Thanks for the OP. I agree 100%. One piece of advice, the OP is too long and will not be successful in people reading it all (especially those that oppose the information)It gets old, the attacks from the right who accuse we Democrats of 'hating America' because we back Boasberg. 'You support terrorists', they keep shouting. The reply is 'no, we support due process'. Without it, we lose our republic, so it is out of LOVE for America that we back the judge, for all he is interested is that those souls get a fair hearing, so that the innocent aren't sent to some prison where their hope of freedom will be lost, probably in a hellish place for a long long time. Consider this story, which emboldens our case for 'due process'.
So it has happened that the Trump administration, that erstwhile bastion of misrule, embarked on a ruthless campaign to uproot hundreds of Venezuelan migrants scattered across this vast land. They did so with the stealth of a jackal, executing deportations without notice or the dignity of due process. These unfortunate souls were dispatched to the unforgiving confines of a prison in El Salvador--a fate as ironic as it is tragic. Now, the curtain is finally lifting on the evidence marshaled against these exiles, and it is nothing short of preposterous.
Take, for instance, the case of Jerce Reyes Barrios, a professional soccer player--yes, a player who fled the suffocating grip of dictator Nicolás Maduro in search of freedom, only to find himself ensnared by the very apparatus designed to protect him. Barrios had settled in the United States, eagerly awaiting an asylum hearing when ICE agents descended upon him like vultures. The accusation? That he was a member of the Tren de Aragua gang, a claim rooted not in hard evidence but in the flimsy fabric of xenophobic hysteria.
What, pray tell, constituted the evidence against Barrios? Two items, both laughable in their absurdity. First, a tattoo on his arm--an innocuous crown perched atop a soccer ball, allegedly emblematic of gang affiliation. The truth, as his attorney Linette Tobin clarifies, is that this tattoo is a tribute to the Real Madrid soccer team, a fact as lost on the powers that be as a whisper in a tempest. Secondly, there exists a photograph in which Barrios is gesturing with both hands--a gesture misconstrued by the ever-suspicious agents as a sign of gang allegiance. Yet, in the world of American Sign Language, this very gesture signifies “I love you,” or is often embraced as a symbol of rock 'n' roll.
Such grotesque misinterpretations seem to be a recurrent theme among those caught in this legislative nightmare. Consider another migrant, referred to as E.V., whose tattoos depict anime, flowers, and animals, yet were grotesquely rebranded as indicators of gang ties. According to his attorney, the crown adorning his skin is not a badge of criminality but a heartfelt homage to his late grandmother.
The Kafkaesque nature of this ordeal escalates as we delve into the tales of others similarly victimized. One, known as J.A.B.V., bore tattoos of a rose, a clock, and his son’s name--all benign symbols that ICE agents twisted into evidence of criminal affiliation. Despite having lived without a criminal record, he was nevertheless shipped away on the flimsiest of charges. L.G. endured a similar fate, his tattoos--one a rosary, another his partner’s name--branded as marks of gang loyalty. The absurdity reaches new heights with Anyelo Jose Sarabia, who was accused based on a tattoo of a Bible verse and a rose adorned with petals of money.
One cannot help but feel a twinge of irony: many of these individuals sought refuge from Tren de Aragua, only to be demonized as members of that very gang. A particularly poignant case involves an unnamed migrant who had applied for asylum, fleeing from the very harm he now faces, yet was unceremoniously deported while living in a New York homeless shelter with his family.
The administration seems to operate under a perverse presumption that any Venezuelan migrant bearing tattoos must be, by default, a member of Tren de Aragua, guilty until proven innocent--a condition that becomes impossible in the absence of due process. Trump’s invocation of the Alien Enemies Act of 1798, under the ludicrous belief it permits the expulsion of noncitizens without judicial oversight, exposes a shocking disdain for constitutional principles. The Department of Justice, ever the willing accomplice, hastens to bypass the courts, claiming that Trump’s decisions exist in a realm beyond judicial scrutiny.
