The Worlds Deadliest Attack Helicopter?

[Vastator]

As if the unparalleled Hind wasn’t fearsome enough; along comes the Ka-52...

While their designs may be more intricate than they can produce in the mass quantities we can; there is no denying the ingenuity of Russian military engineering. Has the Apache been rendered obsolete?

 

[Frankeneinstein]

While their designs may be more intricate than they can produce in the mass quantities we can; there is no denying the ingenuity of Russian military engineering. Has the Apache been rendered obsolete?

That is pretty awesome...but didn't the russians/soviets already have another helicopter that edged out the apache, and haven't stingers made helicopters pretty much a negligible item? the taliban used stingers to turn the tide against the soviets in afghanistan

 

[Tijn Von Ingersleben]

Flight Lieutenant Zabunda would disagree.

 

[Vastator]

While their designs may be more intricate than they can produce in the mass quantities we can; there is no denying the ingenuity of Russian military engineering. Has the Apache been rendered obsolete?

That is pretty awesome...but didn't the russians/soviets already have another helicopter that edged out the apache, and haven't stingers made helicopters pretty much a negligible item? the taliban used stingers to turn the tide against the soviets in afghanistan

Electronic countermeasures, and flares are an ongoing battle waged against missile guidance systems. By the end of the Soviet/Afghan conflict all the hinds had countermeasures in place. However the damage had been done. Too little. Too late I suppose. But as flying machines go; those Russkies know how to make a damn capable aircraft.

 

[Frankeneinstein]

those Russkies know how to make a damn capable aircraft.

Sho nuff do

 

[Vastator]

Nick-named the “Alligator”... Tell me that’s not a cocky dig at American helicopter design!

 

[Weatherman2020]

Russian built hardware is crap. Really.

 

[Vastator]

Russian built hardware is crap. Really.

Care to offer any examples? The AK bucks your suggestion. Then there is the meager ability to reliably launch people into space...

 

[Unkotare]

Russian helicopter crash: Mi-8 crashes, 18 dead, mostly oil workers

 

[Unkotare]

https://www.smh.com.au/world/europe...terrible-aviation-record-20190508-p51l2l.html

 

[Flash]

Russian built hardware is crap. Really.

Care to offer any examples? The AK bucks your suggestion. Then there is the meager ability to reliably launch people into space...

The AK-47 was really a shitty weapon, contrary to the bullshit myths. Crummy sights, inaccurate as hell, can't fire more than a couple of mags of F-A and yes it does jam. It is a peasant gun.

The newest AK-74 variation has copied all the features that make the M-16 platform a better weapon system.

Comparing the AK-47 to the M-16 platform is like comparing the Mosin Nagant to the Garand. The Garand was far superior.

As far as launching people into space you also have to safely return them. The Russians didn't do that very well.

 

[Unkotare]

https://www.smh.com.au/world/europe...terrible-aviation-record-20190508-p51l2l.html

 

[Vastator]

Russian built hardware is crap. Really.

Care to offer any examples? The AK bucks your suggestion. Then there is the meager ability to reliably launch people into space...

The AK-47 was really a shitty weapon, contrary to the bullshit myths. Crummy sights, inaccurate as hell, can't fire more than a couple of mags of F-A and yes it does jam. It is a peasant gun.

The newest AK-74 variation has copied all the features that make the M-16 platform a better weapon system.

Comparing the AK-47 to the M-16 platform is like comparing the Mosin Nagant to the Garand. The Garand was far superior.

As far as launching people into space you also have to safely return them. The Russians didn't do that very well.

The modern M-16 round was developed to emulate the ballistic performance of the soviet 5.54 round. The “poison bullet. At actual real world combat distances there is no appreciable difference between the rifles, or accuracy of the rounds. The M-16 platform is more accurate at a distance. But inside typical distance of engagement; it’s a non-issue.

 

[Weatherman2020]

Russian built hardware is crap. Really.

Care to offer any examples? The AK bucks your suggestion. Then there is the meager ability to reliably launch people into space...

The AK is low tech with decades of experience behind it.
For your example, the downing of KAL007, Russian interceptors couldn’t even find the 747. They were about to turn back bingo fuel when they detected it and shot it down. Russian ships and aircraft are just not well engineered and the materials are subpar.

Also, got to go inside a 70’s Soviet attack sub for a first hand view, just wasn’t impressed.

