Vandals Drain Water Tanks Meant For Illegals

[GotZoom]

HELLO!!!!! ILLEGAL ALLIENS!!!! AGAINST THE LAW!!!! NOT ALLOWED IN THE COUNTRY!!!!! HELLO!!!!

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"We try to save people from dying from dehydration," said Paula Mich, a volunteer with Humane Borders.

Mich, along with hundreds of other Humane Borders volunteers, travels into the wilderness each day to refill tanks with water meant for the lips of illegal immigrants crossing the border.

Marked with a blue flag, the jugs are placed deep in the desert just outside Tucson in areas where volunteers say the most illegal immigrants have died from dehydration.

"We save lives by doing this," said Humane Borders Volunteer Frank Saavedra. "I don't know how many, but if it's only one it's worth it."

Not everyone agrees with Humane Borders placing water tanks in areas heavily trafficked by illegal immigrants.

Mich says vandals have been coming out to the water stations, pulling the caps off the tanks and dumping the water out into the desert.

The volunteers also say vandals are destroying the blue flags that fly atop 30-foot poles in the middle of the desert -- flags the immigrants look for when seeking out a water station on their journeys.

"Flags have been destroyed, and not in this station but in others. They've put bullet holes [the water tanks]," Mich said.

Mich also says each week Humane Borders finds at least one or more of their 70 water tanks vandalized, an act these volunteers say can kill.

"If they're planning on getting their water at that location and they get there and there's no water, then the next time they could get water could be not before they die," Saavedra said.

Russ Dove, a local immigration activist, says he understands why people trash the tanks.

"The vandal issue is a sign that Americans have had enough," Dove said, "and from observation, I think it's only going to get worse."

Dove says Humane Borders is helping illegal immigrants, some he calls criminals, cross the border safely.

"These are robbers, rapists, murders. This is simply aiding and abetting criminal activity," Dove said.

The volunteers, however, say the border crossers are innocent, crossing in search of a better life.

"We're going to continue to do this regardless of how many empty tanks we find," Mich said. "We're going to continue to do this."

http://www.kvoa.com/Global/story.asp?S=5030576

 

[CSM]

Well, it seems to me that if you knowingly help a person commit a criminal act, then you are a criminal too. It also seems to me that if you freely admit to such actions that you could be arrested for said activity...why haven't these folks been arrested?

 

[Trigg]

The volunteers, however, say the border crossers are innocent, crossing in search of a better life.

"We're going to continue to do this regardless of how many empty tanks we find," Mich said. "We're going to continue to do this."



Wasn't there just a round up of around 2000 illegals, half of whom turned out to be child molesters and gang members?????????????????

I'll have to look for the article.

I would say close to 1/2 are not innocent people just looking for work.

 

[5stringJeff]

I really have mixed feelings about this. Obviously, we want to decrease illegal immigration. However, destroying water tanks isn't very humane. Then again, it's not like the water tanks are there naturally - really, the vandals are just undoing what the "Humane Borders" people are doing.

 

[jasendorf]

Destruction of others' property makes the vandals criminals. Simple enough. Either you agree with the actions of criminals or you don't. As for the illegal immigrants, they're criminals too. Both the vandals and the illegals are the same. Criminals. Do those applauding one criminal over the other have debates on whether murderers or rapists are better than the other?

 

[dilloduck]

Destruction of others' property makes the vandals criminals. Simple enough. Either you agree with the actions of criminals or you don't. As for the illegal immigrants, they're criminals too. Both the vandals and the illegals are the same. Criminals. Do those applauding one criminal over the other have debates on whether murderers or rapists are better than the other?

ahhhh It's just an protest, an act of freedom of speech that just got a little outta hand. Maybe they should put a holding cell underneath every blue flag !

 

[GotZoom]

Destruction of others' property makes the vandals criminals. Simple enough. Either you agree with the actions of criminals or you don't. As for the illegal immigrants, they're criminals too. Both the vandals and the illegals are the same. Criminals. Do those applauding one criminal over the other have debates on whether murderers or rapists are better than the other?

Leave it to you.

Geez.

 

[jasendorf]

Leave it to you.

Geez.

Oh, I'm sorry, did I rain on your little "applaud the criminals" parade?

