The Truth about Mormons

[Truthspeaker]

Do you believe Joesph Smith Profited off this Mormon scam he started.

Did Joseph Smith profit? No

Which makes you ask: Was it really a scam?

Oh, he profited.......He did better than Mohammed's promise of 77 virgins in the afterlife..........Smith was doing underage girls in his earthly life.......

Also, Charisma only takes you so far, and then you have to back things up with facts............Obama is learning that too.

Why don't you tell us just what was the legal age of women back in 1840? Care to enlighten us? 18 was nearly an old maid if you weren't married in the U.S.

Why don't u also care to enlighten us on the legal age of women to be married around 1BC when Mary wed Joseph and had other babies beside Jesus. How old was she? 13-15 at most? hmmm.
Different times maybe? Different cultural expectations? Different levels of maturity by women at that age maybe? Don't get locked into presentism.

Oh did u know the legal age of marriage in Arkansas today is 15? So are those abiding the law in that state worthy to be judged pedophiles? Can you deal out that judgment?

I'd really enjoy answers to each of those questions specifically.

 

[Truthspeaker]

And Just what is it that you would like to know about "magic underwear"?

How can ya beat hard hitting reporting like this?

Well hugster I don't understand your question. What's hard hitting and what's reporting about the above quote?

 

[Truthspeaker]

And Just what is it that you would like to know about "magic underwear"?

How can ya beat hard hitting reporting like this?

Who's got magic underwear? That it soaks up urine isn't magic, that's just some Depends, lol.

There is no magic underwear

 

[FrankZapper]

Hmm I wonder how many Bishops believe that. Also Relief Society is quite different depending on the Ward as well.

I'm not quite sure what you mean. Are you asking how many bishops believe in preaching official church doctrine? If someone is found preaching false church doctrine, they are taken to church court and disciplined and if necessary, excommunicated.

So you follow the church teachings out of fear, nice one.

 

[Skeptik]

Another deflection response. Yes they/Mormons believe in something........It's what they believe that either is foundational/biblically sound or is not.

You readers/folks out there have the evidences, and have observed the deflective responses when these Mormons are faced with biblical, archeological, and historical data.

Evidence demands a verdict.

The evidence you have cited is full of part truths and falsehoods. It is from a site that is dedicated to refuting Mormon, 7th. Day Adventist, and Jehova's Witness doctrine.

I will assume that your comments are not because you are a LDS apologist, but because you don't "buy into" the belief that the bible is the foundational/compass point for determining what is Christian and what is not.

I will also take a wild guess that you are agnostic, but like most atheists and agnostics, see the bible as a fairy tale book not unlike the BOM of the LDS church.
******
The web site I gave you that critiqued LDS, and JW, and 7th Day folks only supports what agrees with the bible.

If you do not accept the bible as God's inspired communique' to mankind then it will be difficult to discuss issues with you, as you don't have a foundational point/compass of belief to base your critiques upon.

Never the less you are very welcome to continue to post and comment.

Also, we must ask ourselves where is Christianity's foundation point/compass without the bible? The LDS/Mormons claim that the bible is not accurate, based on the claims of a person of very questionable background and character. LDS historians have formulated their own home-grown unsubstantiated history of J.S. Jr. and other early LDS leaders as a defense against the mounting and unrefutable evidences of how their church was started and arrived where it is nowadays.

There is absolutely no evidences in J.S. Jr.'s life of an actual salvation/born again change as Christ told Nicodemus the Pharisee in the bible. J.S. Jrs. life has never exhibited a contrite heart attitude in respect to Christ and or God, nor did his life while leading his followers Westward from New York to Utah reflect a humility/humbleness of life that would indicate that he/J.S. had an understand of the "grace" of God that is offered to all mankind through the death/burial/ressurrection of Jesus Christ.

The Cross: Mormons think or teach that it is a morbid symbol for Christians to wear around their necks or place upon the steeple of their churches. They will even say that it isn't any different from wearing a little electric chair symbol around one's neck.

That(the cross) is evidence of the Mormon's total lack of understanding of what the Cross trully means to the true biblical Christian. Yes the true Christian realizes that the cross was one very morbid execution device and means, but if it wasn't for that Roman cross on Golgotha Hill outside the city walls of Jerusalem the Son of God would not have "beat" death, sin, and mankinds ultimate eternal destiny that was "total eternal separation from their Maker".

