Do Faithful Muslims Lie?

[Kalam]

Like I said , the fighting continues until only muslims remain.

Fail.

...It does not wean that Islam incites the believers to go to war to force unbelievers at the point of sword to give up disbelief and polytheism and adopt the Way of Allah instead. War is to be waged only to make them give up fitnah. As a matter of fact, Islam allows freedom of belief to all non-Muslims. One may adopt any way of life that one chooses and may or may not worship anyone or anything...​

Thats not the Quran.

And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and polytheism: i.e. worshipping others besides Allâh) and the religion (worship) will all be for Allâh Alone [in the whole of the world[]]. But if they cease (worshipping others besides Allâh), then certainly, Allâh is All-Seer of what they do. (Al-Anfal 8:39)

it says it twice it must mean it.

And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allâh) and (all and every kind of) worship is for Allâh (Alone). But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zâlimûn (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.) (Al-Baqarah 2:193)

The tafseer explains the passage in clear terms; you ignore this and provide your own silly interpretation in spite of having no knowledge of Arabic or Islam. It seems that in spite of what you like to claim, you're very much at odds with "the scholars." Who would have guessed?

When you say "that's not the Qur'an!" and proceed to post a "translation" whose false meaning is based on parenthetical additions to the true text, you garnish your already painfully stupid argument with a generous amount of hypocrisy. All aboard the fail train.

 

[Sky Dancer]

It's ridiculous to see a non-muslim studying the Qu'ran and interpreting it from a biased, Western Christian perspective.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

It's ridiculous to see a non-muslim studying the Qu'ran and interpreting it from a biased, Western Christian perspective.

Well I use the opinions of scholars and imams, I dont post my opinions .

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

Fail.

...It does not wean that Islam incites the believers to go to war to force unbelievers at the point of sword to give up disbelief and polytheism and adopt the Way of Allah instead. War is to be waged only to make them give up fitnah. As a matter of fact, Islam allows freedom of belief to all non-Muslims. One may adopt any way of life that one chooses and may or may not worship anyone or anything...​

Thats not the Quran.

And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and polytheism: i.e. worshipping others besides Allâh) and the religion (worship) will all be for Allâh Alone [in the whole of the world[]]. But if they cease (worshipping others besides Allâh), then certainly, Allâh is All-Seer of what they do. (Al-Anfal 8:39)

it says it twice it must mean it.

And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allâh) and (all and every kind of) worship is for Allâh (Alone). But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zâlimûn (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.) (Al-Baqarah 2:193)

The tafseer explains the passage in clear terms; you ignore this and provide your own silly interpretation in spite of having no knowledge of Arabic or Islam. It seems that in spite of what you like to claim, you're very much at odds with "the scholars." Who would have guessed?

When you say "that's not the Qur'an!" and proceed to post a "translation" whose false meaning is based on parenthetical additions to the true text, you garnish your already painfully stupid argument with a generous amount of hypocrisy. All aboard the fail train.

Its close enough to get the gist .
Isnt it?

From your source concerning the verse I asked about,
8:39
[39-40] O Believers, fight with the disbelievers till there is no more mischief and the way of life prescribed by Allah is established in its entirety.31 Then if they desist from mischief, surely Allah beholds what they do, but if they give no heed, know it that Allah is your Protector, and He is the best of all protectors and helpers.

8. Surah Al Anfal (The Spoils of War) - Sayyid Abul Ala Maududi - Tafhim al-Qur'an - The Meaning of the Qur'an


Meaning of Mischief

In his Tafsir, As-Suddi said that Ibn `Abbas and Ibn Mas`ud commented,

[وَإِذَا قِيلَ لَهُمْ لاَ تُفْسِدُواْ فِى الأَرْضِ قَالُواْ إِنَّمَا نَحْنُ مُصْلِحُونَ ]

(And when it is said to them: "Do not make mischief on the earth,'' they say: "We are only peacemakers.'') "They are the hypocrites. As for,

[لاَ تُفْسِدُواْ فِى الأَرْضِ]