 

[GotZoom]

Oh, I'm sorry, did I rain on your little "applaud the criminals" parade?

A man keeps his wife locked in the basement of the house for month after month. They have no telephone and he doesnt' keep food in the refrigerator; only throw fast food scraps to her every now and then.

One day when he leaves for work, he accidentally leaves the basement door unclocked. She gets out of the house and runs next door for help but no one is home. She breaks into the house and calls 911 for the police to come save her.

She committed a crime. She broke into a house.

Guess she is just as bad as her husband is.

 

[CockySOB]

Anyone have any solid evidence as to whose land these water stations are on? I've been browsing the Humane Borders website, and nothing is ever said as to whose land the sites are on.

Just curious.

 

[The ClayTaurus]

Anyone have any solid evidence as to whose land these water stations are on? I've been browsing the Humane Borders website, and nothing is ever said as to whose land the sites are on.

Just curious.

I was wondering that too. Wouldn't it be ironic if they were trespassing on private property to do the vandalizing?

 

[jasendorf]

A man keeps his wife locked in the basement of the house for month after month. They have no telephone and he doesnt' keep food in the refrigerator; only throw fast food scraps to her every now and then.

One day when he leaves for work, he accidentally leaves the basement door unclocked. She gets out of the house and runs next door for help but no one is home. She breaks into the house and calls 911 for the police to come save her.

She committed a crime. She broke into a house.

Guess she is just as bad as her husband is.

Is that really the analogy you're going with? You're going to equivocate a woman locked in a basement for months breaking a window to call 911 with guys who are running around the desert purposely vandalizing others' property? Maybe if she went to a couple dozen houses breaking windows and then running away... now that would be a decent analogy...

 

[The ClayTaurus]

Is that really the analogy you're going with? You're going to equivocate a woman locked in a basement for months breaking a window to call 911 with guys who are running around the desert purposely vandalizing others' property? Maybe if she went to a couple dozen houses breaking windows and then running away... now that would be a decent analogy...

If you had a lick of intelligence, you would have turned that comparison around to the basement being Mexico. Come on, man. Practice up. You're already slipping.

 

[jasendorf]

Anyone have any solid evidence as to whose land these water stations are on? I've been browsing the Humane Borders website, and nothing is ever said as to whose land the sites are on.

Just curious.

I must say, that was an intriguing question to me too...

here's what I found:

Locations: Public land in Pima County, Organ Pipe Cactus National Monument, Buenos Aires National Wildlife Refuge, Cabeza Prieta National Wildlife Refuge, Ironwood Forest National Monument. Private land in Cochise and Pima counties.

http://www.humaneborders.org/about/about_quickfacts.html

By collaborating with the U.S. Border Patrol and the Mexican Consulate, and tracking stories in the news media, Humane Borders has developed detailed map of the region that mark the GPS location of every migrant discovered to have died. Almost all are along footpaths that stretch north across wilderness of death traps. The information allows us to approach government and private land managers, show them where deaths occur most frequently, and offer a strategy for water stations aimed at curbing the fatalities. On some federal lands, our permits allow us to place the water stations a day's walk apart. On some private ranches we place the barrels at cattle watering stations so that migrants don't damage equipment and drink foul water. We know that more deaths occur in the areas we are not permitted to establish the water stations.

http://www.humaneborders.org/about/about_wstations.html


So, public AND private land, but that doesn't mean that the ones on private land were the ones vandalized. But, if they were, like CT said, wouldn't the irony be thick?

 

[The ClayTaurus]

I must say, that was an intriguing question to me too...

here's what I found:


http://www.humaneborders.org/about/about_quickfacts.html


http://www.humaneborders.org/about/about_wstations.html


So, public AND private land, but that doesn't mean that the ones on private land were the ones vandalized. But, if they were, like CT said, wouldn't the irony be thick?

Massive hypothetical speculation, of course.

 

[dilloduck]

Oh, I'm sorry, did I rain on your little "applaud the criminals" parade?

So Mr. "pro law and order"--how do you feel about aiding and abetting ?

 

[jasendorf]

So Mr. "pro law and order"--how do you feel about aiding and abetting ?

Criminals, including those who aid and abet them, should have their day in court. But, that's not occuring here.

