How Liberalism Lost America

PoliticalChic

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1. If liberalism today was the Classical Liberalism of our Founders, all of us would be liberals. In fact, from the New Deal through the 50's Americans pretty much were liberals.

2. Liberalism took a major step toward the current formulation, and the separation from Classical Liberalism, with the publication of L. T. Hobhouse's “Liberalism”, of 1911. It was a pretty good restatement of Classical Liberalism at the beginning of the 20th century. But the text is interesting as, unlike some of the more commonly cited formulation [J.S. Mill for instance], Hobhouse argues that, even though wealth is produced by individuals, these same individual’s prosperity relied on the health and security of the community. Modern History Sourcebook: Hobhouse, Liberalism 1911

a. Even a casual perusal of Hobhouse would reveal more in common with today’s conservatives than today’s liberals!

b. The new view was adopted in the early 1900’s by Theodore Roosevelt’s “Bull Moose” Republican Party and Woodrow Wilson’s Democrats under the banner of “progressivism, but it was not until Franklin Roosevelt’s New Deal that the actual term ‘liberal’ came into widespread use in the United States.

3. Today, liberals are viewed by many as permissive on social morality, including government programs that offer not merely indulgence, but appear to many to encourage lazy, ill-mannered, and sexually promiscuous conduct, gaming the system and making excuses for riots, violent crime, and other forms of anti-social behavior. Eric Alterman, “Why We’re Liberals,” p. 38

4. ‘Liberal’ became a pejorative, as in the following: “The favoring of blacks over whites and permissiveness toward drug abuse, illegitimacy, welfare fraud, street crime, homosexuality, anti-Americanism, as well as moral anarchy among the young.” Thomas and Mary Edsall, “Chain Reaction: The Impact of Race, Rights, and Taxes on American Politics,” p. 9

5. Other elements that turned many Americans against liberalism:

a. The use of courts rather than the electoral process to achieve liberal aims. Such Supreme Court decisions as Engle v. Vitale (1962) convinced many that liberals were about to attack traditional morality whenever possible. [The prayer in question: “Almighty God, we acknowledge our dependence upon Thee, and we beg Thy blessings upon us, our parents, our teachers and our country. Amen.]

b. Complicated interrelationships between the various left wing groups, i.e., civil libertarians, socialists, communists, anarchists, populists, etc, melded all together in the eyes of much of the apolitical public. The actions of any of these groups often colored the perception of all.

c. Conservative thinking has been propelled by well-funded, and, more importantly, easily accessible institutions such as the American Enterprise Institute, and Heritage Foundation, which offer more than equivalent research and information to the Brookings Institution and the Urban League. Access has been multiplied by the advent of the Internet.
 
I think the fascist have bundled everything they say the don't like and rolled it all into their definition of "Liberal"

For a better def look up the Cato Institute.

How to Label Cato
Today, those who subscribe to the principles of the American Revolution — individual liberty, limited government, the free market, and the rule of law — call themselves by a variety of terms, including conservative, libertarian, classical liberal, and liberal. We see problems with all of those terms. "Conservative" smacks of an unwillingness to change, of a desire to preserve the status quo. Only in America do people seem to refer to free-market capitalism — the most progressive, dynamic, and ever-changing system the world has ever known — as conservative. Additionally, many contemporary American conservatives favor state intervention in some areas, most notably in trade and into our private lives.

"Classical liberal" is a bit closer to the mark, but the word "classical" fails to capture the contemporary vibrancy of the ideas of freedom.

"Liberal" may well be the perfect word in most of the world — the liberals in societies from China to Iran to South Africa to Argentina tend to be supporters of human rights and free markets — but its meaning has clearly been altered in the contemporary United States.

The Jeffersonian philosophy that animates Cato's work has increasingly come to be called "libertarianism" or "market liberalism." It combines an appreciation for entrepreneurship, the market process, and lower taxes with strict respect for civil liberties and skepticism about the benefits of both the welfare state and foreign military adventurism.

This vision brings the wisdom of the American Founders to bear on the problems of today. As did the Founders, it looks to the future with optimism and excitement, eager to discover what great things women and men will do in the coming century. Market liberals appreciate the complexity of a great society, recognizing that socialism and government planning are just too clumsy for the modern world. It is — or used to be — the conventional wisdom that a more complex society needs more government, but the truth is just the opposite. The simpler the society, the less damage government planning does. Planning is cumbersome in an agricultural society, costly in an industrial economy, and impossible in the information age. Today collectivism and planning are outmoded and backward, a drag on social progress.

