Do Palestinians ever have the right of self-defence against Israel?

[OldUSAFSniper]

Your money is used to pay salaries, office expenses, fund raising expenses and holiday flights to Israel how many "Israeli children who's parents have been killed in terrorist attacks" do you think there are?
If Americans Knew - what every American needs to know about Israel/Palestine

Nice try, but I always check out charities BEFORE I give to them. Over 94% of the money given go to it's intended recepients. It's basically an evangelical Christian charity that works closely with the Israeli's.

Don't dismiss that last sentence very quickly either. You hear what I am saying. Conservative, evangelical Christians from America working CLOSELY with JEWISH Israelis, some of them very conservative Orthadox Jews. Why I thought evangelical Christians were supposed to HATE the Jews? Aren't we supposed to HATE the Mormons also? "You will KNOW them by their works..."

Quite frankly, if there's one child... that's one too many. I don't read propaganda dude...

 

[Hossfly]

Attacking terrorists on their way to make terror attacks and fire rockets is completely justiified and should be considered a Palestinian violation of the ceasefire.

Or is that it makes you happy see things like the Eilat terror attack last year? many Israelis killed and injured.

Yeah, it probebly suits you and Tinmore.

Wrong. An attack violates the ceasefire. Anything short of that, is not an attack.

You people really do take the cake for ridiculous statements.

We heard about the attack in the Cinema in Colorado. That was a very sad thing, indeed, and many innocent people were harmed.

But listening to that on the radio. It got us Israelis thinking one thing. "Why do you give 'em guns?" Why don't you have a clear policy about it? or change the law of weapon carrying? Why when you KNOW your people are in good chance of being hurt now, or tomorrow, or the next day, you don't do anything to prevent? to change?

That is what targeted attacks are, in case you don't get it. We don't wait for a terrorist to go bomb a bus and then wait for the world to "condemn" the "tragedy". we go and shoot their a**es down so they won't harm us.

When someone is clearly planning of muder, we don't respect the ceasefire, because the ceasefire broke once you do certain things to kill. We don't think American. And you should stop think American, as well.

It's a terrible thing for people to die needlessly and yes, something needs to be done to avoid these tragedies. One thing would be to have more effective background checks. But the one thing that cannot happen in America is to have gun control. Our 2d Amendment to the Constitution prevents the government from having unlimited control over the people. Imagine what would happen if we had no guns. Every tin pot dictator in the world would be here in America, herding us around like sheep. Plus, we would be in the same boat as the people in Islamic countries. After the Cold War the Russians admitted they considered invading the US and felt they could defeat our military, but they wouldn't be able to overcome the firepower of the citizenry. That's why we must have firearms. It's like riding the back of the tiger.

 

[irosie91]

We Israelis know the feeling
__________________

No, you don't.
When was the last time anyone was killed by one of those crappy "rockets"?

Conversely, when was the last time a Palestinian man, woman, or child was killed by the "brave" IDF, shooting from afar?

Many "palestinians" are killed from afar by RETURN FIRE return fire is always legal and always justified. There is no way of knowing if "palestinians" are storing kids in the sites from which they fire or if they bother to put them out of danger. In fact palestinians are storing children from the sites from which the fire and do nothing to shelter them The real question is-----WHO KILLS CHILDREN FOR THE GLORY OF THEIR "god" how many Israeli children have been grabbed and had their throats slit vs how many palestinian children? Who teaches ------"if your child dies in war he immediately flies up to paradise'?

 

[High_Gravity]

Do Palestinians ever have the right of self-defence against Israel? - YouTube

Launching rockets at Israel isn't self defence, nice try.

 

[OldUSAFSniper]

I think it was Cicero who said it best: "If you are not the first to strike, you will surely be the first struck."

I am an evengelical Christian conservative and I give money to an organization that supports the state of Israel. I give it to them because they help Israeli children who's parents have been killed in terrorist attacks. I will continue to give to this charity.

