Why Do Americans Love to Blame Teachers?

[JakeStarkey]

wow! I had great teachers from K through college.

RMK, I am sorry to hear that. Forgive me, get it off your chest.

Where did you go to school?

 

[JakeStarkey]

I believe it is a rampant epidemic in education, and education is the last place this practice belongs.

Then you and your family and adult friends get involved in local education.

 

[RKMBrown]

wow! I had great teachers from K through college.

RMK, I am sorry to hear that. Forgive me, get it off your chest.

Where did you go to school?

Broward county Florida during the busing era. For the most part I sat on my ass playing games on sheets of paper with the other bored students for 12 years, while I waited for the rest of the class to catch up to where I was before pre-school. Complete waste of time. Much easier to just read a book and figure something out on your own, or talk to someone that knows what they are doing than wasting time in classrooms designed for the lowest common denominator.

Best HS class I ever had the science teacher brought in a home built computer, this was pre-apple days. The teacher said we'll have a test on one chapter each week, if you get a 100 on the test you can sit up front and write a program to run on the computer. I sat up front in that class writing code every week. He gave me a copy of a programming manual for the computer. The programming language was called business basic. We had to spray Freon on it to keep it cool enough to run. That was a fun class. But again... I had to teach myself, this teacher was a great facilitator though.

In college I had one good professor. I went to him to ask some questions about an advanced programming project that he assigned for a subject that wasn't in any of the books... this was before the internet. He walks me over to the library and shows me where to look the topic up. Guy says.. the best thing I can teach you is where to find stuff, your a smart guy you can figure it out yourself once you have access to the information you need. Guy says when you figure it out, how about you teach it to the class. I ended up working for that teacher for the rest of my final year in college.

 

[Samson]

I was blathering because I'm angry.

I went to pre-school, elementary school, middle school, high school, and college. Almost every single one of the teachers I had sucked. Every single one of those schools had a tenure system. My measure of quality might not be the same as yours.

I don't excuse the teachers for the problems in the system because the teachers are a part of the system. You may blame the parents as an excuse for the teachers... I don't. The problem is the entire system that promotes failure and punishes success. You want to be a great teacher? You have to leave the system. You want to be a great student? You have to leave the system. You want to be a failure as a teacher or student? Well then this system is for you.

Yes, your measure of quality is certainly not the same as many.

The fact that after public school, you were able to go to college exceeds the standard.

 

[regent]

As I look back at the teachers I had in my year of high school, I now realize I had some great ones, the problem: I didn't take advantage of those teachers. It was more important to be "one of the guys" the guys that resisted learning, resisted school, and all the school tried to offer. The high school had a 75% dropout rate and I left in the ninth grade. I suspect the 25% that graduated had a fair education.
After I left, because of juvenile delinquency problems, schools began a new approach the "keep em in school, an off the streets" program. Standards were lowered, grades eased, maybe class size lowered, and attempts made to make school less of a burden for students.
Recently, I checked one of my elementary school pictures and discovered that poor Mrs. Wagner had fifty kids in her seventh grade class.

 

[regent]

Last time I checked five states do not allow teacher unions, I wondered how those states ranked educationwise:
State rank
South Carolina 50th.
North Carolina 49th
Georgia 48th
Texas 47th.
Virginia 44th.

 

[RKMBrown]

Last time I checked five states do not allow teacher unions, I wondered how those states ranked educationwise:
State rank
South Carolina 50th.
North Carolina 49th
Georgia 48th
Texas 47th.
Virginia 44th.

Bullshit on two counts. One we have teacher unions in TX. Two Texas is not 47th in education ya dimwit.

As a matter of fact this one right here in Dallas is number one in the nation.

U.S. News Releases 2014 Best High Schools Rankings - US News

On average TX is average for the nation. However, that is in spite of the millions upon millions of illegals sitting in our school system that the feds refuse to boot back south, most of which get donuts, thus bringing the averages down.

 

[regent]

Last time I checked five states do not allow teacher unions, I wondered how those states ranked educationwise:
State rank
South Carolina 50th.
North Carolina 49th
Georgia 48th
Texas 47th.
Virginia 44th.

Bullshit on two counts. One we have teacher unions in TX. Two Texas is not 47th in education ya dimwit.

As a matter of fact this one right here in Dallas is number one in the nation.

