Walter Cronkite's Ridiculous Spin on the 1968 Tet Offensive in South Vietnam

[Hector12]

No they did not

Your claim is fiction.

I have posted this before. Read it this time.

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This page from President Eisenhower's Memoires, Mandate for Change, page 372, shows that he believed Ho Chi Minh would have won any free election in Vietnam in 1954. This is certainly why the U.S. did not permit such an election, though the Geneva Convention of 1954 required it.

"Reviewing the entire episode in retrospect, I find that four questions merit consideration:

(1) Why, with the superiority in manpower and resources available, were the French unable to win?

(2) Why was the very considerable amount of material American aid not more effective in helping the French?

(3) Why, when the French were in difficulty and the interests of the Free World affected, at least indirectly, were the successive French governments unwilling to take logical and reasonable steps to bring United States' and other support to their assistance?

(4) What lessons or benefits, if any, accrued to the Free World as a result?
I am convinced that the French could not win the war because the internal political situation in Vietnam, weak and confused, badly weakened their military position. I have never talked or corresponded with a person knowledgeable in Indochinese affairs who did not agree that had elections been held as of the time of the fighting, possibly 80 per cent of the populations would have voted for the Communist Ho Chi Minh as their leader rather than Chief of State Bao Dai. Indeed, the lack of readership and drive on the part of Bao Dai was a factor in the feeling prevalent among Vietnamese that they had nothing to fight for. As one Frenchman said to me, 'What Vietnam needs is another Syngman Rhee, regardless of all the difficulties the presence of such a personality would entail.'

In the earlier stages of the conflict, the fighting was mostly conducted where rough terrain made it impossible to seek out the enemy and bring him to a pitched battle. Later, even when the battle lines became so located that the grouses mobiles could be effective, there still existed within the Red River Delta a condition in which the French could control even the main roads for only about two or three hours a day. The rest of the time all lines of communication were in the hands of the Vietminh. This meant that the mass of the population supported the enemy. With such a feeling prevalent, it was inevitable that the French should find it impossible to retain the loyalty of their Vietnamese troops." (emphasis added - GF)

Selection from Eisenhower's Memoires

 

[Soupnazi630]

I have posted this before. Read it this time.

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This page from President Eisenhower's Memoires, Mandate for Change, page 372, shows that he believed Ho Chi Minh would have won any free election in Vietnam in 1954. This is certainly why the U.S. did not permit such an election, though the Geneva Convention of 1954 required it.

Selection from Eisenhower's Memoires

I have posted this before try reading it

Ike's personal BELIEF was just a BELIEF it is not definitive or conclusive.

It proves NOTHING

 

[Soupnazi630]

The war in Vietnam was always about National liberation than anything, the Vietnamese fought the French Colonialists and defeated them at Dien Bien Phu, they fought against the Japanese then the US Imperialists, the National liberation front or the Viet Cong to you ignorant clowns were South Vietnamese, it was always more about Vietnamese Nationalism than Communism, General Giap was the mastermind in defeated those foreign thugs.
Suck it up.

WRONG

It was not about liberation it was about CONQUEST

Communism by definition and in practice is slavery. You do not liberate people by enslaving them

The national liberation front was controlled trained and organizxed by the communists of the north. They werre not exclusively south vietnamese you ignorant FOOL

It was about communist enslavement you brainwashed moron

 

[Deadstick]

WRONG

It was not about liberation it was about CONQUEST

Communism by definition and in practice is slavery. You do not liberate people by enslaving them

The national liberation front was controlled trained and organizxed by the communists of the north. They werre not exclusively south vietnamese you ignorant FOOL

It was about communist enslavement you brainwashed moron

The Vietnam had to liberate Cambodia from the Western backed Pol Pot you retard, America never forgave the Vietnamese for liberating their country stay off the drugs.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

NV won because America would not invade the country. Period.

 

[Hector12]

I have posted this before try reading it

Ike's personal BELIEF was just a BELIEF it is not definitive or conclusive.

It proves NOTHING

Go back read it again. Eisenhower said his opinion was based on every single person he talked to who was knowledgeable in Indochinese affairs.

