Zone1 Why are there so many Old Testament Christians?

[irosie91]

It's also on Jewish websites... As you should know, I research both sides, which is how I distinguish your opinions from what historical sites from both perspectives are presenting. Another point I keep in mind, is no one--not me, you, or even the scholars and commentators on those websites were here to observe when it was all going down.

I don't give the "official Christian reconstruction" and from my own research, nor do you give the "official Jewish reconstruction".

Jewish websites describe the life and times of Paul and the reason for his "almost arrest" and his death? I learned the
christian viewpoint in my childhood---I had no education in
synagogues or "hebrew school"--or even at home about the
era in question or anything about Judaism. I learned the christian POV in my very christian town and some time in
"sunday school" and from the islamo-nazi propaganda
which was prevalent in my town in the 50s--and since and
this messageboard. I learned here and in the other places
I mentioned that the "jewish authorities" hated Jesus and
wanted to kill him but somehow were "afraid" to do it.
I learned from christian sources that the
"money changers" were the evil "money lenders" and
"Rothchilds" of era in question-----out to cheat "the poor"
I even learned that the TALMUD IS A BOOD CHOCK full of evil
and BALAAM is a code word for Jesus, and there are lines
in the Talmud "gitten" that describe Jesus being (sic) boiled in
hot semen. I learned lots of bullcrap from christian sources over the past 70 years that jews "believe" and despite prevalent literacy and mountains of writings---somehow forgot to put into print. Speaking of mountains of writings---they cover the
'era of Jesus' and christianity----with those GIANT HOLES that
christians have managed to fill with jelly beans.
over the past 2000 years

 

[norwegen]

To whom do you believe Jesus was sent?

Not the lost tribes. That's not what the text says. He was sent to the lost sheep.

And he found some, who did not include the Syrophonoecian woman.

 

[Woodznutz]

Not the lost tribes. That's not what the text says. He was sent to the lost sheep.

And he found some, who did not include the Syrophoenician woman.

He was sent to the lost sheep of the house of Israel (as distinct from the house of Judah).

The "woman of Canaan" was an Israelite, not a Syrophoenician. That's why Jesus went there in the first place. The "woman at the well" was also an Israelite of Samaria.

A study of Romans 9:25 would be helpful as well.

Romans 9:25

 

[Woodznutz]

Jewish websites describe the life and times of Paul and the reason for his "almost arrest" and his death? I learned the
christian viewpoint in my childhood---I had no education in
synagogues or "hebrew school"--or even at home about the
era in question or anything about Judaism. I learned the christian POV in my very christian town and some time in
"sunday school" and from the islamo-nazi propaganda
which was prevalent in my town in the 50s--and since and
this messageboard. I learned here and in the other places
I mentioned that the "jewish authorities" hated Jesus and
wanted to kill him but somehow were "afraid" to do it.
I learned from christian sources that the
"money changers" were the evil "money lenders" and
"Rothchilds" of era in question-----out to cheat "the poor"
I even learned that the TALMUD IS A BOOD CHOCK full of evil
and BALAAM is a code word for Jesus, and there are lines
in the Talmud "gitten" that describe Jesus being (sic) boiled in
hot semen. I learned lots of bullcrap from christian sources over the past 70 years that jews "believe" and despite prevalent literacy and mountains of writings---somehow forgot to put into print. Speaking of mountains of writings---they cover the
'era of Jesus' and christianity----with those GIANT HOLES that
christians have managed to fill with jelly beans.
over the past 2000 years

Just go to the source for information. Problem solved.

 

[ding]

No, he did not.

It depends how you define chosenness. From everything I have read Jews believe they were chosen to be a holy nation and establish laws which set them apart from other nations or peoples.

 

[irosie91]

Just go to the source for information. Problem solved.

I did---the available sources do not support the jelly-bean version. One of the available sources includes the NT---faulty
as it is----it is still very valuable----read it again

 

[norwegen]

He was sent to the lost sheep of the house of Israel (as distinct from the house of Judah).

The "woman of Canaan" was an Israelite, not a Syrophoenician. That's why Jesus went there in the first place. The "woman at the well" was also an Israelite of Samaria.

All the tribes were Israel. Good lord, man, that's fundamental.

The gospel of Mark says she's Syrophoenician, that's what I say. And of course she was Canaanite. The entire region was Canaanite. The Israelites settled in Canaan, remember?

 

[ding]

I did---the available sources do not support the jelly-bean version. One of the available sources includes the NT---faulty
as it is----it is still very valuable----read it again

So a conspiracy of epic proportions?

 

[norwegen]

It depends how you define chosenness. From everything I have read Jews believe they were chosen to be a holy nation and establish laws which set them apart from other nations or peoples.

The Jew in question is Jesus. He did not consider his countrymen chosen.

 

[irosie91]

The Jew in question is Jesus. He did not consider his countrymen chosen.

how do you know?

 

[irosie91]

Not the lost tribes. That's not what the text says. He was sent to the lost sheep.

And he found some, who did not include the Syrophonoecian woman.

what text?

 

[Woodznutz]

It depends how you define chosenness. From everything I have read Jews believe they were chosen to be a holy nation and establish laws which set them apart from other nations or peoples.

They are but they are currently on God's sh-t list.

 

[Woodznutz]

I did---the available sources do not support the jelly-bean version. One of the available sources includes the NT---faulty
as it is----it is still very valuable----read it again

What is the NT---faulty?

 

[irosie91]

What is the NT---faulty?

NT is an abbreviation for "new testament" which is what christians call, in English--the 'bible' that was commissioned by
Constantine, emperor of the Roman Empire when he decided to
make his kingdom "christian"---in fact "all christian"

 

[Woodznutz]

All the tribes were Israel. Good lord, man, that's fundamental.

The gospel of Mark says she's Syrophoenician, that's what I say. And of course she was Canaanite. The entire region was Canaanite. The Israelites settled in Canaan, remember?

"Canaanite" can mean anyone living in Canaan, regardless of their ethnicity. Jesus identified her to the disciples as an Israelite, one of the lost sheep still living in the region.

 

[Woodznutz]

NT is an abbreviation for "new testament" which is what christians call, in English--the 'bible' that was commissioned by
Constantine, emperor of the Roman Empire when he decided to
make his kingdom "christian"---in fact "all christian"

But what does "---faulty" mean?

 

[Woodznutz]

All the tribes were Israel. Good lord, man, that's fundamental.

The gospel of Mark says she's Syrophoenician, that's what I say. And of course she was Canaanite. The entire region was Canaanite. The Israelites settled in Canaan, remember?

So, it follows that all Israelites are Canaanites?

For the purposes of this discussion the Jews (with Benjamin and Levi) are called "the house of Judah". The other ten tribes are called "the house of Israel" (also called Ephraim, Joseph). After the split the term "Israel" is rarely applied to all of the tribes as it was before the split. However, the term can be confusing especially as Paul used it, and the term "Gentiles", in Romans chapters 9-11.

NIV is a clearer translation than KJV.

 

[irosie91]

But what does "---faulty" mean?

faulty means defective

 

[Woodznutz]

faulty means defective

Maybe for Jews, not for Christians.

 

[Zincwarrior]

As a fallen away Catholic who has spent some time studying the Bible, I am curious as to why so many Christians embrace the Old Testament even as they seem to reject the teachings about love and equality found in the New Testament.

Isn't 'Old Testament' and 'Christian' a contradiction in terms?