Zone1 Why is it so tough to believe in God?

[alang1216]

What experiments/experiences have you conducted in your life to prove/disprove your hypotheses?

I have been observing and studying the world for 70+ years and I've never encountered the supernatural or ANYTHING that couldn't be explained by natural forces only.

 

[Meriweather]

It's because there's no evidence whatsoever.

All of us use subjective evidence and have no quarrel with it. Why quarrel with it when it comes to God? Also, have you looked into the findings within the Shroud of Turin or evidence surrounding the Eucharist? There is also Lourdes. Atheists don't want evidence. Even when it is available, they dismiss it as if it doesn't exist. That brings us back to the question, even when evidence is available, why is it so tough to believe in God?

 

[Carl in Michigan]

Hardly. I could just be the product of natural forces.

The universe DEGENERATES without a Creator, it never evolves

 

[Meriweather]

In my experience, it is tough to believe in God because of many people who claim to speak for God.

Personal interaction/prayer with God can help mitigate what you may be experiencing. With God, each situation is unique and personal. Some who claim to speak for God may base it on something God said in scripture seemingly totally unaware that in another circumstance he said the opposite because of the difference/uniqueness in what was happening.

This is why, when someone proof texts/cherry picks one Biblical verse, it is vital we all keep in mind that there may be a ton of verses that are being ignored. We live complex, intricate, and complicated lives. One verse cannot/does not cover all.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

And where did they come from?

Unicorn was the name of the one horned ancient rhino
Leprechauns are the name that culture gave demons. In this age you'd probably call them little greys

 

[Meriweather]

And where did they come from?

You tell me. Are you suggesting God comes from the same place? That would be like me suggesting since I came from Idaho, all people must come from Idaho. Focus on the main question: Where is God? His presence in our midst is quite different from that of fairies, unicorns, and leprechauns.

 

[Meriweather]

At one time, Zeus had many times the followers than Yahweh had. Did that make Zeus real?

At one time the earth was considered flat and that the sun revolved around earth. Did this belief make it real? Just as our understanding of our planet and all that lives here has grown and changed down through the ages, so has our understanding of the Supreme Being grown and changed.

The difference between you and I is that you are satisfied with past conclusions about Zeus as Supreme Being, while I explored, studied and came to know that just as the earth is a sphere, not flat--and that the earth revolves around the sun--God is much more than what was once thought.

Another difference: You let an unhappy nun(s) come between you and God whereas I did not let an unhappy nun stand in, or block, my way.

 

[alang1216]

The universe DEGENERATES without a Creator, it never evolves

The universe or our planet? Run this experiment on the other 1 billion solar systems in our galaxy and see if the results are the same. Then run it on each of the billion planets in each of the other billion galaxies of our universe.

 

[Meriweather]

I have been observing and studying the world for 70+ years and I've never encountered the supernatural or ANYTHING that couldn't be explained by natural forces only.

Then you missed observing/studying/listening to all that makes up this world. It's a larger portion than you might credit. Compare yourself to any botanist. No matter how much time s/he spends observing and studying plants on this planet, it is literally impossible for him to observe/study all.

 

[JoeB131]

At one time the earth was considered flat and that the sun revolved around earth. Did this belief make it real? Just as our understanding of our planet and all that lives here has grown and changed down through the ages, so has our understanding of the Supreme Being grown and changed.

The difference between you and I is that you are satisfied with past conclusions about Zeus as Supreme Being, while I explored, studied and came to know that just as the earth is a sphere, not flat--and that the earth revolves around the sun--God is much more than what was once thought.

Another difference: You let an unhappy nun(s) come between you and God whereas I did not let an unhappy nun stand in, or block, my way.

Well, totally off-brand, but the Ancient Greeks knew the world was round. They knew this because they watched ships on the horizon, and the hulls vanished from view before the masts. And they still prayed to Zeus's brother Poseidon for calm seas.

The problem is that you think that changing the name of the Imaginary Sky Pixie makes sky pixies real. (I guess Poseidon was a sea pixie, but never mind.)

For ancient people, "God" was an explanation for everything they didn't understand. A bunch of locusts just ate all our crops? God must be angry! A plague broke out? Well, you shouldn't have taken that census, David! Ehud just swelled up from eating shellfish? That must be abominable before the Lord.

Except today we understand food allergies and germ theory and pest control, so really, no need for a God to explain things, just use practical science.

