Who is the most underrated NBA player in history? My 2 submissions.

[sealybobo]

James doesnt play Center you dolt.

Ok. James and most players today would be fine in that era with those rules. The same can’t be said of most players from then doing the same.

Game 1 vs Denver was a perfect example of why Lebron isn't the GOAT. I was going to say he is the GOAT if he wins this series. In fact, I'll still say that. If Lebron can pull off beating Denver, then he is the GOAT.

LeBron dropped a 35-footer at the halftime buzzer to put L.A. up by three, and that was the last significant Laker highlight. The Nuggets ruled the third quarter and never trailed again.

Remember we told you how Jordan got after teammates if they weren't holding up their end? Jordan was famous for this. So his teammates delivered because he demanded it. That's another intangible.

Nuggets-Lakers: 5 takeaways from dominant Game 1 comeback

A better L.A. script will be needed to flip what continues to be a one-sided matchup for the Lakers against the Nuggets.

www.nba.com

Russell threw a bad pass that was scooped up by the wrong team and led to a breakaway layup, and that’s when D’Angelo Russell heard it — LeBron clapped hard in his direction and gave a “C’mon.” On this night, a troubling one for the point guard, LeBron had evidently reached the end of his patience — and it was only the third quarter.

It didn’t get better for Russell, whose struggles Saturday were costly — 6-for-20 shooting and 1-for-9 from deep, and a handful of those looks were wide open.

I guess clapping hard once and saying COME ON! isn't all that motivating or inspiring. I'm sure this is why he doesn't have more rings.

This reminds me of Yianni. How come Lillard played so well with Yianni gone? Perhaps Yianni isn't as great as we thought. If he can't figure out to play with Lillard, that's going to be a blemish on his career. He needs to let Lillard lead that team.

 

[sealybobo]

James doesnt play Center you dolt.

Ok. James and most players today would be fine in that era with those rules. The same can’t be said of most players from then doing the same.

James shows glimmers of greatness. In the first half I saw him do a lot of amazing things. He sure is great. But that greatness disappears in the 4th quarter. Instead Jamal Murray is the hero last night.

We can never know for sure because you would have to put Lebron with the same 4 guys Jordan played with. And they would have to play against the same 5 guys. And maybe the same guy hits an important shot for Jordan and not for Lebron. So it's silly to argue really when. Jordan 6 of 15. Lebron 4 of 21. Obvously Jordan was a bigger winner.

 

[sealybobo]

James doesnt play Center you dolt.

Ok. James and most players today would be fine in that era with those rules. The same can’t be said of most players from then doing the same.

13 seconds left. Lebron has a wide open 3. But he should have waited till the shot clock was down to three before he shot. Maybe he should have taken the ball to the hole.

What he did was miss a wide open 3 and give Denver 13 seconds to come down and make the winning shot.

Come on man. He’s no cerebral assassin

 

[Couchpotato]

13 seconds left. Lebron has a wide open 3. But he should have waited till the shot clock was down to three before he shot. Maybe he should have taken the ball to the hole.

What he did was miss a wide open 3 and give Denver 13 seconds to come down and make the winning shot.

Come on man. He’s no cerebral assassin

You should try taking Jordan's dick out of your mouth every now and again. You might start thinking clearly.

 

[Unkotare]

 

[Fiero425]

13 seconds left. Lebron has a wide open 3. But he should have waited till the shot clock was down to three before he shot. Maybe he should have taken the ball to the hole.

What he did was miss a wide open 3 and give Denver 13 seconds to come down and make the winning shot.

Come on man. He’s no cerebral assassin

I certainly don't give Lebron credit for being "the most intelligent player" on the court! Skip Baseless can't stand him, thinks he doesn't have a "clutch gene," but believes he's that cerebral player people can acknowledge! NOT ME! He's weak, has turned more into a "mercenary" instead of playing in just one town like Cleveland! He clanks "free throws" & game ending shots so it's hard for me to call him the GOAT!

 

[Couchpotato]

I certainly don't give Lebron credit for being "the most intelligent player" on the court! Skip Baseless can't stand him, thinks he doesn't have a "clutch gene, but believes he's that cerebral player people can acknowledge! NOT ME! He's weak, has turned more into a "mercinary" instead of plaing in just one town like Cleveland! He clanks "free throws" & game ending shots so it's hard for me to call him the GOAT!

See post #124

Lebron has made more game winning shots at a higher percentage than Jordan.

 

[Fiero425]

See post #124

Lebron has made more game winning shots at a higher percentage than Jordan.