This is not the first time such absurdity has reared its head. During Trump’s initial tenure, ICE made a habit of accusing noncitizens of gang membership based on little more than inked skin. A federal judge once accused ICE agents of perjury regarding the tattoos of a DACA recipient, ultimately liberating him from unlawful detention. The lesson learned, it seems, is that when afforded the privilege of due process, these victims can challenge the flimsy fabrications that the government spins around them. In response, the authorities have concocted new legal theories, intent on preventing judicial review of their actions.
The question remains: did ICE specifically target these men based on their tattoos, or were they rounded up first, with excuses fabricated later? These details warrant scrutiny, and soon the victims’ lawyers will be entitled to interrogate the architects of this dystopian scheme. What is essential now is that judges have the opportunity to sift through the so-called evidence, allowing the scales of justice to balance before this grotesque theater evolves into a full-scale assault on the constitutional rights of all immigrants.
As we observe this unfolding drama, one cannot help but wonder where the limits of absurdity lie in this creeping authoritarianism. In the grand tapestry of American governance, this chapter stands as a cautionary tale of a nation grappling with its conscience amid a cacophony of injustice. The time has come to demand accountability, lest we descend further into a quagmire of Trumpian madness and, yes, I'll say it, it needs to be said, it needs to be shouted on rooftops across America, TYRANNY.
I've been shouting a simple message since I joined this forum short while ago, it's called 'due process'. Some said the 'gang members' got DP, but, alas, I wouldn't trust ICE nor Trump to uphold 'due process', when Trump as literally defecated all over it, for some time, now.
As the delegates finalized the U.S. Constitution, Franklin, who was 81 years old at the time, exited the hall. According to historical accounts, a woman--often identified as Elizabeth Willing Powel, a well-known Philadelphia socialite and wife of Samuel Powel--approached Franklin and asked:
"Well, Doctor, what have we got? A republic or a monarchy?"
Franklin responded: "A republic, if you can keep it."
IF WE CAN KEEP IT.
I'd like to know who on this forum understands that, without upholding the core principle of due process, we won't 'keep it', it will be lost, we will become a republic of the banana variety? Please stand up a
Oh, I suppose I could holler 'I told you so', as, it seems, my chicken little predictions are coming to pass, and, are neither chicken, nor little. So......
What will keep our republic--our democracy--from falling apart? Pray for the following:
We’re Finally Seeing the “Evidence” Against the Migrants Deported by Trump. It’s Unbelievable.
- A balance of power among co-equal branches of government.
We've lost Congress--too many members have donned kneepads for Trump--leaving us to rely almost entirely on the judiciary to hold the line.- A vigorous, independent press.
The free press is not the enemy of the people--it’s the watchdog that keeps power in check and truth in circulation. It's the one institution that stands between tyranny and you, the citizen, it's the first amendment, and it's the first for a reason, where the second is important, but nothing protects us from tyranny more than a vigorous & free press. Note that I didn't say 'honest' or 'unbiased' because of the three, 'honest, 'bias', and 'vigorous' only the latter is not subject (as much) to interpretation.- A military that honors its oath.
When they swear to defend the Constitution, it’s not just words. It’s a commitment to the rule of law, not to any one man or party.- A judiciary that defends the Constitution and the law.
Judges who stand firm, even under pressure from a hostile executive branch, are the last bulwark of democracy. They must be willing to sacrifice popularity, power, or position in defense of constitutional principle.- We, the people.
A republic doesn’t sustain itself. It lives or dies by the engagement, courage, and conscience of its citizens. If we stay silent while democracy is dismantled, we become accomplices. But if we vote, speak out, protest, organize, and refuse to surrender truth to propaganda--we become the immune system of the republic. No constitution, no court, no press can save democracy if the people don’t care to.