You know, while Egypt was friendly with Israel, they were at peace and prosperous. A wise man said it best: You will know them by their works. If the Palestinians are getting a bad rep, it's because of what they do... simple as that.
__________________

No, it isn't.
Israelis have murdered 3-10 times as many innocent men, women and children as the reverse!

You, Sniper, are a victim of the well-controlled mass media which only gives you the Israeli point of view. E.g., Do you believe that "Iran wants to kill all the Jews/wipe them off the face of the earth"?

Did you know that over 20 THOUSAND Jews prefer to live in Iran? Even when offered money to move to Israel?

PS- Does your support of Israel include the belief that Jews will get to heaven only through Jesus?

Iran???? Ha, ha, ha. Achmidenijad (SP?) believes that the Holocaust is a lie? Iran supports Hamas and Hezbollah, threatens to shut the Strait of Hormuz and seeks to have it's own nuclear arsenal to wipe Israel off of the map, and I'm supposed to believe that ANYTHING Iran does is good? Iran is run by a group of ridiculous old men who impose their will and religious views on their own people while trying to do the same to the rest of the world.

The bus bombing in eastern Europe, the terrorist who blew off his own legs, the taking of American diplomats... As I said before: You will know them by their works.

I am becoming MORE convinced that Iran is a greater threat to the peace and stability of this world than the old Soviet empire ever was.

 

[High_Gravity]

Nothin but net for OLDUSAFSniper.

 

[Jos]

I don't read propaganda dude...

You read Nothing But propaganda, thats maybe why the site I linked is called
IF AMERICANS KNEW, you chose not to read or judge for yourself.


Iran???? Ha, ha, ha. Achmidenijad (SP?) believes that the Holocaust is a lie?
He has called for a dicussion
Iran supports Hamas and Hezbollah,
threatens to shut the Strait of Hormuz
If Attacked
and seeks to have it's own nuclear arsenal to wipe Israel off of the map,
Iran is a signatory of the Nuclear Non proliferation Treaty, which gives them the right to produce nuclear energy (israel refuses to sign or let inspectors in)
and I'm supposed to believe that ANYTHING Iran does is good? Iran is run by a group of ridiculous old men who impose their will and religious views on their own people while trying to do the same to the rest of the world.

The bus bombing in eastern Europe, the terrorist who blew off his own legs,
THe guy with the (fake) American Passport in Bulgaria,did more than lose his legs

the taking of American diplomats... As I said before: You will know them by their works.

I am becoming MORE convinced that Iran is a greater threat to the peace and stability of this world than the old Soviet empire ever was.
Thats the way they want you to see it

 

[irosie91]

I don't read propaganda dude...

You read Nothing But propaganda, thats maybe why the site I linked is called
IF AMERICANS KNEW, you chose not to read or judge for yourself.


Iran???? Ha, ha, ha. Achmidenijad (SP?) believes that the Holocaust is a lie?
He has called for a dicussion
Iran supports Hamas and Hezbollah,
threatens to shut the Strait of Hormuz
If Attacked
and seeks to have it's own nuclear arsenal to wipe Israel off of the map,
Iran is a signatory of the Nuclear Non proliferation Treaty, which gives them the right to produce nuclear energy (israel refuses to sign or let inspectors in)

and I'm supposed to believe that ANYTHING Iran does is good? Iran is run by a group of ridiculous old men who impose their will and religious views on their own people while
trying to do the same to the rest of the world.

The bus bombing in eastern Europe, the terrorist who blew off his own legs,
THe guy with the (fake) American Passport in Bulgaria,did more than lose his legs

the taking of American diplomats... As I said before: You will know them by their works.

