Blue Dogs vs Libs

[Chris]

the so called 'blue dogs' are moderate democrats, representing more than moderate southerners that lean right. they are not in a good place, with an extremely liberal leader and a minority conservative party. Sucks to be them.

The Blue Dogs are the ones who have accepted the most money from the insurance company lobbists.

Got a link?

Go to opensecrets.com and start reading.

 

[Chris]

The Center for Public Integrity is another good link...

The Center for Public Integrity | Latest from the Center - Blue Dogs Fill Their Bowls with Cash

Billy Tauzin, the president and CEO of the Pharmaceutical Research and Manufactures of America (PhRMA), told the Center in a statement that the coalition has “helped foster much-needed bipartisanship and middle ground. … Above all else, they have consistently provided a moderating voice on Capitol Hill.” Tauzin was a founding Blue Dog who left the coalition and the Democratic Party to become a Republican in 1995. PhRMA’s Better Government Committee (its PAC) has donated more than $10,000 to the Blue Dog PAC since 2005 (and had never donated to the PAC previously).

 

[Chris]

So far this year, the Blue Dog Political Action Committee is on track to shatter all its fundraising records; in fact, the total for the first six months of 2009 — more than $1.1 million — is greater than what was raised in the entire 2003-04 fundraising cycle. Furthermore, according to analysis by the Center for Public Integrity of CQ MoneyLine data, the energy, financial services, and health care industries have accounted for nearly 54 percent of the Blue Dog PAC’s 2009 receipts (up from 45 percent in 2004). These contributions poured in as President Obama and the Democratic Congress have been making a major push to reform health care, develop a new energy policy, and restructure oversight of the banking sector. Clearly, these Dogs are having their day.

The Center for Public Integrity | Latest from the Center - Blue Dogs Fill Their Bowls with Cash

 

[DiveCon]

The Center for Public Integrity is another good link...

The Center for Public Integrity | Latest from the Center - Blue Dogs Fill Their Bowls with Cash

Billy Tauzin, the president and CEO of the Pharmaceutical Research and Manufactures of America (PhRMA), told the Center in a statement that the coalition has “helped foster much-needed bipartisanship and middle ground. … Above all else, they have consistently provided a moderating voice on Capitol Hill.” Tauzin was a founding Blue Dog who left the coalition and the Democratic Party to become a Republican in 1995. PhRMA’s Better Government Committee (its PAC) has donated more than $10,000 to the Blue Dog PAC since 2005 (and had never donated to the PAC previously).

So far this year, the Blue Dog Political Action Committee is on track to shatter all its fundraising records; in fact, the total for the first six months of 2009 — more than $1.1 million — is greater than what was raised in the entire 2003-04 fundraising cycle. Furthermore, according to analysis by the Center for Public Integrity of CQ MoneyLine data, the energy, financial services, and health care industries have accounted for nearly 54 percent of the Blue Dog PAC’s 2009 receipts (up from 45 percent in 2004). These contributions poured in as President Obama and the Democratic Congress have been making a major push to reform health care, develop a new energy policy, and restructure oversight of the banking sector. Clearly, these Dogs are having their day.

The Center for Public Integrity | Latest from the Center - Blue Dogs Fill Their Bowls with Cash

nie, now connect any of the dems to these two groups

 

[Chris]

Mike Ross is one of the big opponents of reform....

Take a look at who his biggest industry contributors were in 2008....healthcare PACs!

Mike Ross: Campaign Finance/Money - Summary - Congressman 2008 | OpenSecrets

 

[DiveCon]

Mike Ross is one of the big opponents of reform....

Take a look at who his biggest industry contributors were in 2008....healthcare PACs!

Mike Ross: Campaign Finance/Money - Summary - Congressman 2008 | OpenSecrets

he doesnt oppose reform, he opposes the bullshit Obamacare

 

[Chris]

Mike Ross is one of the big opponents of reform....

Take a look at who his biggest industry contributors were in 2008....healthcare PACs!

Mike Ross: Campaign Finance/Money - Summary - Congressman 2008 | OpenSecrets

he doesnt oppose reform, he opposes the bullshit Obamacare

Now you are just being silly.

The corporations own the Congress, that is why our healthcare is TWICE AS EXPENSIVE per capita as every other Western democracy.

