Were the Confederates traitors

[Zincwarrior]

Yes, I got that. Slavery was legal. The South was doing nothing wrong. The South was not traitor.

But I am asking you if the North, who had slaves long before the War Between The States, ever murdered, or raped, or sold them?

Quantrill

I will restate, at the time of the Civil War only these states had slavery: Alabama, Arkansas, Delaware, Florida, Georgia, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maryland, Mississippi, Missouri, North Carolina, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas, and Virginia.

Then the vast majority of those seceded, and then one bombed a US military facility, just as the Mexicans did, and later the Japanese did. All three lost.

 

[Quantrill]

They bombed Fort Sumter.

Only in your mind.

After the North moved it's troops and arms concerning the forts during the negotiations, which was an act of war. After the North sent the Star of the Werst to reinforce Sumter with arms and men, which was an act of war. The North povoked and started the War.

Quantrill

 

[0311]

Today, the political left considers the rebels who participated in the American Civil War—also known as the War Between the States—as traitors.

My opinion is that people think this way because they are not true Americans; they are imperialists. They believe in the right to rule and own other people.

Our country is different from most others in the world in that sovereignty does not rest in a king or a government, but in the people. In our country, the people are sovereign.

In the United States, the people are organized in two ways: by states and as a collection of states forming a nation. The nation itself is sovereign. The government of the United States is sovereign because it derives its sovereignty from the people.

Likewise, the people of each state are sovereign, and the state governments are sovereign because they also derive their authority from the people.

I believe—though I’m likely in the minority—that the treason clause in the Constitution refers to individuals, not states. After all, the Founders did the same thing with the Declaration of Independence, and I don't believe they saw themselves as traitors. For the Declaration to be accepted, it had to be ratified by a majority of the states—each a sovereign unit. States cannot commit treason because they are sovereign, and the Founders, acting as agents of those sovereign states, were not traitors. I don't think the Founders saw themselves as traitors.

Likewise, the individuals who voted for secession were not traitors, because as a collective—acting as sovereign states—they were exercising a sovereign right.

You can’t be a traitor against yourself.

As a Son of the South, yes they were traitors Lee should have been hung.

 

[Quantrill]

I will restate, at the time of the Civil War only these states had slavery: Alabama, Arkansas, Delaware, Florida, Georgia, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maryland, Mississippi, Missouri, North Carolina, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas, and Virginia.

Then the vast majority of those seceded, and then one bombed a US military facility, just as the Mexicans did, and later the Japanese did. All three lost.

Yes, but what about New Jersey?

And again, the North had slaves long before the War Between The States. Did they rape, murder, and sell those slaves? Please answer.

Quantrill

 

[Zincwarrior]

After the North moved it's troops and arms concerning the forts during the negotiations, which was an act of war.

The US troops were already in the US fortress on US territory. The CSA attacked them, and the US ate their ass for it.

 

[Zincwarrior]

Yes, but what about New Jersey?

And again, the North had slaves long before the War Between The States. Did they rape, murder, and sell those slaves? Please answer.

Quantrill

I did multiple times. At the time of the Civil War only these states legally had slavery:
Alabama, Arkansas, Delaware, Florida, Georgia, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maryland, Mississippi, Missouri, North Carolina, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas, and Virginia.

Note, NO NON SLAVE OWNING STATE SECEDED.

 

[Quantrill]

The US troops were already in the US fortress on US territory. The CSA attacked them, and the US ate their ass for it.

No troops were at Sumter. Anderson moved his trops to Sumter. And act of war.

Quantrill

 

[Zincwarrior]

No troops were at Sumter. Anderson moved his trops to Sumter. And act of war.

Quantrill

US property. The CSA attacked US troops. You don't get to say your guys were innocent when they were the ones who literally started the killing.

 

[Quantrill]

I did multiple times. At the time of the Civil War only these states legally had slavery:
Alabama, Arkansas, Delaware, Florida, Georgia, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maryland, Mississippi, Missouri, North Carolina, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas, and Virginia.