I have had the same experience talking to those who served in Vietnam. Once a Marine sergeant told me, "Whenever we went out into the bundocks Charlie knew we were coming, he knew how we were coming, he knew when we were coming, and he knew how many of us were coming. That would not have been the case if the South Vietnamese government was not infiltrated with Communist sympathizers.

I have not talked to as many Vietnam veterans as the number of professional experts Eisenhower talked to, but I never talked to anyone who said that South Vietnamese were glad to see Americans.

For several years I dated a Vietnamese war refugee who had been a boat person, so she had no reason to be sympathetic to the Communists. After the Communists won the War, they sent her into rural areas to teach English to peasants, because she was fluent in English. She told me that the peasants hated the Americans because the Americans bombed them and made forested areas dangerous with Agent Orange.

 

[Hector12]

NV won because America would not invade the country. Period.

If the United States had invaded North Vietnam, the United States would have had twice as much of a problem as we had in South Vietnam. Support for the Communists was even higher in the North than in the South.

 

[Deadstick]

NV won because America would not invade the country. Period.

They would have been murdered on the beaches.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

They would have been murdered on the beaches.

You fool.

 

[Mushroom]

This page from President Eisenhower's Memoires, Mandate for Change, page 372, shows that he believed Ho Chi Minh would have won any free election in Vietnam in 1954. This is certainly why the U.S. did not permit such an election, though the Geneva Convention of 1954 required it.

A few things missing here for context.

First, the elections were called for in 1956. And by that time, the demographics of Vietnam were very different. As most of the supporters of the Communist Party heading north, and most of the Anti-Communists moving south. Along with a lot of those who were religious, as they knew their religious freedoms would be restricted if not outright abolished.

Plus the ink was barely dry on the treaty when North Vietnam started an assassination campaign as well as an insurgency and invasion of South Vietnam. And there is no reason anybody should have expected elections so long as that continued.

Which by the way was the same conditions that Korea was divided. With the elections being cancelled permanently in the way of the North Korean invasion of South Korea.

 

[Soupnazi630]

Go back read it again. Eisenhower said his opinion was based on every single person he talked to who was knowledgeable in Indochinese affairs.

I have had the same experience talking to those who served in Vietnam. Once a Marine sergeant told me, "Whenever we went out into the bundocks Charlie knew we were coming, he knew how we were coming, he knew when we were coming, and he knew how many of us were coming. That would not have been the case if the South Vietnamese government was not infiltrated with Communist sympathizers.

I have not talked to as many Vietnam veterans as the number of professional experts Eisenhower talked to, but I never talked to anyone who said that South Vietnamese were glad to see Americans.

For several years I dated a Vietnamese war refugee who had been a boat person, so she had no reason to be sympathetic to the Communists. After the Communists won the War, they sent her into rural areas to teach English to peasants, because she was fluent in English. She told me that the peasants hated the Americans because the Americans bombed them and made forested areas dangerous with Agent Orange.

Yes every single person meaning both of them who may or may not have known a damned thing.

I have indeed talked to many who remembered the Vietnamese welcoming them. The fact is popularity is IRRELEVANT.

Mingh calcelled elections and was nebver elected. One does not get to say one is the rightful ruler because one WOULD HAVE Been elected if one had allowed elections.

THAT is the stupid logic you people emoloy defending Minh


No where is dangerous from Agent orange. both sides bombed

 

[Soupnazi630]

The Vietnam had to liberate Cambodia from the Western backed Pol Pot you retard, America never forgave the Vietnamese for liberating their country stay off the drugs.

It was conquest not liberation DUMBASS

Try learning some history rather than bumpersticker talking points which is all you have

 

[Soupnazi630]

They would have been murdered on the beaches.

Wrong the north would have been crushed

 

[Hector12]

Yes every single person meaning both of them who may or may not have known a damned thing.

I have indeed talked to many who remembered the Vietnamese welcoming them. The fact is popularity is IRRELEVANT.

Mingh calcelled elections and was nebver elected. One does not get to say one is the rightful ruler because one WOULD HAVE Been elected if one had allowed elections.

