To those who've accepted Christ as their Savior..

-Cp

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A few questions:

- Do you feel "the church" is effective at fullfilling the "Great Commission"?

- Would you agree or disagree that most church goers go out of a sense of duty?

- Would you agree or disagree that most church goers go out of a sense of self-engrandizement?

- Would you generally agree or disagree that most Church services are nothing more than an over-glorified Social club?

- If you go to church on Sunday's - why do you go?
 

Mr.Conley

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I'm somewhat envious of Christians. I used to believe, but now, due to various circumstances, I've fallen off the path so to speak. In many ways it's a blessing and a curse.
 

Avatar4321

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1. I guess this depends on what Church you are talking about
2. No, i dont think people would go if it was just duty. I think people go because they want to be there.
3. not sure i understand what you mean by this one
4. No. but then i havent been to most church services
5. To feel the spirit and help people.
 
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-Cp

-Cp

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5. To feel the spirit and help people.

So they need to go to a certain destination to "feel the Spirit"?

I'd argue that what most mainstream evangelicals are feeling - assuming they have to go to a certain building - is anything but "the spirit" but more likely a sense of self-indulged euphoria..
 

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A few questions:

- Do you feel "the church" is effective at fullfilling the "Great Commission"?
I assume you mean the American Church. I think we could do A LOT more.

- Would you agree or disagree that most church goers go out of a sense of duty?

- Would you agree or disagree that most church goers go out of a sense of self-engrandizement?
Duty, yes... self-aggrandizment? Maybe some people. It's very difficult to say you know for sure what others' motives are.

- Would you generally agree or disagree that most Church services are nothing more than an over-glorified Social club?
I agree.

- If you go to church on Sundays - why do you go?
Sometimes out of a sense of duty... it isn't always fun, that's for sure. I feel I am helping in something good bc I teach, and am a part of the service. Because of this, I don't often get to hear the sermon. I like the discussions in the pre-service session. The most important thing for me is the interpersonal connections we have built with other believers. However, I wish there was a little more pressure/support in getting deeper into the Spirit. I mean, not just LEARNING stuff, but sharing stories about how we have APPLIED this stuff to our lives.
 
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dmp

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So they need to go to a certain destination to "feel the Spirit"?
Don't put words in his mouth. He didn't say that. He wrote "He goes" not "he MUST GO" in order to feel the spirit.

I'd argue that what most mainstream evangelicals are feeling - assuming they have to go to a certain building - is anything but "the spirit" but more likely a sense of self-indulged euphoria..

Then argue that - but you'd probably lose as there's no way to argue somebody is 'not' feeling or 'is' feeling something or a certain way.

I go to church because I find strength in numbers. I realize I will become like those with whom I share myself, and vice-versa. I go to church because the pastor of our church brings certian parts of my Christian life to the foreground of my mind. I go to church as an escape - a place where I know I'll have at least an hour and a half of being surrounded by people of like-mind..mostly. You can sharpshoot or nit-pick "The Church" until you're blue in the face - all that does is make one jaded and alone and spiritually weak.
 

dmp

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Sometimes out of a sense of duty... it isn't always fun, that's for sure. I feel I am helping in something good bc I teach, and am a part of the service. Because of this, I don't often get to hear the sermon. I like the discussions in the pre-service session. The most important thing for me is the interpersonal connections we have built with other believers. However, I wish there was a little more pressure/support in getting deeper into the Spirit.
Careful - I get the sense, from the tone of this thread, if you mention you 'enjoy' Church, you'll be called 'self-centered'... :)
 

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Careful - I get the sense, from the tone of this thread, if you mention you 'enjoy' Church, you'll be called 'self-centered'... :)
Well, maybe some people DO go just to get a "feel-good" rush. I know I like it when I get that. But, the main thing is, it seems to me, if we aren't applying this stuff OUTSIDE the church building, that's all it is---just a rush. I certainly forget things once I get out the door, but I hope SOME of it sticks in my mind and comes out in my actions. :)

But, Cp, I hope you aren't trying to say that that is ALL church is for people. I think, as a group in America, we ARE too complacent, because we are so comfortable. But, I have found that when something is really bothering me about another person or group of people, that is really God's way of illustrating to me what is bothering HIM about ME. :(

If we want to change the Church, we should start by changing ourselves.
 
