To the NeverTrumpers....

[Brain357]

Why do you think the military needs rebuilding? We spend more than the next 10 countries combined. That will sure add to the debt.

Why do you think immigration is such a big problem? Certain industries sure like the cheap labor.

Because Obama has decimated our military.

I don't think immigration is a problem. I think illegal immigration is a problem.

Really? Please document how our military is decimated. Please use actual facts.

Ok, then what is the problem with illegal immigration. Please be specific about what issues are actually happening.

 

[charwin95]

charwin95 ...I don't support Trump's trade policies. There are several things I disagree with Trump on but I disagree with Hillary on everything. If I only voted for candidates who I agree with 100%, I wouldn't have voted for a president since Reagan.

I actually like some of Trump's proposals better than McCain or Romney's. Returning education to the states, lowering corporate tax rates, rebuilding the military, enforcing border security and aggressively attacking the illegal immigration problem are all areas I agree with Trump on.

The bottom line is, either Hillary or Trump will be elected on Nov. 8th. I find the prospects of Hillary as president to be... deplorable.

I don't agree with Hilary either but Trump proposals from taxes, immigration, economy to foreign policy are blasted by lots of experts. That is where I based from. Not from his celebrity status.
He is saying about all of those good stuff just to get elected. And he lied every time he open his mouth. He lied 3 times yesterday and today. And that's okay for you guys.

 

[theHawk]

It will force companies to manufacture in the US instead of using Chinese slave labor. Tariffs do work. China puts tariffs on US goods going to China in order to protect their own industries. The US already has some 12,000 specific tariffs.

Trump economic plan is rated F. Blasted by independent well know economists and GOPs. Just because it came from Trump doesn't mean its right. Trump economic idea is bad for America. If he is elected get ready for high prices on ALL commodities including health care. Be very careful what you ask for.
The idea of moving manufacturing jobs back to US is nothing but delusional. Labor in America is extremely very high compared to any country. That's the main reason people like me went overseas in the first place.


Trump’s love of tariffs may be the wrong move | New York Post

50 Ways Trump Is Wrong on Trade

Nothing could be more boring to write about. I can hear you snoring already. But if Donald Trump becomes president, you will hear that word a lot. You’ll especially hear it in connection with China.

Tariffs are the taxes placed on imported goods, usually when the other country has done something you don’t like.
Tariffs and taxes have caused wars in the past.
You know all about the Boston Tea Party, which led to the American Revolution. The Brits wanted to tax the colonists’ tea.

Trump, who will accept the Republican Party nomination for president Thursday, has said that he’d like to impose 35 percent to 45 percent tariffs on goods coming into the US from Mexico and China.
A group of reporters from The Post met with Trump a few weeks ago at his self-named tower in Manhattan, and I asked him specifically about the punishment he plans for China.

He didn’t back off the idea of a tariff. The Chinese, he said, want to do business with us and they will pay the tax. I pointed out that it could lead to a trade war — we tax them, they tax us — and then, just to top it off, the Chinese would start stealing more of our technology than they already have.
Trump seemed unfazed. And I hope he’s right to be calm about this.

What a surprise, the establishment says it won't work. They tell you "we must send jobs overseas" and you believe. Clearly the leftists only care about the bottom line for corporations, and care nothing about the employees and workers in the US.

Clearly you don't understand the economy or trade. Many believe tariffs were the cause of the great depression. That is how bad they are.

Except we and most other countries already use tariffs of some kind or another to protect their industries and workers. So why isn't the whole world in a depression? I hate buying cheap Chinese crap that breaks, I'd much rather pay more for something high quality and American made.

You don't understand tariffs or trade just like Trump..... It's been proven over and over that Trump doesn't have a clue about trade and tariffs.
You want pay higher prices just because of your fascination to Trump..... That's mighty of you speaking for the rest of America. We are not talking couple of bucks here. As an example lettuce is about $5/head (not sure bc I don't go to grocery)...... How much do you think it cost if Trump is the president?
Just imagine how much the cost of ALL goods if Trump is the president.
The sad part is ........... It doesn't matter what Trump is blurting lies or wrong .......... Trumpeters like you is so used to it believe him anyway. You are basing your future based from that.

You stil can't acknowledge much less refute that we already use tariffs on certain products. It works for them, why not a few more industries that will protect US jobs and bring jobs back?