THAT is the stupid logic you people emoloy defending Minh


No where is dangerous from Agent orange. both sides bombed

The War in Vietnam was an expensive, losing war against a tough, resourceful enemy in which the rewards of victory and the penalties of defeat were imperceptible. We out spent and outnumbered the Communists. They out fought us because they had the support of the vast majority of the Vietnamese people, and we did not. Don't argue with me about that. Argue with President Eisenhower.

The matter of popularity is relevant; it is the main point.

 

[Hector12]

No where is dangerous from Agent orange. both sides bombed

The bombing campaigns of the Vietnam War were the longest and heaviest aerial bombardment in history. The United States Air Force, the U. S. Navy, and U. S. Marine Corps aviation dropped 7,662,000 tons of explosives. By comparison, U. S. forces dropped a total of 2,150,000 tons of bombs in all theaters of World War II.

vietnam war bombing - Bing

Intelligent search from Bing makes it easier to quickly find what you’re looking for and rewards you.

www.bing.com

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Agent Orange was a powerful herbicide used by U.S. military forces during the Vietnam War to eliminate forest cover and crops for North Vietnamese and Viet Cong troops. The U.S. program, codenamed Operation Ranch Hand, sprayed more than 20 million gallons of various herbicides over Vietnam, Cambodia and Laos from 1961 to 1971. Agent Orange, which contained the deadly chemical dioxin, was the most commonly used herbicide. It was later proven to cause serious health issues—including cancer, birth defects, rashes and severe psychological and neurological problems—among the Vietnamese people as well as among returning U.S. servicemen and their families.

Agent Orange

www.history.com

 

[Hector12]

A few things missing here for context.

First, the elections were called for in 1956. And by that time, the demographics of Vietnam were very different. As most of the supporters of the Communist Party heading north, and most of the Anti-Communists moving south. Along with a lot of those who were religious, as they knew their religious freedoms would be restricted if not outright abolished.

Plus the ink was barely dry on the treaty when North Vietnam started an assassination campaign as well as an insurgency and invasion of South Vietnam. And there is no reason anybody should have expected elections so long as that continued.

Which by the way was the same conditions that Korea was divided. With the elections being cancelled permanently in the way of the North Korean invasion of South Korea.

If Ho Chi Minh had been more resourceful, he could have unified Vietnam under his leadership without a war. That does not justify our policy.

 

[Deadstick]

Wrong the north would have been crushed

it would have been the bay of pigs with interest, and just how would they have been crushed? because it could have brought China into the war just like it did when your Imperial arrogance went too far in Korea.

 

[Deadstick]

The bombing campaigns of the Vietnam War were the longest and heaviest aerial bombardment in history. The United States Air Force, the U. S. Navy, and U. S. Marine Corps aviation dropped 7,662,000 tons of explosives. By comparison, U. S. forces dropped a total of 2,150,000 tons of bombs in all theaters of World War II.

vietnam war bombing - Bing

Intelligent search from Bing makes it easier to quickly find what you’re looking for and rewards you.

www.bing.com

------------

Agent Orange was a powerful herbicide used by U.S. military forces during the Vietnam War to eliminate forest cover and crops for North Vietnamese and Viet Cong troops. The U.S. program, codenamed Operation Ranch Hand, sprayed more than 20 million gallons of various herbicides over Vietnam, Cambodia and Laos from 1961 to 1971. Agent Orange, which contained the deadly chemical dioxin, was the most commonly used herbicide. It was later proven to cause serious health issues—including cancer, birth defects, rashes and severe psychological and neurological problems—among the Vietnamese people as well as among returning U.S. servicemen and their families.

Agent Orange

www.history.com

The criminals also bombed Cambodia and Laos.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

it would have been the bay of pigs with interest, and just how would they have been crushed? because it could have brought China into the war just like it did when your Imperial arrogance went too far in Korea.

Nope. Absolute NV defeat.

 

[Deadstick]

Nope. Absolute NV defeat.

How? you couldn't defeat them in the South or by carpet bombing the North, it just makes people resist more.