("Do not make mischief on the earth''), that is disbelief and acts of disobedience.'' Abu Ja`far said that Ar-Rabi` bin Anas said that Abu Al-`Aliyah said that Allah's statement,

[وَإِذَا قِيلَ لَهُمْ لاَ تُفْسِدُواْ فِى الأَرْضِ]

(And when it is said to them: "Do not make mischief on the earth,''), means, "Do not commit acts of disobedience on the earth. Their mischief is disobeying Allah, because whoever disobeys Allah on the earth, or commands that Allah be disobeyed, he has committed mischief on the earth. Peace on both the earth and in the heavens is ensured (and earned) through obedience (to Allah).'' Ar-Rabi` bin Anas and Qatadah said similarly.
Tafsir.com Tafsir Ibn Kathir

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

From your source.

 

[Sky Dancer]

It's ridiculous to see a non-muslim studying the Qu'ran and interpreting it from a biased, Western Christian perspective.

Well I use the opinions of scholars and imams, I dont post my opinions .

Right. If that were true, then how do I know that you don't like Muslims? I'll tell you one way I know. Whenever I make a post that is neutral to positive about Muslims you neg rep me.

 

[antagon]

It's ridiculous to see a non-muslim studying the Qu'ran and interpreting it from a biased, Western Christian perspective.

Well I use the opinions of scholars and imams, I dont post my opinions .

Right. If that were true, then how do I know that you don't like Muslims? I'll tell you one way I know. Whenever I make a post that is neutral to positive about Muslims you neg rep me.

fitnah is bitchmade with the neg reps, i recall, but the floating piggy was my guess.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

More deflection, it does not answer or explain the second part of the first sentence in ayat 8:39 that is repeated in 2:193
I will bold it so those who wish to explain it can more easliy identify the part Im refering to.


And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and polytheism: i.e. worshipping others besides Allâh) and the religion (worship) will all be for Allâh Alone [in the whole of the world[]]. But if they cease (worshipping others besides Allâh), then certainly, Allâh is All-Seer of what they do. (Al-Anfal 8:39)

And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allâh) and (all and every kind of) worship is for Allâh (Alone). But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zâlimûn (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.) (Al-Baqarah 2:193)

 

[Madeline]

It's ridiculous to see a non-muslim studying the Qu'ran and interpreting it from a biased, Western Christian perspective.

Well I use the opinions of scholars and imams, I dont post my opinions .

Right. If that were true, then how do I know that you don't like Muslims? I'll tell you one way I know. Whenever I make a post that is neutral to positive about Muslims you neg rep me.

Mr. Fitnah, who despises Islam, still claims to be a scholar of that faith although he has never practiced it. He would have us trust him above actual Muslims on all matters Islamic. This desire to control what we think of Islam is quite powerful in him; I cannot recall ever seeing him post on another topic. Speculating about the motives of someone who would behave in this way has led to me one dark idea after another, but IME those with a craven desire to control the thoughts of others have suffered a loss of their own sense of personal power.

He's a victim of his own paranoia and hate, and I pity him.

 

[Si modo]

Well I use the opinions of scholars and imams, I dont post my opinions .

Right. If that were true, then how do I know that you don't like Muslims? I'll tell you one way I know. Whenever I make a post that is neutral to positive about Muslims you neg rep me.

Mr. Fitnah, who despises Islam, still claims to be a scholar of that faith although he has never practiced it. He would have us trust him above actual Muslims on all matters Islamic. This desire to control what we think of Islam is quite powerful in him; I cannot recall every seeing him post on another topic.

He's a victim of his own paranoia and hate, and I pity him.

Interesting. As a person who has admitted being ignorant in Islam, how would you be in any possible position to judge the knowledge of another? Somehow, that makes sense to you.

Fascinating.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

More deflection, it does not answer or explain the second part of the first sentence in ayat 8:39 that is repeated in 2:193
I will bold it so those who wish to explain it can more easliy identify the part Im refering to.


