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Originally posted by freeandfun1
Not sure what you mean by your last sentence.
As for the charges, actually, the law does allow for different charges based on the actions taken during the course of a robbery, murder, etc.
Let's say the third didn't know the other two had guns, or maybe he didn't even know when they went into the store that the other two were going to rob the store, do you still charge the third guy? Do you charge him with armed robbery or just robbery? There are too many variables and decisions to be made and punishment is dished out based on the level and number of decisions.
Originally posted by NewGuy
Therefore, BOTH have equal say.
Originally posted by freeandfun1
Both SHOULD have equal say - but they don't.
Originally posted by NewGuy
You got me.
I am GNASHING my teeth.
:
Originally posted by freeandfun1
I am not sure how you don't see the double, triple or whatever, standard.
Decision 1 - Have sex or not.
Woman decides yes.
Man decides yes.
Woman: 1
Man: 1
Decision 2 - Take fetus to term or not
Woman decides yes.
Man decides. . . . no, no, no, the man has no say oops!
Woman: 2
Man: 1
Decision 3 - to keep the child or give up for adoption
Woman decides yes.
Man decides. . . . no, no, no, the man has no say oops!
Woman: 3
Man: 1
Decision 4 - Man in child's life or not
Woman decides yes.
Man decides yes or no
Woman: 4
Man: 2
Decision 5 - Man pays child support whether he decides to be in child's life or not
Woman decides yes.
Man decides. . . . no, no, no, the man has no say oops!
Woman: 5
Man: 2
Now there are five decisions the woman gets to make and only two for the man.
You focus on the 9 months but then you equate that to 18 or more years of child support the man has to pay. In my opinion, the man should take precautions not to get a woman pregnant. Especially one he does not plan to marry. But at the same time, I look at the above outline and I see five decions being made by the woman and only two by the man. If women are equal, then shouldn't the decisions have equal weight? If so, then it is obvious the woman's responsibility should be more than the man's. She is the one that was able to make the most decisions along the way. She is the one that is responsible for her body and what it brings forth.
Originally posted by freeandfun1
I am not sure how you don't see the double, triple or whatever, standard.
Decision 1 - Have sex or not.
Woman decides yes.
Man decides yes.
Woman: 1
Man: 1
Decision 2 - Take fetus to term or not
Woman decides yes.
Man decides. . . . no, no, no, the man has no say oops!
Woman: 2
Man: 1
Decision 3 - to keep the child or give up for adoption
Woman decides yes.
Man decides. . . . no, no, no, the man has no say oops!
Woman: 3
Man: 1
Decision 4 - Man in child's life or not
Woman decides yes.
Man decides yes or no
Woman: 4
Man: 2
Decision 5 - Man pays child support whether he decides to be in child's life or not
Woman decides yes.
Man decides. . . . no, no, no, the man has no say oops!
Woman: 5
Man: 2
Now there are five decisions the woman gets to make and only two for the man.
You focus on the 9 months but then you equate that to 18 or more years of child support the man has to pay. In my opinion, the man should take precautions not to get a woman pregnant. Especially one he does not plan to marry. But at the same time, I look at the above outline and I see five decions being made by the woman and only two by the man. If women are equal, then shouldn't the decisions have equal weight? If so, then it is obvious the woman's responsibility should be more than the man's. She is the one that was able to make the most decisions along the way. She is the one that is responsible for her body and what it brings forth.
Originally posted by nycflasher
By the way, go fuck yourself.
Ya rude bastard.
A strong mind would point out the faults in my logic instead of insulting me.
Originally posted by freeandfun1
you can't see the double standard because you don't want to admit it.
Woman has all the choice period. There is a very clear double standard but to admit it would then admit that SOME women are not capable of taking care of themselves.
Originally posted by NewGuy
You didn't adress but ignored the point that the Constitution says ALL COURTS must bow to the authority of the Constitution.
Any law made after, if counter is illegal.
Your argument about the supreme court and its authority have no weight.
Back to the topic at hand, shall we get into the same discussion about the Constitution justifying ALL have the right to life, liberty, and the persuit of happiness?
Shall we get into the discussion you lost on when life begins?
Which way do you want to lose?
Originally posted by NewGuy
The first case was Roe v. Wade, which arose from Dallas and was decided in 1973, Justice Blackmun's second year on the court. Justice Blackmun wrote the majority opinion declaring a constitutional right of privacy "broad enough to encompass a woman's decision whether or not to terminate her pregnancy."
The opinion quickly drew criticism from both conservative and liberal scholars, its most evident shortcoming being the failure to identify where the abortion right actually is located in the text of the Constitution. Of course, the ostensible right didn't reside there, nor was it to be found in constitutional history. It had to be forced into our fundamental charter.
Originally posted by brneyedgrl80
I just don't think you want to admit that there isn't one.
I have clearly stated what and why I disagree with you. I belive you to be wrong in 2 out of 5 things you posted that had nothing to do with our original abortion topic. You previously stated that out of your list men only have a say in 2 categories out of 5 (which were 2 seperate issues from the ones I disagreed upon). Now, because I have explained why I do not agree with you, that would leave only 1 option in you list where, in my words, the man does have a say, it's just not a final one. So where is the double standard? So in conclusion, all the "decisions" you have posted, the man does have a say. So again, where is the double standard?
And I can easily admit that there are women who can not take care of themselves just like there are men who can not take care of themselves.
Just admit that at least we agree to disagree.
Originally posted by brneyedgrl80
I know that there is. I suggest to stop implying what I do and do not know and stick to the topic at hand, which orginally enough was about abortion and child support, not all this other crap you brought up to semi-side track from the original topic.
The fact that you seem to ignore is that a say leads to a decision. In 4 out of the 5 decisions you posted, a man's say would/could lead to a decision in the man's favor. With or without the help of a court in some instances.
The only decision in your list where a man can have a say that may not lead to a decision that sides with the man because of a woman's decision is in the abortion issue, which is what I have been saying this whole time. Sigh....
If you wish to play the "hole in the bucket" game, we can.
Originally posted by dilloduck
And your whole choice issue is that it just so happens that the fetus matures inside the mother?
Originally posted by brneyedgrl80
Again, I see where you are coming from. In my opinion (off topic) I think anyone who considers or uses abortion as a contraceptive is abusing the privalage.
Back on topic, the only thing I disagree with you is your last comment that a women's body is no longer her body when she is pregnant. I have to say that I see it as both, her body and a home for the developing embryo.
I still feel that the man can have an opinion, but ultimately it is up to the woman.
The same unfairness occurs even without money in the issue. Let's say my girlfriend and I (together) decide to have a baby. Suddenly, a few months into the pregnancy, she decides to bail out. How come she has the right to get rid of my potential son or daughter?Originally posted by Kathianne
Yes, that seems to be the argument of her and others. As I said from the beginning, ignoring the (im)morality, why does the woman, with the important exception of forced sex, have the right to decide whether or not the 'potential life' survives, via abortion? If she decides to 'keep' the 'potential life' the man is responsible for child support for 18 plus years. How is this fair?