 

[harmonica]

As if the unparalleled Hind wasn’t fearsome enough; along comes the Ka-52...

While their designs may be more intricate than they can produce in the mass quantities we can; there is no denying the ingenuity of Russian military engineering. Has the Apache been rendered obsolete?

1. the Ka was developed after the Apache
2. attack heliocopters are part of a military system-that help protect/enhance each other--an example is the AWACS exponentially enhances ALL the military systems involved
3. the Russians high tech systems were defeated in Afghanistan and the US high tech systems were ''defeated'' in Vietnam
the US high tech systems were victorious in PG1/Iran Jan 2020/etc
high tech SEALS failed in Grenada and Panama
high tech SEALS were victorious killing Osama
4. pilot, troop, unit, and military training also effect the effectiveness of a weapon

..a mediocre wepon in the hands of a trained motivated soldier/Marine/etc is just as
effective [ if not more ] as a high tech weapon in the hands of a mediocre soldier/etc

..I wish I had the link, but I think an Israeli was asked if they would've been as OVERWHELMINGLY victorious in the Syrian Air War if they [ the Israelis ] had the outdated MIGs instead of the F15s----he said it's not the weapon, it's the pilot

..I was in the USMC for 8 years..training/motivation/etc is very critical
...training exercises involving the different units-air/land/sea ---are very critical

no--it's not obsolete

 

[Silver Cat]

As if the unparalleled Hind wasn’t fearsome enough; along comes the Ka-52...

While their designs may be more intricate than they can produce in the mass quantities we can; there is no denying the ingenuity of Russian military engineering. Has the Apache been rendered obsolete?

1. the Ka was developed after the Apache
2. attack heliocopters are part of a military system-that help protect/enhance each other--an example is the AWACS exponentially enhances ALL the military systems involved
3. the Russians high tech systems were defeated in Afghanistan and the US high tech systems were ''defeated'' in Vietnam
the US high tech systems were victorious in PG1/Iran Jan 2020/etc
high tech SEALS failed in Grenada and Panama
high tech SEALS were victorious killing Osama
4. pilot, troop, unit, and military training also effect the effectiveness of a weapon

..a mediocre wepon in the hands of a trained motivated soldier/Marine/etc is just as
effective [ if not more ] as a high tech weapon in the hands of a mediocre soldier/etc

..I wish I had the link, but I think an Israeli was asked if they would've been as OVERWHELMINGLY victorious in the Syrian Air War if they [ the Israelis ] had the outdated MIGs instead of the F15s----he said it's not the weapon, it's the pilot

..I was in the USMC for 8 years..training/motivation/etc is very critical
...training exercises involving the different units-air/land/sea ---are very critical

no--it's not obsolete

Yes. Sure. But lets try to imagine the abstract situation. Year 2025, there is a Civil War in the United Kingdom. Both sides are equally trained, motivated, have equal weapon.
You is a leader of one side, and you have to choose, what helicopters you will buy - 12 units of AH-64D or 12 units of Ka-52. What would you preffer if it is not a political question?

 

[harmonica]

As if the unparalleled Hind wasn’t fearsome enough; along comes the Ka-52...

While their designs may be more intricate than they can produce in the mass quantities we can; there is no denying the ingenuity of Russian military engineering. Has the Apache been rendered obsolete?

1. the Ka was developed after the Apache
2. attack heliocopters are part of a military system-that help protect/enhance each other--an example is the AWACS exponentially enhances ALL the military systems involved
3. the Russians high tech systems were defeated in Afghanistan and the US high tech systems were ''defeated'' in Vietnam
the US high tech systems were victorious in PG1/Iran Jan 2020/etc
high tech SEALS failed in Grenada and Panama
high tech SEALS were victorious killing Osama
4. pilot, troop, unit, and military training also effect the effectiveness of a weapon

..a mediocre wepon in the hands of a trained motivated soldier/Marine/etc is just as
effective [ if not more ] as a high tech weapon in the hands of a mediocre soldier/etc

..I wish I had the link, but I think an Israeli was asked if they would've been as OVERWHELMINGLY victorious in the Syrian Air War if they [ the Israelis ] had the outdated MIGs instead of the F15s----he said it's not the weapon, it's the pilot

..I was in the USMC for 8 years..training/motivation/etc is very critical
...training exercises involving the different units-air/land/sea ---are very critical

no--it's not obsolete

Yes. Sure. But lets try to imagine the abstract situation. Year 2025, there is a Civil War in the United Kingdom. Both sides are equally trained, motivated, have equal weapon.
You is a leader of one side, and you have to choose, what helicopters you will buy - 12 units of AH-64D or 12 units of Ka-52. What would you preffer if it is not a political question?