The entire foundation of Christianity is based on what happened at Golgotha, and what finished-up 3 days later when Christ arose from the dead.
******
I say this respectfully to you Skeptik.

All that is well and good, but none of it addresses the point I made.

Truthspeaker's objective has been to explain Mormon belief, not to necessarily "convert" anyone.

The site you are using is not entirely factual. It tells the truth sometimes, and half truths or outright falsehoods other times.

I'm not writing this to try to make you believe what the Mormons believe, frankly, I could care less about that. What I'm doing is explaining that the information you have posted about Mormon beliefs is not correct.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

I have started this post because it still seems there are a lot of people out there that don't understand our religion. One thing I know I can do is clarify a lot misconceptions that people have.
I served a two year mission in South Africa, and I think I have pretty much heard it all. I actually would welcome some questions that I haven't heard before.
I know some of you aren't interested in what we really believe, but are only going to be interested in trying to trap me in my words, but that's ok. I welcome those attempts as well. Let's see what this develops into.

Thats a nice jacket.

 

[froggy]

Did Joseph Smith profit? No

Which makes you ask: Was it really a scam?

Oh, he profited.......He did better than Mohammed's promise of 77 virgins in the afterlife..........Smith was doing underage girls in his earthly life.......

Also, Charisma only takes you so far, and then you have to back things up with facts............Obama is learning that too.

Why don't you tell us just what was the legal age of women back in 1840? Care to enlighten us? 18 was nearly an old maid if you weren't married in the U.S.

Why don't u also care to enlighten us on the legal age of women to be married around 1BC when Mary wed Joseph and had other babies beside Jesus. How old was she? 13-15 at most? hmmm.
Different times maybe? Different cultural expectations? Different levels of maturity by women at that age maybe? Don't get locked into presentism.

Oh did u know the legal age of marriage in Arkansas today is 15? So are those abiding the law in that state worthy to be judged pedophiles? Can you deal out that judgment?

I'd really enjoy answers to each of those questions specifically.

Joey and the other leaders slept with the wives of the members, no marriage, The commandments say "You shall not commit adultery". "You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.” They were in it for money, sex and power.

 

[Skeptik]

Joey and the other leaders slept with the wives of the members, no marriage, The commandments say "You shall not commit adultery". "You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.” They were in it for money, sex and power.

Making up nonsense might get you a job writing for the tabloids, but it adds nothing to a discussion on this forum.

 

[Truthspeaker]

Hmm I wonder how many Bishops believe that. Also Relief Society is quite different depending on the Ward as well.

I'm not quite sure what you mean. Are you asking how many bishops believe in preaching official church doctrine? If someone is found preaching false church doctrine, they are taken to church court and disciplined and if necessary, excommunicated.

So you follow the church teachings out of fear, nice one.

For fear of what? For fear of offending God. Yes. There's no other punishment for preaching false doctrine besides excommunication. It's not like we cane people.

 

[FrankZapper]

I'm not quite sure what you mean. Are you asking how many bishops believe in preaching official church doctrine? If someone is found preaching false church doctrine, they are taken to church court and disciplined and if necessary, excommunicated.

So you follow the church teachings out of fear, nice one.

For fear of what? For fear of offending God. Yes. There's no other punishment for preaching false doctrine besides excommunication. It's not like we cane people.

Banishment is worse than caning folks. It's a regime of fear, admit it.

 

[Truthspeaker]

Oh, he profited.......He did better than Mohammed's promise of 77 virgins in the afterlife..........Smith was doing underage girls in his earthly life.......

Also, Charisma only takes you so far, and then you have to back things up with facts............Obama is learning that too.

Why don't you tell us just what was the legal age of women back in 1840? Care to enlighten us? 18 was nearly an old maid if you weren't married in the U.S.

Why don't u also care to enlighten us on the legal age of women to be married around 1BC when Mary wed Joseph and had other babies beside Jesus. How old was she? 13-15 at most? hmmm.
Different times maybe? Different cultural expectations? Different levels of maturity by women at that age maybe? Don't get locked into presentism.

Oh did u know the legal age of marriage in Arkansas today is 15? So are those abiding the law in that state worthy to be judged pedophiles? Can you deal out that judgment?