And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and polytheism: i.e. worshipping others besides Allâh) and the religion (worship) will all be for Allâh Alone [in the whole of the world[]]. But if they cease (worshipping others besides Allâh), then certainly, Allâh is All-Seer of what they do. (Al-Anfal 8:39)

And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allâh) and (all and every kind of) worship is for Allâh (Alone). But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zâlimûn (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.) (Al-Baqarah 2:193)
__________________

 

[antagon]

fitnah's record is skipping. you'd imagine he'd have looked into what fitnah means.

 

[Madeline]

More deflection, it does not answer or explain the second part of the first sentence in ayat 8:39 that is repeated in 2:193
I will bold it so those who wish to explain it can more easliy identify the part Im refering to.


And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and polytheism: i.e. worshipping others besides Allâh) and the religion (worship) will all be for Allâh Alone [in the whole of the world[]]. But if they cease (worshipping others besides Allâh), then certainly, Allâh is All-Seer of what they do. (Al-Anfal 8:39)

And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allâh) and (all and every kind of) worship is for Allâh (Alone). But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zâlimûn (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.) (Al-Baqarah 2:193)
__________________

Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me. John 14:6

13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into apostles of Christ. 14 And no wonder! For Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light. 15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers ... 2 Corinthians 11:13–15 (NKJV)

I have come as a light into the world, that whoever believes in Me should not abide in darkness. John 12:46

Of all the major religions on Planet Earth, to my knowledge only Judaism acknowledges that the righteous of another faith are also on a path to God; the rest all claim to be the sole and exclusive Way. Certainly christianity does.

 

[Adamo]

Mr.Fistfucked, when you copy and paste something, do you even know what it means? Or is there another reason why you don't explain how the pasting fits in?

 

[Si modo]

More deflection, it does not answer or explain the second part of the first sentence in ayat 8:39 that is repeated in 2:193
I will bold it so those who wish to explain it can more easliy identify the part Im refering to.


And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and polytheism: i.e. worshipping others besides Allâh) and the religion (worship) will all be for Allâh Alone [in the whole of the world[]]. But if they cease (worshipping others besides Allâh), then certainly, Allâh is All-Seer of what they do. (Al-Anfal 8:39)

And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allâh) and (all and every kind of) worship is for Allâh (Alone). But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zâlimûn (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.) (Al-Baqarah 2:193)
__________________

Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me. John 14:6

13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into apostles of Christ. 14 And no wonder! For Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light. 15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers ... 2 Corinthians 11:13–15 (NKJV)

I have come as a light into the world, that whoever believes in Me should not abide in darkness. John 12:46

Of all the major religions on Planet Earth, to my knowledge only Judaism acknowledges that the righteous of another faith are also on a path to God; the rest all claim to be the sole and exclusive Way. Certainly christianity does.

Of course you address something that isn't even close to his point.

He says it's deflection. At this point, I'm beginning to be convinced that it's plain old stupidity.

 

[Ravi]

More deflection, it does not answer or explain the second part of the first sentence in ayat 8:39 that is repeated in 2:193
I will bold it so those who wish to explain it can more easliy identify the part Im refering to.


And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and polytheism: i.e. worshipping others besides Allâh) and the religion (worship) will all be for Allâh Alone [in the whole of the world[]]. But if they cease (worshipping others besides Allâh), then certainly, Allâh is All-Seer of what they do. (Al-Anfal 8:39)

And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allâh) and (all and every kind of) worship is for Allâh (Alone). But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zâlimûn (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.) (Al-Baqarah 2:193)

What in this passage frightens you? That God is all seeing?

 

[uscitizen]

People seem to forget that the god of muslims is the same god as the one the Jews and Christians worship.

The problem is with people not gods.

 

[Si modo]

People seem to forget that the god of muslims is the dsame gos as the one the Jews and Christians worship.

The problem is with people not gods.

[Emphasis added] Indeed.

 

[Jack Fate]

Get rid of Islam. It's primitive and barbaric and serves absolutely no useful purpose for a civilized society.

 

[Sunni Man]

Get rid of Christianity. It's primitive and barbaric and serves absolutely no useful purpose for a civilized society.

There, I fixed it for you,