What are libertarians?

[rightwinger]

Taxes are the price we pay for a civilized society.

Oliver Wendell Holmes

Gotcha, if I want roads, then you can take my money and spend it for yourself, I'm just selfish. LOL, you're a tool.

Actually, yes. That is the way it works

And that is why a libertarian society is an anarchist society

 

[kaz]

If you believe the FDA should be abolished, you might be a libertarian.

If you believe the FAA should not exist, you might be a libertarian.

If you believe crack cocaine should be legal, you might be a libertarian.

If you believe the US military should be shrunk down to the size of a cub scout troop, you might be a libertarian.

If you believe all roads should be privatized, you might be a libertarian.

If you believe all federal safety regulations should be abolished, you might be a libertarian.

If you believe all child labor laws should be repealed, you might be a libertarian.

If you believe all insider trading and financial fraud regulations should be abrogated, you might be a libertarian.

If you believe human beings will be on their best behavior if there are no rules and regulations, you might be a libertarian.

If you believe "I got mine, screw everyone else", you might be a libertarian

Strawman

Like many libertarians, you have an unrealistic view on the role of government. Your view of government and freedom is fueled by emotion rather than critical thinking. The fact that you do not see the danger of private industry controlling our healthcare system and other essential services is kind of scary. The fact that you do not understand the importance of regulation and taxation is bewildering.

Just because a very limited government sounds good on paper, it doesn't mean it is what this country needs.

LOL, you call me emotional, then cry the rest of the post about having to do things yourself instead of government doing it for you. Liberals are just hysterical.

 

[whitehall]

If libertarians were both socially and fiscally conservative and serious about small government they would have joined the Tea Party movement which is a realistic approach to their goals. 3rd party politics is doomed to failure and everyone knows it. There may be hard core libertarians left but the main libertarian movement has been hijacked by pot heads and dirty tricks lefties who want to syphon votes from the republican party.

 

[kaz]

No true Scotsman time.

Strawman time

And we don't like it when you create them.

Playground! Nice retort.

BTW, you may want to Google what a true scotsman fallacy is since you obviously have no idea. It didn't even make sense.

I do know. I also know that it's quite a farce as you try to pretend that you are a representation of all Libertarians.

OK, go to my original post, then click on my link where I define libertarians, then turn red as a beet as the lazy, idiotic dick that you are for posting crap regarding a link you didn't click on and read in the OP post. LOL, liberals, I don't know if you're dumber or lazier. It's not an easy call.

Actually, since I know you're still going to be too butt lazy to go back and actually read the post you are commenting on over and over, here's the first paragraph

Liberals like to say they don't know what a small government libertarian is. I believe it's pretty clear. No, we are not all the same, but I think when I talk to small government libertarians these are generally agreed upon. Please comment those of you who consider yourself small government libertarian on what you agree and disagree on.

I'm guessing you still don't get it, do you wench?

 

[kaz]

Taxes are the price we pay for a civilized society.

Oliver Wendell Holmes

Gotcha, if I want roads, then you can take my money and spend it for yourself, I'm just selfish. LOL, you're a tool.

Actually, yes. That is the way it works

And that is why a libertarian society is an anarchist society

No matter how it works, I want money I earned, you want money you did not earn. You are the selfish one. Voting doesn't change that. Sorry, Big Guy.

 

[g5000]

So you think we're anarchists, why didn't you vote that?

Not all libertarians are anarchists, but quite a few are.

Try reading my original post and the poll since I specifically addressed that.

I always enjoy posts from people who didn't read the thread subject and then insist on demonstrating that. Thanks!

You are the one who created the straw man fallacy by claiming I think all libertarians are anarchists, and now you are butt hurt that I reject your straw man? BWA-HA-HA-HA!

I always enjoy posts from people who didn't read my posts and then insist on demonstrating that.


My posts have been quite accurate. I have given specific beliefs of libertarians. Legalized crack cocaine, no FAA, no FDA, no child labor laws, etc.