I am becoming MORE convinced that Iran is a greater threat to the peace and stability of this world than the old Soviet empire ever was.
Thats the way they want you to see it

Yes---you have finally posted a true statement THAT IS EXACTLY HOW IRAN WANTS THE WORLD TO SEE IRAN----as the world's greatest POWER and the HEAD OF THE GREAT ISLAMIC CALIPHATE IRAN IS SEEKING EMPIRE it is a bit silly but the fact is that it is going to be very bloody. About 25 years ago-----OLIVER NORTH cited a man name OSAMA BIN LADEN as a threat to world peace and idiots did laugh. For some really interesting reading------go back to the writings of circa 1936 when persons must like Jos were INSISTING that Adolf Hitler was harmless. In fact much of that writing was devoted to the idea that the only people who baselessly did not like Jos's hero Adolf were the WAR MONGERING JEWS It is fascinating stuff. The people writing for the pro adolf stuff always presented themselves as ANTI WAR ---PRO PEACE HUMANISTS

 

[Hossfly]

I don't read propaganda dude...

You read Nothing But propaganda, thats maybe why the site I linked is called
IF AMERICANS KNEW, you chose not to read or judge for yourself.


Iran???? Ha, ha, ha. Achmidenijad (SP?) believes that the Holocaust is a lie?
He has called for a dicussion
Iran supports Hamas and Hezbollah,
threatens to shut the Strait of Hormuz
If Attacked
and seeks to have it's own nuclear arsenal to wipe Israel off of the map,
Iran is a signatory of the Nuclear Non proliferation Treaty, which gives them the right to produce nuclear energy (israel refuses to sign or let inspectors in)
and I'm supposed to believe that ANYTHING Iran does is good? Iran is run by a group of ridiculous old men who impose their will and religious views on their own people while trying to do the same to the rest of the world.

The bus bombing in eastern Europe, the terrorist who blew off his own legs,
THe guy with the (fake) American Passport in Bulgaria,did more than lose his legs

the taking of American diplomats... As I said before: You will know them by their works.

I am becoming MORE convinced that Iran is a greater threat to the peace and stability of this world than the old Soviet empire ever was.
Thats the way they want you to see it

A-Jad is calling for a "discussion?" Very interesting!
I wonder if he thinks the moon landings were faked?
Or if the Yeti is real?

 

[Jos]

A-Jad is calling for a "discussion?" Very interesting!
?

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykd-syzZ4ZY]Iran's Ahmadinejad on Holocaust - YouTube[/ame]

 

[MrAlwaysRight]

Did you know that over 20 THOUSAND Jews prefer to live in Iran? Even when offered money to move to Israel?

PS- Does your support of Israel include the belief that Jews will get to heaven only through Jesus?
Iran???? Ha, ha, ha. Achmidenijad (SP?) believes that the Holocaust is a lie? Iran supports Hamas and Hezbollah, threatens to shut the Strait of Hormuz and seeks to have it's own nuclear arsenal to wipe Israel off of the map, and I'm supposed to believe that ANYTHING Iran does is good? Iran is run by a group of ridiculous old men who impose their will and religious views on their own people while trying to do the same to the rest of the world.

The bus bombing in eastern Europe, the terrorist who blew off his own legs, the taking of American diplomats... As I said before: You will know them by their works.

I am becoming MORE convinced that Iran is a greater threat to the peace and stability of this world than the old Soviet empire ever was.
__________________
OldUSAFSniper
=====================

That's an interesting perspective, Sniper; I'd like to know by which criteria you adjudge a country's relative threat to world peace and security. Stealing land from specific target groups? Refusing to allow AIEA inspectors in? Lying about having nuclear WMDs? Where Jews PREFER to live?
What?

But, are you basing your opinion of what Ahmadinejad said, based on what the media told you he said, or have you read the actual word-for-word translations of what he has really said, and used your OWN critical thinking skills to come to the conclusions you did, above?

PS-You didn't answer the question about getting to Heaven through Jesus. I apologize if that were too uncomfortable to consider.

 

[Hossfly]

Did you know that over 20 THOUSAND Jews prefer to live in Iran? Even when offered money to move to Israel?

PS- Does your support of Israel include the belief that Jews will get to heaven only through Jesus?
Iran???? Ha, ha, ha. Achmidenijad (SP?) believes that the Holocaust is a lie? Iran supports Hamas and Hezbollah, threatens to shut the Strait of Hormuz and seeks to have it's own nuclear arsenal to wipe Israel off of the map, and I'm supposed to believe that ANYTHING Iran does is good? Iran is run by a group of ridiculous old men who impose their will and religious views on their own people while trying to do the same to the rest of the world.