.....CIVIL war???!!!?? in the UK?? who is fighting who??!! ...the Scots vs the Brits? can you at least make the scenario believable....like maybe conflict in Bosnia or something....'''equal weapon'' -- what does that mean?
...the US will have whatever weapons systems that are necessary

 

[Silver Cat]

As if the unparalleled Hind wasn’t fearsome enough; along comes the Ka-52...

While their designs may be more intricate than they can produce in the mass quantities we can; there is no denying the ingenuity of Russian military engineering. Has the Apache been rendered obsolete?

1. the Ka was developed after the Apache
2. attack heliocopters are part of a military system-that help protect/enhance each other--an example is the AWACS exponentially enhances ALL the military systems involved
3. the Russians high tech systems were defeated in Afghanistan and the US high tech systems were ''defeated'' in Vietnam
the US high tech systems were victorious in PG1/Iran Jan 2020/etc
high tech SEALS failed in Grenada and Panama
high tech SEALS were victorious killing Osama
4. pilot, troop, unit, and military training also effect the effectiveness of a weapon

..a mediocre wepon in the hands of a trained motivated soldier/Marine/etc is just as
effective [ if not more ] as a high tech weapon in the hands of a mediocre soldier/etc

..I wish I had the link, but I think an Israeli was asked if they would've been as OVERWHELMINGLY victorious in the Syrian Air War if they [ the Israelis ] had the outdated MIGs instead of the F15s----he said it's not the weapon, it's the pilot

..I was in the USMC for 8 years..training/motivation/etc is very critical
...training exercises involving the different units-air/land/sea ---are very critical

no--it's not obsolete

Yes. Sure. But lets try to imagine the abstract situation. Year 2025, there is a Civil War in the United Kingdom. Both sides are equally trained, motivated, have equal weapon.
You is a leader of one side, and you have to choose, what helicopters you will buy - 12 units of AH-64D or 12 units of Ka-52. What would you preffer if it is not a political question?

.....CIVIL war???!!!?? in the UK?? who is fighting who??!! ...the Scots vs the Brits? can you at least make the scenario believable/sensical.....like maybe conflict in Bosnia or something....'''equal weapon'' -- what does that mean?
...the US will have whatever weapons systems that are necessary

Does it matter if we are comparing helicopters?
Formally, there is a war between two main forces, two heirs of the throne - Prince Henry and Prince William. In fact its just a mess of too many groups - Russians, Radical islamists (both Sunni and Shia), Scots, Irish, Respublicans (former Labour Party), pro-EU and pro-US militants et cetera.... Its the time of treason, wide usage of chemical and biological weapon, fratricidal cruelty...
All foreign forces (including USA, Russia and China) don't want to invest in the victory of one side and get profit from post-war England. They want to sell weapon to all sides and get profit from the in-war Kingdom.
Something like modern Syria, you know.

 

[harmonica]

As if the unparalleled Hind wasn’t fearsome enough; along comes the Ka-52...

While their designs may be more intricate than they can produce in the mass quantities we can; there is no denying the ingenuity of Russian military engineering. Has the Apache been rendered obsolete?

1. the Ka was developed after the Apache
2. attack heliocopters are part of a military system-that help protect/enhance each other--an example is the AWACS exponentially enhances ALL the military systems involved
3. the Russians high tech systems were defeated in Afghanistan and the US high tech systems were ''defeated'' in Vietnam
the US high tech systems were victorious in PG1/Iran Jan 2020/etc
high tech SEALS failed in Grenada and Panama
high tech SEALS were victorious killing Osama
4. pilot, troop, unit, and military training also effect the effectiveness of a weapon

..a mediocre wepon in the hands of a trained motivated soldier/Marine/etc is just as
effective [ if not more ] as a high tech weapon in the hands of a mediocre soldier/etc

..I wish I had the link, but I think an Israeli was asked if they would've been as OVERWHELMINGLY victorious in the Syrian Air War if they [ the Israelis ] had the outdated MIGs instead of the F15s----he said it's not the weapon, it's the pilot

..I was in the USMC for 8 years..training/motivation/etc is very critical
...training exercises involving the different units-air/land/sea ---are very critical

no--it's not obsolete

Yes. Sure. But lets try to imagine the abstract situation. Year 2025, there is a Civil War in the United Kingdom. Both sides are equally trained, motivated, have equal weapon.
You is a leader of one side, and you have to choose, what helicopters you will buy - 12 units of AH-64D or 12 units of Ka-52. What would you preffer if it is not a political question?