Rather than make the stupid mistake of trying to define "libertarian" with other words which will also require definitions ("anarchists", "liberals", "conservatives", etc), it is better to define libertarians by their beliefs, which is what I have done.

Then you came along and invented a story that I believe libertarians are anarchists!!!

Apparently you straw manned yourself when you said things anarchists think and small government libertarians don't.

Well, it appears YOU have no idea what libertarians believe. I have supported each and every one of those libertarian beliefs with evidence in the past on this forum.

So allow me to educate you as to what libertarians believe below.


Everyone knows libertarians are opposed to gun control:

We oppose all laws at any level of government requiring registration of, or restricting, the ownership, manufacture, or transfer or sale of firearms or ammunition.

Source: https://www.lp.org/files/LP Platform 2012.pdf





I mentioned the repeal of child labor laws:

We support repeal of laws that impede the ability of any person to find employment, such as minimum wage laws, so-called "protective" labor legislation for women and children, & governmental restrictions on the establishment of private day-care centers. We deplore government-fostered forced retirement, which robs the elderly of the right to work. We oppose all government welfare, relief projects, and "aid to the poor" programs.

No labor laws, no Social Security, no Medicare, no food stamps, etc.

Source: Libertarian Party on Jobs





I mentioned abolish the FDA:

We should replace harmful government agencies like the Food & Drug Administration (FDA) with more agile, free-market alternatives.

Source: Healthcare | Libertarian Party






I said shrink the military down to the size of a cub scout troop:

If the US were to pursue a policy of defending its own borders while avoiding foreign intervention, we could realistically reduce our defense budget to as little as $125 billion over the next five years.

Shrink our military to one eighth its current size.

Source: Libertarian Party on Defense






I said legalize crack cocaine:

We favor the repeal of all laws creating "crimes" without victims, such as the use of drugs for medicinal or recreational purposes.

Source: Platform | Libertarian Party




It is also well known that libertarians would abolish the Federal Reserve:
Eliminate the Federal Reserve: End the Fed






The elimination of safety regulations:

Pollution of other people's property is a violation of individual rights. Strict liability, not arbitrary government standards, should regulate pollution. We demand the abolition of the Environmental Protection Agency.

No environmental regulations. Source: Libertarian Party on Environment





More on the elimination of safety regulations:

We call for the repeal of the Occupational Safety and Health Act. This law denies the right to liberty and property to both employer and employee, and it interferes in their private contractual relations.

Source: National Platform of the Libertarian Party



More on safety regulations:

We oppose all so-called "consumer protection" legislation which infringes upon voluntary trade, and call for the abolition of the Consumer Product Safety Commission.

Source: 1972 Libertarian Party Platform - LPedia




I said abolish the FAA:

We advocate the abolition of the Federal Aviation Administration, which has jeopardized safety by arrogating to itself a monopoly of safety regulation and enforcement. We call for privatizing the air traffic control system and transferring the FAA's other functions to private agencies.

Source: 1992 National Platform of the Libertarian Party




The FDA again:

We advocate the abolition of the Food and Drug Administration and particularly its policies of mandating specific nutritional requirements and denying the right of manufacturers to make non-fraudulent claims concerning their products.

Source: 1992 National Platform of the Libertarian Party

 

[Disir]

No true Scotsman time.

Strawman time

And we don't like it when you create them.

Playground! Nice retort.

BTW, you may want to Google what a true scotsman fallacy is since you obviously have no idea. It didn't even make sense.

I do know. I also know that it's quite a farce as you try to pretend that you are a representation of all Libertarians.

OK, go to my original post, then click on my link where I define libertarians, then turn red as a beet as the lazy, idiotic dick that you are for posting crap regarding a link you didn't click on and read in the OP post. LOL, liberals, I don't know if you're dumber or lazier. It's not an easy call.