You keep repeating yourself over and over that some lame ass economists are against tariffs, when they have no plan to bring jobs back to America.

I'm not saying we should tax/tariff everything from China. We should be applying them on goods to make it a level playing field. The Chinese don't have labor laws or environmental laws like us, so we basically reward them for shitting all over the environment and treating their workers like slaves. Until China follows the same environmental and labor laws as the rest of the civilized world, they should be taxed the difference.

 

[Boss]

Please share links by good economists that say Trump will not greatly increase the debt. ALL the sources I can find say he will greatly add to the debt.

Nope... I don't play the "cite" game. I know how that works. I don't have a problem linking you to official government websites to confirm the data on tax revenues and national debt. Either side, right or left, can find links to "experts" who support their viewpoint and then it just becomes a pissing contest over the sources. So what is the point of me posting links that you are going to tear down the credibility of as soon as I do? You want an economist who agrees with Trump's policies? Larry Kudlow. Peter Morici. Paul Krugman.

I will also point out that Ronald Reagan faced as similar problem. Economists of the day said his policies would be an economic catastrophe. Reagan proved economists aren't always right.

So nobody who can be taken seriously supports trumps policies. I didn't think so. Reagan tripled the debt. You live in fantasy land.

As I predicted, you immediately shifted your argument to attacking the credibility of the sources. You said you didn't know of any economist who supported Trump's policies and challenged me to present one. I gave you three noted economists and now you want to dismiss them as people who can't be taken seriously. So the bottom line here is that you are only going to accept things said by economists you agree with. Thank you for proving my point that you are a partisan hack.

Reagan and the Democrat congress tripled the debt when the debt was smaller than Obama's average yearly deficits. Let the record also show that you've now abandoned your arguments that Bill Clinton balanced the budget or that tax increases contribute to the debt because the data shows these are untrue statements.

 

[Boss]

Based from EXPERTS not from Trump or followers..... this country will be screwed up both foreign and domestic.
At least with Hillary we might have stability and steady hands. You only voting from Trump because of your fascination. That's your future.

Well, read the OP... I am still technically an undecided voter. I don't know that I am going to vote for Trump. If I do, it certainly won't be because of any fascination with him. If I listened to "the experts" then I would have never voted for Ronald Reagan. Not that Trump is Reagan, but the experts are often wrong. The experts predicted a Reagan presidency would be a foreign and domestic disaster. The experts predicted Jimmy Carter would win re-election in a landslide. The experts told us the only GOP candidates who could win were Bob Dole, John McCain and Mitt Romney. The experts said Trump wasn't a serious candidate and could never win the GOP nomination.

Hillary is corrupt and crooked to the core. She currently has at least 5 FBI investigations swirling around her and she has had criminal investigations swirling around her for nearly all her illustrious 40 year political career. She is the only major party presidential candidate in history to run while under FBI investigation. She will not bring stability any more than she brought stability as Secretary of State. The only "steady hand" she has is the one that corruptly takes money for influence under the tables.

Aside from her overwhelming corruption, every single word that comes out of her mouth is from the radical ideological playbook of Saul Alinsky and is an affront to our Constitution and republic. Her own stated policy positions would put into danger our 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th and 10th Amendments. Not to mention, her election would throw the country into a constitutional crisis because she is likely to be indicted on criminal charges.

 

[Boss]

Really? Please document how our military is decimated. Please use actual facts.

Ok, then what is the problem with illegal immigration. Please be specific about what issues are actually happening.

Look... I don't know why you're not understanding this but I don't play the liberal game of presenting things for you to knock down or dismiss because you don't agree. I don't really have the patience for your nonsense. The Heritage Foundation recently did an assessment of our military and found it lacking in virtually all aspects. Our equipment is worn out or obsolete. Maintenance is being deferred. Budgets have been cut. Overall readiness for deployment is at a historic low. Couple this with the ridiculous "social engineering" happening, where we now have policies shaped around accommodating transsexuals and other such nonsense, and anyone who is serious understands that Obama has decimated our military.