We’re Finally Seeing the “Evidence” Against the Migrants Deported by Trump. It’s Unbelievable.
The Trump admin said a soccer player had a gang tattoo. It’s a tattoo of Real Madrid’s logo.slate.com
After the Trump administration rounded up hundreds of Venezuelan migrants around the country—without notice or court hearings—and sent them off to a prison in El Salvador, we’re finally getting details on who was deported and why. And the more we learn, the more obvious it becomes why the government is so eager to expel these individuals without any semblance of due process. It claims that these men are terrorists by virtue of their alleged membership in the Tren de Aragua gang—but evidence of this affiliation is weak to the point of nonexistence.
Consider Jerce Reyes Barrios, one victim of the deportations: a professional soccer player who had fled Venezuela after protesting against dictator Nicolás Maduro and was living peacefully in the U.S. until the government snatched him up and deported him to El Salvador. Linette Tobin, Barrios’ attorney, submitted a declaration in federal court that detailed the disturbing reasons why her client was targeted by Immigration and Customs Enforcement. After entering the U.S. last year, Barrios was scheduled to have an asylum hearing in April. But on Saturday, he was arrested and held at a San Diego detention facility after ICE agents accused him of being a member of Tren de Aragua, the Venezuelan gang that President Donald Trump has been fixated on to fulfill his mass-deportation plan.
We’re Finally Seeing the “Evidence” Against the Migrants Deported by Trump. It’s Unbelievable.
- Thread starter Rumpole
- Start date
AZrailwhale
Diamond Member
No one will interfere with their rights, their parents would just get deported.
Trump of course hates do process since it allows people that are accused of horrible crimes to defend themselves. For Trump, the solution is to breaks doors down in the middle of the night night, grabbing people and throwing them into far away prisons, the very action that our founders rebelled against so that would never happen again.
Last edited:
- Apr 11, 2023
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That will be up to the courts.
Marchimedes
Platinum Member
Any nation in the world besides America:
Any nation: "May I see your ID? No? Papers?"
Poor bastard with no papers: "I have no papers."
Any nation: "The fu(k then, you think this is America? Good-bye."
How much does not having any papers, not being able to show any reason why are you allowed in America , (I could go to Tiajuana, get drunk, lose my wallet, sneak back into America, get pulled over for walking while white near the border and talk my way outta everything... my full name, birthdate see right there, that's my mug shot for when I got arrested for swimming too far into the Atlantic Ocean. Don't make me go whipping out my SSN.)
Due process. What, jury trial?
"Mr. Pedro Smith, is it?
"Si."
"Who was the first person to hit three(3) home runs in a Word Series game?"
What exactly is due process here?
Or a bunch of fu(ks running around that don't know the answer is Reggie Jackson.
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Marchimedes is confused.
g5000
Diamond Member
- Nov 26, 2011
- 132,566
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Lies and the Lying Liars Who Tell Them
Yesterday morning, JD Vance described Kilmar Abrego Garcia—the migrant wrongly deported to a Salvadorean supermax prison this month—as “a convicted MS-13 gang member.” This was flatly false; Abrego Garcia has never been charged with, let alone convicted of, a crime.
But asked about it at her press briefing later, Press Secretary Karoline Leavitt doubled down.
“The vice president said he was a convicted member of MS-13,” a reporter asked her. “What evidence is there to back that up?”
“There’s a lot of evidence,” Leavitt replied. “And the Department of Homeland Security and ICE have that evidence, and I saw it this morning.”
Again: That this is a lie is a matter of public record. DHS and ICE are not sitting on secret records showing Abrego Garcia is a convict. If they were, they would release them. Instead, the public record is what his lawyers wrote in a filing this week, an assertion the government did not dispute in its response: “Abrego Garcia has never been arrested or charged with any crime in the U.S. or El Salvador.”
"And I saw it this morning."
Wow!
This regime is getting bolder and bolder with their in-your-face lying.
