Breaking: Van runs into crowd outside N. London Mosque

[Hutch Starskey]

The reason you are wrong is that the responder is not in the same category as the instigator
Nice try on your "responding to terrorism is the same thing as initiating it" but it's a no sale

WTF?

So are you saying that targeting and killing people who had nothing to do with a prior act of violence is ok? Seriously?

You do realize don't you, that's the same pathetic excuse used by terrorists who accuse the west of attacking them first?

You approve of all that?

The reason you are wrong is that the responder is not in the same category as the instigator
Nice try on your "responding to terrorism is the same thing as initiating it" but it's a no sale

WTF?

So are you saying that targeting and killing people who had nothing to do with a prior act of violence is ok? Seriously?

You do realize don't you, that's the same pathetic excuse used by terrorists who accuse the west of attacking them first?

You approve of all that?

You are judging that the events are "the same thing" and that is not my assessment
Repeated Islam attributed attacks upon all walks of life is not the same as one
Retaliatory response directed at the instigators
Facts over emotions would allow this assessment but your are an apologist and frother
So to answer your question-I do not view this response to the instigators as equal to the multiple instigations and there really are no "innocent" Muslims, and this is actually an anticipated and even good response as to finally slapping them back

What did those people at the Islamic welfare center do to instigate anything? The act the of being Muslim?

Murdering innocent people is a "good response"?

She's as much a fanatical lunatic as the terrorists.

 

[Issa]

Lybia and Syria threatened You? Mali?
France has been interfering and toppling regimes and even bombing those countries....after years of occupation and criminal acts. Honey you are no saint.

You didn't answer my question.
France also acts a terrorist state killing Libyan, Syrians, Maliens, and others. Your state ruined entire countries to get a grip on natural resources and place puppets in to keep stealing resources in Lot of countries around the world. Isn't that a bigger scale terrorism?

Gypsies, the Romanians are wrecking havoc in France (crimes, drug dealing, kidnappings, extortion, killingsl) why don't you say the same about them?

Europe is aging and they need migrants. Is a win win.

Europe is almost broke, she is in agony
It's a comparison that may be simple, but it means something.
At home you do not invite someone if you can not welcome him propely or you do not like that people invite themself to your house when they are not welcome.
Well, it's the same thing for immigration, you have to have the capacity to receive and the people most agree, but with all the attacks that has been made by Muslims are no longer welcome, it's a normal reaction

Issa simply because the terrorist Muslims were the one who massacred the French, Charlie Hebdo, Paris November 2015 and Nice. We can not forgive horrors like that.
The Americans have not forgotten on September 11th 2001 and neither do i and their worst enemy bin Laden

ISSA ;I already told you that terrorism and war are not the same...war was declare to the countries who Attack Threatens the safety of the French

 

[Hutch Starskey]

This situation in Finsbury Park, it's a completely random one man happening, a drunk man in a vehicle, there is no "Group" behind him, no "Group" who have been orchestrating and executing coordinated multiple attacks, he is by himself, he isn't affiliated with any Network.

He hired a vehicle, he got drunk, he crashed the vehicle.

He's probably got mental health problems....you know like many on the Left said about the Nice attacker and the one that murdered all the gays in the club in Orlando.

So going on Leftist thinking - Orlando not a terrorist, just had mental health problems. Finsbury Park not a terrorist, just has mental health problems.

And as more and more muslims pour into our civilized western countries, there will be an occasional nut job that will take them out. Then the sob sister apologists can say "see, non muslims are just as bad as muslims".

I'm saying one thing - terrorist attacks are terrorist attacks - it doesn't matter who commits them, they're wrong.

You are aware that NOBODY is DEAD from this Finsbury Park situation? There's one elderly man and he died of a heart attack.

So NOBODY was even killed in this incident.

The whole reaction is completely hysterical and out of all rational proportion in relation to the London Bridge Islamic Terrorist attack for example, where three Killer Kebabs mowed down and killed multiple people and then all got out of the vehicle wielding machete type long knives and began stabbing multiple people to death.

THAT IS what you call a Terrorist Attack.