U.S. News Releases 2014 Best High Schools Rankings - US News

On average TX is average for the nation. However, that is in spite of the millions upon millions of illegals sitting in our school system that the feds refuse to boot back south, most of which get donuts, thus bringing the averages down.

You may be right Texas may now be 45th in Ranking rather than 47th. Dallas is meaningless for state rankings, the entire state must be involved. Teacher organizations may not be teacher unions.

 

[RKMBrown]

Last time I checked five states do not allow teacher unions, I wondered how those states ranked educationwise:
State rank
South Carolina 50th.
North Carolina 49th
Georgia 48th
Texas 47th.
Virginia 44th.

Bullshit on two counts. One we have teacher unions in TX. Two Texas is not 47th in education ya dimwit.

As a matter of fact this one right here in Dallas is number one in the nation.

U.S. News Releases 2014 Best High Schools Rankings - US News

On average TX is average for the nation. However, that is in spite of the millions upon millions of illegals sitting in our school system that the feds refuse to boot back south, most of which get donuts, thus bringing the averages down.

You may be right Texas may now be 45th in Ranking rather than 47th. Dallas is meaningless for state rankings, the entire state must be involved. Teacher organizations may not be teacher unions.

Wrong wrong wrong, ya dim wit. Where did you get these lies from?

 

[Rikurzhen]

Last time I checked five states do not allow teacher unions, I wondered how those states ranked educationwise:
State rank
South Carolina 50th.
North Carolina 49th
Georgia 48th
Texas 47th.
Virginia 44th.

What you're doing is ranking in a way which captures population variance, not education.

Let's see how they perform:

Texas white students outperform white students in heavily unionized states like Wisconsin, Ohio, New York, Michigan, Illinois, Indiana, Delaware and they outperform national standards. Furthermore, Texas' black students outperform black students in heavily unionozed states as well. And the same for Texas' Hispanic students.

 

[Samson]

Last time I checked five states do not allow teacher unions, I wondered how those states ranked educationwise:
State rank
South Carolina 50th.
North Carolina 49th
Georgia 48th
Texas 47th.
Virginia 44th.

You "wondered?"

How about "wondering" how states with largest black populations ranked?

The fact is neither race or unionized teachers has everything to do with performance.

The fact is that even the author of the book reviewed in the OP believes teacher's unions need reform.

 

[Politico]

When your grandkids know more about Tubman than Washington...something is fucked up.

Healthcare has nothing to do with education And your grandkids don't know how to add without an iPhone app much less dial a rotary phone. They have no idea who Tubman is. BTW her first name is Harriet.

 

[regent]

Last time I checked five states do not allow teacher unions, I wondered how those states ranked educationwise:
State rank
South Carolina 50th.
North Carolina 49th
Georgia 48th
Texas 47th.
Virginia 44th.

You "wondered?"

How about "wondering" how states with largest black populations ranked?

The fact is neither race or unionized teachers has everything to do with performance.

The fact is that even the author of the book reviewed in the OP believes teacher's unions need reform.

So are you suggesting there are more components in education than just teacher unions? Maybe the type of student is a factor, and maybe the student's IQ, or ability to learn? There may be a number of factors involved in education besides just teacher unions?

 

[DGS49]

OF COURSE, there are many good teachers! No one said there were not. The problem is that a bad teacher is a "cancer," and can never be removed. They can be removed for stealing something, or coming to work drunk (maybe), or screwing a student, but for incompetence or nonperformance? Never.

I've written about this before, but just for fun everyone should go to a local school board meeting and ask how many teachers got an "Unsatisfactory" performance rating the preceding year. The answer in every single case will be ZERO. What does that tell you? Professionals? Hardly.

And by the way, I know my school district is exceptional, but the STARTING pay here is $45k, and about half the teachers are now into six figures, salary wise. And they can retire with full pay and benefits after 30 years. That means at 52-54 years old, in most cases.

The fact is, there is not much to "blame" teachers here for. More than half of the households have two college-grad parents, and when kids are having problems, we send them to private tutors (often other teachers within the district) for help. Our kids basically get a "private school" education, but with much better sports facilities.

 

[Samson]

Last time I checked five states do not allow teacher unions, I wondered how those states ranked educationwise:
State rank
South Carolina 50th.
North Carolina 49th
Georgia 48th
Texas 47th.
Virginia 44th.

You "wondered?"

How about "wondering" how states with largest black populations ranked?

The fact is neither race or unionized teachers has everything to do with performance.