They do this because the Trump cult BEGS to be lied to. The cult hasn't a single critical thinking brain cell between them.
AZrailwhale
Diamond Member
Due process has nothing to do with courts. It just means that both sides have to follow the applicable laws. Due process for a driver’s license is passing a written and driving test.
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When dealing with immigration it can very well deal with courts, and the Orange cannot get away from it.
BULLDOG
Diamond Member
- Jun 3, 2014
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You should recheck. They can apply for asylum regardless of where they enter. Just because you want something to be true doesn't make it so.
They are supposed to apply for asylum when they cross the border leaving their country.
Kondor3
Cafeteria Centrist
Golly-gosh gee-whiz, Emmy Lou... I get the impression you don't approve of the Trump Administration's deportations...It gets old, the attacks from the right who accuse we Democrats of 'hating America' because we back Boasberg. 'You support terrorists', they keep shouting. The reply is 'no, we support due process'. Without it, we lose our republic, so it is out of LOVE for America that we back the judge, for all he is interested is that those souls get a fair hearing, so that the innocent aren't sent to some prison where their hope of freedom will be lost, probably in a hellish place for a long long time. Consider this story, which emboldens our case for 'due process'.
So it has happened that the Trump administration, that erstwhile bastion of misrule, embarked on a ruthless campaign to uproot hundreds of Venezuelan migrants scattered across this vast land. They did so with the stealth of a jackal, executing deportations without notice or the dignity of due process. These unfortunate souls were dispatched to the unforgiving confines of a prison in El Salvador--a fate as ironic as it is tragic. Now, the curtain is finally lifting on the evidence marshaled against these exiles, and it is nothing short of preposterous.
Take, for instance, the case of Jerce Reyes Barrios, a professional soccer player--yes, a player who fled the suffocating grip of dictator Nicolás Maduro in search of freedom, only to find himself ensnared by the very apparatus designed to protect him. Barrios had settled in the United States, eagerly awaiting an asylum hearing when ICE agents descended upon him like vultures. The accusation? That he was a member of the Tren de Aragua gang, a claim rooted not in hard evidence but in the flimsy fabric of xenophobic hysteria.
What, pray tell, constituted the evidence against Barrios? Two items, both laughable in their absurdity. First, a tattoo on his arm--an innocuous crown perched atop a soccer ball, allegedly emblematic of gang affiliation. The truth, as his attorney Linette Tobin clarifies, is that this tattoo is a tribute to the Real Madrid soccer team, a fact as lost on the powers that be as a whisper in a tempest. Secondly, there exists a photograph in which Barrios is gesturing with both hands--a gesture misconstrued by the ever-suspicious agents as a sign of gang allegiance. Yet, in the world of American Sign Language, this very gesture signifies “I love you,” or is often embraced as a symbol of rock 'n' roll.
Such grotesque misinterpretations seem to be a recurrent theme among those caught in this legislative nightmare. Consider another migrant, referred to as E.V., whose tattoos depict anime, flowers, and animals, yet were grotesquely rebranded as indicators of gang ties. According to his attorney, the crown adorning his skin is not a badge of criminality but a heartfelt homage to his late grandmother.
The Kafkaesque nature of this ordeal escalates as we delve into the tales of others similarly victimized. One, known as J.A.B.V., bore tattoos of a rose, a clock, and his son’s name--all benign symbols that ICE agents twisted into evidence of criminal affiliation. Despite having lived without a criminal record, he was nevertheless shipped away on the flimsiest of charges. L.G. endured a similar fate, his tattoos--one a rosary, another his partner’s name--branded as marks of gang loyalty. The absurdity reaches new heights with Anyelo Jose Sarabia, who was accused based on a tattoo of a Bible verse and a rose adorned with petals of money.