Finsbury Park isn't, despite what the Politically Correct British Police say because they are afraid to contradict the Iman in case they are called Islamaphobes and Bigots.

It was similar with the Pakistani Rape Gangs in Rotherham, England, for YEARS the police KNEW that over 1,000 young girls were being groomed and gang raped, girls even TOLD the police they had been groomed and gang raped and the testicle free police did NOTHING and when finally it did go to Court the head of the police was asked WHY when they knew for YEARS didn't they do anything and he said because he was afraid the police would be called racist.

It's sheer luck that no one is dead, not for LACK OF INTENT.

It is a terrorist attack. If the victims weren't Muslim - there'd be no question.

And the utter police failure on the Rotherham affair shouldn't make any difference in the Finsbury.

"It's sheer luck that no one is dead, not for LACK OF INTENT."

Do drunken people even know WTF they are DOING when they are drunk? I'm sure you have seen the pictures of him, he looks completely pissed and totally out of it.

^ Making excuses for terrorists.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

Sounds like he was planning a much bigger attack, but fell into a drunken stupor in his van and missed the opportunity.

Finsbury Park terror suspect 'planned to attack' Muslim march in London but was too late, it is claimed

The landlord of his local pub, Andy Parker, claimed the day before the incident he had been ranting about the pro-Palestinian, Al Quds day rally, which took place on Sunday afternoon in central London.


Mr Parker, who runs the Hollybush pub in Pentwyn, said: "The gentleman came in and was very political with everyone he spoke to.


"He was very motivated about the Muslim Al Quds Day rally going on on Sunday and London and kept saying: 'Our brothers and sisters are dying and someone needs to do something about it'.



"He kept saying he would do something about it, but he kept going on about it, and was saying we need to 'stand up to Muslims' it is 'time we did something about them'.


"I did not like one bit of it so asked him to leave."​

We are supposed to all go on what the Landlord of the pub says? A pub Landlord

How many excuses are you going to make Lucy....first, you discount the Imam and the other people there because they're Muslims. Now you discount the pub landlord. You going to find a reason for each and everyone? If so - you going to apply that reason to other terrorist attacks and discount witness' who heard "allah akbar"?

"How many excuses are you going to make Lucy"

I'm doing exactly what 90% of the Leftists do at this forum EVERY time there is a Paris, Nice, London, Manchester, Orlando, San Bernardino

Bullshit!

 

[Dalia]

Lybia and Syria threatened You? Mali?
France has been interfering and toppling regimes and even bombing those countries....after years of occupation and criminal acts. Honey you are no saint.

You didn't answer my question.
France also acts a terrorist state killing Libyan, Syrians, Maliens, and others. Your state ruined entire countries to get a grip on natural resources and place puppets in to keep stealing resources in Lot of countries around the world. Isn't that a bigger scale terrorism?

Gypsies, the Romanians are wrecking havoc in France (crimes, drug dealing, kidnappings, extortion, killingsl) why don't you say the same about them?

Europe is almost broke, she is in agony
It's a comparison that may be simple, but it means something.
At home you do not invite someone if you can not welcome him propely or you do not like that people invite themself to your house when they are not welcome.
Well, it's the same thing for immigration, you have to have the capacity to receive and the people most agree, but with all the attacks that has been made by Muslims are no longer welcome, it's a normal reaction

Issa simply because the terrorist Muslims were the one who massacred the French, Charlie Hebdo, Paris November 2015 and Nice. We can not forgive horrors like that.
The Americans have not forgotten on September 11th 2001 and neither do i and their worst enemy bin Laden

ISSA ;I already told you that terrorism and war are not the same...war was declare to the countries who Attack Threatens the safety of the French

And muslims are terrorist

 

[Hutch Starskey]

This article has some interesting points to make - a bit thought provoking because these sort of attacks are almost impossible to prevent - there's little planning and few or no ties to established radical organizations such as ISIS which would alert police.

The Mundane Radicalism of Today's Terror

Osborne's profile is similar to that of Khalid Masood, the convert to Islam who perpetrated the March 22 attack that started on Westminster Bridge in London. Osborne, a father of four, is 48. Masood, 52, had three kids. Masood had a long history of violence and went to jail for one of the brawls in which he used a knife. Osborne is described as "shouty" and volatile, though seems to have kept his outbursts to the level of pub confrontations. Neither could hold down a job for long. Neither had any links with radical organizations. They appear to have led miserable, angry lives.