Libertarians have a cosmopolitan, inclusive vision for society. We applaud the progressive extension of the promises of the Declaration of Independence to more people, especially to women, African-Americans, religious minorities, and gay and lesbian people. Our greatest challenge today is to continue to extend the political freedom and economic opportunity to those who are still denied it, in our own country and around the world.
 
Something I have a hard time understanding. How did liberals go from,

"Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country."

To inviting actual socialist and communist groups to fund a gather in DC.


How did they drop so far that the very people that funded wars against communism, now rub shoulders with them?

I simply can't fathom that.
 
I think the fascist have bundled everything they say the don't like and rolled it all into their definition of "Liberal"

THis right here, the general tone, is exactly the reason.
 
Something I have a hard time understanding. How did liberals go from,

"Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country."

To inviting actual socialist and communist groups to fund a gather in DC.


How did they drop so far that the very people that funded wars against communism, now rub shoulders with them?

I simply can't fathom that.

Well, the Progressives, Marxists and Communists have co opted the Dems by virtue of the Dems' decades of creating victims... victims of racism, victims of the rich, victims of Capitalism, victims of this oppression and that oppression. It was a natural fit. One day the rank and file working class guy who typically voted Democrat was slowly sold the notion of entitlement. It is called incrementalism. Much like boiling a frog. Well, the frog has been boiled.
 
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Something I have a hard time understanding. How did liberals go from,

"Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country."

To inviting actual socialist and communist groups to fund a gather in DC.


How did they drop so far that the very people that funded wars against communism, now rub shoulders with them?

I simply can't fathom that.

progressive agenda. Not just Liberals, but cons as well.
 
ahh last election Liberals got millions more votes.
sore losers anyone?
 
Something I have a hard time understanding. How did liberals go from,

"Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country."

To inviting actual socialist and communist groups to fund a gather in DC.


How did they drop so far that the very people that funded wars against communism, now rub shoulders with them?

I simply can't fathom that.

The Communists took the Dem Party over just like they said they would
 
Something I have a hard time understanding. How did liberals go from,

"Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country."

To inviting actual socialist and communist groups to fund a gather in DC.


How did they drop so far that the very people that funded wars against communism, now rub shoulders with them?

I simply can't fathom that.

progressive agenda. Not just Liberals, but cons as well.

What conservative rubs shoulders with communist? I'm not talking free trade or diplomacy. What conservative was at 10/2 with the communist? Or has had personnal dealings with them.

note; I will thank you for listing any individual, as I don't think there is a group.
 
Last edited:
Something I have a hard time understanding. How did liberals go from,

"Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country."

To inviting actual socialist and communist groups to fund a gather in DC.


How did they drop so far that the very people that funded wars against communism, now rub shoulders with them?

I simply can't fathom that.

The Communists took the Dem Party over just like they said they would

I know the man that ran for President for the socialist party stopped b/c he thought the DNC had absorbed thier platform back in the 40's (?). But JFK was violently against the communist.

Was it just a steady degridation?
 
1. If liberalism today was the Classical Liberalism of our Founders, all of us would be liberals. In fact, from the New Deal through the 50's Americans pretty much were liberals.

2. Liberalism took a major step toward the current formulation, and the separation from Classical Liberalism, with the publication of L. T. Hobhouse's “Liberalism”, of 1911. It was a pretty good restatement of Classical Liberalism at the beginning of the 20th century. But the text is interesting as, unlike some of the more commonly cited formulation [J.S. Mill for instance], Hobhouse argues that, even though wealth is produced by individuals, these same individual’s prosperity relied on the health and security of the community. Modern History Sourcebook: Hobhouse, Liberalism 1911

a. Even a casual perusal of Hobhouse would reveal more in common with today’s conservatives than today’s liberals!

b. The new view was adopted in the early 1900’s by Theodore Roosevelt’s “Bull Moose” Republican Party and Woodrow Wilson’s Democrats under the banner of “progressivism, but it was not until Franklin Roosevelt’s New Deal that the actual term ‘liberal’ came into widespread use in the United States.

3. Today, liberals are viewed by many as permissive on social morality, including government programs that offer not merely indulgence, but appear to many to encourage lazy, ill-mannered, and sexually promiscuous conduct, gaming the system and making excuses for riots, violent crime, and other forms of anti-social behavior. Eric Alterman, “Why We’re Liberals,” p. 38

4. ‘Liberal’ became a pejorative, as in the following: “The favoring of blacks over whites and permissiveness toward drug abuse, illegitimacy, welfare fraud, street crime, homosexuality, anti-Americanism, as well as moral anarchy among the young.” Thomas and Mary Edsall, “Chain Reaction: The Impact of Race, Rights, and Taxes on American Politics,” p. 9