Actually, since I know you're still going to be too butt lazy to go back and actually read the post you are commenting on over and over, here's the first paragraph

Liberals like to say they don't know what a small government libertarian is. I believe it's pretty clear. No, we are not all the same, but I think when I talk to small government libertarians these are generally agreed upon. Please comment those of you who consider yourself small government libertarian on what you agree and disagree on.

I'm guessing you still don't get it, do you wench?

I get it just fine. You wanted to create a thread all about you. So, you have. Just like your last one.

Generally agreed on beliefs and those damn details. I understand perfectly, twit.

 

[kaz]

If libertarians were both socially and fiscally conservative and serious about small government they would have joined the Tea Party movement which is a realistic approach to their goals. 3rd party politics is doomed to failure and everyone knows it. There may be hard core libertarians left but the main libertarian movement has been hijacked by pot heads and dirty tricks lefties who want to syphon votes from the republican party.

We're socially conservative? We think drugs, prostitution, gambling and other morality laws should be repealed as it's not government's role to enforce morality. We think gay sex as sodomy laws should be repealed. We are mostly pro-choice. What are you talking about socially conservative?

Why should we join the tea party? They are not small government, they just want to put a dent in the growth of what we have, they do not want to transform government to what it was meant to be and should be.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

I am a small government libertarian. Here is how I defined it already.

What is a small government libertarian US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum

Yet, I'm still regularly called a liberal, a conservative, an anarchist. So what am I? What say you? What are small government libertarians really?

You are called all those things because a good chunk of this board are extreme idiots and anything that you believe that differs from their narrow minded view makes you the enemy regardless of reality. I've been called a liberal among other things. When it happens I just laugh the stupidity off. It seems passing judgment on your own "perceived" party is a sin on USMB.
Besides, what other people "think" you are is pretty meaningless. I didn't answer your poll because I don't know you well enough & even if I did it's not my position to judge you. When we agree, we agree. When we dont, we don't.

 

[kaz]

What you said.

I do know. I also know that it's quite a farce as you try to pretend that you are a representation of all Libertarians.

Please comment those of you who consider yourself small government libertarian on what you agree and disagree on.

I'm guessing you still don't get it, do you wench?

I get it just fine. You wanted to create a thread all about you. So, you have. Just like your last one.

Generally agree on beliefs and those damn details. I understand perfectly, twit.

LOL, you said I speak for all libertarians, I showed you what I actually said and you claim you get it? Obviously not, dumb bimbo. I hope you're hot, you're not making a living except on your back.

 

[Disir]

So you think we're anarchists, why didn't you vote that?

Not all libertarians are anarchists, but quite a few are.

Try reading my original post and the poll since I specifically addressed that.

I always enjoy posts from people who didn't read the thread subject and then insist on demonstrating that. Thanks!

You are the one who created the straw man fallacy by claiming I think all libertarians are anarchists, and now you are butt hurt that I reject your straw man? BWA-HA-HA-HA!

I always enjoy posts from people who didn't read my posts and then insist on demonstrating that.


My posts have been quite accurate. I have given specific beliefs of libertarians. Legalized crack cocaine, no FAA, no FDA, no child labor laws, etc.

Rather than make the stupid mistake of trying to define "libertarian" with other words which will also require definitions ("anarchists", "liberals", "conservatives", etc), it is better to define libertarians by their beliefs, which is what I have done.

Then you came along and invented a story that I believe libertarians are anarchists!!!

Apparently you straw manned yourself when you said things anarchists think and small government libertarians don't.

Well, it appears YOU have no idea what libertarians believe. I have supported each and every one of those libertarian beliefs with evidence in the past on this forum.

So allow me to educate you as to what libertarians believe below.


Everyone knows libertarians are opposed to gun control:

We oppose all laws at any level of government requiring registration of, or restricting, the ownership, manufacture, or transfer or sale of firearms or ammunition.