Osborne wasn't provoked to violence by anyone nearly as mainstream as Farage: His isn't among the 32 accounts Osborne followed on Twitter. Jayda Fransen and Paul Golding, leaders of the far right Britain First party are. After the Finsbury Park attack, Fransen posted a video claiming it was "intellectually dishonest" to compare "sporadic" right-wing terrorism with the "industrialized" mayhem perpetrated by Islamist terrorists.

In fact, however, a lot of terrorism these days is sporadic. From time to time, there are major plots, like the Islamist one that resulted in the 2015 Paris attacks or, on the right-wing side, the foiled 2016 Kansas conspiracy to blow up a mosque, or this year's failed plan by some Germany Army servicemen to assassinate politicians and blame it on Muslim refugees. But attacks such as the Westminster one, the more recent one on London Bridge and the Finsbury Park one don't require much planning. They can be spur-of-the moment angry outbursts, requiring no more than a few hours of seething and frantic action.​

In a lengthy 2016 report to the U.S. Department of Homeland Security, Pete Simi of the University of Nebraska, Omaha, described the common radicalization paths for U.S. far-right terrorists. They closely match those of Islamist extremists: A troubled personal history, a desire to belong and be accepted, the thrill of the forbidden, the search for a cause to which one could serve with violence.​

Bloomberg can fuck off, what disgusting POS Bloomberg is, like ALL MSM they are pathetic and desperate to put Osbourne in the same category as the Killer Kebabs.

THERE is NOTHING SIMILAR between Osbourne or ANY of the Killer Kebabs.

Rot In Hell Bloomsberg.

"Osborne's profile is similar to that of Khalid Masood"

^ Disgusting.

^ Too dense to see the similarities. Blinded by hate.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

Gypsies, the Romanians are wrecking havoc in France (crimes, drug dealing, kidnappings, extortion, killingsl) why don't you say the same about them?

Europe is aging and they need migrants. Is a win win.

The reasons for that humanitarian disaster in MidEast are largely that the entire world refused to stem it by providing new safe DEVELOPMENTS (not camps) in the war zones. Then when the Med started to fill up with rafts and floating bodies and MILLIONS tried to pour in -- Europe THEN decided to be "humanitarian" and allow the migration and TRIED to parcel it out all over the map.

Because they see desperate Arabs -- like we "see" Mexicans. It's that short sighted vision of obtaining a low maintenance underclass to fill in for the crashing Euro birth rates. Several problems with that assessment. By the 2 or 3rd generation, this influx WONT be doing menial tasks. At least not the history of "our Mexicans" (sarcasm). Our 2 and 3rd gen Mex are fully integrated into every profession in the USA. The Euros won't be as fortunate. Because they never INTENDED to facilitate assimilation and integration. And that's an error we shouldn't repeat.

The most important vetting question to be asked should be -- Do you INTEND to become a _______ citizen? And if so, why did you choose _______ over other choices? Answer too often with the RECENT wave of "refugees" is --- they didn't HAVE a choice and don't INTEND to be citizens. They just wanted to survive..

Reminds me of a quote I heard, from a Somali born poet - people leave for a reason, and to them it's a good reason...."people don't leave home unless home is a sharks mouth"...

What about Economic Migrants, they leave home because their nation doesn't have things like Welfare and other hand outs.

Europe is almost broke, she is in agony
It's a comparison that may be simple, but it means something.
At home you do not invite someone if you can not welcome him propely or you do not like that people invite themself to your house when they are not welcome.
Well, it's the same thing for immigration, you have to have the capacity to receive and the people most agree, but with all the attacks that has been made by Muslims are no longer welcome, it's a normal reaction

"Gypsies, (crimes, drug dealing, kidnappings, extortion, killingsl) why don't you say the same about them?"

