Zone1 Worse than sin is the denial of sin

[The Sage of Main Street]

Much of society just dont give a shit about your "sins"
As I said, its silly. Many people think so. Apparently more do, than dont or this thread wouldnt exist

Domination Through Damnation

Making up sins is a way for Christofascists to control people. I read a pamphlet from the infamous Jehovah's Witness in which the preacher creatures claimed that everybody commits l,360 sins every day. It's a Guilt Guild.

 

[forkintheroad7]

Domination Through Damnation

Making up sins is a way for Christofascists to control people. I read a pamphlet from the infamous Jehovah's Witness in which the preacher creatures claimed that everybody commits l,360 sins every day. It's a Guilt Guild.

most ridiculous post I've seen today

and thanks for insulting the intelligence of all Christians. But let me guess: you're a liberal

and as such, you NEVER ever believe that your sick, baby killing party is trying to control you


hahahahha...

 

[Ace Nova]

No, and I thought I was done w/ you

oh yeh, forgot to officially Ignore

Your questions/comments indicate a HUGE ignorance of modern Church history. I wish I could find someone who could converse me on this topic of how corrupt and UN-Catholic the Vatican is, but I guess I'll have to go elsewhere. People here, generally speaking, appear to prefer ignorance on such topics.

Sorry you feel that way. I would love to converse you on the topic but you need to make a statement or ask a question first. Or maybe start a thread on it?

 

[forkintheroad7]

Sorry you feel that way. I would love to converse you on the topic but you need to make a statement or ask a question first. Or maybe start a thread on it?

bang head

I've started SEVERAL in the last few months. No one knows what the devil I'm talking about--and worse, don't act like they CARE (not even Catholics!)

which actually is essentially what I'm talking about: the devil. And how he finally got what he wanted by destroying TRUE Catholicism, at least in the Vatican

 

[BreezeWood]

What other sins are we in denial of?

the false desert religions all three w/ the same preamble inducing the lies of abraham and moses their hereditary idolatry, false commandments that never existed and those people that perpetuate those bibles than to correct their injustices - and for the crucifiers to be brought to justice for the crucifixion of those that gave their lives for the heavenly rendering of the 1st century events - the repudiation of judaism.

 

[Ace Nova]

bang head

I've started SEVERAL in the last few months. No one knows what the devil I'm talking about--and worse, don't act like they CARE (not even Catholics!)

which actually is essentially what I'm talking about: the devil. And how he finally got what he wanted by destroying TRUE Catholicism, at least in the Vatican

How much history of the Catholic Church are you aware of?

In my humble opinion, The Spirit of the Adversary has been at it since the beginning - always dwelling, waiting for the moment to contradict or corrupt.

Why is that? Because Catholicism is not perfect - not because of God, the ministry of Christ or the teachings of the prophets - it is because mankind is not perfect.

Jesus Christ set a very high standard for us to live by for a reason - because he knew no matter how hard we tried, we would likely fail - at some point or another. But if the standard is set high enough, even the failures would look like mere stumbling blocks - compared to what it could have been in a Pagan world or a world controlled by hundreds of rituals and laws that were never spoken by a prophet.

This world would be a vastly different place had things not transpired- exactly as they did - from the words of the Prophets - to the structure of the Roman Empire - to the ministry of Jesus - to the hundreds of years of persecution of Christians - to the the eventual "marriage of Rome to Christianity" and the events that came after.

The Church - through the faith of its people - has withheld the test of time - "The Netherworld has not destroyed it" as Jesus stated to Peter.

The miracle of Christ is that the faithful within the Church - and now to many people around the world" - is that if they truly followed the path of Christ - lived by the Golden Rule, lived a life of good will and works - their Spiritual reward awaits therm - despite the amount of accusations, "corruption or wrong doings" within the Church or other religions over the years.

" "Lord Jesus Christ, you said to your apostles; I leave you peace, my peace I give to you. Look not on our sins, but on the faith of your Church, and grant us the peace and unity of your kingdom where you live forever and ever"

 

[buttercup]

I dont consider them "sins" because i dont buy into your 2k year old desert savage fairy tales.

You're getting too hung up on the word "sin" instead of the idea.

Do you believe there's such a thing as right and wrong? If your answer is yes, then you agree with the idea of sin, you just call it by a different name.

As for who decides what is right or wrong, that's a different matter. First I just wanted to ask you if you even believe in morals/ ethics.

 

[forkintheroad7]

How much history of the Catholic Church are you aware of?