The bus bombing in eastern Europe, the terrorist who blew off his own legs, the taking of American diplomats... As I said before: You will know them by their works.

I am becoming MORE convinced that Iran is a greater threat to the peace and stability of this world than the old Soviet empire ever was.
__________________
OldUSAFSniper
=====================

That's an interesting perspective, Sniper; I'd like to know by which criteria you adjudge a country's relative threat to world peace and security. Stealing land from specific target groups? Refusing to allow AIEA inspectors in? Lying about having nuclear WMDs? Where Jews PREFER to live?
What?

But, are you basing your opinion of what Ahmadinejad said, based on what the media told you he said, or have you read the actual word-for-word translations of what he has really said, and used your OWN critical thinking skills to come to the conclusions you did, above?

PS-You didn't answer the question about getting to Heaven through Jesus. I apologize if that were too uncomfortable to consider.

At the appropriate time the Jews in the Diaspora will return home. That's a given.

 

[Billo_Really]

At the appropriate time the Jews in the Diaspora will return home. That's a given.

The diaspora was a myth; it never happened.

 

[Billo_Really]

We heard about the attack in the Cinema in Colorado. That was a very sad thing, indeed, and many innocent people were harmed.

But listening to that on the radio. It got us Israelis thinking one thing. "Why do you give 'em guns?" Why don't you have a clear policy about it? or change the law of weapon carrying? Why when you KNOW your people are in good chance of being hurt now, or tomorrow, or the next day, you don't do anything to prevent? to change?

That is what targeted attacks are, in case you don't get it. We don't wait for a terrorist to go bomb a bus and then wait for the world to "condemn" the "tragedy". we go and shoot their a**es down so they won't harm us.

When someone is clearly planning of muder, we don't respect the ceasefire, because the ceasefire broke once you do certain things to kill. We don't think American. And you should stop think American, as well.

I don't own a gun and I never will. I could also care less about the 2nd amendment. Gun owner's in this country are fuckin' nuts. And the NRA can go to hell. We need gun control laws similar to that of Canada's.

That's my take on all that.

 

[docmauser1]

At the appropriate time the Jews in the Diaspora will return home. That's a given.

The diaspora was a myth; it never happened.

Arab discriminatory attitudes have no bounds - arab wholesale diaspora is residing in palistan, but they deny diaspora to others!

 

[docmauser1]

I don't own a gun and I never will. I could also care less about the 2nd amendment. Gun owner's in this country are fuckin' nuts. And the NRA can go to hell. We need gun control laws similar to that of Canada's.

Armed citizens are an impediment to the sharia diktat, indeed. And sharia recognizes only those parts of the Constitution that serve the promotion of sharia, with the Constitution to be abolished altogether after a takeover, of course, cue islam under siege drivel and all that.

 

[ima]

You know, I have no dog in this fight. I live here in the United States, smack dab in the middle in the state of Oklahoma. My day-to-day life consists of trying to keep a small working cattle ranch going. My biggest worry is about how much feed is going to cost me and whether or not I can get the hay from the field into the pole barn.

But here's the deal. I listen to this stuff about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict and I have to tell you that I see no Israeli's strapping suicide vests onto men and women and marching them into schools or check points to blow up the odd Israeli. I don't see the Israeli's launching Katusha rockets randomly into settlements hoping that they can blow up a child or someone else. I haven't seen the Israeli's take over a school full of children and then kill all of them. I don't see the Israeli's making cartoons so they can brainwash their children into why it is a good thing to kill someone. And the last point? I don't see the Israeli's electing a bona fide terrorist organization to represent them in some banana like national government who's only real goal is to pad their own pockets with aid money anyway.

Since the creation of the state of Israel, their neighbors have been trying to destroy them and the Israeli's have kind of stood on their own two feet and said, "Uh, no... we aren't going through this again." You got to give it to them, they've got cajones. I mean time after time after time, the Israeli's do what they need to do to keep themselves from the ovens (where the Arabs would SURELY put them if they had the chance).