Roma are Defective and Inferior DNA, they always have been, we do say worse about the Roma, we don't want them and have always not wanted them, historically EVERYONE has always not wanted the Roma, the Roma KNOW that NOBODY has ever wanted them, they KNOW they are inferior, it's why they are obsessed with wanting to be ANYTHING but Roma. They are also unhygienic and stink to high heaven, they look dirty, even if they shower, they still look dirty. They also have even most recently in Hungary, Romania and Bulgaria been sterilised, Roma women who have gone into hospital to have a baby, have been given injections and have never had a baby ever again.

The Czechs and Romanians make their Roma live in the sewers, literally. I'll post some links. They also force drug addicts and homeless people into the sewers.

The below people, most are Roma, the drug addicts and the homeless are nearly ALL Roma.

Born in the sewers

Homeless tours show visitors "dark side" of Prague

Inside the Underground World of Bucharest's Sewer Kids

It would be best that they are given one patch of land somewhere in the farthest of Eastern Europa, we will build houses, hospitals, recreation areas, we'll send them food supplies, they don't need schools as 98% of them are illiterate anyway, but this patch of land the Roma would inhabit would be sealed off from the outside world and they could live their amongst themselves and they would be left alone.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

I just gave you a thousand examples. And what has Europe achieved in the past 100 years besides 2 world wars and the proliferation of Islam. Bad architecture and the Beatles? Right. STFU about America. You're talking out your ass.

Have to agree on the Beatles and modern architecture. They both stink.

To cite old paintings turning brown on gallery walls and dead composers as superior culture while Europe is dying is an act of desperation. I liked a lot of the music that came out of England in the 60s but Europe isn't exactly a cultural center these days unless you like Falafels . And their architecture really does suck. America's is awesome!

Well, I'm English and I love European culture, but yes it is being subsumed. The mantra of the Left for decades has been to cry 'what culture!' When this issue is raised. It's yet another topic that is deemed racist or BIGOTTED in some way, and we all supposed to pretend that our culture started 50 yrs or so ago and begins and ends with curry and mosques. I love America too. I know Lucy does too. Now you two kiss and make up!

Lucy just needs to stop trashing America to get at Coyote. Counter productive.

I haven't trashed America, I have correctly stated that your Culture cannot hold a candle to our Culture, we have High Culture, I refuse to accept anything post-1920s as Culture, especially nothing from the 1960s as Culture, the art and architecture was both crap and vulgar.

America has Low Culture and Middle Brow Culture, you have never achieved any High Culture ever.

I'm sorry but you cannot put Norman Rockwell in even the same sentence as Michelangelo.

You called me a snob. Of COURSE I'm a snob darling, why wouldn't I be.

America is made up of mostly Europeans, dope.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

Gypsies, the Romanians are wrecking havoc in France (crimes, drug dealing, kidnappings, extortion, killingsl) why don't you say the same about them?

Europe is aging and they need migrants. Is a win win.

The reasons for that humanitarian disaster in MidEast are largely that the entire world refused to stem it by providing new safe DEVELOPMENTS (not camps) in the war zones. Then when the Med started to fill up with rafts and floating bodies and MILLIONS tried to pour in -- Europe THEN decided to be "humanitarian" and allow the migration and TRIED to parcel it out all over the map.

Because they see desperate Arabs -- like we "see" Mexicans. It's that short sighted vision of obtaining a low maintenance underclass to fill in for the crashing Euro birth rates. Several problems with that assessment. By the 2 or 3rd generation, this influx WONT be doing menial tasks. At least not the history of "our Mexicans" (sarcasm). Our 2 and 3rd gen Mex are fully integrated into every profession in the USA. The Euros won't be as fortunate. Because they never INTENDED to facilitate assimilation and integration. And that's an error we shouldn't repeat.

The most important vetting question to be asked should be -- Do you INTEND to become a _______ citizen? And if so, why did you choose _______ over other choices? Answer too often with the RECENT wave of "refugees" is --- they didn't HAVE a choice and don't INTEND to be citizens. They just wanted to survive..

Reminds me of a quote I heard, from a Somali born poet - people leave for a reason, and to them it's a good reason...."people don't leave home unless home is a sharks mouth"...