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-Cp

-Cp

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Don't put words in his mouth. He didn't say that. He wrote "He goes" not "he MUST GO" in order to feel the spirit.

No word placement here man.... the context of the question and his answer was a "they" - as in most people....

Additionally, there is no "tone" here darin - these are simply posted as thought-provoking questions to get us to pause for a bit and ponder to ourselves as to the reasons behind the things we do under the mantra of "Christianity".. that's all..
 

dmp

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No word placement here man.... the context of the question and his answer was a "they" - as in most people....
You did place words:

avatar said:
(I go to church) To feel the spirit and help people
-Cp said:
So they need to go to a certain destination to "feel the Spirit"?
It's a logical fallacy to state "Because THIS happens (he goes to church to feel the spirit), something ELSE must be true (people must go to church to feel the spirit). Your use of the word 'so' indicates you're drawing a conclusion - because HE goes to church to feel the spirit, "People MUST go to a specified destination to feel God's spirit."



Additionally, there is no "tone" here darin - these are simply posted as thought-provoking questions to get us to pause for a bit and ponder to ourselves as to the reasons behind the things we do under the mantra of "Christianity".. that's all..
Exactly - that's the tone of this thread...the flavour. Not tone as in 'attitude'...
 

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A few questions:

- Do you feel "the church" is effective at fullfilling the "Great Commission"?
What's the "Great Commission"?

- Would you agree or disagree that most church goers go out of a sense of duty?
No. It says in the Bible that Jesus said, "where two or more are gathered in my name, there shall be power". People go to church for "fellowship". To be with other believers. To reinvigerate their faith.
- Would you agree or disagree that most church goers go out of a sense of self-engrandizement?
Speaking for myself, disagree. You're asking a loaded question anyway. Who do you expect to answer that in the affirmative.
- Would you generally agree or disagree that most Church services are nothing more than an over-glorified Social club?
"Over glorified social club"? I think that just sounds like a cheap shot. It's hardly worth answering, but, I totally disagree. I think most everyone that goes to church is pretty good people.
- If you go to church on Sunday's - why do you go?
I haven't been to church in a long, long time. But if and when I go again, it will be for the reasons I stated above.
 

Avatar4321

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So they need to go to a certain destination to "feel the Spirit"?

I'd argue that what most mainstream evangelicals are feeling - assuming they have to go to a certain building - is anything but "the spirit" but more likely a sense of self-indulged euphoria..
Well, I dont know that I would disagree its like that some places. but then im not an evangelical for a reason.
 

Avatar4321

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What's the "Great Commission"?
15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every ccreature.
16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. (Mark 16:15-16)

i would have quoted Matthew, but for some reason it wouldnt let me cut it.
 

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Hobbit

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Matthew 28:19-20 NIV

Jesus said:
Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.
I like this version better, because 'go forth and preach' is used as an excuse for those guys who like to tell everyone they're going to Hell. They have no excuse, however, when you point out that they've made no disciples.

Now, for the questions.

- Do you feel "the church" is effective at fullfilling the "Great Commission"?
Depends on the church. Many I've been to use every spare dime they can to sponsor missionaries and train their entire congregation to basically be domestic missionaries. Others stagnate because they never have any new members unless somebody has a baby.

- Would you agree or disagree that most church goers go out of a sense of duty?
Disagree. Most people I know who go to church have other motives, most of them good. I'm sure some people go out of duty, though.

- Would you agree or disagree that most church goers go out of a sense of self-engrandizement?
Disagree. Once again, some do, but I wouldn't say most.

- Would you generally agree or disagree that most Church services are nothing more than an over-glorified Social club?
Disagree. I've seen those churches before, and all churches are, at some level, a social club. However, most churches I've seen are more like, shall we say, Christian training camps. They give Christians the information and training necessary both to live a Christian life and to help bring others to Christ.

- If you go to church on Sunday's - why do you go?
To bring myself closer to God and learn more about Him and the Bible.
 

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Since I can't rep you again, I'll just say nice answers, Hobbit.
 

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A lot of Christians go to church out of believing it to be a duty..........and that's unbiblical.

