I have a question for a person who is Pro-Life

[Foxfyre]

I have a serious question for someone who is of the belief that abortion is wrong because actual life begins at conception.

I am not judging sides and my own personal view is unimportant. Also, my question is not meant to be facetious -- I really have worked through the moral implications mentioned here, so I ask anyone who is truly and sincerely pro-life to please give me a few seconds, consider what I am asking and help me understand your position in this regard:

As you feel that life begins at conception, and the fetus needs protections on the level of any other human being against harm and not just death, would you accept the notion that alcohol, excessive sugary foods and smoking should be criminalized for pregnant women as they lead to fetal damage? Can a woman who is pro-life be ethically consistent and yet smoke during pregnancy?

As an extension, should any behavior the woman exhibits be considered as if she was holding a 1 year old in her arms so that a charge of child endangerment could be sustained if the woman acts in a reckless way which might endanger the fetus?

These are serious questions which, to my mind are logical continuations of the idea that the fetus needs protections as a person.

Thanks in advance for thoughtful answers.

The morality of the issue will always be the problem and there is no way to regulate it other than whoever holds the power decides what it and is not moral. That could be a very bad thing. If the power demands the woman follow the current science as to what protects the developing baby, the only way to demand the woman do that takes away her liberty.

On the other hand if the power demands that the woman may kill that developing baby at any stage for any reason, at some point we have to ask how that is not infanticide? How does that not make us a society with no respect for life? As a Christian I can't believe there are no terrible consequences for that.

So I am staunchly pro life, but I also know there are valid reasons that an abortion is necessary and the moral choice and I want the law to always allow that when an abortion is necessary.

I am also a Christian who knows that no human being walks the earth who was not once a fertilized egg, zygote, embryo, all the stages of the developing baby. All abortion should be with the full understanding that it is a human life that is being ended.

And then I hope that we return to a culture of life in which women who do not want children or to be pregnant do not take the risk of becoming pregnant. And those who do will take responsibility for the welfare of the developing human being she is carrying. The irresponsible will always be among us but we can hope they become very rare in a culture that promotes personal responsibility and appreciation and respect for life.

I am gratified that a significant majority of Americans feel the same way. They do not want a culture in which a developing human being has no value, but they recognize that some abortion is necessary/advisable and should be legal while thinking a moral society does put some restrictions on abortion.

 

[ding]

I also know there are valid reasons that an abortion is necessary and the moral choice

When is an abortion morally good?

 

[Foxfyre]

When is an abortion morally good?

I did not use the term 'good.' I used the term NECESSARY/ADVISABLE.

There could be any number of reasons an abortion could be necessary or advisable. For example, when the life or significant health of the mother is in jeopardy, most especially when she has other children to raise, ,when the developing baby has no chance to make it to full term, in he very rare cases of multiple babies that have little chance for survival if one or more are not removed, etc, I will leave the question of what is moral to the doctor and the woman.

 

[ding]

I did not use the term 'good.' I used the term NECESSARY/ADVISABLE.

You said:

I also know there are valid reasons that an abortion is necessary and the moral choice

...which implies a good moral choice as opposed to an immoral choice.

 

[ding]

There could be any number of reasons an abortion could be necessary or advisable. For example, when the life or significant health of the mother is in jeopardy, most especially when she has other children to raise, ,when the developing baby has no chance to make it to full term, in he very rare cases of multiple babies that have little chance for survival if one or more are not removed, etc, I will leave the question of what is moral to the doctor and the woman.

Can you think of any moral reasons abortion is a good choice?

 

[Foxfyre]

You said:

...which implies a good moral choice as opposed to an immoral choice.

In my opinion the moral choice respects life. And if it is necessary to save/protect one life by taking another, it should be done respectfully and with the full understanding that a human life is being ended.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Don't feel sad if you can't keep up. Not everyone is suited for adult conversation. I'm sure if you look, you can find a child somewhere to chat with.

I chatted with children daily for 21 years. How many years do you have under your belt?

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Just explain how abortion can be murder but poor prenatal care isn't child abuse.

It is. Proving it is difficult and a matter of opinion in most cases. Proving it in court is a whole new ballgame. That just facts.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

So both are actionable crimes? Thank you.

That's what just about everyone has been saying! How can you teach a reading class when you have no comprehension for yourself?

 

[rosends]

I chatted with children daily for 21 years. How many years do you have under your belt?

a lot more than that, but you really have immersed yourself in the "talking to children" motif.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

who gets to decide that any law is so complex that it becomes a misdemeanor?

That's his opinion, not the law.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

a lot more than that

I have children in their 40s, and three teenage grandkids. How about you?

 

[rosends]

It is. Proving it is difficult and a matter of opinion in most cases.

so you insist it is, but then say in most cases it is a matter of opinion. So then it isn't.

 

[rosends]

I have children in their 40s, and three teenage grandkids. How about you?

my kids have no kids. I do spend most everyday working with teenagers, helping them understand argument and rhetoric. Thirty plus years in the classroom will do that.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

my kids have no kids. I do spend most everyday working with teenagers, helping them understand argument and rhetoric. Thirty plus years in the classroom will do that.

You have no understanding of the subject that you have demonstrated in this discussion. I think a plurality of posters here would agree that your performance has failed miserably. Keep up the good work!

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

so you insist it is, but then say in most cases it is a matter of opinion. So then it isn't.

There was exactly zero logic in that statement.

 

[rosends]

You have no understanding of the subject that you have demonstrated in this discussion. I think a plurality of posters here would agree that your performance has failed miserably. Keep up the good work!

You keep on making things up. Be proud of your imagination.

 

[rosends]

There was exactly zero logic in that statement.

Exactly - it was your statement and I was pointing out how it made no sense.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Exactly - it was your statement and I was pointing out how it made no sense.

I will pray for you. That's all I can say. I also pray for the young minds you are going to pollute with your nonsense.

 

[MayorQuimby]

let me try again -- you seem troubled by the aspect of my question about the foods. if so, i ask you to skip that part. the other prongs hold -- if a child in utero deserves protection against harm, then is there an ethical way to allow smoking by a pregnant women?

Yes.

Smoking around actual children also harms their health in some way, but this is not illegal. Therefore, pregnant women can smoke.

No one said the unborn should be protected from all harms. We are merely saying we shouldn't murder them. You are trying to think of an absurd situation to make our position look unreasonable.