Illegal immigration is causing problems in virtually every border state with regard to essential services. States are going broke trying to provide services to people who don't contribute to the tax base. Illegal immigrants drive the cost of labor down everywhere and cost us tens of thousands of jobs. Violent crimes by illegal aliens are on the rise in "sanctuary" cities and elsewhere. We have no way of knowing how many "illegal aliens" are actually radical Islamic terrorists infiltrating our borders. Not only are these things happening but whack-a-doodle liberals are actually making these people legal voters in some places as fast as they can by handing out legal identification. This has to end and so far, Trump has been the only candidate who has taken a firm and bold stand against it.

 

[EvilCat Breath]

Any battle plan shaped around the desires of transsexuals and homosexuals is a plan designed to fail.

 

[Brain357]

Trump economic plan is rated F. Blasted by independent well know economists and GOPs. Just because it came from Trump doesn't mean its right. Trump economic idea is bad for America. If he is elected get ready for high prices on ALL commodities including health care. Be very careful what you ask for.
The idea of moving manufacturing jobs back to US is nothing but delusional. Labor in America is extremely very high compared to any country. That's the main reason people like me went overseas in the first place.


Trump’s love of tariffs may be the wrong move | New York Post

50 Ways Trump Is Wrong on Trade

Nothing could be more boring to write about. I can hear you snoring already. But if Donald Trump becomes president, you will hear that word a lot. You’ll especially hear it in connection with China.

Tariffs are the taxes placed on imported goods, usually when the other country has done something you don’t like.
Tariffs and taxes have caused wars in the past.
You know all about the Boston Tea Party, which led to the American Revolution. The Brits wanted to tax the colonists’ tea.

Trump, who will accept the Republican Party nomination for president Thursday, has said that he’d like to impose 35 percent to 45 percent tariffs on goods coming into the US from Mexico and China.
A group of reporters from The Post met with Trump a few weeks ago at his self-named tower in Manhattan, and I asked him specifically about the punishment he plans for China.

He didn’t back off the idea of a tariff. The Chinese, he said, want to do business with us and they will pay the tax. I pointed out that it could lead to a trade war — we tax them, they tax us — and then, just to top it off, the Chinese would start stealing more of our technology than they already have.
Trump seemed unfazed. And I hope he’s right to be calm about this.

What a surprise, the establishment says it won't work. They tell you "we must send jobs overseas" and you believe. Clearly the leftists only care about the bottom line for corporations, and care nothing about the employees and workers in the US.

Clearly you don't understand the economy or trade. Many believe tariffs were the cause of the great depression. That is how bad they are.

Except we and most other countries already use tariffs of some kind or another to protect their industries and workers. So why isn't the whole world in a depression? I hate buying cheap Chinese crap that breaks, I'd much rather pay more for something high quality and American made.

You don't understand tariffs or trade just like Trump..... It's been proven over and over that Trump doesn't have a clue about trade and tariffs.
You want pay higher prices just because of your fascination to Trump..... That's mighty of you speaking for the rest of America. We are not talking couple of bucks here. As an example lettuce is about $5/head (not sure bc I don't go to grocery)...... How much do you think it cost if Trump is the president?
Just imagine how much the cost of ALL goods if Trump is the president.
The sad part is ........... It doesn't matter what Trump is blurting lies or wrong .......... Trumpeters like you is so used to it believe him anyway. You are basing your future based from that.

You stil can't acknowledge much less refute that we already use tariffs on certain products. It works for them, why not a few more industries that will protect US jobs and bring jobs back?

You keep repeating yourself over and over that some lame ass economists are against tariffs, when they have no plan to bring jobs back to America.

I'm not saying we should tax/tariff everything from China. We should be applying them on goods to make it a level playing field. The Chinese don't have labor laws or environmental laws like us, so we basically reward them for shitting all over the environment and treating their workers like slaves. Until China follows the same environmental and labor laws as the rest of the civilized world, they should be taxed the difference.

But they aren't really working. They protect one industry, but hurt the economy as a whole more than they help.

 

[Brain357]

Please share links by good economists that say Trump will not greatly increase the debt. ALL the sources I can find say he will greatly add to the debt.

Nope... I don't play the "cite" game. I know how that works. I don't have a problem linking you to official government websites to confirm the data on tax revenues and national debt. Either side, right or left, can find links to "experts" who support their viewpoint and then it just becomes a pissing contest over the sources. So what is the point of me posting links that you are going to tear down the credibility of as soon as I do? You want an economist who agrees with Trump's policies? Larry Kudlow. Peter Morici. Paul Krugman.

