What's a conservative way to address healthcare and insurance costs?

[Seymour Flops]

That does, however, bring up a good point. If you offered your doctor a cash deal for a subscription-based service with him for a set number of visits and agreed upon covered services, he would probably take it because he wouldn't have to wrangle with an insurance company or be told what he could and could not do for his patient. In an ideal world, you would then be free to buy a cheap catastrophic care plan to cover the big stuff.

That would work just fine.

A large provider, like Kelsey Seybold, is well fixed to do exactly that. Yet, I have ACA-compliant insurance that directs me to Kelsey-Seybold and get the same thing for more costs. Because instead of paying directly to Kelsey, my money gets churned through the insurance company, and the regulations it must comply with, so much of that money is lost.

 

[hadit]

That would work just fine.

A large provider, like Kelsey Seybold, is well fixed to do exactly that. Yet, I have ACA-compliant insurance that directs me to Kelsey-Seybold and get the same thing for more costs. Because instead of paying directly to Kelsey, my money gets churned through the insurance company, and the regulations it must comply with, so much of that money is lost.

As we introduce more moving parts into the system, more is lost along the way. At one point it was patient/doctor. Now it's patient/government/insurance company/doctor and every piece takes a bite out of what you pay. Not only that, but introduces restrictions on what they will pay for and what a doctor is allowed to do.

 

[Seymour Flops]

As we introduce more moving parts into the system, more is lost along the way. At one point it was patient/doctor. Now it's patient/government/insurance company/doctor and every piece takes a bite out of what you pay. Not only that, but introduces restrictions on what they will pay for and what a doctor is allowed to do.

Exactly. It was that way in the late sixties-early seventies for my family.

I got sick a couple of times as a kid, once had to get tubes put in my ears. Had tonsils nad adnoids out, which they did at the first sore throat in those days.

None of it broke my parents' bank.

 

[Mr Natural]

I got sick a couple of times as a kid, once had to get tubes put in my ears. Had tonsils nad adnoids out, which they did at the first sore throat in those days.

None of it broke my parents' bank.

Back in the day before insurance companies and corporate medicine took over.

 

[Seymour Flops]

Back in the day before insurance companies and corporate medicine took over.

Right.

We didn't have a lot of money. Maybe they had to make payments I don't know. They were not ones to whine about their finances, because they preferred hard work to sad lamentations.

But having to get a large medical bill once in a while is better than making payments every month forever and still having to pay for deductables and co-pays that make treatment just as expensive as it once was without insurance.

 

[dblack]

But having to get a large medical bill once in a while is better than making payments every month forever and still having to pay for deductables and co-pays that make treatment just as expensive as it once was without insurance.

People just don't understand this. Insurance doesn't make health care more affordable. It does the opposite. Insurance companies will never pay out more than than take in. Not for long anyway. That means we're paying more in the long run for health care when we try to finance it with insurance. So, the less we lean on insurance, the better.

Beyond that, insurance also impacts the market by driving health care inflation. Especially when we reach the critical point where most people are insured for most of their health care costs. At that point, people quit caring how much their health care costs (because they're not paying for it) and prices go up.

All of this is driven by the desire for free shit, the secret hope that the insurance game will somehow net us more than we pay in. Of course, that's delusional, but it's delusion that the insurance companies are happy to promote. We fell for it, and now the insurance industry has painted us into a corner that they're now trying to "solve" by promoting themselves as national utilities, with guaranteed, tax-payer funded profits.

 

[sealybobo]

Clearly the man thought so, since he cut it off.

The man goes to the emergency room, the hospital saves his life and bills him.

If they can reattach it, they will bill him for that.

What's wrong with that plan?

Sure but how much? I think if you are paying out of pocket, it shouldn't be $200K. $200K is what they charge the insurance company. I think out of pocket should be 10% of what insurance charges.

So fine. Charge him $20K.

 

[Seymour Flops]

Sure but how much? I think if you are paying out of pocket, it shouldn't be $200K. $200K is what they charge the insurance company. I think out of pocket should be 10% of what insurance charges.

So fine. Charge him $20K.

No, it should not and wound not be $200K

Insurance companies are charged much more for their customer's procedures. They gladly pay, because they are getting billions in tax dollars on the premise that medical treatment is cripplingly unaffordable without insurance so government has to subsidize it.

Suppose a guy loses his arm and has no insurance. He can pay 45,000 for the reattachment and if he hasn't got that much money, he can set up a payment plan. Or they can stop the bleeding, stitch him up, and he can explore options for prostetics later.

Hospitals would like providing care with an agreement to repay a lot better than the current system where people walk into an emergncy room and must be provided free treatment with no hope of the providers ever getting paid for it.

