Charles Krauthammer Explains Problem With Ground Zero Mosque Perfectly

[Truthmatters]

No its you who dont get it.

You hate because of your jewish faith.

You spewed hate on ANYONE who suggested that the current government of Isreal was not godlike.

I know many jews who see the wrongs of the current government of Isreal and know they are fallable like any other human beings.

This is America and there is nothing wrong with a mosque anywhere just like there is nothing wrong with the strip clubs that are just as close to ground zero.

You my dear are merely thinking with your emotions.

you have never seen me generalize hatred against an entire religion. you are a liar. and there is nothing in being tolerant that requires me to tolerate terrorists.

no one here talks about specific actions of the israeli government. freaking lunatics and liars like you are too busy aggrandizing terrororists as freedom fighters and posting internet lies spewed by al jazeera.

let me know when i have to tolerate BS like that from people who want jews dead.

then we'll talk.

Then why do you agree that there is something wrong in a mosque being build near ground zero?

You claim I grandize terrorist by saying there is nothing wrong with the muslim religion?


Yes many have critized individual actions of the current Isreali government and you blew a fucking gasket calling every one of them a slew of names.

YOU are prejudice because of your religion. I know many Jews who are not as knee jerk foolish as you when it comes to the actions of the current Isreali government.

Where have I EVER said I wanted any jew dead?

You become an utter nutter when it comes to this subject.

I dont think ANY religion has the answers this world needs to move forward, I am an atheist and find every single one lacking.

I would NEVER suggest they be ordered to be quiet likke you want this mosque to be pushed to the back of the bus.

I believe in ideas and their power. The power of my ideas will overcome the inferior ideas.

I wish you felt as strongly about your religious ideas.

You dont bevcause you think others have to be punished to make your ideas heard.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

"A place is made sacred by a widespread belief that it was visited by the miraculous or the transcendent (Lourdes, the Temple Mount), by the presence there once of great nobility and sacrifice (Gettysburg), or by the blood of martyrs and the indescribable suffering of the innocent (Auschwitz). When we speak of Ground Zero as hallowed ground, what we mean is that it belongs to those who suffered and died there -- and that such ownership obliges us, the living, to preserve the dignity and memory of the place, never allowing it to be forgotten, trivialized or misappropriated. ... Religious institutions in this country are autonomous. Who is to say that the [near-Ground Zero] mosque won't one day hire an Anwar al-Aulaqi -- spiritual mentor to the Fort Hood shooter and the Christmas Day bomber, and one-time imam at the Virginia mosque attended by two of the 9/11 terrorists? An Aulaqi preaching in Virginia is a security problem. An Aulaqi preaching at Ground Zero is a sacrilege. Location matters. Especially this location. Ground Zero is the site of the greatest mass murder in American history -- perpetrated by Muslims of a particular Islamist orthodoxy in whose cause they died and in whose name they killed. ... America is a free country where you can build whatever you want -- but not anywhere. That's why we have zoning laws. No liquor store near a school, no strip malls where they offend local sensibilities, and, if your house doesn't meet community architectural codes, you cannot build at all. These restrictions are for reasons of aesthetics. Others are for more profound reasons of common decency and respect for the sacred. No commercial tower over Gettysburg, no convent at Auschwitz -- and no mosque at Ground Zero. Build it anywhere but there." --columnist Charles Krauthammer

Sacrilege at Ground Zero - Opinion - PatriotPost.US

While I agree that it's sacrilege...if they own the property and if it's not against NY city codes, they have every right to build their mosque there. It's in incredibly poor taste, but they have the right to be in incredibly poor taste. Nothing in our laws gives you the right not to be offended.

I agree. They do have every right to build it on private property as long as it passes all local ordinances. That is not the issue at hand.

The issue at hand is the implications of building a mosque in said location which, according to the majority of Americans including our president, is hallowed ground.

You dont do it. You dont build a church in auchiwitz, you dont build a japenese soldier memorial at pearl harbor, you dont put up a mosque in full view of ground zero. This is the point and the subject matter of this thread.

 

[johnrocks]

Of course U.E. went down after Pearl Harbor with millions of men taken out of the job market but the economy was far from healthy until after the war ended, we had rationing of everything from shoes to gas to food in those days, it took the private sector to get us out of what government got us into in the first place.

 

[dilloduck]

So Krauthammer says it's legal but immoral. Gotcha.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

Question?.....