Source: https://www.lp.org/files/LP Platform 2012.pdf



I mentioned the repeal of child labor laws:

We support repeal of laws that impede the ability of any person to find employment, such as minimum wage laws, so-called "protective" labor legislation for women and children, & governmental restrictions on the establishment of private day-care centers. We deplore government-fostered forced retirement, which robs the elderly of the right to work. We oppose all government welfare, relief projects, and "aid to the poor" programs.

No labor laws, no Social Security, no Medicare, no food stamps, etc.

Source: Libertarian Party on Jobs



I mentioned abolish the FDA:

We should replace harmful government agencies like the Food & Drug Administration (FDA) with more agile, free-market alternatives.

Source: Healthcare | Libertarian Party






I said shrink the military down to the size of a cub scout troop:

If the US were to pursue a policy of defending its own borders while avoiding foreign intervention, we could realistically reduce our defense budget to as little as $125 billion over the next five years.

Shrink our military to one eighth its current size.

Source: Libertarian Party on Defense





I said legalize crack cocaine:

We favor the repeal of all laws creating "crimes" without victims, such as the use of drugs for medicinal or recreational purposes.

Source: Platform | Libertarian Party


It is also well known that libertarians would abolish the Federal Reserve:
Eliminate the Federal Reserve: End the Fed





The elimination of safety regulations:

Pollution of other people's property is a violation of individual rights. Strict liability, not arbitrary government standards, should regulate pollution. We demand the abolition of the Environmental Protection Agency.

No environmental regulations. Source: Libertarian Party on Environment



More on the elimination of safety regulations:

We call for the repeal of the Occupational Safety and Health Act. This law denies the right to liberty and property to both employer and employee, and it interferes in their private contractual relations.

Source: National Platform of the Libertarian Party



More on safety regulations:

We oppose all so-called "consumer protection" legislation which infringes upon voluntary trade, and call for the abolition of the Consumer Product Safety Commission.

Source: 1972 Libertarian Party Platform - LPedia




I said abolish the FAA:

We advocate the abolition of the Federal Aviation Administration, which has jeopardized safety by arrogating to itself a monopoly of safety regulation and enforcement. We call for privatizing the air traffic control system and transferring the FAA's other functions to private agencies.

Source: 1992 National Platform of the Libertarian Party


The FDA again:

We advocate the abolition of the Food and Drug Administration and particularly its policies of mandating specific nutritional requirements and denying the right of manufacturers to make non-fraudulent claims concerning their products.

Source: 1992 National Platform of the Libertarian Party

Do NOT ever let the facts get in the way there. Ever.

 

[kaz]

I am a small government libertarian. Here is how I defined it already.

What is a small government libertarian US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum

Yet, I'm still regularly called a liberal, a conservative, an anarchist. So what am I? What say you? What are small government libertarians really?

You are called all those things because a good chunk of this board are extreme idiots and anything that you believe that differs from their narrow minded view makes you the enemy regardless of reality. I've been called a liberal among other things. When it happens I just laugh the stupidity off. It seems passing judgment on your own "perceived" party is a sin on USMB.
Besides, what other people "think" you are is pretty meaningless. I didn't answer your poll because I don't know you well enough & even if I did it's not my position to judge you. When we agree, we agree. When we dont, we don't.

It's not about caring about what they think, it's getting it out for the discussion, I think it's interesting. But thanks for the comments.

 

[rightwinger]

Taxes are the price we pay for a civilized society.

Oliver Wendell Holmes

Gotcha, if I want roads, then you can take my money and spend it for yourself, I'm just selfish. LOL, you're a tool.

Actually, yes. That is the way it works

And that is why a libertarian society is an anarchist society

No matter how it works, I want money I earned, you want money you did not earn. You are the selfish one. Voting doesn't change that. Sorry, Big Guy.

Taxes are the price we pay for a civilized society.
Oliver Wendell Holmes

Like it or not, you belong to a society. As a member of a society, you get a say in how that society is run. Some of the things decided by that society you will agree with. others you will not

Libertarians believe that society does not apply to them

 

[Disir]

What you said.

