Why We Don't Have Universal Health Care.

[Woodznutz]

Anyone with common sense would take Kennedy's suggestion with a pound of salt.

Probably should wait until his recommendations come out.

 

[Woodznutz]

You be sure and follow his directives!

He will offer suggestions to people, directives to companies.

I've got my health ducks pretty much in a row. Kennedy is being pragmatic in his approach. He knows that what Americans really need to do would be rejected by most.

 

[dblack]

He will offer suggestions to people, directives to companies.

I've got my health ducks pretty much in a row. Kennedy is being pragmatic in his approach. He knows that what Americans really need to do would be rejected by most.

Yes. He's a real font of wisdom. Do what he says!

 

[LibertyKid]

We have the right to life liberty and happiness, shouldn't we strive to do better in the life category.
I'm a capitalist, free market man, BUT... when it comes to healthcare, can't we do better? What was it 5-7 years ago the pharma company that produced the Epi Pen increased the cost substantially over a short period of time. But because of current laws copyright and market laws, there are no alternatives to the pen. Mylan, could do what they want. And what they did was wrong. I don't care if you're a capitalist, what they did was wrong.

But how do we fix it? We have to make healthcare a 'right' while at the same time rewarding and incentivising research in healthcare. If one pharma company produces a breakthrough drug, they are mandated to share the recipe, with all manufacturers, and they can be rewarded financially through step program where they garner the majority of profits which is eventually scaled back.

IMO, healthcare is a moral problem in our country, and until we get big pharma to have a change of heart, make them private organizations, maybe even non-profit, nothing will change. But we can change.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

You know, like all the other developed nations (among others) have. The reason is because of the Insurance industry and the money they can get politicians to take. I say we hang the insurance industry out to dry.

It's MedMal, Insurance and Congress

 

[dblack]

We have the right to life liberty and happiness, shouldn't we strive to do better in the life category.
I'm a capitalist, free market man, BUT... when it comes to healthcare, can't we do better?

Better how?

But how do we fix it? We have to make healthcare a 'right' ...

What does it mean to you to make healthcare a right?

 

[LibertyKid]

Better how?

Greatly reduced costs through legislation and laws.

What does it mean to you to make healthcare a right?

For example, if a cure for breast cancer was found, should a woman be afforded that cure free of charge?

 

[dblack]

Greatly reduced costs through legislation and laws.

So state price controls? I think you skipped some classes in "libertarian school".

For example, if a cure for breast cancer was found, should a woman be afforded that cure free of charge?

Not sure what "should be afforded" means. I'm willing to help her out personally, but I don't think government has an business intervening.

 

[LibertyKid]

So state price controls? I think you skipped some classes in "libertarian school".

Not sure what "should be afforded" means. I'm willing to help her out personally, but I don't think government has an business intervening.

Clearly you blieve that healthcare should remain a profit center and if someone contracts cancer, the ability to afford or obtain the best treatment is on them.

 

[dblack]

Clearly you blieve that healthcare should remain a profit center and if someone contracts cancer, the ability to afford or obtain the best treatment is on them.

Basically, yeah. I'm all for charity and community. I just don't want government controlling healthcare.

Please stop calling yourself a libertarian. You really don't get it.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

A profit incentive government market is perhaps the best we can do in our society.

 

[dblack]

A profit incentive government market is perhaps the best we can do in our society.

WTF is that??

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

WTF is that??

Look it up.

 

[dblack]

Look it up.

I did. Sounded like the usual socialist bullshit. You want to give government more power over trade.

 

[Captain Caveman]

You know, like all the other developed nations (among others) have. The reason is because of the Insurance industry and the money they can get politicians to take. I say we hang the insurance industry out to dry.

To answer the thread title, one word, "Stupidity".

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

I did. Sounded like the usual socialist bullshit. You want to give government more power over trade.

That is Donald doing that, you freak.

 

[dblack]

That is Donald doing that, you freak.

No, it's both.

 

[LibertyKid]

Basically, yeah. I'm all for charity and community. I just don't want government controlling healthcare.

Please stop calling yourself a libertarian. You really don't get it.

Yes, I understand that a libertarian doesn't like big gov't and libertarians are all about individual freedoms and rights, but also the free market. But I believe we can also agree that a free market CAN take advantage of the people.

I only propose that as a society, life, liberty, and happiness are core principles, then those areas, like healthcare and medicine that sustain those principles, could become a right. I too agree, that I don't like the gov't becoming involved. So how do we do it? How do we convince big pharma and hospitals to be charitable? How do we incentivise R&D and medical services to continue to create medical breakthroughs, while giving the public the right to those medicines and services that help sustain life and liberty?

I'm asking how can we do it? To say we can't because it's against a political or economic system that you might believe in isn't a good enough answer IMO.

At any given time, most middle to upper class Americans can be financially ruined with a medical diagnosis. And to sit back and go, that's your lot in life, sorry about your luck, and maybe ask your local charity, church to help, isn't the ONLY answer we should be giving people.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

Bankruptcy is one exit door for medical catastrophe in America.

How many medical bankrupticies occured in Scandanavia and Finland in 2024?

In 2024, medical bankruptcies in Scandinavia—which includes Sweden, Norway, Denmark, and Finland—were extremely rare to virtually nonexistent.

Why So Few?​

These countries all operate universal healthcare systems, meaning:

• Medical care is publicly funded and largely free at the point of use.
• Citizens are not burdened with large out-of-pocket expenses for hospital stays, surgeries, or chronic care.
• Bankruptcy due to medical bills is not a systemic issue, unlike in countries without universal coverage.

n contrast:

• The United States saw hundreds of thousands of medical-related bankruptcies.
• Countries like Canada, Australia, and the UK report small percentages, often tied to loss of income rather than direct medical costs3.

So in short: Scandinavia and Finland had virtually zero medical bankruptcies in 2024, thanks to their robust public healthcare systems.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

LibertyKid, IOW, there are viable, healthy alternatives to our American health and medical systems.