Zone1 What makes Christianity different from other religions?

[SweetSue92]

The Catholic Church provided the Bible. Jesus gave the keys to Peter, the church, not to anyone who wants to interpret scripture on their own.

Well that's what they told you anyway, and since most Catholics don't read the Bible much if at all, I guess you're gonna go with that.

 

[SweetSue92]

Go back and read post #8. SweetSue92 claims that doing good works makes the atonement of Christ less effective. The gospel teaches that we will be judged according to our works and yes our salvation is conditional upon our choices we make. An unrepentant serial killer will not gain salvation into the kingdom of heaven. Also read post #1 where Votto accuses some of trying to earn their way to heaven by doing good works.

That is not what I said. It's not that good works make the atonement "less effective"; it's that they're not necessary for salvation.

The way you have it rendered, Jesus did okay with the atonement but needs a little help from us with our "good works".

That is blasphemous, actually.

 

[SweetSue92]

While true Jesus does not need our “help” for salvation, he does require our faith.

We must choose to believe in him, and follow the rules set forth by him and the Church. Like baptism, receiving the sacraments, etc. These are the normal means for people to be saved. Though circumstances may allow for exceptions, such as an elect who has not actually been baptized yet dying can still be saved.

Yes, Catholics and Mormons share that belief. Jesus was pretty cool but what have YOU done?

That's not the Gospel really

 

[Dragonlady]

Where do you come up with this nonsense?

You don’t need to be baptized at birth to be able to get buried on “consecrated ground”. Why would an baptized adult not be able to?

You need to re-read my post. I didn't say that adult baptism didn't count. I said that Catholics baptize babies, and Baptists don't baptize anyone until the are old enough to accept Jesus as your Lord and Saviour. While I agree it's nonsense, it's Catholic Church Dogma. I think "original sin" is nonsense too. The idea that we're punished for Eve eating the apple is ridiculous.

If you die before you're baptized, you cannot be buried on consecrated ground if you're Catholic. Catholic babies were baptized in HOSPITAL at birth, so that if they died, they could be buried in consecrated ground. Stillborn babies don't qualify for burial.

"The Roman Catholic view is that baptism is necessary for salvation and that it frees the recipient from original sin. Roman Catholic tradition teaches that unbaptized infants, not being freed from original sin, go to Limbo (Latin: limbus infantium), which is an afterlife condition distinct from Hell."

What Are the Requirements for A Catholic Baptism? - CatechismClass.com

What are the Requirements for a Catholic Baptism? Infant Baptisms and Adult Baptisms have different requirements. Godparents have separate guidelines as well.

www.catechismclass.com

 

[Dragonlady]

That is not what I said. It's not that good works make the atonement "less effective"; it's that they're not necessary for salvation.

The way you have it rendered, Jesus did okay with the atonement but needs a little help from us with our "good works".

That is blasphemous, actually.

Jesus said otherwise.

James 2:
17. Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

18. Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

You might also want to take a look at the parable of the Good Samaritan who despite being an "inferior", Jesus said was more righteous than the Pharisee who crossed by on the other side of the road. The DEED of the unbeliever was greater powerful than the faith of Pharisee.

This is why claims that the USA is a Christian nation, rings hollow while you're running a "mass deportation" program. Faith without deeds is DEAD.

 

[SweetSue92]

Jesus said otherwise.

James 2:
17. Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

18. Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

You might also want to take a look at the parable of the Good Samaritan who despite being an "inferior", Jesus said was more righteous than the Pharisee who crossed by on the other side of the road. The DEED of the unbeliever was greater powerful than the faith of Pharisee.

This is why claims that the USA is a Christian nation, rings hollow while you're running a "mass deportation" program. Faith without deeds is DEAD.

Faith will manifest in good works. Faith begin with good works though; good works are evidence of a healthy faith.

I am opposed to illegal immigration and yet have fed illegal immigrants using my own hands and money.

you? Or do you just complain about what the govt does?

 

[BreezeWood]

Ridiculous, Jesus said he would be with him in Paradise.

after accountability is achieved ... for both.

 

[BreezeWood]

Faith will manifest in good works.

not for faith in the desert bibles of forgeries and fallacies, as you prove resistance to the very teaching of jesus - to sin no more is simply the only way to enter heaven is the final judgement. no bibles required, the other tenant taught by jesus ...

the spoken religions are the only ones recognized by the heavens.

 

[Meriweather]

Well that's what they told you anyway, and since most Catholics don't read the Bible much if at all, I guess you're gonna go with that.

Catholics who attend Mass read through the Bible every three years. Those who attend daily Mass read through the Bible every year. And, then there are all those Bible study classes as well. I don't know who came up and spread the slander about Catholics not reading the Bible. It's ignorant.

 

[SweetSue92]

Catholics who attend Mass read through the Bible every three years. Those who attend daily Mass read through the Bible every year. And, then there are all those Bible study classes as well. I don't know who came up and spread the slander about Catholics not reading the Bible. It's ignorant.

What do you mean, "Read through the Bible" at Mass? Because it's read aloud? We do that too--we hear Scripture at church, but that's not what we consider "Bible reading", which is done at home

 

[Meriweather]

What do you mean, "Read through the Bible" at Mass? Because it's read aloud? We do that too--we hear Scripture at church, but that's not what we consider "Bible reading", which is done at home

We both teach. We do quite a bit of reading aloud at school. Have you ever told a class at the end of the period, "This, of course, does not matter. You must go and read it at home before it counts."

Recall that in early Christianity, many people did not know how to read, and there was not a lot of reading material readily available (due to the cost). The Catholic Church has always read through the entire Bible with the assembly.