 

[DiveCon]

Mike Ross is one of the big opponents of reform....

Take a look at who his biggest industry contributors were in 2008....healthcare PACs!

Mike Ross: Campaign Finance/Money - Summary - Congressman 2008 | OpenSecrets

he doesnt oppose reform, he opposes the bullshit Obamacare

Now you are just being silly.

The corporations own the Congress, that is why our healthcare is TWICE AS EXPENSIVE per capita as every other Western democracy.

when are you going to admit that Obamacare isnt reform

 

[mskafka]

My favorite healthcare moment was when a women told Obama she didn't want any socialized medicine, and they better not touch her Medicare.

Priceless...

That's a typical dumbass liberal for you.

Yes, a dumbass liberal who depends on Medicare...incredible...

She should drag her frail body out on the street, gain a full time job, and earn health insurance like everyone else!

Hey, what about the "kill the elderly" portion of hr 3200? I thought that all cons were worried that the government was going to kill granny. Contradictions. Tsk Tsk.

 

[mskafka]

Mike Ross is one of the big opponents of reform....

Take a look at who his biggest industry contributors were in 2008....healthcare PACs!

Mike Ross: Campaign Finance/Money - Summary - Congressman 2008 | OpenSecrets

he doesnt oppose reform, he opposes the bullshit Obamacare

And he has almost $50,000 reasons to oppose reform, doesn't he?

 

[mskafka]

Mike Ross is one of the big opponents of reform....

Take a look at who his biggest industry contributors were in 2008....healthcare PACs!

Mike Ross: Campaign Finance/Money - Summary - Congressman 2008 | OpenSecrets

he doesnt oppose reform, he opposes the bullshit Obamacare

Now you are just being silly.

The corporations own the Congress, that is why our healthcare is TWICE AS EXPENSIVE per capita as every other Western democracy.

Yes they do.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Mike Ross is one of the big opponents of reform....

Take a look at who his biggest industry contributors were in 2008....healthcare PACs!

Mike Ross: Campaign Finance/Money - Summary - Congressman 2008 | OpenSecrets

he doesnt oppose reform, he opposes the bullshit Obamacare

And he has almost $50,000 reasons to oppose reform, doesn't he?

In fact, every American has $100,000,000,000 per year reasons to oppose this bill. And that's only the part the Congress is telling us about. How much more will the states be stuck for when the eligibility for Medicaid is raised to 133% or 150% of the poverty level and the states that can't pay their bills now will have to come up with half of it?

If you decided to buy a car, would you let some salesman talk you into buying the first car you saw, or would you shop around for the car that best suited your needs and then for the best price you could get? Obama says we have a health care crisis so we don't have time to shop around for the best solutions for our health care problems or the least expensive ways of solving them, that if we don't act right away, it may be too late to act at all.

He would have made a hell of a car salesman.

But of course, it isn't true. We have growing health care problems we should try to find solutions for, but if we don't find good solutions to them this month, there is no reason to think we can't find them next month or the month after, and if we don't know how to best solve all the our health care problems right now, then we can work to solve some of them now and continue thinking how to best solve the others as we go along.

The two goals health care reform is supposed to meet are to rein in health care costs and provide greater access to affordable health care, but the CBO has already told us that the House plan will not only not rein in costs, but will make them increase faster. Doesn't that tell you we need to shop around some more before making a decision on how to reform our health care system?

Obama has told us that it will lower the cost of health insurance and that will make US businesses more competitive and that if we don't do this it will be very bad for the economy, but we all understand that if health insurance companies have to cover all the additional things this bill requires, both public and private plans will have to charge more, not less, for health insurance and this will raise overhead costs for US companies and make them less competitive and this will be bad for the US economy. Doesn't this tell you we need to shop around some more before making a decision about how to reform our health care system?

What we need now is not politicians trying to scare us into buying the first bill that comes along by claiming doom awaits us if we don't act right away, but a blue ribbon panel of experts, doctors, economists, insurance experts, etc. to define our problems, define our goals, analyze the various ways in which we can try to reach them and calculate how much each would cost us, and lead us in having a national discussion about change so that we can make an informed decision about how we want to reform our health care system.

If one of our goals is still to rein in health care costs, we already know the House bill won't work, so it is clearly time to start shopping around for a plan or plans that will work.

