God and Man

[Said1]

w00t I'm an intellectual

 

[dilloduck]

We come to realize that 'who we are' and 'what is our meaning' are important----If we are to get the second qustion right, we better make sure we have the answer to the first question right.

 

[Phaedrus]

the purpose of man is to fear God.

This is a purpose.

We come to realize that 'who we are' and 'what is our meaning' are important----If we are to get the second qustion right, we better make sure we have the answer to the first question right.

i.e. purpose is subjective.

For me, the purpose of life is determining perspective. What's important to you? This answer can only be subjective, and scorning somebody else's only reveals ignorance in yourself. Only when you know what’s truly important to you, can live accordingly.

Note: Please remember, I made a distinction between Man's purpose and God's purpose for Man. This is with repect to Fisherking's quote as that appears to me to be a possible purpose God has for Man.

 

[Bullypulpit]

I have always viewed purpose as a means of fullfilment, and if being charitable brings that for a person, then that could be a purpose for them.
I think 5string said it best, the purpose of man is to fear God. God strongly encourages charity among believers, It is helping mankind bear the burdens of the other so nobody has to walk alone through hardships. This is a charecteristic of charity, and I believe is a purpose for mankind.

Why would an omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, eternal being wish to be feared?

Such ephemeral beings as ourselves would be beneath the notice of such a being. And due to the limitations of our perception and cognition, as well as our brief existence, we humans would be unable to percieve such a being. The only reason I can posit for such a beings interest in our species would be boredom or ennui.

 

[Nuc]

Why would an omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, eternal being wish to be feared?

Such ephemeral beings as ourselves would be beneath the notice of such a being. And due to the limitations of our perception and cognition, as well as our brief existence, we humans would be unable to percieve such a being. The only reason I can posit for such a beings interest in our species would be boredom or ennui.

Not to mention the punishments "He" is supposed to be handing out to us for our misdeeds are comparable to a human burning an ant with a magnifying glass.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

But is it our duty to fulfill our purpose?

 

[jillian]

Charity is an action, philanthropy is an ideal.

I always thought philanthropy was just charity given by rich people.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Masturbation is an action, a dipstick is a noun.

 

[Phaedrus]

But is it our duty to fulfill our purpose?

Not necessarily.

Why would an omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, eternal being wish to be feared?

The line of reasoning that God wishes us to fear him, IMHO, points to him caring about us. Man is inherently bad, so in order to instill sufficient order, we must fear the Wrath of God, or his ennui (Best he keeps watchin us ants).

 

[dilloduck]

This is a purpose.



i.e. purpose is subjective.

For me, the purpose of life is determining perspective. What's important to you? This answer can only be subjective, and scorning somebody else's only reveals ignorance in yourself. Only when you know what’s truly important to you, can live accordingly.

Note: Please remember, I made a distinction between Man's purpose and God's purpose for Man. This is with repect to Fisherking's quote as that appears to me to be a possible purpose God has for Man.

So man decides his own purpose?

 

[Phaedrus]

For me, man as an individual provides his own subjective purpose.

 

[dilloduck]

For me, man as an individual provides his own subjective purpose.

not part of any larger plan?

 

[5stringJeff]

Why would an omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, eternal being wish to be feared?

Such ephemeral beings as ourselves would be beneath the notice of such a being. And due to the limitations of our perception and cognition, as well as our brief existence, we humans would be unable to percieve such a being. The only reason I can posit for such a beings interest in our species would be boredom or ennui.

1. It's not that He wishes to be feared, necessarily; it's that because He is omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, and, eternal, whereas humans are none of those things, that we are to fear Him - and 'fear' carrying the connotation of awe, not the connotation of scared.

2. If God created all life, as an omnipotent being would have done, then we would hardly be below His notice. And if God is able to create us, then He is also able to create us with the ability to partially understand Him (not fully, as understanding an infinite being would require infinite understanding, which only an infinite being has).

 

[Phaedrus]

not part of any larger plan?

If I'm part of some larger plan, so be it. I only know the purpose I make for myself.

 

[Bullypulpit]

Man is inherently bad...

Original sin...What utter rubbish. Humans are not "inherently bad", that is learned, along with that which is good.

 

[dilloduck]

Original sin...What utter rubbish. Humans are not "inherently bad", that is learned, along with that which is good.

Run across any feral children recently ?

 

[Phaedrus]

Original sin...What utter rubbish.

Taking a quote out of context is utter rubbish. I was providing a justification for the belief that God's purpose for man is to fear Him. I never said that was my own personal belief.

I do believe, however, that our inherent situation is quite shitty. This fact can be transcended, however, to obtain bliss/purpose/worth. Thus in face of our situation being "shitty" we can be truly happy.

People choose to do bad, and people choose to do good. The choices themselves are neutral, the actions that result are not.

 

[Dr Grump]

1. It's not that He wishes to be feared, necessarily; it's that because He is omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, and, eternal, whereas humans are none of those things, that we are to fear Him - and 'fear' carrying the connotation of awe, not the connotation of scared.

2. If God created all life, as an omnipotent being would have done, then we would hardly be below His notice. And if God is able to create us, then He is also able to create us with the ability to partially understand Him (not fully, as understanding an infinite being would require infinite understanding, which only an infinite being has).

And this is where I just don't get it. Why does he want us to be in awe/fear of him/her? Why does he/she want us to partially understand him/her? As a non-believer, my cynacism kicks in. I find any explanation that seems forthcoming too convenient, because it is usually of the "who are we to question" etc. IOW, nobody knows, and this is the bit that I find frustrating.

 

[Fisherking]

And this is where I just don't get it. Why does he want us to be in awe/fear of him/her? Why does he/she want us to partially understand him/her? As a non-believer, my cynacism kicks in. I find any explanation that seems forthcoming too convenient, because it is usually of the "who are we to question" etc. IOW, nobody knows, and this is the bit that I find frustrating.

Imagine that you were a King of a country of people that did not esteem you as such. You would think that there would be a certain amount of respect that would be shown, but the people showed you none.
Or maybe a superviser with people under you who would never listen to instruction, it would be kind of disrespectfull.

God, as creator of mankind and ultimate authority and King, simply wants the reverance and honor of being just that. Any other way he is like the superviser that was not esteemed that way by the employees.

Another example I can think of is my daughter, she is 12 years old and very respectful, not so much that she is afraid of getting in trouble, but she doesnt want us to be dissappointed in her. We are the parents, and she is( in most cases) very respectful of that.
Hopefully that helps some with what it means to fear God.

 

[jillian]

And this is where I just don't get it. Why does he want us to be in awe/fear of him/her? Why does he/she want us to partially understand him/her? As a non-believer, my cynacism kicks in. I find any explanation that seems forthcoming too convenient, because it is usually of the "who are we to question" etc. IOW, nobody knows, and this is the bit that I find frustrating.

The best explanation I've ever heard is that we're supposed to be in awe of the greatness, but that we can't really comprehend His true nature. The creator is defined more by what he is not than what he is. He's infinite with no static form, with no beginning, no end. I don't know about anyone else, but I like the idea that there's something much greater than we can even comprehend.