What about Economic Migrants, they leave home because their nation doesn't have things like Welfare and other hand outs.

Europe is almost broke, she is in agony
It's a comparison that may be simple, but it means something.
At home you do not invite someone if you can not welcome him propely or you do not like that people invite themself to your house when they are not welcome.
Well, it's the same thing for immigration, you have to have the capacity to receive and the people most agree, but with all the attacks that has been made by Muslims are no longer welcome, it's a normal reaction

A few years ago the French had a clear out of Roma, of course the Human Rights and the EU nuisances didn't like this, yes France MUST have filthy Roma stinking up the place. Muh Racism, hello, Roma ISN'T a Race.

This is WHY the EU must be destroyed, to save the European Continent the EU must go.

Deportation of Roma migrants from France

Deportation of Roma migrants from France - Wikipedia

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

Are you drunk?

They put them in ghettos and discriminated against 2nd and 3rd generation kids of immigrants and that's why we see the troubled. France recognized it's mistake, but it's somewhat too late.

Europe is aging and they need migrants. Is a win win.

That's a good point and it IS a problem with Europe. The trick is to make it work.

That's what I've read also and also why the immigrant experience in countries like the US and Canada is very different than that of France for example. The other thing, which I mentioned is that France's policies encourage huge numbers of immigrants from former colonies that had no real job skills, not a lot of education and they brought thier communities with them creating their own insular groups. I think that combined with the French attitudes towards non-French and the economic disparities made integration a lot harder.

As a side point how many illegal immigrants do you have voting in your elections? Answer you don't know, people can literally turn up on voting day with NO ID and just vote.

We do NOT have this situation on the European Continent.

Being asked to show some ID to vote is not racist and the morons who suggest it is are doing that for party political reasons, because they know that the majority of illegal immigrants will vote Democrat as it's ONLY the Democrats who ridiculously say that illegal immigrants are not illegal because there's no such thing as people being illegal, which is why in Democrat areas you have Leftist politicians with the Sanctuary Cities protecting the illegal immigrants and effectively breaking American Federal Law.

In the below States where NO ID is needed, look at California, Arizona, Virginia and the majority of your East Coast, how many illegal immigrants can go from one polling station to another and vote multiple times? There is NOTHING to stop ONE person voting 50 times in ONE election.

You need an ID to get a car, a passport, a bank account etc so why isn't having an ID for those things racist if asking for an ID to vote is racist?

View attachment 134863

Oh so you don't like the idea of needing to show ID to vote? So how many times have you illegally voted?

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

Reminds me of a quote I heard, from a Somali born poet - people leave for a reason, and to them it's a good reason...."people don't leave home unless home is a sharks mouth"...

Not a lot of optimists in Somalia. For valid reasons. But at OTHER times, when the bombs are not dropping and people dying daily outside their door -- The ones that WANT more liberty and WANT more opportunity -- are welcome to come. And they KNOW WHY they are coming..

Sometimes I think there is a certain self-selection going on - these people take huge risks, life threatening risks - and many die - for those opportunities. These aren't people who will shy away from hard work and challenges.

That mass migration was motivated solely out of fear. Wasn't much "deliberation" about opportunities involved. It's hard to make critical decisions like that intelligently when your kids are dying and your city is a pile of rubble. That really makes them "refugees" and NOT immigrants. PERHAPS -- since the world took a crap on them for 4 long years of epic destruction in their homelands -- we should MAKE exceptions and recieve them as "TEMP refugees".. But our divided country would never allow that option politically..

From a personal (not pragmatic) standpoint - I feel we owe them for wrecking their country. At the very least we absolutely owe safety and a welcome to any who assisted us and who's live and family are now in jeopardy because of that.

You're right in terms of our complicity. And ABSOLUTELY correct about the folks that supported OUR people when we were in their country. They KNOW what they are coming to America for. It's a more "informed" decision. And we SPEED that up -- because many are endangered.

But instead of spending $200Mill for 10 "freedom fighters" of which only 2 ever MADE IT to a conflict spot -- we should have been organizing the World to build NEW syrian cities in protected zones. We don't ''owe them" citizenship in countries that the majority of refugees would rather NOT be in..