Note, NO NON SLAVE OWNING STATE SECEDED.

Are you saying New Jersey didn't have slaves at the time of and during the War Between The States?

Quantrill

 

[Quantrill]

US property. The CSA attacked US troops. You don't get to say your guys were innocent when they were the ones who literally started the killing.

Once South Carolin seceded that property went back to South Carolina. The North started the War.

Quantrill

 

[Zincwarrior]

Are you saying New Jersey didn't have slaves at the time of and during the War Between The States?

Quantrill

The abolition of Slavery Law was passed in 1804. New Jersey did not secede. New Jersey did not join the CSA. New Jersey forces did not attempt to murder US troops.

 

[Quantrill]

The abolition of Slavery Law was passed in 1804. New Jersey did not secede. New Jersey did not join the CSA. New Jersey forces did not attempt to murder US troops.

Why are you scared to answer the question. Did New Jersey have slaves at the start of and during the War Between The States?

And did those yankee slave holders rape, murder, and sell their slaves?

Quantrill

 

[Zincwarrior]

Why are you scared to answer the question. Did New Jersey have slaves at the start of and during the War Between The States?

And did those yankee slave holders rape, murder, and sell their slaves?

Quantrill

I see what you are asking now. Yes, there were still slaves in New Jersey, although the practice had been effectively deadlined. Like Kentucky and Maryland, New Jersey did not secede, join the CSA, or murder US troops.

 

[Unkotare]

W

Yes, there has always been a difference of people in the North and South. During the making of the Constitiution in 1787 both sides would claim this. The people were different, their interests were different. And slavery would be the issue that both centered on that proved those differences.

The North, especially that New England bunch, always feared the growth of territories. They knew that new states would be carved out of them. They knew that these new states would not have the same interests as New England. In other words they would lose control.

War was the only recourse for New England. They must conquer the South and dictate who would be new states in the west. Power, money, control. Slavery was just the WMD of the day. And so they did.

But whatever happens, make sure the South fires the first shot, that way we, the North, can sit on our righteous throne as the good people defending the flag and freedom. Glory, glory...hallelujah.

Quantrill

What a load of horse shit!

 

[Unkotare]

No the South chose peaceable secession. The North chose war. As I have proved.

Quantrill

You haven’t proven anything, you ignorant wannabe.

 

[Unkotare]

After the North moved it's troops and arms concerning the forts during the negotiations, which was an act of war. After the North sent the Star of the Werst to reinforce Sumter with arms and men, which was an act of war. The North povoked and started the War.

Quantrill

Horse shit.

 

[Unkotare]

Once South Carolin seceded that property went back to South Carolina. The North started the War.

Quantrill

Horse shit

 

[Quantrill]

I see what you are asking now. Yes, there were still slaves in New Jersey, although the practice had been effectively deadlined. Like Kentucky and Maryland, New Jersey did not secede, join the CSA, or murder US troops.

That they did not secede is immaterial. The oh so righteous north had slaves, my oh my. And, did those righteous yankee slave holders rape and murder and sell their slaves? Or was it just the Southern slave holders who raped and murdered and sold their slaves, as you claim.

Quantrill

 

[Unkotare]

That they did not secede is immaterial. The oh so righteous north had slaves, my oh my. And, did those righteous yankee slave holders rape and murder and sell their slaves? Or was it just the Southern slave holders who raped and murdered and sold their slaves, as you claim.

Quantrill

You know you have lost this argument, and you are falling apart.

 

[Zincwarrior]

That they did not secede is immaterial. The oh so righteous north had slaves, my oh my. And, did those righteous yankee slave holders rape and murder and sell their slaves? Or was it just the Southern slave holders who raped and murdered and sold their slaves, as you claim.

Quantrill

They were traitors. They killed Americans to keep the wealthy with slaves. They lost. The slaves were freed. Only crackers in low rent states living in trailers contest this still. Its embarrassing. The entire country thinks you are sad.