 

[Zincwarrior]

The $22 increase was what your boyfriend led with.

All the horror stories seem to be financial, problems caused by poor choices, such as not getting a job with employer-provided healthcare and not getting a health savings account or a flexible savings account. Too much of the health budget spent on "medicinal" marijuana . . .

Not people dying from not having health insurance. That isn't happening, unless you think bankruptcy is worse than death.

Now, these bankruptcies, they have occurred dozen years?

I know who is not dealing with bankruptcy? CEO's of health insurance providers. They are having billions pumped into their pockets taken from waitresses, mechanics, and janitors.

So you aren't American are you? Else you would know about Medical Bankruptcies.

 

[sealybobo]

No, it should not and wound not be $200K

View attachment 1197359

Insurance companies are charged much more for their customer's procedures. They gladly pay, because they are getting billions in tax dollars on the premise that medical treatment is cripplingly unaffordable without insurance so government has to subsidize it.

Suppose a guy loses his arm and has no insurance. He can pay 45,000 for the reattachment and if he hasn't got that much money, he can set up a payment plan. Or they can stop the bleeding, stitch him up, and he can explore options for prostetics later.

Hospitals would like providing care with an agreement to repay a lot better than the current system where people walk into an emergncy room and must be provided free treatment with no hope of the providers ever getting paid for it.

Less talk, more fixing healthcare. If Trump went after fixing healthcare like he went after illegals, imagine how great healthcare would be. You guys are in charge. Don't talk. Do. You're being judged in the midterms better get to solving shit pronto tonto.

 

[Seymour Flops]

So you aren't American are you? Else you would know about Medical Bankruptcies.

Born and raised in the Great State of Texas.

Yes, I know about medical bankruptcies due to poor or no health insurance. I talked about it in the post you are replying to:

Post in thread 'What's a conservative way to address healthcare and insurance costs?'

Dec 23, 2025

No dumbfuck. Medical bankruptcies are the worst stories. Pathetic vermin.

The $22 increase was what your boyfriend led with.

All the horror stories seem to be financial, problems caused by poor choices, such as not getting a job with employer-provided healthcare and not getting a health savings account or a flexible savings account. Too much of the health budget spent on "medicinal" marijuana . . .

Not people dying from not having health insurance. That isn't happening, unless you think bankruptcy is worse than death.

Now, these bankruptcies, they have occurred dozen years?

I...

• Seymour Flops

EDIT: My bad. I didn't ask the question correctly. Here is is again,

Have these medical bankruptcies happened in the last dozen years?

 

[Seymour Flops]

Less talk, more fixing healthcare. If Trump went after fixing healthcare like he went after illegals, imagine how great healthcare would be. You guys are in charge. Don't talk. Do. You're being judged in the midterms better get to solving shit pronto tonto.

There is no way to fix healthcare and keep the ACA. So long as the media refuses to tell the truth about the ACA, there will never be the political will to get rid of it. Not for a generation, at least. We may have to see how bad it is actually going to be by then, to realize we have to get rid of it.

Best that can be done at this point is to curb the worst excesses - like waitresses, janitors and mechanics paying for the healtcare of millionaire artists and entrepreneurs.

 

[Zincwarrior]

Born and raised in the Great State of Texas.

Yes, I know about medical bankruptcies due to poor or no health insurance. I talked about it in the post you are replying to:

Post in thread 'What's a conservative way to address healthcare and insurance costs?'

Dec 23, 2025

No dumbfuck. Medical bankruptcies are the worst stories. Pathetic vermin.

The $22 increase was what your boyfriend led with.

All the horror stories seem to be financial, problems caused by poor choices, such as not getting a job with employer-provided healthcare and not getting a health savings account or a flexible savings account. Too much of the health budget spent on "medicinal" marijuana . . .

Not people dying from not having health insurance. That isn't happening, unless you think bankruptcy is worse than death.

Now, these bankruptcies, they have occurred dozen years?

I...

• Seymour Flops

EDIT: My bad. I didn't ask the question correctly. Here is is again,

Have these medical bankruptcies happened in the last dozen years?

So you should SHUT The **** UPyou supposed Texan.

I live in Central Texas and am wiling to discuss it in person at an array of shooting competitions. Be aware, they know me
They don't know you
. *****.

 

[Seymour Flops]

So you should SHUT The **** UPyou supposed Texan.

I live in Central Texas and am wiling to discuss it in person at an array of shooting competitions. Be aware, they know me
They don't know you
. *****.

That's a wildly inappropriate response, I must say.