I will also point out that Ronald Reagan faced as similar problem. Economists of the day said his policies would be an economic catastrophe. Reagan proved economists aren't always right.

So nobody who can be taken seriously supports trumps policies. I didn't think so. Reagan tripled the debt. You live in fantasy land.

As I predicted, you immediately shifted your argument to attacking the credibility of the sources. You said you didn't know of any economist who supported Trump's policies and challenged me to present one. I gave you three noted economists and now you want to dismiss them as people who can't be taken seriously. So the bottom line here is that you are only going to accept things said by economists you agree with. Thank you for proving my point that you are a partisan hack.

Reagan and the Democrat congress tripled the debt when the debt was smaller than Obama's average yearly deficits. Let the record also show that you've now abandoned your arguments that Bill Clinton balanced the budget or that tax increases contribute to the debt because the data shows these are untrue statements.

Kudlow is an economic advisor for Trump. He isn't going to say the plan is a disaster. Morici works for Breitbart.

Here is Krugman on Trumps trade policy:
More broadly, Trump’s whole view on trade is that other people are taking advantage of us — that it’s all about dominance, and that we’re weak. And even if you think we’ve pushed globalization too far, even if you are worried about the effects of trade on income distribution, that’s just a foolish way to think about the problem.

So don’t score Trump as somehow winning on trade. Yes, he blustered more confidently on that subject than on anything else. But he was talking absolute garbage even there.
http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2016/09/27/trump-on-trade/?_r=0

Krugman on Kudlow:
For those who don’t follow such things, Mr. Kudlow has a record of being wrong about, well, everything. In 2005 he ridiculed “bubbleheads who expect housing-price crashes in Las Vegas or Naples, Florida, to bring down the consumer, the rest of the economy, and the entire stock market” — which was exactly what happened. In 2007 he predicted three years of “Goldilocks” prosperity. And on and on.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/13/opinion/trump-and-taxes.html

Krugman on Trump:
Donald Trump gave a speech on economic policy last week. Just about every factual assertion he made was wrong, but I’m not going to do a line-by-line critique. What I want to do, instead, is talk about the general thrust: the candidate’s claim to be on the side of American workers.
Is Mr. Trump for any of these things? Not as far as anyone can tell. And it should go without saying that a populist agenda won’t be possible if we’re also pushing through a Trump-style tax plan, which would offer the top 1 percent huge tax cuts and add trillions to the national debt.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/04/opinion/trump-trade-and-workers.html

I give you nonpartisan and you give 2 completely partisan economists and one who seems to agree trump is a disaster..

 

[Brain357]

Really? Please document how our military is decimated. Please use actual facts.

Ok, then what is the problem with illegal immigration. Please be specific about what issues are actually happening.

Look... I don't know why you're not understanding this but I don't play the liberal game of presenting things for you to knock down or dismiss because you don't agree. I don't really have the patience for your nonsense. The Heritage Foundation recently did an assessment of our military and found it lacking in virtually all aspects. Our equipment is worn out or obsolete. Maintenance is being deferred. Budgets have been cut. Overall readiness for deployment is at a historic low. Couple this with the ridiculous "social engineering" happening, where we now have policies shaped around accommodating transsexuals and other such nonsense, and anyone who is serious understands that Obama has decimated our military.

Illegal immigration is causing problems in virtually every border state with regard to essential services. States are going broke trying to provide services to people who don't contribute to the tax base. Illegal immigrants drive the cost of labor down everywhere and cost us tens of thousands of jobs. Violent crimes by illegal aliens are on the rise in "sanctuary" cities and elsewhere. We have no way of knowing how many "illegal aliens" are actually radical Islamic terrorists infiltrating our borders. Not only are these things happening but whack-a-doodle liberals are actually making these people legal voters in some places as fast as they can by handing out legal identification. This has to end and so far, Trump has been the only candidate who has taken a firm and bold stand against it.

Who are you worried about? We spend more than the next 10 countries combined. We will collapse economically due to the debt long before we are beaten militarily. No other country has near the ability we have.

I haven't noticed any real issues with immigration. I'm lawful so I'm all for sending any back you catch, but not rounding them up. The wall is just silliness. Immigration sure isn't worth electing a guy who will put us in recession and more deeply in debt.