In my humble opinion, The Spirit of the Adversary has been at it since the beginning - always dwelling, waiting for the moment to contradict or corrupt.

Why is that? Because Catholicism is not perfect - not because of God, the ministry of Christ or the teachings of the prophets - it is because mankind is not perfect.

Jesus Christ set a very high standard for us to live by for a reason - because he knew no matter how hard we tried, we would likely fail - at some point or another. But if the standard is set high enough, even the failures would look like mere stumbling blocks - compared to what it could have been in a Pagan world or a world controlled by hundreds of rituals and laws that were never spoken by a prophet.

This world would be a vastly different place had things not transpired- exactly as they did - from the words of the Prophets - to the structure of the Roman Empire - to the ministry of Jesus - to the hundreds of years of persecution of Christians - to the the eventual "marriage of Rome to Christianity" and the events that came after.

The Church - through the faith of its people - has withheld the test of time - "The Netherworld has not destroyed it" as Jesus stated to Peter.

The miracle of Christ is that the faithful within the Church - and now to many people around the world" - is that if they truly followed the path of Christ - lived by the Golden Rule, lived a life of good will and works - their Spiritual reward awaits therm - despite the amount of accusations, "corruption or wrong doings" within the Church or other religions over the years.

" "Lord Jesus Christ, you said to your apostles; I leave you peace, my peace I give to you. Look not on our sins, but on the faith of your Church, and grant us the peace and unity of your kingdom where you live forever and ever"

well, I don't disagree with this, or not much of it, but I fail to see what it has to do with the modern history of the Vatican and how it was taken over by anti-Catholic entities? I guess you're saying that since we've had sin and sinners for 2000+ years, this takeover of the Vatican is no different than all the problems we've had before? Well, you are WRONG on that one. Never before was the Church actually overtaken by its enemies. What is coming from the Vatican is NOT Catholic.. NOT Christian of any kind. It is paganism, accepting any perverse thing mankind chooses to do, essentially obliterating the concept of SIN. Why do you think there have been so many cases of "priests" molesting children? The infiltrators are not only NOT Catholic, but anti-Catholic. I'm sure there are some sincere Catholics still in the hierarchy, but they are --or appear to be --outnumbered.

 

[forkintheroad7]

You're getting too hung up on the word "sin" instead of the idea.

Do you believe there's such a thing as right and wrong? If your answer is yes, then you agree with the idea of sin, you just call it by a different name.

As for who decides what is right or wrong, that's a different matter. First I just wanted to ask you if you even believe in morals/ ethics.

very well said!

Thanks

 

[initforme]

Fifty years ago, Karl Menninger (eminent psychiatrist of that time) noted that no one could talk about sin anymore. He said when theologians gave up talking about sin, lawyers took it on, and sin became crime/lawsuits. When lawyers gave up on sin, psychiatrists took it on, and sin became a psychological complex. He foresaw a time when society doesn’t talk about sin at all but would simply go along with it.

Abortion, couples living together, gay weddings, openly taking God’s name in vain, no day of rest, elimination of prayer and bible studies in schools, divorce. What other sins are we in denial of?

Should we continue to deny sin? Do you agree that denial of sin is worse than sin?

You forgot to add having wealth. Somehow I feel you will skirt the issue.

 

[Ace Nova]

well, I don't disagree with this, or not much of it, but I fail to see what it has to do with the modern history of the Vatican and how it was taken over by anti-Catholic entities? I guess you're saying that since we've had sin and sinners for 2000+ years, this takeover of the Vatican is no different than all the problems we've had before? Well, you are WRONG on that one. Never before was the Church actually overtaken by its enemies. What is coming from the Vatican is NOT Catholic.. NOT Christian of any kind. It is paganism, accepting any perverse thing mankind chooses to do, essentially obliterating the concept of SIN. Why do you think there have been so many cases of "priests" molesting children? The infiltrators are not only NOT Catholic, but anti-Catholic. I'm sure there are some sincere Catholics still in the hierarchy, but they are --or appear to be --outnumbered.

You are correct - the Spirit of the Adversary is not Catholic - but anti-Catholic? Likely not specifically but I guess we can simplify it that way. The same Spirit has been around since the dawn of mankind and civilization.

As far as corruption and scandals within the Church, sadly enough, it likely seems "more now" because the size of the Church is much larger than it ever has been throughout history and the fact that through divine justice the guilty within the Church are exposed - now, more than ever.

That said, even now, the corrupt and guilty within the Church represent less than 1% of the servants within the church. One or one percent is far too much but it does show that the vast majority of the Church, its servants, its members have not been corrupted and by the Grace of God, they will never be corrupted.