5. Other elements that turned many Americans against liberalism:

a. The use of courts rather than the electoral process to achieve liberal aims. Such Supreme Court decisions as Engle v. Vitale (1962) convinced many that liberals were about to attack traditional morality whenever possible. [The prayer in question: “Almighty God, we acknowledge our dependence upon Thee, and we beg Thy blessings upon us, our parents, our teachers and our country. Amen.]

b. Complicated interrelationships between the various left wing groups, i.e., civil libertarians, socialists, communists, anarchists, populists, etc, melded all together in the eyes of much of the apolitical public. The actions of any of these groups often colored the perception of all.

c. Conservative thinking has been propelled by well-funded, and, more importantly, easily accessible institutions such as the American Enterprise Institute, and Heritage Foundation, which offer more than equivalent research and information to the Brookings Institution and the Urban League. Access has been multiplied by the advent of the Internet.

Today's conservatism is last year's liberalism because conservatism is always wrong. Liberals win the battles, conservatives accept the liberal victory and have no choice but to incorporate the consequences of that victory as part of their own philosophy.

How many conservatives today do you see opposing women's suffrage? for example.
 
Something I have a hard time understanding. How did liberals go from,

"Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country."

To inviting actual socialist and communist groups to fund a gather in DC.


How did they drop so far that the very people that funded wars against communism, now rub shoulders with them?

I simply can't fathom that.

The Communists took the Dem Party over just like they said they would

I know the man that ran for President for the socialist party stopped b/c he thought the DNC had absorbed thier platform back in the 40's (?). But JFK was violently against the communist.

Was it just a steady degridation?

First the media and Labor Unions, then they got FDR in the 30's. JFK was a low point for American Progressives, but he got himself dead, right and Progressive LBJ stepped right in.

Clinton homogenized the Party in the mid-90's and eradicated all the Moderate Dems. Now, they are open about being Socialists (aka: Progressives)
 
Something I have a hard time understanding. How did liberals go from,

"Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country."

To inviting actual socialist and communist groups to fund a gather in DC.


How did they drop so far that the very people that funded wars against communism, now rub shoulders with them?

I simply can't fathom that.

The Communists took the Dem Party over just like they said they would

I know the man that ran for President for the socialist party stopped b/c he thought the DNC had absorbed thier platform back in the 40's (?). But JFK was violently against the communist.

Was it just a steady degridation?

Like boiling a frog....
 
It starts with shit like... "how can you be against helping out ______________ ?". Pretty soon, they've consumed everything and the sheeple are standing with their hands out expecting everything at the expense of some made-up boogyman.

It happens just like that.
 
"Today's conservatism is last year's liberalism because conservatism is always wrong. Liberals win the battles, conservatives accept the liberal victory and have no choice but to incorporate the consequences of that victory as part of their own philosophy.

How many conservatives today do you see opposing women's suffrage? for example. "


What? Womans suffrage? Do you mean that all out decline in family values? How many pro-abortion conservatives do you know? Pro-welfare?

Please be specific, and inside the last 100 years.
 
1. If liberalism today was the Classical Liberalism of our Founders, all of us would be liberals. In fact, from the New Deal through the 50's Americans pretty much were liberals.

2. Liberalism took a major step toward the current formulation, and the separation from Classical Liberalism, with the publication of L. T. Hobhouse's “Liberalism”, of 1911. It was a pretty good restatement of Classical Liberalism at the beginning of the 20th century. But the text is interesting as, unlike some of the more commonly cited formulation [J.S. Mill for instance], Hobhouse argues that, even though wealth is produced by individuals, these same individual’s prosperity relied on the health and security of the community. Modern History Sourcebook: Hobhouse, Liberalism 1911

a. Even a casual perusal of Hobhouse would reveal more in common with today’s conservatives than today’s liberals!

b. The new view was adopted in the early 1900’s by Theodore Roosevelt’s “Bull Moose” Republican Party and Woodrow Wilson’s Democrats under the banner of “progressivism, but it was not until Franklin Roosevelt’s New Deal that the actual term ‘liberal’ came into widespread use in the United States.