 

[Boss]

I gave you three economists who have spoken favorably of Trump's economic policies. You said you couldn't find any. Now you're trying to dismiss two on the basis they support Trump... does that not sound fucked-up to you? So I was supposed to find economists who don't support Trump but think Trump's economic policies are good? I can see at least one reason you might have trouble finding those... just sayin'.

And I will point out again, if Krugman believes tax cuts will "add trillions to the national debt" then he is an idiot who doesn't know history. Tax cuts historically produce more tax revenue so they simply can't contribute to the debt.

 

[Brain357]

I gave you three economists who have spoken favorably of Trump's economic policies. You said you couldn't find any. Now you're trying to dismiss two on the basis they support Trump... does that not sound fucked-up to you? So I was supposed to find economists who don't support Trump but think Trump's economic policies are good? I can see at least one reason you might have trouble finding those... just sayin'.

And I will point out again, if Krugman believes tax cuts will "add trillions to the national debt" then he is an idiot who doesn't know history. Tax cuts historically produce more tax revenue so they simply can't contribute to the debt.

You gave 2 who essentially work for the trump campaign. That is different than just support. Krugman rightly thinks trump will be a disaster and clearly knows kudlow is a joke.

 

[Boss]

Really? Please document how our military is decimated. Please use actual facts.

Ok, then what is the problem with illegal immigration. Please be specific about what issues are actually happening.

Look... I don't know why you're not understanding this but I don't play the liberal game of presenting things for you to knock down or dismiss because you don't agree. I don't really have the patience for your nonsense. The Heritage Foundation recently did an assessment of our military and found it lacking in virtually all aspects. Our equipment is worn out or obsolete. Maintenance is being deferred. Budgets have been cut. Overall readiness for deployment is at a historic low. Couple this with the ridiculous "social engineering" happening, where we now have policies shaped around accommodating transsexuals and other such nonsense, and anyone who is serious understands that Obama has decimated our military.

Illegal immigration is causing problems in virtually every border state with regard to essential services. States are going broke trying to provide services to people who don't contribute to the tax base. Illegal immigrants drive the cost of labor down everywhere and cost us tens of thousands of jobs. Violent crimes by illegal aliens are on the rise in "sanctuary" cities and elsewhere. We have no way of knowing how many "illegal aliens" are actually radical Islamic terrorists infiltrating our borders. Not only are these things happening but whack-a-doodle liberals are actually making these people legal voters in some places as fast as they can by handing out legal identification. This has to end and so far, Trump has been the only candidate who has taken a firm and bold stand against it.

Who are you worried about? We spend more than the next 10 countries combined. We will collapse economically due to the debt long before we are beaten militarily. No other country has near the ability we have.

I haven't noticed any real issues with immigration. I'm lawful so I'm all for sending any back you catch, but not rounding them up. The wall is just silliness. Immigration sure isn't worth electing a guy who will put us in recession and more deeply in debt.

1) I don't really care how much more we spend on our military than other countries. That is not a factor for me. According to Heritage, we are challenged if we should have to deal with multiple conflicts at the same time.

2) What you have noticed doesn't factor in to my database of knowledge whatsoever. I do not form my educated opinions based on things you've noticed or what you think is silly.

As I said before, if recessions could be controlled by politicians, we'd never have them. Recessions happen as the result of a myriad of economic factors, none of which the president can really control. His/her policies may exacerbate the situation but they don't cause or cure recessions.

Electing someone who is not corrupt and under FBI criminal investigation seems like a good idea to me.

 

[Brain357]

Really? Please document how our military is decimated. Please use actual facts.

Ok, then what is the problem with illegal immigration. Please be specific about what issues are actually happening.

Look... I don't know why you're not understanding this but I don't play the liberal game of presenting things for you to knock down or dismiss because you don't agree. I don't really have the patience for your nonsense. The Heritage Foundation recently did an assessment of our military and found it lacking in virtually all aspects. Our equipment is worn out or obsolete. Maintenance is being deferred. Budgets have been cut. Overall readiness for deployment is at a historic low. Couple this with the ridiculous "social engineering" happening, where we now have policies shaped around accommodating transsexuals and other such nonsense, and anyone who is serious understands that Obama has decimated our military.