.....CIVIL war???!!!?? in the UK?? who is fighting who??!! ...the Scots vs the Brits? can you at least make the scenario believable/sensical.....like maybe conflict in Bosnia or something....'''equal weapon'' -- what does that mean?
...the US will have whatever weapons systems that are necessary

Does it matter if we are comparing helicopters?
Formally, there is a war between two main forces, two heirs of the throne - Prince Henry and Prince William. In fact its just a mess of too many groups - Russians, Radical islamists (both Sunni and Shia), Scots, Irish, Respublicans (former Labour Party), pro-EU and pro-US militants et cetera....
All foreign forces (including USA, Russia and China) don't want to invest in the victory of one side and get profit from post-war England. They want to sell weapon to all sides and get profit from the in-war Kingdom.
Something like modern Syria, you know.

....whatever, the US will have countermeasures for the Ka...are you saying the Ka will go head to head with an Apache?
.. I was in the USMC and had Cobras around alot...we also did an exercise with the Army and they had an Apache overhead ...very awe inspiring

 

[Silver Cat]

As if the unparalleled Hind wasn’t fearsome enough; along comes the Ka-52...

While their designs may be more intricate than they can produce in the mass quantities we can; there is no denying the ingenuity of Russian military engineering. Has the Apache been rendered obsolete?

1. the Ka was developed after the Apache
2. attack heliocopters are part of a military system-that help protect/enhance each other--an example is the AWACS exponentially enhances ALL the military systems involved
3. the Russians high tech systems were defeated in Afghanistan and the US high tech systems were ''defeated'' in Vietnam
the US high tech systems were victorious in PG1/Iran Jan 2020/etc
high tech SEALS failed in Grenada and Panama
high tech SEALS were victorious killing Osama
4. pilot, troop, unit, and military training also effect the effectiveness of a weapon

..a mediocre wepon in the hands of a trained motivated soldier/Marine/etc is just as
effective [ if not more ] as a high tech weapon in the hands of a mediocre soldier/etc

..I wish I had the link, but I think an Israeli was asked if they would've been as OVERWHELMINGLY victorious in the Syrian Air War if they [ the Israelis ] had the outdated MIGs instead of the F15s----he said it's not the weapon, it's the pilot

..I was in the USMC for 8 years..training/motivation/etc is very critical
...training exercises involving the different units-air/land/sea ---are very critical

no--it's not obsolete

Yes. Sure. But lets try to imagine the abstract situation. Year 2025, there is a Civil War in the United Kingdom. Both sides are equally trained, motivated, have equal weapon.
You is a leader of one side, and you have to choose, what helicopters you will buy - 12 units of AH-64D or 12 units of Ka-52. What would you preffer if it is not a political question?

.....CIVIL war???!!!?? in the UK?? who is fighting who??!! ...the Scots vs the Brits? can you at least make the scenario believable/sensical.....like maybe conflict in Bosnia or something....'''equal weapon'' -- what does that mean?
...the US will have whatever weapons systems that are necessary

Does it matter if we are comparing helicopters?
Formally, there is a war between two main forces, two heirs of the throne - Prince Henry and Prince William. In fact its just a mess of too many groups - Russians, Radical islamists (both Sunni and Shia), Scots, Irish, Respublicans (former Labour Party), pro-EU and pro-US militants et cetera....
All foreign forces (including USA, Russia and China) don't want to invest in the victory of one side and get profit from post-war England. They want to sell weapon to all sides and get profit from the in-war Kingdom.
Something like modern Syria, you know.

....whatever, the US will have countermeasures for the Ka...

Yes. And they will have countermeasures to the Apache, too... What countermeasures will be more effective?

are you saying the Ka will go head to head with an Apache?

I very doubt that copters are fighting against copters. Both of them will fight mostly against former British Army units and half-trained local militants.

.. I was in the USMC and had Cobras around alot...we also did an exercise with the Army and they had an Apache overhead ...very awe inspiring

Yes. That's why I don't suggest Cobras for this competition.