Why We Don't Have Universal Health Care.

Deflecting from your socialist ideas does nothing to support your OP.
My ideas are shared by millions here, Bernie Sanders for example. There's nothing in the constitution that prevents the American people deciding whether to have a nationalized health care.

Do you seek to restrict free speech? open political discourse? perhaps you're the one who should move to Russia or China.
 
My ideas are shared by millions here, Bernie Sanders for example. There's nothing in the constitution that prevents the American people deciding whether to have a nationalized health care.
Yeah, I know. Open borders and unbridled illegal immigration to the tune of 10+ million has that effect. As for Bernie Sanders, LOL, the DNC dumped him before they dumped your favorite vegetable. Just another senile Marxist.
 
My ideas are shared by millions here, Bernie Sanders for example. There's nothing in the constitution that prevents the American people deciding whether to have a nationalized health care.
There doesn't have to be. That's not how the Constitution works. The salient point is that there's nothing in the Constitution that authorizes a federal takeover of health care.
 
Yeah, I know. Open borders and unbridled illegal immigration to the tune of 10+ million has that effect. As for Bernie Sanders, LOL, the DNC dumped him before they dumped your favorite vegetable. Just another senile Marxist.
That's right the Democrats and Republicans are more or less the same, they are both owned by private wealth, they both support genocide in Gaza, they both supply weapons to foreign despotic regimes, they both oppose universal health care.
 
There doesn't have to be. That's not how the Constitution works. The salient point is that there's nothing in the Constitution that authorizes a federal takeover of health care.
There's nothing in the Constitution that authorizes a federal takeover of drug classifications or a federal takeover of state election policies.

Finally the constitution can be amended, it's happened before.
 
There's nothing in the Constitution that authorizes a federal takeover of drug classifications or a federal takeover of state election policies.
Agreed. The Court has failed us more than once.
Finally the constitution can be amended, it's happened before.
Yep. Unfortunately, some people don't want to go to the trouble. They think we can just pretend the Constitution means something else and roll with that, because majority rules.
 
That's right the Democrats and Republicans are more or less the same, they are both owned by private wealth, they both support genocide in Gaza, they both supply weapons to foreign despotic regimes, they both oppose universal health care.
If all of that were true, it would tend to indicate that your views are in the minority. Hmmm. Next.
 
I basically agree with your larger point, but would like to expand it. If those who wrote the Constitution accommodated postal service as a legitimate and necessary role and duty of government, why not healthcare? Do the rights of man under a democratic republic also include healthcare?

As a tax payer, I would much rather my tax dollars go to universal healthcare than perpetual illegitimate wars.
Healthcare back then was scarce, private, often ran by charities and mainly the wealthy had access.
 
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Healthcare back then was scarce, private, often ran by charities and mainly the wealthy had access.
So were roads, and they travelled by horse and buggy. Nonetheless, the founding document also ordered and empowered the new government to build "post roads." Plus, there were doctors in those days, and druggists. Back in those days most if not all doctors honored the Hippocratic Oath, and often traded their work for food and other necessary items.

It's true that the fledgling government in 1789 had no medical facilities, but it would be nice to ask one of the founding fathers that if the new country and its government had the wealth it had acquired by, say 1950 or so, would they consider public health to be important enough for a wealthy government to provide it?
 
It's true that the fledgling government in 1789 had no medical facilities, but it would be nice to ask one of the founding fathers that if the new country and its government had the wealth it had acquired by, say 1950 or so, would they consider public health to be important enough for a wealthy government to provide it?
It's not a question of whether it's important enough or not. The question is whether government should control it. or if it's something people should be free to deal with as they see fit.

I know progressives never want to hear about the slippery slope. They never want to talk about how precedents established by one proposed program will impact government overall, how it will impact society. If your criteria for socializing something is merely how "important" something is - should we be targeting food and housing next? Arguably, those are even more important than health care. Should government control those as well?
 
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It's not a question of whether it's important enough or not. The question is whether government should control it. or if it's something people should be free to deal with as they see fit.

I know progressives never want to hear about the slippery slope. They never want to talk about how precedents established by one proposed program will impact government overall, how it will impact society. If your criteria for socializing something is merely how "important" something is - should we be targeting food and housing next? Arguably, those are even more important than health care. Should government control those as well?
I'm not advocating for the government to control it per se, but rather that the people receive the benefit. It can be done, but you're right that it could certainly present a slippery slope given the fascist tendencies we have.

If the argument becomes that we can't afford it, then my answer is that if our Eisenhower-warned Pentagon can be missing trillions of dollars to commit military aggression around the globe, we can damn sure afford some sort of universal healthcare plan.
 
Because, in a free society, the purpose government isn't to solve all of our problems. It's there for a very specific class of problems that have to do with conflict resolution - problems that potentially require the use of violence to resolve. The rest is up to us to deal with on our own, voluntarily.
If the government was created to solve special problems, and I agree that it was, and the government's powers in the founding document are enumerated and finite, do we agree that what we have as governance today is mostly illegitimate? In violation of letter and spirit of the founding document?
 
I'm not advocating for the government to control it per se, but rather that the people receive the benefit.
Unfortunately, you can't separate the two. Wherever pays the bills is in control.
It can be done, but you're right that it could certainly present a slippery slope given the fascist tendencies we have.
Yep. If we socialize health care every election will be a bitterly contested struggle over how "we" do health care. The fearmongers will go into overdrive and your vote will be cast as a referendum on whether grandma lives or dies.
If the argument becomes that we can't afford it. ...
That's not my argument. It's a question of liberty - whether I can spend my money on health care as I choose, or whether government takes that money from me in the form of taxes and spends it on my behalf.
 
If the government was created to solve special problems, and I agree that it was ...
Government is there to solve very specific problems, primarily in the area of conflict resolution. We create government so we can enjoy living in society without packing a gun to defend our rights.

Government is not there to take care of the peasants. It's not there to service special interest groups. It's not there to "partner" with business. It's not there to control the economy, or interfere in trade.

Government is there to protect our rights and manage the commons, and otherwise stay out of the way.
... do we agree that what we have as governance today is mostly illegitimate? In violation of letter and spirit of the founding document?
Much of it, yes. That's no reason to add more fuel to the fire.
 
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I'm not advocating for the government to control it per se, but rather that the people receive the benefit. It can be done, but you're right that it could certainly present a slippery slope given the fascist tendencies we have.

If the argument becomes that we can't afford it, then my answer is that if our Eisenhower-warned Pentagon can be missing trillions of dollars to commit military aggression around the globe, we can damn sure afford some sort of universal healthcare plan.
Who runs the NHS in the UK and is it one organisation?
 
Ask somebody who knows.
I know, I just wondered any Yanks did because their posts indicates a big fat no.

Americans think government run the NHS, explain how and is the NHS one part or many? I'm just trying to educate numbskulls.
 
Government is there to solve very specific problems, primarily in the area of conflict resolution. We create government so we can enjoy living in society without packing a gun to defend our rights.

Government is not there to take care of the peasants. It's not there to service special interest groups. It's not there to "partner" with business. It's not there to control the economy, or interfere in trade.

Government is there to protect our rights and manage the commons, and otherwise stay out of the way.

Much of it, yes. That's no reason to add more fuel to the fire.
Everything you say there dblack is contradicted by the Preamble to the Constitution and by the Declaration of Independence. Why should I give your claims any credibility?
 
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