I live in the Houston area, and I usually shoot my guns at a little outdoor range in the Liberty area. I like it becuase they have a shotgun range, for shooting close in targets rather than skeet. Well really no targets for the shotguns, just a high berm that you can fire into.

But none of that has anything to do with the civilized debate we were engaged in until a moment ago.

To answer the question I posed to you:

Obamacare is a failure.

But the name Obama is sacred, and he is one of the few senior Democrats not yet tainted by the Epstein debacle. So "his" plan (really Mitt Romney's and Jonathan Gruber's) is currently the third rail of politics. Once people realize how much more often they are being run over by the train than they are riding it, Obamacare will die an ignoble death.

 

[WorldWatcher]

.

 

[Zincwarrior]

That's a wildly inappropriate response, I must say.

I live in the Houston area, and I usually shoot my guns at a little outdoor range in the Liberty area. I like it becuase they have a shotgun range, for shooting close in targets rather than skeet. Well really no targets for the shotguns, just a high berm that you can fire into.

But none of that has anything to do with the civilized debate we were engaged in until a moment ago.

To answer the question I posed to you:

View attachment 1197378

Obamacare is a failure.

But the name Obama is sacred, and he is one of the few senior Democrats not yet tainted by the Epstein debacle. So "his" plan (really Mitt Romney's and Jonathan Gruber's) is currently the third rail of politics. Once people realize how much more often they are being run over by the train than they are riding it, Obamacare will die an ignoble death.

Liberty Hill is 200 miles from Houston.

 

[Seymour Flops]

Liberty Hill is 200 miles from Houston.

Liberty Hill? Never heard of it. I said Liberty.

Are you okay?

 

[sealybobo]

There is no way to fix healthcare and keep the ACA. So long as the media refuses to tell the truth about the ACA, there will never be the political will to get rid of it. Not for a generation, at least. We may have to see how bad it is actually going to be by then, to realize we have to get rid of it.

Best that can be done at this point is to curb the worst excesses - like waitresses, janitors and mechanics paying for the healtcare of millionaire artists and entrepreneurs.

Then replace it. Trump's been saying he has a replacement for 10 years. Every time he says it he says give him 2 weeks. But he never comes out with anything. It's because he's completely full of shit.

You middle class Republicans need to wise up. 30 years ago the rich had 30 million and we had $100K. Today they have $1 billion and you have $200K. One million doesn't mean what it used to. And costs have gone up. But the people deciding at the top don't dare re tweek our economic system so that it's fair and works for all.

Elon Musk is widely considered on track to become the world's first trillionaire

Maybe one day the masses, YOU, will wake up.

This is as simple as I can put it.

 

[sealybobo]

There is no way to fix healthcare and keep the ACA. So long as the media refuses to tell the truth about the ACA, there will never be the political will to get rid of it. Not for a generation, at least. We may have to see how bad it is actually going to be by then, to realize we have to get rid of it.

Best that can be done at this point is to curb the worst excesses - like waitresses, janitors and mechanics paying for the healtcare of millionaire artists and entrepreneurs.

Republicans are such flip floppers. When a Dem is POTUS, they make one argument. When a GOP, they change their arguments. For example you guys love to say the wealth gap went up on Clinton, Obama and Biden's watch too. But when a GOP is president, you don't dare. In fact your policies cause the gap to widen. Don't make me list all of them.

Anyways, here is something from last year. It's been going on for decades. You don't believe the rich have waged class warfare on us? You don't think the rich have taken over our government and it's not doing us any favors? We are labor. Labor is a cost to them. Trump included.

Under Biden I pointed out From 2019 to 2022, the median net worth of American families jumped 37% to $192,900, after adjusting for inflation. It’s the largest increase ever recorded by the federal Survey of Consumer Finances, released last fall. Surging home values and rising stock ownership fed the surge.

Something Trump will not be able to boast unless his tariff causing inflation raises prices on homes too. Right now homes are down. The market is not good. Trump takes credit for everything else why not this?

Then I went on to brag under Biden Average household net worth now tops $500,000 for Americans in their late 30s. For late-40-somethings, it exceeds $750,000. For 50-somethings, it reaches seven figures.

But then I always pointed out If you’re a 50-something and you’re not worth a cool $1 million, do not despair. Those numbers are averages, and the super-rich drive them waaaay up.

And YOU don't want our government to do anything about it. If they try, you'll cry class warfare which means you still don't realize they started it in 1978.

 

[sparky]

Less talk, more fixing healthcare. If Trump went after fixing healthcare like he went after illegals, imagine how great healthcare would be.

he did well negotiated w/big pharma using tariffs Sealy ~S~