Mr. Friscus
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I did, I just didn't get sexually aroused like you did.
Who is the most underrated NBA player in history? My 2 submissions.
- Thread starter Mr. Friscus
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Jordan 1 NCAA championship does count for something
And 2 Gold Metals. Didn't Lebron win a Bronze in 2004?
Mr. Friscus
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Yes a NCAA championship counts for a lot. It's why you see guys who won it as sports casters. You know they usually pick former champions and HOF'ers to be sportscasters right? Grant Hill's only claim to fame is a NCAA championship with Duke.
It's not quite a NBA championship but it's SOMETHING. A lot actually.
This guy is talking about how Michael had the flu. If Jordan doesn't play, they go down 3 games to 2 and Utah wins a championship. Michael's greatest game.
This guy is like me. He says "I wasn't a Bulls fan at the time".
Gary Payton Supersonics were just as good as the Bulls.
Bulls had to deal with Orlando 60 win team. Shaq and Penny Hardaway. Nick Anderson, Horace Grant.
If you are going to put your money on one guy who's going to get it done, you would bet on Jordan every time and you know it.
Had to beat Stockton Malone. They won 64 games that year. They beat Hakeem Rockets and Barkley. Utah was a great team.
Mr. Friscus
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lg325
Diamond Member
It's a team sport so a player may have top class skills if on a lower-level team his stats may not show his full potential.
Sorry but I watched Jordan play for years and I watched Lebron play for years. Jordan is just more of a winner. Which makes him the GOAT
Who do you think is the GOAT?
Either you and a minority of NBA players past and present are right or me and the MAJORITY of NBA players past and present are right.
Results found that the vast majority (58.3%) consider Michael Jordan as the greatest player of all time, with LeBron James (33%) and Kobe Bryant (6.8%) coming in at second and third. Bill Russell and Tracy McGrady were the only other players mentioned in the votes.
Forget the rings. Let's ask some of the greatest players about Jordan before he won all those championships
The players asked were Julius Erving, Jerry West, Elgin Baylor, Magic Johnson, Bob Cousy, Connie Hawkins. 1993.
It’s interesting how when people talked how great Jordan was it had almost nothing to do with “how many rings” he had and really total accolades in general. It was more about how he was playing at a higher level than everyone else in the league including those before him.
No, it doesn’t
Tim Duncan
Why do they compare LeBron to Jordan? Duncan dominated LeBron with a 21-15 record in the regular season against LeBron. Duncan never left San Antonio or asked for stars or a change of coaches. He won 5 championships, 3 Finals MVPs and 2 NBA MVPs, finished with a 5-1 record in the NBA Finals and was one three point away from Ray Allen to be 6-0 in the Finals equal to Jordan.
LeBron needed to control his franchises, change players and coaches, bring in superstars, form super teams and still has more losses in the Finals than wins. Duncan led with discipline, he won consistently. He had loyalty, legacy, leadership and he was a winner. LeBron has none of that.
Fiero425
Gold Member
Diehards out there can't be convinced or even reasoned w/! Weak minded Millenials can only relate to current affairs over history! Unless they see it, it doesn't exist or matter! I go thru the same thing in tennis! Federer & Nadal are thought to be the greatest 2 players of all time even though Novak Djokovic came along & surpassed all their numbers; I MEAN ALL! They have little to hang their hats on besides the "Tennis Intelligentsia" continung to sing their praises! OTOH Federer has 1 more Wimbledon (8) than Novak & Nadal has 14 French Open crowns over Novak's 3! It's almost embarrassing how long the list of accomp. he has over Fedal including 8 YE #1's, 24 Majors, 40 Masters, 7 YEC's, & an Olympic Gold; 73 Big Titles in total! Fedal have been left in the dust of history as far as I'm concerned, but the diehards will die on that hill thinking they're greater no matter the facts, stats, & record!
I'm Greek. I was so upset to see guys pass his 14.Diehards out there can't be convinced or even reasoned w/! Weak minded Millenials can only relate to current affairs over history! Unless they see it, it doesn't exist or matter! I go thru the same thing in tennis! Federer & Nadal are thought to be the greatest 2 players of all time even though Novak Djokovic came along & surpassed all their numbers; I MEAN ALL! They have little to hang their hats on besides the "Tennis Intelligentsia" continung to sing their praises! OTOH Federer has 1 more Wimbledon (8) than Novak & Nadal has 14 French Open crowns over Novak's 3! It's almost embarrassing how long the list of accomp. he has over Fedal including 8 YE #1's, 24 Majors, 40 Masters, 7 YEC's, & an Olympic Gold; 73 Big Titles in total! Fedal have been left in the dust of history as far as I'm concerned, but the diehards will die on that hill thinking they're greater no matter the facts, stats, & record!