They're putting drinking water in tanks. I'm sure that if any of the prosecutors in the places they're putting them felt they could win a case of aiding and abetting they'd have already made political hay out of it.

I wonder how you'd howl when they throw Reverend Hoover, Sister Ohmann and Reverend Mayer in jail for it though

# Officers:
* Founder, media representative: Rev. Robin Hoover, Ph.D.
* President: Mark Townley
* Treasurer: Tim Holt
* Vice President: Paul Fuschin
* Secretary: Sister Elizabeth Ohmann
* Corporate Officers: Rev. Randy Mayer and Sue Ann Goodman

http://www.humaneborders.org/about/about_quickfacts.html


Maybe you could sue Humane Borders' headquarters:

Headquarters: First Christian Church, Tucson, Ariz.

 

[GotZoom]

Is that really the analogy you're going with? You're going to equivocate a woman locked in a basement for months breaking a window to call 911 with guys who are running around the desert purposely vandalizing others' property? Maybe if she went to a couple dozen houses breaking windows and then running away... now that would be a decent analogy...

Let me quote a post by one of our members, with certain highlighted points:

"Destruction of others' property makes the vandals criminals. Simple enough. Either you agree with the actions of criminals or you don't. As for the illegal immigrants, they're criminals too. Both the vandals and the illegals are the same. Criminals. Do those applauding one criminal over the other have debates on whether murderers or rapists are better than the other?"

Using this argument, both the wife and the husband are criminals. They both violated the law. Degree of violation is not important. Either you agree with the actions of criminals or you don't.

Certainly you aren't applauding her crime of breaking and entering over his crime of kidnapping and spousal abuse? Or is it the other way around?

 

[jasendorf]

Using this argument, both the wife and the husband are criminals. They both violated the law. Degree of violation is not important. Either you agree with the actions of criminals or you don't.

Certainly you aren't applauding her crime of breaking and entering over his crime of kidnapping and spousal abuse? Or is it the other way around?

Actually, she would only be breaking the law if the owners of the house whose window she broke pressed charges. And, if they did, I think she should be charged as appropriate under the law.


Still can't believe you're comparing some caring, compassionate Christians with a guy who keeps his wife locked in his basement.

 

[GotZoom]

Criminals, including those who aid and abet them, should have their day in court. But, that's not occuring here.

They're putting drinking water in tanks. I'm sure that if any of the prosecutors in the places they're putting them felt they could win a case of aiding and abetting they'd have already made political hay out of it.

I wonder how you'd howl when they throw Reverend Hoover, Sister Ohmann and Reverend Mayer in jail for it though


http://www.humaneborders.org/about/about_quickfacts.html


Maybe you could sue Humane Borders' headquarters:

A little background on the founder of Sactuary, which Humane Borders was born from:

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THE BUDDING NETWORK has also revitalized many veterans of the Sanctuary Movement, including Rev. John Fife. In 1986 Fife, the minister of Tucson's Southside Presbyterian Church, was among eight activists convicted on various alien-smuggling charges, stemming from an underground railroad the group operated for refugees from civil war-torn Central America.

Fife served five years' probation for his efforts. Today, the minister says a new assistance movement called Humane Borders is "just beginning to be organized, as Sanctuary was in the very beginning. Faith communities are meeting to address the whole set of moral issues along the border.

"The same standards (of Sanctuary) apply--we're going to be public about everything we do, because it's part of the obligation to change immoral and disastrous immigration policies."

He considers it among the "best traditions along the borderlands. People in this region have always responded to human need with compassion."

Already Humane Borders has begun cooperative efforts with other Tucson humanitarian groups such as Derechos Humanos and the American Friends Service Committee. One of the coalition's first efforts was establishing water stations in the desert, at spots where immigrants have died from dehydration.

But the overall breadth of this compassion, whether simply providing food and temporary shelter, or breaking the law by hiding and transporting immigrants, "is up to each individual," Fife says. "This is going to be a movement that says 'Help as you feel it's appropriate, given the situation.' In my experience, some people are willing to give transportation, and some are just willing to give a glass of water."

http://www.tucsonweekly.com/tw/2000-11-09/curr2.html
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Advocating breaking of the law. Advocating human smuggling. Nice.