I do know. I also know that it's quite a farce as you try to pretend that you are a representation of all Libertarians.

Please comment those of you who consider yourself small government libertarian on what you agree and disagree on.

I'm guessing you still don't get it, do you wench?

I get it just fine. You wanted to create a thread all about you. So, you have. Just like your last one.

Generally agree on beliefs and those damn details. I understand perfectly, twit.

LOL, you said I speak for all libertarians, I showed you what I actually said and you claim you get it? Obviously not, dumb bimbo. I hope you're hot, you're not making a living except on your back.

You arrogant ignorant douche bag. The only thing I'm seeing is you spin shit.

 

[g5000]

So, Kaz, it appears you have been calling yourself a "libertarian" without a clue as to what a libertarian is. This is why it is stupid to try to define a belief system by using other terms like "liberal" or "conservative" or "anarchist" which also require definition.

Now that I have taught you what libertarians actually believe, perhaps you will reconsider whether or not you are worthy of the label.

This is what I meant when I said a Gadsden flag, a one-tenth ownership of a Bitcoin, a five gallon bucket of hoarded ammo, and some weed do not a libertarian make.

 

[Disir]

Hmmm.........Kaz was spanked by G5000 in the first 3 pages.

Well done.

 

[kaz]

Not all libertarians are anarchists, but quite a few are.

Try reading my original post and the poll since I specifically addressed that.

I always enjoy posts from people who didn't read the thread subject and then insist on demonstrating that. Thanks!

Well, it appears YOU have no idea what libertarians believe. I have supported each and every one of those libertarian beliefs with evidence in the past on this forum.

So allow me to educate you as to what libertarians believe below.[/QUOTE]

I didn't say I disagreed with every point you made. However, your argument is based on that if you can find any libertarian who thinks it, then every libertarian must think it. Some of the things you listed are anarchists. And I never said I am a capital L Libertarian Party member, I said I am a small government libertarian. If you read my thread, I got general agreement from other small government libertarians on how I defined it.

The Libertarian Party is better than the Republican or Democrat parties, but they are sadly more party than libertarian and they have endless litmus tests. Their last two candidates were not even libertarian, they are just devolving into attention whores who want to affect elections rather than advance actual small government ideology.

 

[kaz]

Hmmm.........Kaz was spanked by G5000 in the first 3 pages.

Well done.

As determined by a serving wench who can't or won't even read? LOL, I'll give that all due consideration.

 

[kaz]

So, Kaz, it appears you have been calling yourself a "libertarian" without a clue as to what a libertarian is. This is why it is stupid to try to define a belief system by using other terms like "liberal" or "conservative" or "anarchist" which also require definition.

Now that I have taught you what libertarians actually believe, perhaps you will reconsider whether or not you are worthy of the label.

This is what I meant when I said a Gadsden flag, a one-tenth ownership of a Bitcoin, a five gallon bucket of hoarded ammo, and some weed do not a libertarian make.

Now you're just being an ass

 

[kaz]

What you said.

I do know. I also know that it's quite a farce as you try to pretend that you are a representation of all Libertarians.

Please comment those of you who consider yourself small government libertarian on what you agree and disagree on.

I'm guessing you still don't get it, do you wench?

I get it just fine. You wanted to create a thread all about you. So, you have. Just like your last one.

Generally agree on beliefs and those damn details. I understand perfectly, twit.

LOL, you said I speak for all libertarians, I showed you what I actually said and you claim you get it? Obviously not, dumb bimbo. I hope you're hot, you're not making a living except on your back.

You arrogant ignorant douche bag. The only thing I'm seeing is you spin shit.

You started with the lie I am speaking for all small government libertarians. When I showed you that was factually wrong, not just unsupported you wouldn't woman up to admitting that. Your bias reeks.