3. Today, liberals are viewed by many as permissive on social morality, including government programs that offer not merely indulgence, but appear to many to encourage lazy, ill-mannered, and sexually promiscuous conduct, gaming the system and making excuses for riots, violent crime, and other forms of anti-social behavior. Eric Alterman, “Why We’re Liberals,” p. 38

4. ‘Liberal’ became a pejorative, as in the following: “The favoring of blacks over whites and permissiveness toward drug abuse, illegitimacy, welfare fraud, street crime, homosexuality, anti-Americanism, as well as moral anarchy among the young.” Thomas and Mary Edsall, “Chain Reaction: The Impact of Race, Rights, and Taxes on American Politics,” p. 9

5. Other elements that turned many Americans against liberalism:

a. The use of courts rather than the electoral process to achieve liberal aims. Such Supreme Court decisions as Engle v. Vitale (1962) convinced many that liberals were about to attack traditional morality whenever possible. [The prayer in question: “Almighty God, we acknowledge our dependence upon Thee, and we beg Thy blessings upon us, our parents, our teachers and our country. Amen.]

b. Complicated interrelationships between the various left wing groups, i.e., civil libertarians, socialists, communists, anarchists, populists, etc, melded all together in the eyes of much of the apolitical public. The actions of any of these groups often colored the perception of all.

c. Conservative thinking has been propelled by well-funded, and, more importantly, easily accessible institutions such as the American Enterprise Institute, and Heritage Foundation, which offer more than equivalent research and information to the Brookings Institution and the Urban League. Access has been multiplied by the advent of the Internet.

Your usual pile of revisionist horseshit. But even a blind squirrel finds an acorn once in a while. You do 'touch' on a sliver of the truth at the end. Look up Lewis F. Powell, Jr. and the Powell Memorandum. Liberalism didn't change. It was redefined by corporate funded think tanks and right wing rhetors.

It led to a conservative hijacking of America by corporations, and led to the demise we witnessed when the economy crashed.

The assassination of President Kennedy began the demise of the Democratic Party. On October 11, 1963, Kennedy signed NSAM 263, initiating a withdrawal of 1,000 troops out of roughly 16,000 Americans stationed in Vietnam. Other documents, including planning documents from the spring of 1963, show that this was the first step in a planned complete withdrawal. He was also having personal conversations with Nikita Khrushchev to end the cold war and also had back channel talks with Castro to normalize relations with Cuba. A month later the President was dead, and a few days later the fate of the Democratic Party was sealed when LBJ reversed Kennedy's plan to withdraw. It was a death sentence for almost 60,000 American sons & daughters and it began a downward spiral that we are still in today. There was a coup d'état in this country. Eisenhower tried to warn us of the military/industrial complex, because his own plans for peace talks with Russia were undermined by the CIA and the 1960 U-2 incident.

I find it haunting that the agenda of the far right wing radicals that circulated this flier in Dallas on November 21, 1963 has become the agenda of today's Republican corporate party...the most UN America group of people we have been burdened with.

1205_1_lg.jpg
 
Today's conservatism is last year's liberalism because conservatism is always wrong. Liberals win the battles, conservatives accept the liberal victory and have no choice but to incorporate the consequences of that victory as part of their own philosophy.

How many conservatives today do you see opposing women's suffrage? for example.

Way to TOTALLY miss the point. You really want to argue that the liberals of yesteryear that supported women's suffrage are the same as the liberals today? Do you really want to argue that today's conservatives don't support a woman's right to vote?
 
Something I have a hard time understanding. How did liberals go from,

"Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country."

To inviting actual socialist and communist groups to fund a gather in DC.


How did they drop so far that the very people that funded wars against communism, now rub shoulders with them?

I simply can't fathom that.

progressive agenda. Not just Liberals, but cons as well.

What conservative rubs shoulders with communist? I'm not talking free trade or diplomacy. What conservative was at 10/2 with the communist? Or has had personnal dealings with them.

note; I will thank you for listing any individual, as I don't think there is a group.

The republlicans were in lock step with the NPR during Bush Sr.s Administration, sharing technology, RNC receiving campaign funds, and did you know that George Bush is the only president who the Chinese celebrate during New Years? He brought them oil companies so the Communist would have heat. Then along comes Bush jr. & we get the repeat. He lets China become a permanent member of the WTO, even had that in his 1st plank if you ever read it. And borrowed trillions to sustain taxcuts and wars, that you will be paying for to the NPR. There is probably a book on it somewhere. Richard Nixon took us into Russia, Bush Sr. took us into China. Bush Jr. let the Chinese slide when we found weapons caches in the Afghan mountains being used against our troops. Bush apologized to China for their pilot ramming a US spy plane in open waters. Then he attends several get togethers with China, and attends the Olympics.
 
ahh last election Liberals got millions more votes.
sore losers anyone?

PRINCETON, NJ -- Thus far in 2009, 40% of Americans interviewed in national Gallup Poll surveys describe their political views as conservative, 35% as moderate, and 21% as liberal. This represents a slight increase for conservatism in the U.S. since 2008, returning it to a level last seen in 2004. The 21% calling themselves liberal is in line with findings throughout this decade, but is up from the 1990s.
"Conservatives" Are Single-Largest Ideological Group
 

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