Feel the Spirit.............The Spirit doesn't motivate or communicate via the emotions or feeler........but through the mind of the individual Christian. As, "Faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God.". Not, "Faith comes by "feeling", and "feeling" the Word of God.".

Some churches are basically doing their darndest to be biblical, and others aren't.

Folks should attend church out of a desire to worship God in the community of other like minded/spirited believers.

Church is also a place of fellowship with other like minded/spirited folks. A place to be possibly encouraged and prayed for and to also pray for others too. Often this once a week time also is a Christian's time to be exhorted, encouraged, by a teacher/preacher in order to get through those next 7 days until they can fellowship again with others of same-belief-faith.

I don't know if "No man is an island.", was a quote by a Christian, but it is applicable to the Christian, as biblically St. Paul, the disciple said that all Christians are part of the Body of Christ, here on earth. Each individual believer is one important part of the body as a whole. Paul likened one believer as the "eye" and another as another body part metaphorically. He went on to say that each part needs the other parts to function, and contribute so that the body(all Christians) can function healthily. Paul even said that the one body part can't say to a different body part, "I have no need of you!".

Yet, the whole body of believers is also referred to as the "bride" of Christ. So actually individually, and corporately, Christians need to maintain a fruitful relationship with Christ.........via prayer, study of scripture, learning from other believers, being acceptable to correction from others, sharing their faith when it's the right time.

Evangelizing should be motivated by a desire to see/have others enjoy or partake in the joy, peace, security, and love that God has shared with onesself through a relationship with Christ. Evangelizing is not a duty, so much as a natural desire, motivated by the outpouring of God's love through Christ to the individual Christian. Love should motivate any and all things that a Christian does in their lives. Of course that is utopian in hope, as Christians will , do things not always with the motivation of God's love, but for other reasons that aren't biblical.

Christians can unrightly be motivated by greed, search for identity, jealousy, accolades, etc.. First of all, God's love needs to engender all actions.......but in this imperfect world, Christians are still being perfected, and will do things with the wrong motivation either willfully or by ignorance.

Just as John said in one of his Epistles.......anyone(referring to Christians) that claims that they never sin, is a liar.

Basically, we humans all do "things" based on needs, either perceived objectively or subjectively. Some of these needs are erroneous, and some aren't. We are a needy species. We aren't equipped with claws and fangs to protect ourselves from predators, or fir to stay warm in the Winter. We find sufficiency in many ways, but most of those ways are temporal, and usually don't last. We often look in the wrong places for sufficiency. Anyway, Christians have a complete total sufficiency for their lives in Christ, Jesus, yet even they(Christians) will lose sight of that and fall into the temporal trap of "things" to meet their needs.

Attending church can be a means to meet an insufficiency, or it can be a means bolster a relationship that's already established in God, through Christ.
 

5stringJeff

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A few questions:

- Do you feel "the church" is effective at fullfilling the "Great Commission"?

- Would you agree or disagree that most church goers go out of a sense of duty?

- Would you agree or disagree that most church goers go out of a sense of self-engrandizement?

- Would you generally agree or disagree that most Church services are nothing more than an over-glorified Social club?

- If you go to church on Sunday's - why do you go?
1. Yes, there are new converts to Christ all over the world, and although we may not see that progress in America (especially in WA), that doesn't mean it's not happening. The Church is growing in places like Africa and Asia.
2. Many probably go out of a sense of duty. But, then again, we are commanded to remain in fellowship with other Christians (Hebrews 10:25). But there is much more to going to church than fulfilling a commandment.
3. I would say that a few are, but most are not.
4. Some may be, but many are not. If your church is that way, may I suggest looking for a different congregation to join.
5. I go to worship God, to fellowship with other Christians, and to learn more about how to walk with God and live a Christian life.
 

Abbey Normal

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Going to church helps me keep my eyes on the prize. Goodness knows there are enough distractions the rest of the week. Church has a way of focusing your mind. And for me, singing and worshipping with fellow Christians with a strong contemporary worship team is the best way to feel close to God.

I think it can become a social club if you let it. Anytime a group of people are together there will have to be a social aspect, but no one forces you to join in. I have learned to avoid situations and churches that do not feed my soul.
 

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