Or at least we should. We still have nutters out there saying AIDS was God's revenge on homosexuals or that we should go to Church during COVID because God will be angry if we don't.

The reason why religion persists is because we are all afraid of death. We need to believe there is something beyond this (even though according to your own teachings, very few of us are getting into Heaven).

 

[alang1216]

Then you missed observing/studying/listening to all that makes up this world. It's a larger portion than you might credit. Compare yourself to any botanist. No matter how much time s/he spends observing and studying plants on this planet, it is literally impossible for him to observe/study all.

You're right of course but would you expect that botanist to ever find a plant that could talk? Has any botanist, or anyone else, ever found a plant that could talk?

 

[Meriweather]

The reason why religion persists is because we are all afraid of death.

I know this is your theory, which I have refuted in the past. And yes, I am aware that some in the past saw the earth as a sphere and even held the belief the earth revolved around the sun long before Copernicus lived. This, despite common belief, which changed as knowledge and communication spread throughout the world. Hope you get over that fear of death. Phobias are no fun.

 

[Meriweather]

You're right of course but would you expect that botanist to ever find a plant that could talk? Has any botanist, or anyone else, ever found a plant that could talk?

Are you aware that plants can communicate with each other? Not in the same way we do, of course, but on a plant basis.

 

[TNHarley]

Is it because:

• Lack of belief we are lovable
• Lack of belief we are cared for
• Lack of belief God is an active agent in our lives
• Lack of belief we have a reason for being

What blocks people from believing in God? Why is it so hard to believe?

There is no proof.
The bible is absolutely unbelievable. I dont believe in magic. Adults should have grown out of that childish belief.
The bible is contradictory.
The god portrayed in the bible is a narcissistic, genocidal, jealous, tyrant. I would like to believe if there is a supreme being capable of creating everything, he would be good and smart enough to not have those horrible traits. Satan actually sounds more likable.
He is either not omniscient, or he is a sadist and enjoys watching his creation suffer.
It seems the abrahamic religions were just rip offs of other religions that come before it.

 

[alang1216]

Are you aware that plants can communicate with each other? Not in the same way we do, of course, but on a plant basis.

I was aware and I'm sure there are many things we have yet to learn but none, so far as I know require a supernatural explanation.

 

[Meriweather]

There is no proof.
The bible is absolutely unbelievable. I dont believe in magic. Adults should have grown out of that childish belief.
The bible is contradictory.
The god portrayed in the bible is a narcissistic, genocidal, jealous, tyrant. I would like to believe if there is a supreme being capable of creating everything, he would be good and smart enough to not have those horrible traits. Satan actually sounds more likable.
He is either not omniscient, or he is a sadist and enjoys watching his creation suffer.
It seems the abrahamic religions were just rip offs of other religions that come before it.

The above are your own conclusions about the Bible. The Bible addresses truths in a number of ways. People are contradictory, history is contradictory, lives are contradictory, but many contradictions fall into place when the differences in each event are studied.

God is also portrayed as loving, good, merciful, and just. Why dismiss and ignore those traits?

 

[TNHarley]

The above are your own conclusions about the Bible.

Pretty hard to ignore it if you read it for what it is, and not try to pastorsplain it away.

God is also portrayed as loving, good, merciful, and just. Why dismiss and ignore those traits?

After he went through rehab for the NT. The OT he was not loving. He was not merciful. He was not good. He was not just.

 

[TNHarley]

Another reason is, Jesus was obviously not the messiah. The messianic age did not happen.

 

[midcan5]

Someone may have answered but for many it is the reality of existence. If there were a loving God would they tolerate the horror of every day existence for many? The starving children, the horrid existence for many, the cruel actions of leaders - it was an interesting idea but humans made a mess of it.

 

[Meriweather]

I was aware and I'm sure there are many things we have yet to learn but none, so far as I know require a supernatural explanation.

You may be aware that there is much of reality that is invisible to the human eye, ear, and other senses. Have you considered that some may be more sensitive to a reality that you dismiss as "supernatural" and therefore non-existent?

I often use the example of my nephew who was born color-blind. It took us several years to know that he could only see in black and white (probably more accurately, shades of grey). Color is not a reality for him. It is impossible to explain 'blue' to him--for him, it simply doesn't exist. The difference between him and you, alang, is that he does believe color exists for others. Not only do you not believe God exists for you, you cannot/will not believe He exists for others.