"But instead of spending $200Mill for 10 "freedom fighters" of which only 2 ever MADE IT to a conflict spot -- we should have been organizing the World to build NEW syrian cities in protected zones. We don't ''owe them" citizenship in countries that the majority of refugees would rather NOT be in.."

That is exactly what should have happened, but it was vetoed, the Syrian Protection Zones were vetoed.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

Lybia and Syria threatened You? Mali?
France has been interfering and toppling regimes and even bombing those countries....after years of occupation and criminal acts. Honey you are no saint.

You didn't answer my question.
France also acts a terrorist state killing Libyan, Syrians, Maliens, and others. Your state ruined entire countries to get a grip on natural resources and place puppets in to keep stealing resources in Lot of countries around the world. Isn't that a bigger scale terrorism?

Gypsies, the Romanians are wrecking havoc in France (crimes, drug dealing, kidnappings, extortion, killingsl) why don't you say the same about them?

Europe is almost broke, she is in agony
It's a comparison that may be simple, but it means something.
At home you do not invite someone if you can not welcome him propely or you do not like that people invite themself to your house when they are not welcome.
Well, it's the same thing for immigration, you have to have the capacity to receive and the people most agree, but with all the attacks that has been made by Muslims are no longer welcome, it's a normal reaction

Issa simply because the terrorist Muslims were the one who massacred the French, Charlie Hebdo, Paris November 2015 and Nice. We can not forgive horrors like that.
The Americans have not forgotten on September 11th 2001 and neither do i and their worst enemy bin Laden

ISSA ;I already told you that terrorism and war are not the same...war was declare to the countries who Attack Threatens the safety of the French

"Lybia and Syria threatened You? Mali?
France has been interfering and toppling regimes and even bombing those countries"

The Government of Mali asked the French to intervene, France also had a UN Resolution backing for Operation Serval, the operation was that the Government of Mali asked the French for help because Tuareg Islamist Militants who were in North Mali had started an offensive toward Central Mali.

Of course you being an Observant Muslim who attends the Mosque would be against France intervening at the request of the Government of Mali to put down an Islamist Militant offensive who's objective was to overthrow the Government of Mali.

Operation Serval - Wikipedia

You obviously would also disagree with Operation Barkhane.

Operation Barkhane - Wikipedia

 

[Tilly]

Police had initially been investigating whether Mr Ali died following the attack, or whether his death was connected to his collapse.

But today Scotland Yard confirmed that a preliminary post-mortem examination found Mr Ali died 'as a result of multiple injuries'.



Read more: Finsbury Park victim, 51, died from multiple injuries | Daily Mail Online
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

 

[Coyote]

Gypsies, the Romanians are wrecking havoc in France (crimes, drug dealing, kidnappings, extortion, killingsl) why don't you say the same about them?

Europe is aging and they need migrants. Is a win win.

Europe is almost broke, she is in agony
It's a comparison that may be simple, but it means something.
At home you do not invite someone if you can not welcome him propely or you do not like that people invite themself to your house when they are not welcome.
Well, it's the same thing for immigration, you have to have the capacity to receive and the people most agree, but with all the attacks that has been made by Muslims are no longer welcome, it's a normal reaction

Issa simply because the terrorist Muslims were the one who massacred the French, Charlie Hebdo, Paris November 2015 and Nice. We can not forgive horrors like that.
The Americans have not forgotten on September 11th 2001 and neither have I and their worst enemy bin Laden

We haven't and won't forget 9/11 - but I won't blame all Muslims for the acts of those terrorists.

This is where it hurts that day is a horror and everybody reacted differently we have the eternal anti-Americans but I saw on live TV that some of them muslims were happy with the misfortune you were living in USA.
It's unforgivable

On TV there was a small number of people "celebrating" - most of the Muslim world was as horrified as we were.

 

[leftwinger]

Keep the headscarf, no problem. No Koran, mosque or Burka. You can drive. You can come outside. You can work. Ackmed does not own you.

Islam must be and will be banned. If you want to stay............you must renounce. If not.........you will go home or to isolation camp until you wish to come out non-islam.

Bible only from now on. No more nut-cases. We have enough problem humans to monitor.