 

[Care4all]

he doesnt oppose reform, he opposes the bullshit Obamacare

And he has almost $50,000 reasons to oppose reform, doesn't he?

In fact, every American has $100,000,000,000 per year reasons to oppose this bill. And that's only the part the Congress is telling us about. How much more will the states be stuck for when the eligibility for Medicaid is raised to 133% or 150% of the poverty level and the states that can't pay their bills now will have to come up with half of it?

If you decided to buy a car, would you let some salesman talk you into buying the first car you saw, or would you shop around for the car that best suited your needs and then for the best price you could get? Obama says we have a health care crisis so we don't have time to shop around for the best solutions for our health care problems or the least expensive ways of solving them, that if we don't act right away, it may be too late to act at all.

He would have made a hell of a car salesman.

But of course, it isn't true. We have growing health care problems we should try to find solutions for, but if we don't find good solutions to them this month, there is no reason to think we can't find them next month or the month after, and if we don't know how to best solve all the our health care problems right now, then we can work to solve some of them now and continue thinking how to best solve the others as we go along.

The two goals health care reform is supposed to meet are to rein in health care costs and provide greater access to affordable health care, but the CBO has already told us that the House plan will not only not rein in costs, but will make them increase faster. Doesn't that tell you we need to shop around some more before making a decision on how to reform our health care system?

Obama has told us that it will lower the cost of health insurance and that will make US businesses more competitive and that if we don't do this it will be very bad for the economy, but we all understand that if health insurance companies have to cover all the additional things this bill requires, both public and private plans will have to charge more, not less, for health insurance and this will raise overhead costs for US companies and make them less competitive and this will be bad for the US economy. Doesn't this tell you we need to shop around some more before making a decision about how to reform our health care system?

What we need now is not politicians trying to scare us into buying the first bill that comes along by claiming doom awaits us if we don't act right away, but a blue ribbon panel of experts, doctors, economists, insurance experts, etc. to define our problems, define our goals, analyze the various ways in which we can try to reach them and calculate how much each would cost us, and lead us in having a national discussion about change so that we can make an informed decision about how we want to reform our health care system.

If one of our goals is still to rein in health care costs, we already know the House bill won't work, so it is clearly time to start shopping around for a plan or plans that will work.

CBO has the Bill Budget Neutral Toomuchtime?

Newsvine - CBO: Health Care Reform Bill (HR 3200) Budget Neutral, Saves $6 Billion Over 10 Years
The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) released estimates this evening confirming for the first time that H.R. 3200, America's Affordable Health Choices Act, is deficit neutral over the 10-year budget window - and even produces a $6 billion surplus. CBO estimated more than $550 billion in gross Medicare and Medicaid savings. More importantly, the bill includes a comprehensive array of delivery reforms to set the stage for lowering the future growth in health care costs.

 

[DiveCon]

And he has almost $50,000 reasons to oppose reform, doesn't he?

In fact, every American has $100,000,000,000 per year reasons to oppose this bill. And that's only the part the Congress is telling us about. How much more will the states be stuck for when the eligibility for Medicaid is raised to 133% or 150% of the poverty level and the states that can't pay their bills now will have to come up with half of it?

If you decided to buy a car, would you let some salesman talk you into buying the first car you saw, or would you shop around for the car that best suited your needs and then for the best price you could get? Obama says we have a health care crisis so we don't have time to shop around for the best solutions for our health care problems or the least expensive ways of solving them, that if we don't act right away, it may be too late to act at all.

He would have made a hell of a car salesman.

But of course, it isn't true. We have growing health care problems we should try to find solutions for, but if we don't find good solutions to them this month, there is no reason to think we can't find them next month or the month after, and if we don't know how to best solve all the our health care problems right now, then we can work to solve some of them now and continue thinking how to best solve the others as we go along.

The two goals health care reform is supposed to meet are to rein in health care costs and provide greater access to affordable health care, but the CBO has already told us that the House plan will not only not rein in costs, but will make them increase faster. Doesn't that tell you we need to shop around some more before making a decision on how to reform our health care system?