Illegal immigration is causing problems in virtually every border state with regard to essential services. States are going broke trying to provide services to people who don't contribute to the tax base. Illegal immigrants drive the cost of labor down everywhere and cost us tens of thousands of jobs. Violent crimes by illegal aliens are on the rise in "sanctuary" cities and elsewhere. We have no way of knowing how many "illegal aliens" are actually radical Islamic terrorists infiltrating our borders. Not only are these things happening but whack-a-doodle liberals are actually making these people legal voters in some places as fast as they can by handing out legal identification. This has to end and so far, Trump has been the only candidate who has taken a firm and bold stand against it.

Who are you worried about? We spend more than the next 10 countries combined. We will collapse economically due to the debt long before we are beaten militarily. No other country has near the ability we have.

I haven't noticed any real issues with immigration. I'm lawful so I'm all for sending any back you catch, but not rounding them up. The wall is just silliness. Immigration sure isn't worth electing a guy who will put us in recession and more deeply in debt.

1) I don't really care how much more we spend on our military than other countries. That is not a factor for me. According to Heritage, we are challenged if we should have to deal with multiple conflicts at the same time.

2) What you have noticed doesn't factor in to my database of knowledge whatsoever. I do not form my educated opinions based on things you've noticed or what you think is silly.

As I said before, if recessions could be controlled by politicians, we'd never have them. Recessions happen as the result of a myriad of economic factors, none of which the president can really control. His/her policies may exacerbate the situation but they don't cause or cure recessions.

Electing someone who is not corrupt and under FBI criminal investigation seems like a good idea to me.

Heritage is extremely right wing and so of course that is what they have determined. We easily have the strongest military and we have lots of allies. Spending more on the military while deeply in debt is not financially responsible.

Trumps tariff policy would put us in a recession. Just the fact he wants to do that should be enough to not support him.

 

[Boss]

You gave 2 who essentially work for the trump campaign. That is different than just support. Krugman rightly thinks trump will be a disaster and clearly knows kudlow is a joke.

As far as I know, neither of them are on Trump's payroll. They support Trump, but you'd expect that from economists who favor his economic policies. It's also not surprising they've advised Trump since they agree with his economic policies.

The little Krugman smears Kudlow thing just goes to show that economists do not collectively agree on anything... which is a point I made to you earlier. It was indeed a minor point but thanks for conceding that as well.

 

[Boss]

Heritage is extremely right wing....

And THIS is exactly the way Liberals argue. The ONLY information you will accept are left-wing radical sources who support your world views. Nothing else is allowed to penetrate your granite-like heads. You reject anything that isn't a radical left-wing source and then proceed to claim that "everyone" agrees with you.

 

[Boss]

Trumps tariff policy would put us in a recession. Just the fact he wants to do that should be enough to not support him.

No... His policies might be bad for the economy but they will not put is in a recession by themselves. So that's not a fact. And IF there were another viable candidate who could win the election, then it might be a reason not to support him. As it stands, the only candidate who can defeat him is under criminal investigation by the FBI and will likely be indicted.

 

[Brain357]

Heritage is extremely right wing....

And THIS is exactly the way Liberals argue. The ONLY information you will accept are left-wing radical sources who support your world views. Nothing else is allowed to penetrate your granite-like heads. You reject anything that isn't a radical left-wing source and then proceed to claim that "everyone" agrees with you.

I believe in being financially responsible. When we are deeply in debt we shouldn't spend more on the military. Our military is easily the strongest in the world.

 

[Brain357]

Trumps tariff policy would put us in a recession. Just the fact he wants to do that should be enough to not support him.

No... His policies might be bad for the economy but they will not put is in a recession by themselves. So that's not a fact. And IF there were another viable candidate who could win the election, then it might be a reason not to support him. As it stands, the only candidate who can defeat him is under criminal investigation by the FBI and will likely be indicted.

Very unlikely to happen.

 

[Brain357]

Trumps tariff policy would put us in a recession. Just the fact he wants to do that should be enough to not support him.

No... His policies might be bad for the economy but they will not put is in a recession by themselves. So that's not a fact. And IF there were another viable candidate who could win the election, then it might be a reason not to support him. As it stands, the only candidate who can defeat him is under criminal investigation by the FBI and will likely be indicted.

What we know is that economists agree the other candidate will be much more fiscally responsible.