How much scripture do you hear at your church each time you attend services? In Catholicism we hear/read one Old Testament reading; one Psalm; and then both a Gospel reading, and New Testament passage that is outside the Gospel (Acts, Letters, Revelation). Each of these readings encompass the same lesson that is taught throughout the Bible.

I do not know if the typical Catholic does this, but I do know many of us do. Before Mass we read through and study all of the readings. I know of someone who studies the next Sunday's readings every day of the week leading up to that Sunday. My own habit is to do this on Saturday, where I also listen to a homily that focuses on these readings before ever heading to church. After Mass, I listen to another homily covering these same readings, and plan on how I will specifically incorporate these lessons into my everyday life during the week. Throughout the week there are my own personal studies depending on where my interests and life takes me.

 

[theHawk]

Well that's what they told you anyway, and since most Catholics don't read the Bible much if at all, I guess you're gonna go with that.

Well the Bible says so itself, since you appear to be a sola Scriptura type.

 

[theHawk]

is is why claims that the USA is a Christian nation, rings hollow while you're running a "mass deportation" program. Faith without deeds is DEAD

What would make us a Christian nation? Allowing women to kill their unborn children? Promoting homosexuality and transgenderism?

 

[SweetSue92]

We both teach. We do quite a bit of reading aloud at school. Have you ever told a class at the end of the period, "This, of course, does not matter. You must go and read it at home before it counts."

That's called homework, or practice, and yes, it's valuable.

I want to reiterate that I have no beef with individual Catholics, many of whom love God and follow Jesus. I do have a big problem with some of their doctrines, which are just Biblically wrong.

 

[theHawk]

You need to re-read my post. I didn't say that adult baptism didn't count. I said that Catholics baptize babies, and Baptists don't baptize anyone until the are old enough to accept Jesus as your Lord and Saviour. While I agree it's nonsense, it's Catholic Church Dogma. I think "original sin" is nonsense too. The idea that we're punished for Eve eating the apple is ridiculous.

If you die before you're baptized, you cannot be buried on consecrated ground if you're Catholic. Catholic babies were baptized in HOSPITAL at birth, so that if they died, they could be buried in consecrated ground. Stillborn babies don't qualify for burial.

"The Roman Catholic view is that baptism is necessary for salvation and that it frees the recipient from original sin. Roman Catholic tradition teaches that unbaptized infants, not being freed from original sin, go to Limbo (Latin: limbus infantium), which is an afterlife condition distinct from Hell."

What Are the Requirements for A Catholic Baptism? - CatechismClass.com

What are the Requirements for a Catholic Baptism? Infant Baptisms and Adult Baptisms have different requirements. Godparents have separate guidelines as well.

www.catechismclass.com

You’re lying again. You said that Catholic Church won’t bury you on consecrated ground if you weren’t baptized at birth. That is 100% false.

Original sin was accepted by the entire early church. Only modern day quack churches like the Mormons reject original sin.

Yes, God punishes humans with generational sin. You may not like it, you may think it’s “unfair”, but it is the truth.

If you don’t believe in it, then why are all humans so sinful? There shouldn’t be anything at all preventing you from never sinning. Yet here you are, defending abortion (murder) and LGBTQ rights (homosexuality/adultery) all the time.

 

[SweetSue92]

You’re lying again. You said that Catholic Church won’t bury you on consecrated ground if you weren’t baptized at birth. That is 100% false.

Original sin was accepted by the entire early church. Only modern day quack churches like the Mormons reject original sin.

Yes, God punishes humans with generational sin. You may not like it, you may think it’s “unfair”, but it is the truth.

If you don’t believe in it, then why are all humans so sinful? There shouldn’t be anything at all preventing you from never sinning. Yet here you are, defending abortion (murder) and LGBTQ rights (homosexuality/adultery) all the time.

I believe there's a fellow Catholic in this very thread who said Original Sin is not a thing, or something like.

I mean, if you don't even get that, there is no reason whatsoever for Jesus to have been born (and died) in the first place.

 

[Paradoxical#1]

The Jews believed God came to them, too, in their Most Holy Place, though periodically and through a select few. They tried to differentiate themselves from the polytheistic religions all around them, though failed. They struggled with their monotheism.

Christianity is a much cleaner departure, repudiating even Judaism.

Jesus never once repudiated Judaism. Only Paul did that.

 

[theHawk]

I believe there's a fellow Catholic in this very thread who said Original Sin is not a thing, or something like.

I mean, if you don't even get that, there is no reason whatsoever for Jesus to have been born (and died) in the first place.

Then he isn’t a real Catholic.

 

[Paradoxical#1]

You’re lying again. You said that Catholic Church won’t bury you on consecrated ground if you weren’t baptized at birth. That is 100% false.

Original sin was accepted by the entire early church. Only modern day quack churches like the Mormons reject original sin.

Yes, God punishes humans with generational sin. You may not like it, you may think it’s “unfair”, but it is the truth.

If you don’t believe in it, then why are all humans so sinful? There shouldn’t be anything at all preventing you from never sinning. Yet here you are, defending abortion (murder) and LGBTQ rights (homosexuality/adultery) all the time.

Convince people there is something wrong with them, and you have the cure, and a cult.

 

[SweetSue92]

Jesus never once repudiated Judaism. Only Paul did that.

Well he rather did, everytime he excoriated the Pharisees. It wasn't an attack on Judaism as a whole, which would be strange, since Jesus Himself was Jewish. But an attack on being stuck in a rut in your own faith