Obama has told us that it will lower the cost of health insurance and that will make US businesses more competitive and that if we don't do this it will be very bad for the economy, but we all understand that if health insurance companies have to cover all the additional things this bill requires, both public and private plans will have to charge more, not less, for health insurance and this will raise overhead costs for US companies and make them less competitive and this will be bad for the US economy. Doesn't this tell you we need to shop around some more before making a decision about how to reform our health care system?

What we need now is not politicians trying to scare us into buying the first bill that comes along by claiming doom awaits us if we don't act right away, but a blue ribbon panel of experts, doctors, economists, insurance experts, etc. to define our problems, define our goals, analyze the various ways in which we can try to reach them and calculate how much each would cost us, and lead us in having a national discussion about change so that we can make an informed decision about how we want to reform our health care system.

If one of our goals is still to rein in health care costs, we already know the House bill won't work, so it is clearly time to start shopping around for a plan or plans that will work.

CBO has the Bill Budget Neutral Toomuchtime?

Newsvine - CBO: Health Care Reform Bill (HR 3200) Budget Neutral, Saves $6 Billion Over 10 Years
The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) released estimates this evening confirming for the first time that H.R. 3200, America's Affordable Health Choices Act, is deficit neutral over the 10-year budget window - and even produces a $6 billion surplus. CBO estimated more than $550 billion in gross Medicare and Medicaid savings. More importantly, the bill includes a comprehensive array of delivery reforms to set the stage for lowering the future growth in health care costs.

and you believe that?

 

[Care4all]

In fact, every American has $100,000,000,000 per year reasons to oppose this bill. And that's only the part the Congress is telling us about. How much more will the states be stuck for when the eligibility for Medicaid is raised to 133% or 150% of the poverty level and the states that can't pay their bills now will have to come up with half of it?

If you decided to buy a car, would you let some salesman talk you into buying the first car you saw, or would you shop around for the car that best suited your needs and then for the best price you could get? Obama says we have a health care crisis so we don't have time to shop around for the best solutions for our health care problems or the least expensive ways of solving them, that if we don't act right away, it may be too late to act at all.

He would have made a hell of a car salesman.

But of course, it isn't true. We have growing health care problems we should try to find solutions for, but if we don't find good solutions to them this month, there is no reason to think we can't find them next month or the month after, and if we don't know how to best solve all the our health care problems right now, then we can work to solve some of them now and continue thinking how to best solve the others as we go along.

The two goals health care reform is supposed to meet are to rein in health care costs and provide greater access to affordable health care, but the CBO has already told us that the House plan will not only not rein in costs, but will make them increase faster. Doesn't that tell you we need to shop around some more before making a decision on how to reform our health care system?

Obama has told us that it will lower the cost of health insurance and that will make US businesses more competitive and that if we don't do this it will be very bad for the economy, but we all understand that if health insurance companies have to cover all the additional things this bill requires, both public and private plans will have to charge more, not less, for health insurance and this will raise overhead costs for US companies and make them less competitive and this will be bad for the US economy. Doesn't this tell you we need to shop around some more before making a decision about how to reform our health care system?

What we need now is not politicians trying to scare us into buying the first bill that comes along by claiming doom awaits us if we don't act right away, but a blue ribbon panel of experts, doctors, economists, insurance experts, etc. to define our problems, define our goals, analyze the various ways in which we can try to reach them and calculate how much each would cost us, and lead us in having a national discussion about change so that we can make an informed decision about how we want to reform our health care system.

If one of our goals is still to rein in health care costs, we already know the House bill won't work, so it is clearly time to start shopping around for a plan or plans that will work.

CBO has the Bill Budget Neutral Toomuchtime?

Newsvine - CBO: Health Care Reform Bill (HR 3200) Budget Neutral, Saves $6 Billion Over 10 Years
The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) released estimates this evening confirming for the first time that H.R. 3200, America's Affordable Health Choices Act, is deficit neutral over the 10-year budget window - and even produces a $6 billion surplus. CBO estimated more than $550 billion in gross Medicare and Medicaid savings. More importantly, the bill includes a comprehensive array of delivery reforms to set the stage for lowering the future growth in health care costs.

and you believe that?

Well, I was suppose to believe him when he quoted the CBO as saying it would add billions to our deficit....which they were saying until they made some cuts elsewhere so why not use his source for where congress stands now with it?

but no, of course I don't believe cbo....I would believe the omb long before the cbo because it is independent...the head gets a 10yr appointment where no one can fire them or threaten their job if they don't report it with the fluff of congress!