How many of you have actually stood on the top of the then WTC? I have and I resent anyone including Fuckenheimer trying to tell me what my loss of that event should be or who I am supposed to hate for it. Piss on him and any who thinks they know how I should feel about something I felt on a clear New York morning not unlike the one in which those beautiful buildings collapsed. My thoughts are not about what Al Kaida did to the United States. Fuck that cheezy pentagon.. My sorrow is for what religion does to the best things we think of and build. It has been like that for as long as we have been keeping time. The events of 9/11 are just a blip when looking at the whole history of religious indifference for humanity.

I agree with this, especially the part I highlighted.

BTW I lost family in the WTC on 9/11 and feel that give me a different perspective than some people posting here. Not a better perspective just a different one.

 

[Truthmatters]

Of course U.E. went down after Pearl Harbor with millions of men taken out of the job market but the economy was far from healthy until after the war ended, we had rationing of everything from shoes to gad to food in those days, it took the private sector to get us out of what government got us into in the first place.

Why did we have rationing you idiot?

So we could supply our soldiers and the allies.

Here you are rewriting history.

FDR presided over a recovery spurned by government intervention.

The people who lived at the time Agreed and relected him right up to his death.

People like you spit on every one of the people who lived through the depression and the war to gain cheap political points by LYING about it afterwards.

Fuck you and the neocons you rode in on.

 

[boedicca]

If the country hadn't gone through years and years of a Depression made far worse by FDR's policies, there might not have been such a need for rationing.

 

[Truthmatters]

If the country hadn't gone through years and years of a Depression made far worse by FDR's policies, there might not have been such a need for rationing.

So you are really going to say the war era rationing was not to supply our troops and allies?

jesus you people are lying sacks of shit.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

No its you who dont get it.

You hate because of your jewish faith.

You spewed hate on ANYONE who suggested that the current government of Isreal was not godlike.

I know many jews who see the wrongs of the current government of Isreal and know they are fallable like any other human beings.

This is America and there is nothing wrong with a mosque anywhere just like there is nothing wrong with the strip clubs that are just as close to ground zero.

You my dear are merely thinking with your emotions.

you have never seen me generalize hatred against an entire religion. you are a liar. and there is nothing in being tolerant that requires me to tolerate terrorists.

no one here talks about specific actions of the israeli government. freaking lunatics and liars like you are too busy aggrandizing terrororists as freedom fighters and posting internet lies spewed by al jazeera.

let me know when i have to tolerate BS like that from people who want jews dead.

then we'll talk.

Ok Ive been reading your posts TruthMatters and at this point I have to say something.

Jillian and I typically do not share the same opinions on many political matters. However, she has NEVER done the type of behavior you are putting on her here.

Please stop attacking her personally in my thread. If you have a problem with something being said adress the comment and provide your reason for dissagreeing. Attacking someone in this manner is poor behavior and, even though im not jewish, bothers me a lot.

Furthermore, Jillian said they have the right to build a mosque anywhere that private property is available but she doesn't like the location (if im wrong correct me Jillian). This means your low blow attack on her was not only poor behavior but dishonest.

Ok i'm back on topic.

 

[Againsheila]

for all those in favor of the mosque, can i just ask what your initial reaction was when you heard about it?

My first impression was "no way". Then I found out is wasn't actually AT ground zero, just NEAR it. They own the property, if it's not against the city codes, they have the right to build it. We have freedom of religion, not freedom from religion and that includes religions that aren't mine.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

i never hear anyone discussing the sacred ground in ok city?

o wait....

Oklahoma City National Memorial & Museum – Official Website

its been 9 years since 9/11 and yet there is nothing but a mosque being built...does that say something for the islamics or does it say more about the government of nyc?

Both.

It says the government is a bunch of slacker jackanapes who need to stop sitting on their hands.

It says the specific people (read not all muslims) who want to build the mosque in that specific location on the edge of ground zero have no respect for the victims of 9/11, their surviving family members, and the effect of that tragedy on our entire country.

Again these are opinions.

 

[boedicca]

i never hear anyone discussing the sacred ground in ok city?

o wait....

Oklahoma City National Memorial & Museum – Official Website

its been 9 years since 9/11 and yet there is nothing but a mosque being built...does that say something for the islamics or does it say more about the government of nyc?

Both.

It says the government is a bunch of slacker jackanapes who need to stop sitting on their hands.

It says the specific people (read not all muslims) who want to build the mosque in that specific location on the edge of ground zero have no respect for the victims of 9/11, their surviving family members, and the effect of that tragedy on our entire country.

Again these are opinions.

And lest we forget, the St. Nicholas Greek Orthodox Church near Ground Zero which was destroyed on 9/11 has been forced to relocate its rebuilding efforts by the Port Authority.