One cannot help but feel a twinge of irony: many of these individuals sought refuge from Tren de Aragua, only to be demonized as members of that very gang. A particularly poignant case involves an unnamed migrant who had applied for asylum, fleeing from the very harm he now faces, yet was unceremoniously deported while living in a New York homeless shelter with his family.
The administration seems to operate under a perverse presumption that any Venezuelan migrant bearing tattoos must be, by default, a member of Tren de Aragua, guilty until proven innocent--a condition that becomes impossible in the absence of due process. Trump’s invocation of the Alien Enemies Act of 1798, under the ludicrous belief it permits the expulsion of noncitizens without judicial oversight, exposes a shocking disdain for constitutional principles. The Department of Justice, ever the willing accomplice, hastens to bypass the courts, claiming that Trump’s decisions exist in a realm beyond judicial scrutiny.
This is not the first time such absurdity has reared its head. During Trump’s initial tenure, ICE made a habit of accusing noncitizens of gang membership based on little more than inked skin. A federal judge once accused ICE agents of perjury regarding the tattoos of a DACA recipient, ultimately liberating him from unlawful detention. The lesson learned, it seems, is that when afforded the privilege of due process, these victims can challenge the flimsy fabrications that the government spins around them. In response, the authorities have concocted new legal theories, intent on preventing judicial review of their actions.
The question remains: did ICE specifically target these men based on their tattoos, or were they rounded up first, with excuses fabricated later? These details warrant scrutiny, and soon the victims’ lawyers will be entitled to interrogate the architects of this dystopian scheme. What is essential now is that judges have the opportunity to sift through the so-called evidence, allowing the scales of justice to balance before this grotesque theater evolves into a full-scale assault on the constitutional rights of all immigrants.
As we observe this unfolding drama, one cannot help but wonder where the limits of absurdity lie in this creeping authoritarianism. In the grand tapestry of American governance, this chapter stands as a cautionary tale of a nation grappling with its conscience amid a cacophony of injustice. The time has come to demand accountability, lest we descend further into a quagmire of Trumpian madness and, yes, I'll say it, it needs to be said, it needs to be shouted on rooftops across America, TYRANNY.
I've been shouting a simple message since I joined this forum short while ago, it's called 'due process'. Some said the 'gang members' got DP, but, alas, I wouldn't trust ICE nor Trump to uphold 'due process', when Trump as literally defecated all over it, for some time, now.
As the delegates finalized the U.S. Constitution, Franklin, who was 81 years old at the time, exited the hall. According to historical accounts, a woman--often identified as Elizabeth Willing Powel, a well-known Philadelphia socialite and wife of Samuel Powel--approached Franklin and asked:
"Well, Doctor, what have we got? A republic or a monarchy?"
Franklin responded: "A republic, if you can keep it."
IF WE CAN KEEP IT.
I'd like to know who on this forum understands that, without upholding the core principle of due process, we won't 'keep it', it will be lost, we will become a republic of the banana variety? Please stand up a
Oh, I suppose I could holler 'I told you so', as, it seems, my chicken little predictions are coming to pass, and, are neither chicken, nor little. So......
What will keep our republic--our democracy--from falling apart? Pray for the following:
We’re Finally Seeing the “Evidence” Against the Migrants Deported by Trump. It’s Unbelievable.
- A balance of power among co-equal branches of government.
We've lost Congress--too many members have donned kneepads for Trump--leaving us to rely almost entirely on the judiciary to hold the line.- A vigorous, independent press.
The free press is not the enemy of the people--it’s the watchdog that keeps power in check and truth in circulation. It's the one institution that stands between tyranny and you, the citizen, it's the first amendment, and it's the first for a reason, where the second is important, but nothing protects us from tyranny more than a vigorous & free press. Note that I didn't say 'honest' or 'unbiased' because of the three, 'honest, 'bias', and 'vigorous' only the latter is not subject (as much) to interpretation.- A military that honors its oath.