The fact is that even the author of the book reviewed in the OP believes teacher's unions need reform.

So are you suggesting there are more components in education than just teacher unions? Maybe the type of student is a factor, and maybe the student's IQ, or ability to learn? There may be a number of factors involved in education besides just teacher unions?

Obviously.

The arguments for and against Teacher Unions seem to believe there is some ridiculous calculus that makes Union affiliation a major factor in student learning, while at best it is a minor factor.

The OP only mentions Unionization because one component of Union Contracts may make removing INDIVIDUAL undesirable teachers more difficult than necessary. This reflects poorly on the Union, and teachers in general. There is no mention of removing the ability of ALL teachers to collectively bargain with the state, and no implication that this would effect learning one way or the other.

 

[Samson]

I've written about this before, but just for fun everyone should go to a local school board meeting and ask how many teachers got an "Unsatisfactory" performance rating the preceding year. The answer in every single case will be ZERO. What does that tell you? Professionals? Hardly.

You must be attending a helluva lot of school board meetings throughout the country to have made such a sweeping conclusion.

Having actually been employed as a teacher in the public school system, I can assure you that you are very much mistaken.

While I agree that it is very difficult to remove an "Unsatisfactory" teacher during the school year, it is very possible to not renew their employment contract for the next year.

 

[regent]

I've written about this before, but just for fun everyone should go to a local school board meeting and ask how many teachers got an "Unsatisfactory" performance rating the preceding year. The answer in every single case will be ZERO. What does that tell you? Professionals? Hardly.

You must be attending a helluva lot of school board meetings throughout the country to have made such a sweeping conclusion.

Having actually been employed as a teacher in the public school system, I can assure you that you are very much mistaken.

While I agree that it is very difficult to remove an "Unsatisfactory" teacher during the school year, it is very possible to not renew their employment contract for the next year.

Teachers are removed all the time, it is a job administrators may hate, however. The high school in our district had an unsatisfactory teacher and the department chairman, with union and faculty backing, insisted the teacher be removed from his department and fired. After a lot of hemming the principal brought charges and with union help the teacher was fired. School faculty associations can help with the process but I don't think most administrators would welcome teachers intrusion into what they feel is their domain. I also don't think most teachers resent incompetent teachers from being fired, it is the definition of the word incompetent.

 

[Samson]

I've written about this before, but just for fun everyone should go to a local school board meeting and ask how many teachers got an "Unsatisfactory" performance rating the preceding year. The answer in every single case will be ZERO. What does that tell you? Professionals? Hardly.

You must be attending a helluva lot of school board meetings throughout the country to have made such a sweeping conclusion.

Having actually been employed as a teacher in the public school system, I can assure you that you are very much mistaken.

While I agree that it is very difficult to remove an "Unsatisfactory" teacher during the school year, it is very possible to not renew their employment contract for the next year.

Teachers are removed all the time, it is a job administrators may hate, however. The high school in our district had an unsatisfactory teacher and the department chairman, with union and faculty backing, insisted the teacher be removed from his department and fired. After a lot of hemming the principal brought charges and with union help the teacher was fired. School faculty associations can help with the process but I don't think most administrators would welcome teachers intrusion into what they feel is their domain. I also don't think most teachers resent incompetent teachers from being fired, it is the definition of the word incompetent.

While you may be correct, the fact remains that from the OP:

This isn't to say that all teachers are good. There are certainly bad teachers, and Goldstein recommends adjusting union rules to make such teachers easier to remove.

​

 

[psikeyhackr]

It is useless to blame the parents of all of the screwed up kids that your children have to share classes with because not even the schools can do anything about them.

 

[GHook93]

Why Do Americans Love to Blame Teachers?
Healthcare has its critics, but few of them are calling for doctors to be replaced. Education is different—and as a new book reveals, it has been throughout U.S. history.

Why Do Americans Love to Blame Teachers - The Atlantic

As long as we have parents who refuse to be involved in their children's education or those parents who wish to impose ultra liberal or far right reactionary values on the rest of us, the war will continue.

Nice red herring! We don't blame teacher (well some teachers), we blame:
(1) The teacher unions that hamstring schools,
(2) Public schools, when Charter schools have proven to be 1000 fold better,
(3) Politicians that shoot down school choice for political reasons,
(4) Tenure that protects bad teachers,
(5) Liberal-agenda minded teachers who push their politics on their students,