Lebron's also played twice as long! lol!

 

[Couchpotato]

Lebron's also played twice as long! lol!

you missed the higher percentage part?

 

[sealybobo]

You should try taking Jordan's dick out of your mouth every now and again. You might start thinking clearly.

I saw something yesterday where Jordan was number one and Luka Doncic was on the list. I can't remember what the record was but now when I look for what I thought I heard, looks like Lebron has the most of those.


I think it was most 30 point games?

Anyways, in a shorter amount of time Jordan had 109 30 plus playoff games. Lebron, in all these years, has 120. But who cares if at the end of the game you lost? Who cares that you scored 30?

 

[Mr. Friscus]

I saw something yesterday where Jordan was number one and Luka Doncic was on the list. I can't remember what the record was but now when I look for what I thought I heard, looks like Lebron has the most of those.


I think it was most 30 point games?

Anyways, in a shorter amount of time Jordan had 109 30 plus playoff games. Lebron, in all these years, has 120. But who cares if at the end of the game you lost? Who cares that you scored 30?

scoring 30 isn’t good if it took you 25 shots to do it. You probably cost your team the game if you did that.

Jordan shot the most in NBA history

 

[Mr. Friscus]

You should try taking Jordan's dick out of your mouth every now and again.

For real.

Dude is wide open pressing his nose into Jordan’s low abdomen.

He definitely merely bought the mythology and didn’t watch it as it happened… just relied on ESPN/Nike and fellow awe-struck sports commentators.. he’s reciting their narratives word for word.

Jordan was human, he played awful at times, he was a whiney diva, he whined to the refs all the time, he travelled all the time, he cost his team games with his high volume shooting game, and he missed many many game winning shots.

He’s also on the very short list to be considered the GOAT

That’s just the truth, if you watched the NBA at that time

 

[sealybobo]

scoring 30 isn’t good if it took you 25 shots to do it. You probably cost your team the game if you did that.

Jordan shot the most in NBA history

Jordan didn't "cost" his team anything. He gave them the world. They, and now I, worship him. Miami thanks Lebron for 2 rings. Cleveland thanks him for 1. LA barely remembers his win in the bubble. But they'll take the rings I'm sure.

Just thinking about Lebron tie ballgame, 13 seconds left, and he shoots. Wide open shot. Forget that he missed. He should have dribbled and drove to the hole, scoring with 4 seconds left. Take the 2 point lead with 4 seconds left. Instead he tried to pop a 3 with 13 seconds left. No awareness of what he needed to do. Reminds me of Chris Webber at Michigan calling a time out he didn't have.

The Lakers stretched their advantage to 68-48 two minutes into the second half and they still led by 10 entering the fourth quarter.

I will remember James blowing a 20 point lead in the 2nd half, game 2, first round of the playoffs. CHOKE! Typical Lebron. What is he 4 for 22?

 

[Couchpotato]

For real.

Dude is wide open pressing his nose into Jordan’s low abdomen.

He definitely merely bought the mythology and didn’t watch it as it happened… just relied on ESPN/Nike and fellow awe-struck sports commentators.. he’s reciting their narratives word for word.

Jordan was human, he played awful at times, he was a whiney diva, he whined to the refs all the time, he travelled all the time, he cost his team games with his high volume shooting game, and he missed many many game winning shots.

He’s also on the very short list to be considered the GOAT

That’s just the truth, if you watched the NBA at that time

sealybobo hasnt made a single coherent argument for Jordan's GOAT status (not that one cant be made because it certainly can) I agree with you that it's exceedingly hard if not impossible to definitively name a "GOAT" because all these guys didnt play in the same era. Different rule sets, different competition, etc etc. That said if I were forced to pick a "GOAT" it would probably be LeBron and for a multitude of reasons.

 

[sealybobo]

sealybobo hasnt made a single coherent argument for Jordan's GOAT status (not that one cant be made because it certainly can) I agree with you that it's exceedingly hard if not impossible to definitively name a "GOAT" because all these guys didnt play in the same era. Different rule sets, different competition, etc etc. That said if I were forced to pick a "GOAT" it would probably be LeBron and for a multitude of reasons.

What reasons?

 

[Mr. Friscus]

What reasons?

I think first you need to give a reason for MJ that isn’t based on some mythological assumption or platitude.. or some anecdote

 

[sealybobo]

I think first you need to give a reason for MJ that isn’t based on some mythological assumption or platitude.. or some anecdote

6 rings in 15 seasons.

I watch Lebron play. I'm impressed but I don't hate him like I did Jordan. That's because he didn't break my heart like Jordan. I rooted against both and Jordan always disappointed me.