When they swear to defend the Constitution, it’s not just words. It’s a commitment to the rule of law, not to any one man or party.- A judiciary that defends the Constitution and the law.
Judges who stand firm, even under pressure from a hostile executive branch, are the last bulwark of democracy. They must be willing to sacrifice popularity, power, or position in defense of constitutional principle.- We, the people.
A republic doesn’t sustain itself. It lives or dies by the engagement, courage, and conscience of its citizens. If we stay silent while democracy is dismantled, we become accomplices. But if we vote, speak out, protest, organize, and refuse to surrender truth to propaganda--we become the immune system of the republic. No constitution, no court, no press can save democracy if the people don’t care to.
We’re Finally Seeing the “Evidence” Against the Migrants Deported by Trump. It’s Unbelievable.
The Trump admin said a soccer player had a gang tattoo. It’s a tattoo of Real Madrid’s logo.
After the Trump administration rounded up hundreds of Venezuelan migrants around the country—without notice or court hearings—and sent them off to a prison in El Salvador, we’re finally getting details on who was deported and why. And the more we learn, the more obvious it becomes why the government is so eager to expel these individuals without any semblance of due process. It claims that these men are terrorists by virtue of their alleged membership in the Tren de Aragua gang—but evidence of this affiliation is weak to the point of nonexistence.
Consider Jerce Reyes Barrios, one victim of the deportations: a professional soccer player who had fled Venezuela after protesting against dictator Nicolás Maduro and was living peacefully in the U.S. until the government snatched him up and deported him to El Salvador. Linette Tobin, Barrios’ attorney, submitted a declaration in federal court that detailed the disturbing reasons why her client was targeted by Immigration and Customs Enforcement. After entering the U.S. last year, Barrios was scheduled to have an asylum hearing in April. But on Saturday, he was arrested and held at a San Diego detention facility after ICE agents accused him of being a member of Tren de Aragua, the Venezuelan gang that President Donald Trump has been fixated on to fulfill his mass-deportation plan.
I can't think of a better reason to not only continue with those deportations but to accelerate them by an order of magnitude...
Our country... our rules... if you're on US soil without our express prior consent then it's time for you to go back home...
We're perfectly willing to let you go back home of your own volition so long as it happens quickly and quietly...
But if we have to scoop you up and trebuchet you back across the border we'll be just as happy to do that, too...
Your choice...
FWIW - DHS is requesting IRS provide tax data to locate 7 million illegals.
BULLDOG
Diamond Member
- Jun 3, 2014
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And they do, dumb ass.
The first country they set foot in.
You cross the river without authorization, you are breaking the law and not eligible for asylum.
BULLDOG
Diamond Member
- Jun 3, 2014
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Which law states that and when did congress enact that law?
BULLDOG
Diamond Member
- Jun 3, 2014
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Wrong. The US recognizes the right to apply for asylum according to international treaties such as the 1951 refugee convention and it's1967 protocol. Just because hannity told you that was our law doesn't make it so.
No, how about reading the 5th amendment.
The Fifth Amendment to the United States Constitution protects individuals from self-incrimination, double jeopardy, and ensures due process of law, while also prohibiting the government from taking private property for public use without just compensation
Due process ensures fairness and justice in legal proceedings, requiring the government to follow established rules and principles when taking away someone's life, liberty, or property. It encompasses both procedural and substantive aspects, with examples including the right to a fair trial and the protection of fundamental rights.
Example:
Federal law enforcement picking up supposed members of a criminal gang, without a warrant, denying them the right to speak to an attorney, denying them their right to a fair hearing, and sending them to a jail outside the country. All of which is a gross violation of the 5th amendment as well as multiple sections of immigration laws.
Crepitus
Diamond Member
- Mar 28, 2018
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No. For them to have the trials the Constitution requires.
Crepitus
Diamond Member
- Mar 28, 2018
- 94,856
- 137,192
- 3,615
Yes. He was awaiting trial.
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