Pete Sampras won 64 ATP Tour-level singles titles, including 14 men's singles majors, which was an all-time record at the time of his retirement
Novak Djokovic holds the all-time record of 24 major singles titles, including a record 10 Australian Open titles. He is the only singles player to hold all four majors simultaneously across three different surfaces (2016), and the only one to complete a triple Career Grand Slam (2023).
I wish Tiger would have passed Jack. So close. 15. Would have loved to see them play each other.
Nicklaus is widely considered a titan of the game, winning 18 major championships and having a career that spanned from 1961 to 1986. His ability to adapt and excel across different eras and course designs is legendary.
Back to Jordan. It really isn't even close. He's clearly the GOAT. I get all the arguments for why it COULD be Lebron but he's not. Winning. Jordan was a winner. You have to say "Jordan had better teammates" to EXPLAIN why Lebron just wasn't a winner or as competitive as Jordan was.
It's hard to argue the facts. He won 6 Championships. And we NEVER saw him lose in a finals. So when it mattered the most, he won. Forget every other year he played. I certainly don't fault old Jordan in Washington. He and Rip made the playoffs. And before Jordan won, EVERYONE in the NBA knew he was the best. Magic, the Pistons, Boston, all knew Jordan was the ******* man. Yes so was Lebron. That's why people who say Lebron is the GOAT think he's the best. Sorry. I remember Lebron failing way too much.
Put it this way. Tom Brady is the GOAT. Because he played a long time. We forget all those years he didn't win. He won 7 right? That's why he's the GOAT. Same reason Lebron is NOT.
Last night I watched some of the last dance. You need to watch it. It was MJs competitiveness and super abilities. Lebron has the super abilities he’s just not as competitive as MJ. And they talked about MJs ability to make teammates better. He made Steve Kerr great.
Perfect example. As soon as the bulls lost to Detroit in 90 they went right to the gym. Mj put on 15 pounds. They would never again be bullied by Detroit. Then they won 3 in a row. MJ ruled his team with an iron fist. Lebron didn’t do this in Cleveland, Miami or LA.
Jordan the clear goat. Ask he pros. They agree with me. Is Larry bird right or you?
Fiero425
Gold Member
Living in Chicago, you hear the real dirt! MJ w/o a doubt, one of the biggest "pricks" in the history of sports!
He may have been competitive as they say, but he took it further! His own teammates admitted "he'd cheat" to win; even against his own mother! Supposedly MJ was playing cards on the team bus w/ his mom & he was busted cheating her! The man's disturbed; but I guess "a winner" is all we'll really care about! 
This is what makes him the GOAT. Would not accept defeat. His teammates feared him. Lebron is not this competitive. This is why Lebron falls short. Watching him fail in the playoffs like he did. When his team was struggling, he did not take over games.Living in Chicago, you hear the real dirt! MJ w/o a doubt, one of the biggest "pricks" in the history of sports!
Maybe some of it is optics. the public's opinion and understanding of a situation after seeing it as the media shows it
But we all write our own history. Let me know when you hear a story about how Lebron got everyone in the locker room to the weight room right after they lost and they put on weight so they could take on Denver, OKC and whoever else is better than them. My dad was sure the Lakers were going to win it all this year. They have a pretty good squad. But clearly those role players don't fear or respect Lebron enough. If they did he'd be in the finals right now. Or last year. Last time the Lakers won was 2020. Last time before that Lebron won was 2016 Cleveland. He got lucky in Cleveland then bolted. Didn't even defend his title.
Manofsteel131621
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- Jun 18, 2025
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You weren't paying close enough attention. When it mattered most. Did you watch all 7 games of this OKC Pacers series? Bet you didn't. So you probably didn't watch every game Michael played in the finals. Be honest. You're white right? Dude, you didn't watch the entire game once. So shut the **** up.
Living in Chicago, you hear the real dirt! MJ w/o a doubt, one of the biggest "pricks" in the history of sports!
Yesterday Lebron said winning is overrated. That's why he's not the GOAT
LeBron James has not publicly stated that "winning is overrated." He has, however, acknowledged the importance of championships but also emphasized that they are a collective effort and that there are other aspects of the game, like personal growth and breaking records, that are also valuable. He has also spoken about the pressure of chasing titles and the impact it has on players, suggesting that while winning is a goal, it's not the only measure of success.
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