6%
2004 6.9%
2005 6.5%
2006 6.7%
2007 6.1%
Compare to 10.5% in 1970 and 13% in 1980
http://spectator.org/archives/2009/06/08/downgrading-american-medical-c/print

Your link is dead, just like your brain... percentage OF WHAT?

Funny, I seem to recall a 10% rise in healthcare spending in the first quarter of this year:

Health Costs Resume Their Rise - Forbes

 

[PoliticalChic]

You understand that doesnt prove anything, right?
btw we can fact check Factcheck.org here:
Health Care Summit Squabbles
They were completely wrong. Lamar Alexander was right. Premiums have risen substantially as a result of Obamacare.

Premiums HAD risen substantially BEFORE the ACA. As a matter of FACT it was substantial increases like a 39 percent rise sought by Anthem Blue Cross in 2010 that helped give impetus to the law. Increases before the ACA were out of control.

Obamacare Premium Hikes Relatively Modest, Non-Partisan CBO Says

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The average premium for an Obamacare benchmark plan will rise slightly in 2015 and increase about 6 percent a year during the rest of this decade, the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office (CBO) said on Monday in a report the White House trumpeted as proof its healthcare reform was working.

Obamacare marketplace plans are available over a range of quality levels, from lower-cost "bronze" coverage to top quality "platinum" plans. The CBO report looked at mid-tier "silver" plans that are used as benchmarks in determining how much federal money consumers can receive under the law to help cover insurance costs.

Government researchers concluded that the average annual premium of the second-lowest-cost "silver" plan would increase by only about 2.6 percent to $3,900 in 2015 from the current $3,800.

The cost would rise more rapidly to $4,400 in 2016 and about $6,900 in 2024. "Thus, premiums are projected to increase by about 6 percent per year on average from 2016 to 2024," the CBO report said.

The CBO also noted that its 2016 projection is 15 percent lower than its initial forecast in 2009.

more

Five facts about Obamacare and health premiums

Insurance premium growth has wiped out the last decade of wage growth. Overall, that middle-income family saw its income go up by $23,000, from $76,000 in 1999 to $99,000 in 2009 — not too bad. But rising health-care costs in the form of increased insurance premiums and co-pays, ate up nearly all of that. Factor in that spending, as a recent Health Affairs article did, and the average family only had $95 a month more in available income than it did a decade ago.

The Affordable Care Act has returned more than $1 billion in premiums to consumers in the form of insurance rebates. The health care law requires insurance companies to spend at least 80 percent of subscriber dollars on medical care. If they spend less than that, the difference must be made up in a rebate to insurance subscribers.
In 2011, the year that provision went into effect, health insurers sent out $1.1 billion in rebates to 12.8 million American households. They averaged $151 per household, with Vermont seeing the highest rebates (their average check was $807 in the individual market). Using the numbers from the Commonwealth Fund above, that would work out to a 1 percent decrease in premiums for the average family.


5. Regulators rejected or lowered at least 924 insurer rate hikes in 2010. While the federal government cannot reject rate hikes, regulators in 37 states do have that authority. The Government Accountability Office looked at how frequently regulators exercised that authority. It found that in 36 states, regulators had turned back over 900 rate increases. Colorado and Ohio overturned more than 100 each.

So, how'd they get 14 insurance companies to lower or withdraw their rates? They sat down and negotiated with the insurers. And it worked. "Officials from the California Department of Insurance told us that they negotiated with carriers to reduce proposed rates by 2 percentage points to 25 percentage points in 2010," the GAO report says. "These officials also told us that they negotiated with one carrier not to raise rates in 2010 although the carrier had originally proposed a 10-percent average increase in rates."

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"Premiums HAD risen substantially BEFORE the ACA."

A lie, just like all the other lies you bought like they were on sale.

Increases in healthcare expenditures:

2003 8.6%
2004 6.9%
2005 6.5%
2006 6.7%
2007 6.1%
Compare to 10.5% in 1970 and 13% in 1980
http://spectator.org/archives/2009/06/08/downgrading-american-medical-c/print

Your link is dead, just like your brain... percentage OF WHAT?

National Health Expenditures Data 1970-2012

10.6% 13.1% 11.0% 6.6% 8.4% 9.7% 8.6% 7.2% 6.8% 6.5% 6.3% 4.7% 3.8% 3.8% 3.6% 3.7%
Health Consumption Expenditures

http://www.cms.gov/Research-Statist...NationalHealthExpendData/Downloads/tables.pdf

F