I think it was Cicero who said it best: "If you are not the first to strike, you will surely be the first struck."

I am an evengelical Christian conservative and I give money to an organization that supports the state of Israel. I give it to them because they help Israeli children who's parents have been killed in terrorist attacks. I will continue to give to this charity.

You know, while Egypt was friendly with Israel, they were at peace and prosperous. A wise man said it best: You will know them by their works. If the Palestinians are getting a bad rep, it's because of what they do... simple as that.

Your dog in this fight is that you need the apocalypse to happen in the Middle East before Jesus can come back and save you, that's why you support Israel, or at least that's why your pastor tells you that you support Israel (although he probably doesn't lay it out like I just did, lol).
And as for cicero's quote, is establishing a country at the tip of a gun and against widespread disagreement considered the first strike?

 

[MrAlwaysRight]

At the appropriate time the Jews in the Diaspora will return home. That's a given.
__________________
And, what does the Torah say is the appropriate time, Hossfly? When the Likudniks say, or when G-d sends a Messiah to gather up all the Jews from the "four corners" of the earth?

PS- What's keeping Jews from ending the Diaspora now? Are Jews being held captive in the US (the second largest population of people who claim to be followers of Judaism)?

 

[Hossfly]

At the appropriate time the Jews in the Diaspora will return home. That's a given.
__________________
And, what does the Torah say is the appropriate time, Hossfly? When the Likudniks say, or when G-d sends a Messiah to gather up all the Jews from the "four corners" of the earth?

PS- What's keeping Jews from ending the Diaspora now? Are Jews being held captive in the US (the second largest population of people who claim to be followers of Judaism)?

I haven't the slightest idea when it will happen and it make's no difference to me at this time. Just put your money on it and you won't lose.

 

[OldUSAFSniper]

The very first thing I noticed about the responses to my statement here in this thread is that an attempt was made to bring a religious overtone into the situation. Really??? Religion??? You're going to ask me about what Jesus says about the Jews, about the end times, what my pastor 'tells' me to do, or anything else about MY religion trying to make the point that this somehow 'taints' my perception of what is happening? I wonder sometimes if some of these posters aren't from countries other than the United States. If that is the case, then I can understand why it's hard to understand Americans. Especially if your in a situation where the rulers of the nation makes a persons religion so important.

In the United States, religion can be important. Very important... or not. You see, our constitution says that a man has a right to worship however he wants to worship. You can disagree, but religion is NOT something you go to war over. My evangelical Christian church sits right next to an Espiscopal Church. Some of my friends go to that church and to say that we are a mile apart in doctrine would be a massive understatement. Within one mile of my church is a Buddhist temple, a Jewish Synogogue and a Mormon church. There is a huge Islamic facility in Tulsa. A group from my church attended a service at an all-African American church in north Tulsa and quite frankly I can tell you that God is alive in that church. They rocked the house! When I meet someone, perhaps one of the very last things I determine is what religion they follow. Because I DON'T CARE.

I don't get this: We'll kill you because you don't worship or believe like I do crap. Really? And I have a little clue for you: I go to church, but my pastor DOES NOT tell me what to do. Occassionally, just occassionally, I'll join the guys for a drink every now and then. And yep, if I bust my knuckle with a hammer you really can hear the cussing a mile away.

Facts are facts and you can try and spin it anyway you want to. The Palestinians strap suicide vests to women to blow up Israeli's and don't care if it's women or children. They launch Katusha rockets into Jewish settlements not caring one bit about who might get killed. Aid money sent to the Palestinians NEVER see the intended uses. It winds up lining some maggot's pocket. And Hamas and Hezbollah are TERRORIST ORGANIZATIONS funded by Iran. The Palestinians elected one of them as their legitimate government.

When the Palestinians decide that surviving and thriving is what they want and they go to the Israeli's and hold out their hand for peace... then I'll be behind them...