Yes, it was mythical. You should have seen it. Apparently you didn't. Even if you say you did, you clearly don't remember it right. Back then, perhaps you weren't into basketball that much or maybe you were stuck on a deserted island for 8 years. Coming from a Piston Bad Boy, Jordan was the man. Practically single handed retired my Pistons. He made them walk off the court without shaking hands. He HUMILIATED them. Lebron's never done that to anybody. Got lucky in Cleveland, LA, and those Heat championships. Meh. I also remember an awful lot of failure.

Lebron would have had to have dominated more in Miami for me to say he was better than Jordan. With all that help he didn't do much.

LeBron’s success in Miami has always been measured against those words (“not one, not two …”), ones he wished he had back. But two titles and four Finals appearances is a success by any measure. Nothing is guaranteed, even when three, sometimes more, of the greatest players in the world come together.

D’Angelo: LeBron James going up against Miami Heat organization that helped mold a champion

Lakers' LeBron James on his days with Miami Heat: ‘I fit perfectly in that culture because I worked just as hard as anybody else'

www.palmbeachpost.com

Lebron didn't live up to my expectations. Jordan did.

We're talking about the instantly infamous "Not one, not two, not three, not four, not five, not six, not seven..." prediction LBJ made at the Big Three welcome party the Heat threw for fans in July 2010.

 

[Mr. Friscus]

6 rings in 15 seasons.

If that’s your objective stat, then why not Bill Russell? 11 rings in 13 seasons

 

[sealybobo]

If that’s your objective stat, then why not Bill Russell? 11 rings in 13 seasons

He didn't score enough. His team was too good. There are lots of reasons almost everyone says he's not the GOAT. Next question?

 

[Couchpotato]

What reasons?

1. He was the best player in the world for over a decade.
2. He has maintained his play at an exceedingly high level longer than anyone in NBA history. He's top 10 in the league in year 21.
3. The 2007 playoffs when he took a team full of no bodies to the NBA finals on his back.

6	Shannon Brown	SG	6-4	205	November 29, 1985	us	R	Michigan State
1	Daniel Gibson	PG	6-2	190	February 27, 1986	us	R	Texas
90	Drew Gooden	PF	6-10	250	September 24, 1981	us	4	Kansas
32	Larry Hughes	SG	6-5	184	January 23, 1979	us	8	Saint Louis
11	Zydrunas Ilgauskas	C	7-3	238	June 5, 1975	lt	8
23	LeBron James	SF	6-9	250	December 30, 1984	us	3
19	Damon Jones	PG	6-3	185	August 25, 1976	us	8	Houston
27	Dwayne Jones	PF	6-11	250	June 9, 1983	us	1	Saint Joseph's
24	Donyell Marshall	PF	6-9	218	May 18, 1973	us	12	UConn
14	Ira Newble	SF	6-7	220	January 20, 1975	us	6	Miami University
3	Sasha Pavlović	SG	6-8	220	November 15, 1983	me	3
31	Scot Pollard	C	6-11	265	February 12, 1975	us	9	Kansas
20	Eric Snow	PG	6-3	190	April 24, 1973	us	11	Michigan State
17	Anderson Varejão	C	6-11	273	September 28, 1982	br	2
4	David Wesley	SG	6-0	190	November 14, 1970	us	13	Baylor

That was the roster he took to the NBA finals. There isnt a single other great player on that roster. It's debatable any of them are starters on most NBA teams.


5. He can play every position on the floor at a high level, and has.
6. He's elevated every team he's been on and when he's left that team has fallen off a cliff.

02-03 Cleveland won 17 games, that total doubled James rookie year. They were in the NBA finals in 06-07. in 09-10 win 61 games lose in C Finals, 10-11 they win 19 games.

09-10 Miami is 3rd in their division loses in the 1st rd of the PO's.
10-11 1st in their division lose in the Finals.
Year after he leaves back to 3rd in the division.

Back to Cleveland. Year before he gets there they are sub .500 The next year they go to the finals for 4 straight years winning 1. Lebron leaves they win 19 games.

Same bascially happens in LA. Non contender to winning a Championship within 2 years.

You can say its the other guys on his team but James is the common denominator in it. Irving, Bosch, Love, Davis. Never did anything without LeBron. (Wade being the exception but Wade had Shaq for his other rings) Id argue the only other HOF'ers James has played with are Wade, Allen and Davis. Not sure Bosch or Love will make it. Irving might depending on how the rest of his career goes.


Shall I go on?