 

[Coyote]

Keep the headscarf, no problem. No Koran, mosque or Burka. You can drive. You can come outside. You can work. Ackmed does not own you.

Islam must be and will be banned. If you want to stay............you must renounce. If not.........you will go home or to isolation camp until you wish to come out non-islam.

Bible only from now on. No more nut-cases. We have enough problem humans to monitor.

That's nutty.

 

[leftwinger]

Keep the headscarf, no problem. No Koran, mosque or Burka. You can drive. You can come outside. You can work. Ackmed does not own you.

Islam must be and will be banned. If you want to stay............you must renounce. If not.........you will go home or to isolation camp until you wish to come out non-islam.

Bible only from now on. No more nut-cases. We have enough problem humans to monitor.

That's nutty.

That's nutty.

Maybe. But also "nutty" is getting up in the morning and loading a backpack full of explosives and walking "against the grain" into an exiting crowd and pulling the trigger. This happens over and over and over. Why again? Because Israel exists?

that would be "nutty". I am merely looking for solutions to improve safety in Western Countries.

 

[Issa]

Well I'm glad you liked my country and the culture....but you do come across as racist from your posts.
Humans being migrating for centuries it's human nature. I moved here I have my culture but I also embrace the American way of life, I celebrate Christmas, thanksgiving, go to funerals in churches and also go to the mosque, most of my friends and my kids friends are non Muslims....i don't see why we can't co exist especially here in the US, a diverse and secular country.

Speaking of Morocco I'm half Berber from my dad's side, which are genetically (DNA) From northern Europe, blonde, light skin and European complexions, in the north there are the Moorskies the South Europeans that were kicked out during the Spanish inquisition, the jews....we also have lot of subsahrians that settled there, and we have lot of Europeans that retired or settled in Morocco. We welcome all and we co exist with all. Be Christian, new or Buddhist we don't care have a cup of tea and some cookies.

That's exactly what happened....im Morooccan and migrants from Morocco in North America fair better than their counterparts in Europe because of the points you made.

They put them in ghettos and discriminated against 2nd and 3rd generation kids of immigrants and that's why we see the troubled. France recognized it's mistake, but it's somewhat too late.

That's a good point and it IS a problem with Europe. The trick is to make it work.

That's what I've read also and also why the immigrant experience in countries like the US and Canada is very different than that of France for example. The other thing, which I mentioned is that France's policies encourage huge numbers of immigrants from former colonies that had no real job skills, not a lot of education and they brought thier communities with them creating their own insular groups. I think that combined with the French attitudes towards non-French and the economic disparities made integration a lot harder.

That's interesting to know! Morocco is interesting, I just finished reading an interesting memoir by Fatima Mernissi about her childhood in Morocco called the "Harem Within".

The other aspect of immigration that is different is that because we don't get entire villages moving over en-masse, immigrant communities are more mixed, so quite often a local Mosque will have Muslims from a variety of Islamic backgrounds attending and that tends to dilute insularity.

I have been to Morocco, to Marrakech and Tangiers, the Marrakech Museum is incredible as is the Museum of Moroccan Arts, see links I provide below.

I have previously written about my appreciation of the architecture of these places. Why would you want to leave a nation like Morocco, so rich in architecture and romance?

I have NEVER said that I hated Muslim peoples, it's Islam I have a problem with, I have a great respect for Arabesque Culture, especially the architecture and also the music.

I would just prefer that Muslims stay in their OWN nations and not come to Western nations, I have NO problem with them visiting for a holiday, just like we visit their nations for a holiday, but we cannot live TOGETHER in Western nations, it's a Culture Clash that can ONLY end in tears.

The Moroccans I met in Marrakech and Tangiers were wonderful people, who were rightly proud of these two amazing and historically rich cities.

Marrakech Museum - Wikipedia

The below is The Museum of Moroccan Arts.

Dar el Makhzen (Tangier) - Wikipedia

In Marrakech they have this green tea, Maghrebi mint tea that is served almost like a Mint Julep but sans the booze, it's served in the glass with fresh mint and sugar and is excellent and the people of Marrakech you see them drinking this tea all day long.