As far as your fear of "progress" within the church, if you look at the nature of the world now, compared to the nature of the world when the Church was founded, do you see a difference?

If so - and I hope you do - then the church and society has been successful.

Fulfillment of God's teachings through the prophets and Christ will eventually lead to harmony between God's Kingdom and society, yes?

Isaiah 65:

​

25 The wolf and the lamb will feed together,​

and the lion will eat straw like the ox,​

Any time the Church and society come closer together - and is witnessed as being wise - it should be celebrated .


Matthew 11:

18 For John came neither eating nor drinking, and they said, ‘He is possessed.’ 19 The Son of Man came eating and drinking, and they say, ‘Look at him! He is a glutton and a drunkard, a friend of tax collectors and sinners.’ Yet wisdom is proved right by her actions.”

 

[Meriweather]

You forgot to add having wealth. Somehow I feel you will skirt the issue.

Why? I specifically asked for any other sins we are in denial of.

 

[BreezeWood]

Why? I specifically asked for any other sins we are in denial of.

- sin is what is in the heart of those who claim them.

 

[BreezeWood]

Abortion, couples living together, gay weddings, openly taking God’s name in vain, no day of rest, elimination of prayer and bible studies in schools, divorce. What other sins are we in denial of?

an example of a sinner in their heart ... the heavenly sabbath is the heavens claim for what they created - to keep holy.

for the sinners a sabbath in their book means a day off.

 

[Ace Nova]

an example of a sinner in their heart ... the heavenly sabbath is the heavens claim for what they created - to keep holy.

View attachment 1040926

for the sinners a sabbath in their book means a day off.

"Sabbath"

an example of a sinner in their heart ... the heavenly sabbath is the heavens claim for what they created - to keep holy.

View attachment 1040926

for the sinners a sabbath in their book means a day off.

How do the heavens "respect" the Sabbath and keep it holy?

 

[BreezeWood]

"Sabbath"

How do the heavens "respect" the Sabbath and keep it holy?

how can that be the garden earth is their creation they made it ...

they judge who have lived there to keep it holy - sinners need not apply.

 

[ninja007]

True Catholics reject francis because he is not Catholic

and only Catholics can be pope

catholics arent saved.

 

[ninja007]

bang head

I've started SEVERAL in the last few months. No one knows what the devil I'm talking about--and worse, don't act like they CARE (not even Catholics!)

which actually is essentially what I'm talking about: the devil. And how he finally got what he wanted by destroying TRUE Catholicism, at least in the Vatican

being catholic isnt a requirement for salvation. being saved is.

 

[ninja007]

well, I don't disagree with this, or not much of it, but I fail to see what it has to do with the modern history of the Vatican and how it was taken over by anti-Catholic entities? I guess you're saying that since we've had sin and sinners for 2000+ years, this takeover of the Vatican is no different than all the problems we've had before? Well, you are WRONG on that one. Never before was the Church actually overtaken by its enemies. What is coming from the Vatican is NOT Catholic.. NOT Christian of any kind. It is paganism, accepting any perverse thing mankind chooses to do, essentially obliterating the concept of SIN. Why do you think there have been so many cases of "priests" molesting children? The infiltrators are not only NOT Catholic, but anti-Catholic. I'm sure there are some sincere Catholics still in the hierarchy, but they are --or appear to be --outnumbered.

catholicism has never been Christian.

 

[ninja007]

Irrefutable questions that Roman Catholics and Orthodox can't answer

"Roman Catholic Examined" Home Page "Orthodox Church Examined" Home Page Return to "Canon of the Bible" Home Page

Questions for Catholics and Orthodox:

1. If the Roman Catholic church gave the world the Bible, being infallible, then why did Rome reject or question the inspiration of James and Hebrews , then later accept it? Conversely, Rome accepted as scripture books that were later rejected. If the Catholic church really is illuminated by the Holy Spirit so that men can trust her as "God's organization", why was she so wrong about something so simple? Should not the "Holy See" have known?
2. If the Orthodox church gave the world the Bible, being infallible, then why did the eastern churches reject or question the inspiration of Revelation, then later accept it? Conversely, the east accepted as scripture books that were later rejected. If the Orthodox church really is illuminated by the Holy Spirit so that men can trust her as "God's organization", why was she so wrong about something so simple?
3. If the Roman Catholic church gave the world the Bible in 397 AD, then why did many different versions of canons continue to circulate long afterwards?
4. If the Roman Catholic church gave us the Bible, why were the two synods of Hippo (393 AD) and Carthage, (397 AD) African councils, and not initiatives of Rome?
5. Since the synod Carthage in 393 AD stated, "But let Church beyond sea (Rome) be consulted about confirming this canon", does this not prove that Rome had no direct input or initiative in determining the canon.
6. Since the two synods of Hippo (393 AD) and Carthage, (397 AD) were under the control of what would later become the "orthodox church", how can the Roman Catholic church claim they determined the Canon? Would not such a claim be more naturally due the Eastern Orthodox church?
7. If the Catholic church, "by her own inherent God given power and authority" gave the world the Bible, why did she not get it right the first time? Why did the Roman Catholic church wait until 1546 AD in the Council of Trent, to officially add the Apocrypha to the Canon?
8. Both Roman Catholic and Greek Orthodox church leaders make the identical claim that they gave the world the Bible. If both the Roman Catholic and Orthodox churches make the same claim they gave the world the Bible, why do they have different books in each of their Bibles? Whose "church authority" shall we believe? Whose tradition is the one we should follow?
9. Provide a single example of a doctrine that originates from an oral Apostolic Tradition that the Bible is silent about? Provide proof that this doctrinal tradition is apostolic in origin.
10. Provide a single example of where inspired apostolic "oral revelation" (tradition) differed from "written" (scripture)?
11. If you are not permitted to engage in private interpretation of the Bible, how do you know which "apostolic tradition" is correct between the Roman Catholic, the Orthodox and the Watchtower churches, for all three teach the organization alone can interpret scripture correctly, to the exclusion of individual?
12. Why did God fail to provide an inspired and infallible list of Old Testament books to Israel? Why would God suddenly provide such a list only after Israel was destroyed in 70 AD?
13. How could the Jews know that books of Kings or Isaiah were Scripture?
14. If the Roman Catholic and Orthodox churches both believes that the scripture: "the church is the pillar and foundation of truth" means the church is protected from error then: a. Why do they teach doctrine so different that they are not even in communion with each other? b. How do you account for the vast number of documented theological errors made by the pope and the church in general?
15. If the both the Orthodox and Catholic churches follow apostolic oral tradition exactly, how come they teach doctrine so different, that they are not even in communion with each other?
16. Both Tertullian and Jerome gave a list of oral traditions that were not found in the Bible. (Tertullian, The crown or De Corona, ch 3-4), (Jerome, Dialogue Against the Luciferians, 8) Tertullian said of these practices that "without any written instrument, we maintain on the ground of tradition alone". These include, baptizing by immersion three times, giving the one baptized a "drink of milk and honey" then forbidding the person from taking a bath for a week, kneeling in Sunday mass was forbidden, and the sign of the cross was to be made on the forehead. Jerome, echoing Tertullian, said that these "observances of the Churches, which are due to tradition, have acquired the authority of the written law". Why does the Catholic church not immerse thrice and allow kneeling? Why do both the Roman Catholic and Orthodox churches not keep any of these traditions, with the exception of thrice immersion by the Orthodox? Why do Roman Catholic churches today have knelling rails in front of every pew? If the "apostolic tradition" was to make the sign of the cross on the forehead, why do both Orthodox and Catholic churches change this to the current practice of the sign on the chest and head? If extra-biblical oral tradition is to be followed, then why don't the Roman Catholic and Orthodox churches practice all of these things?

Practice from Tradition	Orthodox​	Catholic​
disown the devil before baptism​	​	​
thrice immersed​	​	​
Drink milk and honey after baptism​	​	​
don't bath for a week after baptism​	​	​
kneeling in worship is forbidden​	​	​
Sign of cross on forehead​	​	​
SCORE​ What percentage of the oral tradition in 200 AD do Orthodox and Catholic keep today? Worse still, the traditions of Orthodox and Catholic today contradict each other!	50%​	0%​
Tertullian, The crown or De Corona, ch 3-4 Jerome, Dialogue Against the Luciferians, 8​

· As you can see from the chart above, neither Orthodox or Catholic keep the oral tradition of the 2nd century AD. Catholics keep none of it and Orthodox keep 50% of it! Worse still, both these church fight with protestants that you must use their oral tradition but the Orthodox and Catholic oral traditions DIFFER WITH EACH OTHER!!!

· IF ORAL TRADITION IS AUTHORTATIVE, HOW ARE OUTSIDERS SUPPOSED TO KNOW WHICH OF THESE TWO ORAL TRADITIONS IS CORRECT? The solution is that oral tradition is worthless and what we are left with is the BIBLE ALONE.