Why are you against universal health care?

[Woodznutz]

Why are you opposed to universal healthcare for all Americans?

The present state of health of Americans would quickly collapse such a system. The only way UHC will work is if Americans become much, much healthier than they are now. Unfortunately, UHC would de-incentivize people from improving their health, so UHC would actually make the nation's health even worse than it is now.

 

[dblack]

I am aware of how insurance pools work...make money for the insurance company and screw the customer.

Sigh... More with the "pools". Liberals, very badly, want to pretend that insurance is just a kind of socialism. So that they can further pretend that, hey, we've already got socialism, so roll over and accept more!

But insurance isn't socialism and it's not a social safety net. It's a hedge against risk, a bet that comes in if you get sick with something covered by the policy. It takes the sting out of bad things happening.

It's not a club you join to score discounts on health care. But that's how we've been trying to use it, and that's why it's so fucked up. Using it that way isn't sustainable. We need to get back to using as intended - to soften the blow of unexpected calamities. Unfortunately, ACA killed that kind of health insurance in favor of a delusion.

 

[LordBrownTrout]

Why? Because it would be controlled by a government that is corrupt.

 

[task0778]

The present state of health of Americans would quickly collapse such a system. The only way UHC will work is if Americans become much, much healthier than they are now. Unfortunately, UHC would de-incentivize people from improving their health, so UHC would actually make the nation's health even worse than it is now.

Pretty much, yeah. I thought we had already had a shortage of doctors, nurses, and other care professionals, and not many of them will sign up to provide care for less money. I do not see enough politicians voting to end Medicare, Medicaid, and other health programs, ao the total cost of UHC would be astronomical.

 

[dblack]

Why? Because it would be controlled by a government that is corrupt.

Or stupid. Or just has radically different values than you. The point is, your health care will depend on government. For the life of me, I can't figure out why Dems would want someone like Trump in charge of their health care.

 

[LordBrownTrout]

Sigh... More with the "pools". Liberals, very badly, want to pretend that insurance is just a kind of socialism. So that they can further pretend that, hey, we've already got socialism, so roll over and accept more!

But insurance isn't socialism and it's not a social safety net. It's a hedge against risk, a bet that comes in if you get sick with something covered by the policy. It takes the sting out of bad things happening.

It's not a club you join to score discounts on health care. But that's how we've been trying to use it, and that's why it's so fucked up. Using it that way isn't sustainable. We need to get back to using as intended - to soften the blow of unexpected calamities. Unfortunately, ACA killed that kind of health insurance in favor of a delusion.

If more people ate fruits and vegetables and meat that wasn't pumped with antibiotics, hormones, and was minimally processed, we could greatly reduce going to the doctor. I'm not against junk food though. I enjoy it sometimes!
Most doctors have no clue of what good nutritional and sure don't advise their patients to quit eating all the grease, sugar, etc.......just take another pill. It's kinda like when I took my daughter to the dentist a couple of weeks ago and they had a basket full of candies for the kids after they were done.

 

[Papageorgio]

Why are you opposed to universal healthcare for all Americans?

Government is greedy and does not operate efficiently add to it the high probability of fraud and theft, it is not beneficial.

Look at our education, highest cost per student in the world and middle of the pack results.

Government agencies bleed money from greed. See the daycare fraud in Minnesota, the unemployment fraud in Washington State after Covid. Then look at all the fraudulent schemes with the Covid money, another round of theft.

I have no trust in our government doing what is right by us.

 

[dblack]

Government is greedy and does not operate efficiently add to it the high probability of fraud and theft, it is not beneficial.

Even if we imagine a trustworthy government, we'd still subject to the moral and ideological prerogatives of whatever administration gains power. Let's say Obama had actually signed single payer into law. What would Trump be doing to it RIGHT NOW? Regardless of what you think of Trump, I don't want my health insurance to be in jeopardy with every election. And it would be if government takes control..

 

[Woodznutz]

Sigh... More with the "pools". Liberals, very badly, want to pretend that insurance is just a kind of socialism. So that they can further pretend that, hey, we've already got socialism, so roll over and accept more!

But insurance isn't socialism and it's not a social safety net. It's a hedge against risk, a bet that comes in if you get sick with something covered by the policy. It takes the sting out of bad things happening.

It's not a club you join to score discounts on health care. But that's how we've been trying to use it, and that's why it's so fucked up. Using it that way isn't sustainable. We need to get back to using as intended - to soften the blow of unexpected calamities. Unfortunately, ACA killed that kind of health insurance in favor of a delusion.

My insurance company is owned by a large hospital. I can get an examination right away, but they schedule treatment only after my enrollment date, so my out-of-pocket costs reset to the maximum. I recently had to wait five months to have an ear problem treated. When I arrived the waiting room was empty. I was the only one there.

 

[task0778]

I have no trust in our government doing what is right by us.

Me neither. They'll do what's best for them and their donors. That's both sides, although I hafta say the democrats are worse. I don't trust academia, corporations, or the media either.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Insurance is a voluntary association.
UHC is not.

Wrong: insurance is not exactly voluntary either . Do you own a car and live someplace where you can't get around with out one. Do you own a home?

Universal Health care my not be voluntary, but neither are taxes, and who the **** do you think ultimately foots the bill when uninsured people show up in the ER ? Who pays when people who are much sicker than they would be if they had been able get preventive and followup care but did not- and now can no longer work or pay taxes? YOU dumb ass!! YOU. Damned ! You people are stupid and short sighted.