View attachment 134869

View attachment 134871

They also have excellent Briouat usually filled with either chicken or lamb and mixed in with cheese and lemon juice and black pepper and then baked.

View attachment 134873

Also Chebakia which is fried dough which is post-frying coated with honey and sesame seeds, very wonderful.

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Um as a side point, when I was in Texas I was given Mint Juleps and I very much liked them. I had a VERY unpleasant moment though when I thought that Alabama Sweet Tea sounded nice and it was DISGUSTING. The people who produce Alabama Sweet Tea should be just taken out and SHOT, alternatively round them up and send them to Gitmo.

A Mint Julep

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Alabama Sweet Tea

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[Issa]

Same story again and again...in this very same subject you asked the US to back off the middle East and now you ok with France's intervention in Mali??!!
What we see is modern colonialism, ex colonies are being proxy controlled by European countries they put in their puppets to guarantee loyalty, flow of resources and preferential treatments in business dealings. And when their interest is threatened they go invade those countries. Iraq, Afghanistan, iran. Syria, lybia, Mali and other countries had to suffer the same outcome we all know.

Lybia and Syria threatened You? Mali?
France has been interfering and toppling regimes and even bombing those countries....after years of occupation and criminal acts. Honey you are no saint.

You didn't answer my question.
France also acts a terrorist state killing Libyan, Syrians, Maliens, and others. Your state ruined entire countries to get a grip on natural resources and place puppets in to keep stealing resources in Lot of countries around the world. Isn't that a bigger scale terrorism?

Gypsies, the Romanians are wrecking havoc in France (crimes, drug dealing, kidnappings, extortion, killingsl) why don't you say the same about them?

Issa simply because the terrorist Muslims were the one who massacred the French, Charlie Hebdo, Paris November 2015 and Nice. We can not forgive horrors like that.
The Americans have not forgotten on September 11th 2001 and neither do i and their worst enemy bin Laden

ISSA ;I already told you that terrorism and war are not the same...war was declare to the countries who Attack Threatens the safety of the French

"Lybia and Syria threatened You? Mali?
France has been interfering and toppling regimes and even bombing those countries"

The Government of Mali asked the French to intervene, France also had a UN Resolution backing for Operation Serval, the operation was that the Government of Mali asked the French for help because Tuareg Islamist Militants who were in North Mali had started an offensive toward Central Mali.

Of course you being an Observant Muslim who attends the Mosque would be against France intervening at the request of the Government of Mali to put down an Islamist Militant offensive who's objective was to overthrow the Government of Mali.

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Operation Serval - Wikipedia

You obviously would also disagree with Operation Barkhane.

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Operation Barkhane - Wikipedia

 

[Issa]

Nope we are not, French are racists and terrorists if we see the actions of your governments that represented you.

Millions killed in Africa by the French.
Resources stolen till this day from Africa, Polynesia, by the French.
Bombing of innocent civilians in Mali, Syria and other countries by the French.
Regime changes and backing dictators in Africa, by the French.
Supplying arms to civil wars in Africa by the French.
And let's not talk about racism in France.

And to sum it up when Germany occupied France, we helped you liberate your country....big fucking mistake.

Lybia and Syria threatened You? Mali?
France has been interfering and toppling regimes and even bombing those countries....after years of occupation and criminal acts. Honey you are no saint.

You didn't answer my question.
France also acts a terrorist state killing Libyan, Syrians, Maliens, and others. Your state ruined entire countries to get a grip on natural resources and place puppets in to keep stealing resources in Lot of countries around the world. Isn't that a bigger scale terrorism?

Gypsies, the Romanians are wrecking havoc in France (crimes, drug dealing, kidnappings, extortion, killingsl) why don't you say the same about them?

Issa simply because the terrorist Muslims were the one who massacred the French, Charlie Hebdo, Paris November 2015 and Nice. We can not forgive horrors like that.
The Americans have not forgotten on September 11th 2001 and neither do i and their worst enemy bin Laden

ISSA ;I already told you that terrorism and war are not the same...war was declare to the countries who Attack Threatens the safety of the French

And muslims are terrorist