Zone1 Which came first, Christianity or Judaism?

[rosends]

In order to 'suffer' you would have to go barefoot, right? My sneakers are actually more comfortable than my leather dress shoes.

Yes, many people see the injunction as applying now to comfy shoes and others see a symbolic aspect of leather (using an animal product for human benefit) so they keep it as related to leather footwear.

 

[Woodznutz]

There are 5 "inuyim" or forms of suffering on the day of atonement, all designed to have us focus on the spiritual not the physical. So we refrain from eating/drinking, from washing, wearing lotions/cosmetics, physical intimacy and wearing leather shoes.

Being hungry and other deprivations doesn't lend itself to 'focusing on the spiritual', in fact it has the opposite effect. It's much easier to focus on the spiritual when the brain is fully nourished. Being satisfied physically is the best way to prepare for spiritual things.

 

[Woodznutz]

Neither was "escaped" but one had a function of helping effect atonement through being pushed off a cliff.

The Scapegoat - Aish.com

aish.com

The 'scapegoat' (escaped goat) wasn't 'pushed off a cliff' but was led into a waste place in the wilderness and released alive. There is nothing in the ceremony that suggests that this goat 'atoned' for the sins of Israel. It represented the Devil, who is ultimately the blame for all sin. That it wasn't killed as part of the ritual indicates that the Devil cannot be killed but can only be restrained.

 

[BreezeWood]

Just wow. You have a real hard-on for trying to eliminate Judaism, don't you?

the desert religions ...

provide the etched tablets from the heavens w/ 10 commandments claimed by the liar moses or remove their claim of authenticity that does not exist and their unwarranted influence used to persecute and victimize the innocent.

 

[BreezeWood]

The 'heavenly prescription' doesn't include 'self determination' (lifting oneself up by your own bootstraps).

I'm not a Jew, therefore I can't 'renounce' Judaism.

jews most likely embrace self determination - its their false rendering from the garden to its objective is what does not work for them.

you are a jew if you render the c-bible ... the forgeries and fallacies are equally shared.

 

[Woodznutz]

jews most likely embrace self determination - its their false rendering from the garden to its objective is what does not work for them.

you are a jew if you render the c-bible ... the forgeries and fallacies are equally shared.

A forgery is an unauthorized duplicate of an original.
How does one determine a 'fallacy'?

 

[rosends]

Being hungry and other deprivations doesn't lend itself to 'focusing on the spiritual', in fact it has the opposite effect. It's much easier to focus on the spiritual when the brain is fully nourished. Being satisfied physically is the best way to prepare for spiritual things.

That's your understanding. Judaism works on refining the self to focus away from creature comforts and spend more time connecting to the divine in pursuit of a spiritual self. On 2 days of the year, we limit our physicality -- once to accentuate our sense of loss and once to underscore our attempt to rise above the self.

 

[BreezeWood]

A forgery is an unauthorized duplicate of an original.
How does one determine a 'fallacy'?

produce the heavenly etched tablets claimed by moses w/ 10 commandments ... false imagery is a forgery and everything else biblical -

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

there is no christ that was not the reason for the jewish execution of jesus - liberation theology, self determination - is the crime the jews are guilty of committing and entwines them forever till they are brought to justice. as their false commandments be stricken than used to persecute and victimize the innocent by the execution they relied on for their perpetuity.

Babbling Buzzing Beelzebub

Proof that the Bible is historical is that the Tower of Babel has been re-located to the Netrix.

 

[Woodznutz]

produce the heavenly etched tablets claimed by moses w/ 10 commandments ... false imagery is a forgery and everything else biblical -

If the laws of God are now written on the fleshly hearts of those guided by the Holy Spirit, what need is there of tablets of stone?

 

[Woodznutz]

That's your understanding. Judaism works on refining the self to focus away from creature comforts and spend more time connecting to the divine in pursuit of a spiritual self. On 2 days of the year, we limit our physicality -- once to accentuate our sense of loss and once to underscore our attempt to rise above the self.

It's a ritual 'loss'. A true loss would have a dramatically different effect on you. I was never more spiritual than when my marriage was breaking up. Also, I was in a church that kept Atonement by fasting. Easy-peasy as I was a health freak so it didn't bother me at all. I didn't feel any more spiritual than I did on any other day.

 

[rosends]

It's a ritual 'loss'. A true loss would have a dramatically different effect on you. I was never more spiritual than when my marriage was breaking up. Also, I was in a church that kept Atonement by fasting. Easy-peasy as I was a health freak so it didn't bother me at all. I didn't feel any more spiritual than I did on any other day.

No, the other day signals an actual, physical loss. This is a different day from the day of atonement. And we don't fast as an ends, but as a means so it isn't about whether fasting bothers me, but whether I can use the time and energy to separate from the physical sense and pour myself into my prayers.

 

[Woodznutz]

No, the other day signals an actual, physical loss. This is a different day from the day of atonement. And we don't fast as an ends, but as a means so it isn't about whether fasting bothers me, but whether I can use the time and energy to separate from the physical sense and pour myself into my prayers.

Still not a true loss as everything temporarily put on the shelf for the day will be there the day after. If you feel a loss you're probably addicted to those comforts. Many in the west believe that if they miss a single meal that they are going starve to death. You are imposing an inconvenience upon yourself, not a true loss.

 

[BreezeWood]

If the laws of God are now written on the fleshly hearts of those guided by the Holy Spirit, what need is there of tablets of stone?

then ...

remove the fallacies than use them - nutz.

do you through jesus renounce judaism and their false commandments and hereditary idolatry. and the reaffirmation of the heavenly religion of antiquity.

there is no faith involved, you are either with jesus or against him and those others that gave their lives to liberation theology, self determination in the 1st century -

 

[AsherN]

In order to 'suffer' you would have to go barefoot, right? My sneakers are actually more comfortable than my leather dress shoes.

Why is abstaining from those other things 'suffering'. God only requires abstinence from food and drink. Seems to me that you are trying to outdo God with extra requirements.

Because it's not really suffering. It is eschewing physical well being to focus on the spiritual. Back in the day, the alternative to leather shoes was not comfy trainers.

 

[Woodznutz]

then ...

View attachment 792701

remove the fallacies than use them - nutz.



there is no faith involved, you are either with jesus or against him and those others that gave their lives to liberation theology, self determination in the 1st century -

Breeze, you need to compose your thoughts better. I don't understand most of what you post.

 

[Woodznutz]

Because it's not really suffering. It is eschewing physical well being to focus on the spiritual. Back in the day, the alternative to leather shoes was not comfy trainers.

I live a very spiritual life, so engaging in 'ritual' spirituality is meaningless to me. But for those who need it, it probably has some value.

 

[irosie91]

produce the heavenly etched tablets claimed by moses w/ 10 commandments ... false imagery is a forgery and everything else biblical -

breezie----give it up-----I am still looking for my 2022 10 40 form

 

[BreezeWood]

produce the heavenly etched tablets claimed by moses w/ 10 commandments ...

breezie----give it up-----I am still looking for my 2022 10 40 form

well, we would presume - you filled out the form if you are looking for it ... the form exists regardless.

moses is a liar the worst kind that has an irrational, self fulfilling following - the desert religions ...

- you have hitler - i have moses ... they are one in the same.

 

[irosie91]

well, we would presume - you filled out the form if you are looking for it ... the form exists regardless.

moses is a liar the worst kind that has an irrational, self fulfilling following - the desert religions ...

- you have hitler - i have moses ... they are one in the same.

You have Hitler------and the easter bunny----THE SAME