 

[Hafar1014]

Wrong: insurance is not exactly voluntary either . Do you own a car and live someplace where you can't get around with out one. Do you own a home?

Universal Health care my not be voluntary, but neither are taxes, and who the **** do you think ultimately foots the bill when uninsured people show up in the ER ? Who pays when people who are much sicker than they would be if they had been able get preventive and followup care but did not- and now can no longer work or pay taxes? YOU dumb ass!! YOU. Damned ! You people are stupid and short sighted.

Universal health care costs more and the quality is poor.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Universal health care costs more and the quality is poor.

Costs more than what? How is the quality poor? What are you basing that on? How do you measure quality?

What about the cost and quality of for profit private insurance where those companies can-in the absence of government regulations charge whatever they want, impose annual and lifetime caps on benefits , reject people with pre-existing conditions, and deny needed testing and medication? Anything that is for profit will cost more

 

[Hafar1014]

Costs more than what? How is the quality poor? What are you basing that on. What about the cost and quality of for profit private insurance where those companies can-in the absence of government regulations charge whatever they want, impose annual and lifetime caps on benefits , reject people with pre-existing conditions, and deny needed testing and medication? Anything that is for profit will cost more

Lets take the NHS in the UK. Im there every year know some DRs and I trained mental health therapists there.
Its out of funds Covid broke it. Drs have gotten one raise in 14 years after a strike by Jr Drs. Wait times are now in months and even years. People die waiting fir treatment. Acute emergencies dont wait. There is zero mental health fir children you have to pay it yourself.
They pay higher taxes than we pay, a 15% VAT tax on all goods and services, have lower standard of living(median) and live in much smaller spaces.

The Collapse of Britain’s National Health Service - FEE

It’s a poorly-kept secret that Britain’s National Health Service (NHS) has faced crisis after crisis. But the latest scandal over 3 million “unseen patients”

fee.org

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Because providing free healthcare to people is not a legitimate function of the fed-gov, and its record of fiscal incompetence and bureaucratic inefficiency disqualify it.

Horseshit!

Providing healthcare is widely considered a legitimate and essential government function, though the extent and method vary; governments ensure access, regulate markets, protect vulnerable populations (like through Medicare/Medicaid in the U.S.), and fund services, balancing public well-being with market-based approaches, reflecting a global view that health is a human right and a public good.

Arguments for Government Role

• Public Health & General Welfare: Governments have a broad mandate to ensure "general welfare" and protect citizens, which extends to public health, seeing healthcare as a necessity, like clean water, rather than a luxury.
• Human Rights: Many view healthcare as a fundamental human right, obligating governments to ensure universal access, even if services are privately delivered.
• Market Failures: Markets alone often fail to provide equitable or affordable care for everyone, necessitating government intervention to expand coverage and control costs, as seen with the ACA.
• Ensuring Access: Governments fund programs (Medicare, Medicaid) and enact laws (EMTALA) to guarantee care for vulnerable groups, the elderly, and those in emergencies.

Roles of Government in Healthcare

• Purchasing & Providing: Funding and delivering care (e.g., VA, military, Medicaid).
• Regulating: Overseeing quality, safety, and markets for pharmaceuticals, insurance, and providers.
• Supporting: Investing in research, workforce development, and public health infrastructure.

 

[Orangecat]

That was because of the huge national debt.

Tax cuts don’t incur debt, pending above revenue does.

 

[dblack]

Wrong: insurance is not exactly voluntary either . Do you own a car and live someplace where you can't get around with out one. Do you own a home?

Legally mandated insurance is wrong, in any case.

 

[dblack]

Horseshit!

Providing healthcare is widely considered a legitimate and essential government function, though the extent and method vary; governments ensure access, regulate markets, protect vulnerable populations (like through Medicare/Medicaid in the U.S.), and fund services, balancing public well-being with market-based approaches, reflecting a global view that health is a human right and a public good.

Arguments for Government Role

• Public Health & General Welfare: Governments have a broad mandate to ensure "general welfare" and protect citizens, which extends to public health, seeing healthcare as a necessity, like clean water, rather than a luxury.
• Human Rights: Many view healthcare as a fundamental human right, obligating governments to ensure universal access, even if services are privately delivered.
• Market Failures: Markets alone often fail to provide equitable or affordable care for everyone, necessitating government intervention to expand coverage and control costs, as seen with the ACA.
• Ensuring Access: Governments fund programs (Medicare, Medicaid) and enact laws (EMTALA) to guarantee care for vulnerable groups, the elderly, and those in emergencies.

Roles of Government in Healthcare

• Purchasing & Providing: Funding and delivering care (e.g., VA, military, Medicaid).
• Regulating: Overseeing quality, safety, and markets for pharmaceuticals, insurance, and providers.
• Supporting: Investing in research, workforce development, and public health infrastructure.

Do you really want your health care to be in jeopardy every single election?

 

[Hector12]

Tax cuts don’t incur debt, pending above revenue does.

That is like saying that eating too much does not cause obesity, but not exercising enough does. Actually, eating too much and not getting exercise both contribute to obesity.

Republicans like to cut taxes for the rich and spend more on the military. Beginning with the Reagan administration both actions have contributed to the rise in the national debt.

 

[LAUGHatLEFTISTS]

Why are you opposed to universal healthcare for all Americans?

The government that cuts the checks to the Somali daycare centers with zero accountability is the same government that will be running universal healthcare.
Understand now?