 

[Againsheila]

"A place is made sacred by a widespread belief that it was visited by the miraculous or the transcendent (Lourdes, the Temple Mount), by the presence there once of great nobility and sacrifice (Gettysburg), or by the blood of martyrs and the indescribable suffering of the innocent (Auschwitz). When we speak of Ground Zero as hallowed ground, what we mean is that it belongs to those who suffered and died there -- and that such ownership obliges us, the living, to preserve the dignity and memory of the place, never allowing it to be forgotten, trivialized or misappropriated. ... Religious institutions in this country are autonomous. Who is to say that the [near-Ground Zero] mosque won't one day hire an Anwar al-Aulaqi -- spiritual mentor to the Fort Hood shooter and the Christmas Day bomber, and one-time imam at the Virginia mosque attended by two of the 9/11 terrorists? An Aulaqi preaching in Virginia is a security problem. An Aulaqi preaching at Ground Zero is a sacrilege. Location matters. Especially this location. Ground Zero is the site of the greatest mass murder in American history -- perpetrated by Muslims of a particular Islamist orthodoxy in whose cause they died and in whose name they killed. ... America is a free country where you can build whatever you want -- but not anywhere. That's why we have zoning laws. No liquor store near a school, no strip malls where they offend local sensibilities, and, if your house doesn't meet community architectural codes, you cannot build at all. These restrictions are for reasons of aesthetics. Others are for more profound reasons of common decency and respect for the sacred. No commercial tower over Gettysburg, no convent at Auschwitz -- and no mosque at Ground Zero. Build it anywhere but there." --columnist Charles Krauthammer

Sacrilege at Ground Zero - Opinion - PatriotPost.US

While I agree that it's sacrilege...if they own the property and if it's not against NY city codes, they have every right to build their mosque there. It's in incredibly poor taste, but they have the right to be in incredibly poor taste. Nothing in our laws gives you the right not to be offended.

I agree. They do have every right to build it on private property as long as it passes all local ordinances. That is not the issue at hand.

The issue at hand is the implications of building a mosque in said location which, according to the majority of Americans including our president, is hallowed ground.

You dont do it. You dont build a church in auchiwitz, you dont build a japenese soldier memorial at pearl harbor, you dont put up a mosque in full view of ground zero. This is the point and the subject matter of this thread.

I don't, because I have manners and respect, but not everyone does, haven't you noticed? And there is no law in America requiring you to have manners and respect.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

i never hear anyone discussing the sacred ground in ok city?

o wait....

Oklahoma City National Memorial & Museum – Official Website

its been 9 years since 9/11 and yet there is nothing but a mosque being built...does that say something for the islamics or does it say more about the government of nyc?

Both.

It says the government is a bunch of slacker jackanapes who need to stop sitting on their hands.

It says the specific people (read not all muslims) who want to build the mosque in that specific location on the edge of ground zero have no respect for the victims of 9/11, their surviving family members, and the effect of that tragedy on our entire country.

Again these are opinions.

And lest we forget, the St. Nicholas Greek Orthodox Church near Ground Zero which was destroyed on 9/11 has been forced to relocate its rebuilding efforts by the Port Authority.

Since I brought up auchwitz the pope understood what is being said here about things being on hallowed ground

POPE ORDERS NUNS OUT OF AUSCHWITZ - NYTimes.com

 

[Ravi]

"A place is made sacred by a widespread belief that it was visited by the miraculous or the transcendent (Lourdes, the Temple Mount), by the presence there once of great nobility and sacrifice (Gettysburg), or by the blood of martyrs and the indescribable suffering of the innocent (Auschwitz). When we speak of Ground Zero as hallowed ground, what we mean is that it belongs to those who suffered and died there -- and that such ownership obliges us, the living, to preserve the dignity and memory of the place, never allowing it to be forgotten, trivialized or misappropriated. ... Religious institutions in this country are autonomous. Who is to say that the [near-Ground Zero] mosque won't one day hire an Anwar al-Aulaqi -- spiritual mentor to the Fort Hood shooter and the Christmas Day bomber, and one-time imam at the Virginia mosque attended by two of the 9/11 terrorists? An Aulaqi preaching in Virginia is a security problem. An Aulaqi preaching at Ground Zero is a sacrilege. Location matters. Especially this location. Ground Zero is the site of the greatest mass murder in American history -- perpetrated by Muslims of a particular Islamist orthodoxy in whose cause they died and in whose name they killed. ... America is a free country where you can build whatever you want -- but not anywhere. That's why we have zoning laws. No liquor store near a school, no strip malls where they offend local sensibilities, and, if your house doesn't meet community architectural codes, you cannot build at all. These restrictions are for reasons of aesthetics. Others are for more profound reasons of common decency and respect for the sacred. No commercial tower over Gettysburg, no convent at Auschwitz -- and no mosque at Ground Zero. Build it anywhere but there." --columnist Charles Krauthammer

Sacrilege at Ground Zero - Opinion - PatriotPost.US

It's not at Ground Zero. Krauthammer is an idiotic rightwingloonatic.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

While I agree that it's sacrilege...if they own the property and if it's not against NY city codes, they have every right to build their mosque there. It's in incredibly poor taste, but they have the right to be in incredibly poor taste. Nothing in our laws gives you the right not to be offended.