 

[DiveCon]

CBO has the Bill Budget Neutral Toomuchtime?

and you believe that?

Well, I was suppose to believe him when he quoted the CBO as saying it would add billions to our deficit....which they were saying until they made some cuts elsewhere so why not use his source for where congress stands now with it?

but no, of course I don't believe cbo....I would believe the omb long before the cbo because it is independent...the head gets a 10yr appointment where no one can fire them or threaten their job if they don't report it with the fluff of congress!

no new program has ever been added and cost what it was projected to

 

[Cecilie1200]

If nothing happens and the Health Care reform effort is killed due to continued misinformation from the republican party, the GOP may lose more seats in 2010. It is incredible what many of us have been receiving in our Inboxes.

This Bill does NOT give Health Care benefits to illegal aliens, as has been asserted. The Bill is NOT going to encourage the elderly to die, as has been asserted.

The motive behind the lies is to slam Obama. None of these e-mailers care a twit about healthcare. They just want to slam Obama, so they lie.

Okay, enough with the lies and disinformation and whatever fairy dust Obama has blown up your ass.

Here's the text of HR 3200, so everyone can reference it for themselves:

http://waysandmeans.house.gov/media/pdf/111/AAHCA09001xml.pdf

Section 152, pages 50-51 say this:

". . . all health care and related services (including insurance coverage and public health activities) covered by this Act shall be provided without regard to personal characteristics extraneous to the provision of high-quality health care or related services."

What are those "extraneous personal characteristics"? One of them would be US citizenship, or lack thereof. Which is why Representative Heller of Nevada tried to introduce an amendment to this bill in the House Ways and Means Committee to exclude illegal immigrants from being covered by our government. Said amendment was voted down by every single Democrat on the Committee.

Section 59B, page 170, Line 1 specifically addresses "non-resident aliens". Yes, this means people who are here on green cards, but it also legally applies to those here illegally as well.

Section 1233, page 425, addresses "Advance Care Planning Consultation". This is what it says:

"Subject to paragraphs (3) and (4), the term `advance care planning consultation' means a consultation between the individual and a practitioner described in paragraph (2) regarding advance care planning, if, subject to paragraph (3), the individual involved has not had such a consultation within the last 5 years. Such consultation shall include the following:

`(A) An explanation by the practitioner of advance care planning, including key questions and considerations, important steps, and suggested people to talk to.

`(B) An explanation by the practitioner of advance directives, including living wills and durable powers of attorney, and their uses.

`(C) An explanation by the practitioner of the role and responsibilities of a health care proxy.

`(D) The provision by the practitioner of a list of national and State-specific resources to assist consumers and their families with advance care planning, including the national toll-free hotline, the advance care planning clearinghouses, and State legal service organizations (including those funded through the Older Americans Act of 1965).

`(E) An explanation by the practitioner of the continuum of end-of-life services and supports available, including palliative care and hospice, and benefits for such services and supports that are available under this title.

`(F)(i) Subject to clause (ii), an explanation of orders regarding life sustaining treatment or similar orders, which shall include--

`(I) the reasons why the development of such an order is beneficial to the individual and the individual's family and the reasons why such an order should be updated periodically as the health of the individual changes;" (emphasis mine)

So right there, HR 3200 provides for end-of-life counseling, where you get to explain to a government bureaucrat why life-sustaining treatment orders are beneficial to the patient and the patient's family. You get to tell them why it's a good idea for Granny's life to be extended.

Anything else you'd like explained to you?

 

[Chris]

God these right wing nuts are stupid.

End of life counseling is sorely needed in this country.

We treat our dogs better than we treat ourselves.

 

[DiveCon]

God these right wing nuts are stupid.

End of life counseling is sorely needed in this country.

We treat our dogs better than we treat ourselves.

^^^^^^^^^^^

see, Chris supports killing the elderly

 

[Chris]

God these right wing nuts are stupid.

End of life counseling is sorely needed in this country.

We treat our dogs better than we treat ourselves.

^^^^^^^^^^^

see, Chris supports killing the elderly

My mother left strict instructions for when she was about to go.

No resuscitation.....she did not want to live as a vegetable.

Thank God, she discussed it with us ahead of time.