I agree. They do have every right to build it on private property as long as it passes all local ordinances. That is not the issue at hand.

The issue at hand is the implications of building a mosque in said location which, according to the majority of Americans including our president, is hallowed ground.

You dont do it. You dont build a church in auchiwitz, you dont build a japenese soldier memorial at pearl harbor, you dont put up a mosque in full view of ground zero. This is the point and the subject matter of this thread.

I don't, because I have manners and respect, but not everyone does, haven't you noticed? And there is no law in America requiring you to have manners and respect.

If there were laws about that many in this thread would be in trouble

 

[Againsheila]

i never hear anyone discussing the sacred ground in ok city?

o wait....

Oklahoma City National Memorial & Museum – Official Website

its been 9 years since 9/11 and yet there is nothing but a mosque being built...does that say something for the islamics or does it say more about the government of nyc?

Both.

It says the government is a bunch of slacker jackanapes who need to stop sitting on their hands.

It says the specific people (read not all muslims) who want to build the mosque in that specific location on the edge of ground zero have no respect for the victims of 9/11, their surviving family members, and the effect of that tragedy on our entire country.

Again these are opinions.

And lest we forget, the St. Nicholas Greek Orthodox Church near Ground Zero which was destroyed on 9/11 has been forced to relocate its rebuilding efforts by the Port Authority.

This may change everything. Why was the church relocated?

 

[Truthmatters]

http://www.usmessageboard.com/current-events/67091-is-the-red-cross-full-of-nazis-2.html



01-08-2009, 02:36 PM
jillian
Princess
Member #3135 Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: The Other Side of Paradise
Posts: 26,661
Thanks: 970
Thanked 1,802 Times in 1,330 Posts
Rep Power: 742



Quote: Originally Posted by Truthmatters
Because Israel is leading the world into WWIII their actions.

Do you care at all what happens to your own country?
that's like blaming a battered woman because her husband beats her you psycho.

tell the terrorists to stop lobbing missiles.

no WWIII... easy.

unless of course you're a terrorist supporting, anti-semitic cretin.
__________________
"Trust none of what you hear And less of what you see" Springsteen

When the Founding Fathers protected our right to free speech, I think that meant we were supposed to use it.

Abu Musab Al-Zarqawi was the world's most unhinged lunatic. He's now dead. So that moves Ann Coulter up to first place - David Letterman





This is just one example of Jillian knee jerk reacting to any questioniung of the actions of the current government of Isreal, This is about the red cross saying Isreal was commiting atrosities

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

Both.

It says the government is a bunch of slacker jackanapes who need to stop sitting on their hands.

It says the specific people (read not all muslims) who want to build the mosque in that specific location on the edge of ground zero have no respect for the victims of 9/11, their surviving family members, and the effect of that tragedy on our entire country.

Again these are opinions.

And lest we forget, the St. Nicholas Greek Orthodox Church near Ground Zero which was destroyed on 9/11 has been forced to relocate its rebuilding efforts by the Port Authority.

This may change everything. Why was the church relocated?

Im curious too....i have to go put a muffler on a car then i'll be back to see if you guys found anything. If not I'll google around for something about it.

 

[johnrocks]

Of course U.E. went down after Pearl Harbor with millions of men taken out of the job market but the economy was far from healthy until after the war ended, we had rationing of everything from shoes to gad to food in those days, it took the private sector to get us out of what government got us into in the first place.

Why did we have rationing you idiot?

So we could supply our soldiers and the allies.

Here you are rewriting history.

FDR presided over a recovery spurned by government intervention.

The people who lived at the time Agreed and relected him right up to his death.

People like you spit on every one of the people who lived through the depression and the war to gain cheap political points by LYING about it afterwards.

Fuck you and the neocons you rode in on.

So you want to debate by being an asshole
If anyone is an idiot it's your dumbass, anyone that knows a wiff of my politics knows I'm a Ron Paul type rightie, not a god damn neo slug, now go suck on that fuck face.