I'd really enjoy answers to each of those questions specifically.

Joey and the other leaders slept with the wives of the members, no marriage, The commandments say "You shall not commit adultery". "You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.” They were in it for money, sex and power.

Think what you want but false accusers tried to prove this in court but couldn't do it. Joseph was never rich and was known for his money problems. Your accusations of adultery are just that, accusations. God will be the final judge. The courts of earth couldn't prove it so we'll have to leave it to the courts in heaven.

 

[Truthspeaker]

So you follow the church teachings out of fear, nice one.

For fear of what? For fear of offending God. Yes. There's no other punishment for preaching false doctrine besides excommunication. It's not like we cane people.

Banishment is worse than caning folks. It's a regime of fear, admit it.

banishment from a religion you don't believe in is far better than caning. And no one is ever banished from the church. excommunication does not mean banishment. Many excommunicated members come back to the church. Both my grandparents on my fathers sided had this happen.

 

[FrankZapper]

For fear of what? For fear of offending God. Yes. There's no other punishment for preaching false doctrine besides excommunication. It's not like we cane people.

Banishment is worse than caning folks. It's a regime of fear, admit it.

banishment from a religion you don't believe in is far better than caning. And no one is ever banished from the church. excommunication does not mean banishment. Many excommunicated members come back to the church. Both my grandparents on my fathers sided had this happen.

So you toe the party line or you're gone, it's a regime of fear, either agree or get lost.

 

[froggy]

Joey and the other leaders slept with the wives of the members, no marriage, The commandments say "You shall not commit adultery". "You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.” They were in it for money, sex and power.

Think what you want but false accusers tried to prove this in court but couldn't do it. Joseph was never rich and was known for his money problems. Your accusations of adultery are just that, accusations. God will be the final judge. The courts of earth couldn't prove it so we'll have to leave it to the courts in heaven.

in spite of 140 years of silence, the records did surface. Rev. Wesley Walters discovered the documents in the basement of the Chenango County, New York, jailhouse at Norwich, N.Y. in 1971. The records, affidavits, and other data show conclusively that Joseph Smith was arrested, went to trial, was found guilty as an imposter in the Stowell matter of "glass-looking." It is not a matter of debate, opinion or religious preference. It is a proven historical fact.

 

[Eightball]

The evidence you have cited is full of part truths and falsehoods. It is from a site that is dedicated to refuting Mormon, 7th. Day Adventist, and Jehova's Witness doctrine.

I will assume that your comments are not because you are a LDS apologist, but because you don't "buy into" the belief that the bible is the foundational/compass point for determining what is Christian and what is not.

I will also take a wild guess that you are agnostic, but like most atheists and agnostics, see the bible as a fairy tale book not unlike the BOM of the LDS church.
******
The web site I gave you that critiqued LDS, and JW, and 7th Day folks only supports what agrees with the bible.

If you do not accept the bible as God's inspired communique' to mankind then it will be difficult to discuss issues with you, as you don't have a foundational point/compass of belief to base your critiques upon.

Never the less you are very welcome to continue to post and comment.

Also, we must ask ourselves where is Christianity's foundation point/compass without the bible? The LDS/Mormons claim that the bible is not accurate, based on the claims of a person of very questionable background and character. LDS historians have formulated their own home-grown unsubstantiated history of J.S. Jr. and other early LDS leaders as a defense against the mounting and unrefutable evidences of how their church was started and arrived where it is nowadays.

There is absolutely no evidences in J.S. Jr.'s life of an actual salvation/born again change as Christ told Nicodemus the Pharisee in the bible. J.S. Jrs. life has never exhibited a contrite heart attitude in respect to Christ and or God, nor did his life while leading his followers Westward from New York to Utah reflect a humility/humbleness of life that would indicate that he/J.S. had an understand of the "grace" of God that is offered to all mankind through the death/burial/ressurrection of Jesus Christ.

The Cross: Mormons think or teach that it is a morbid symbol for Christians to wear around their necks or place upon the steeple of their churches. They will even say that it isn't any different from wearing a little electric chair symbol around one's neck.

That(the cross) is evidence of the Mormon's total lack of understanding of what the Cross trully means to the true biblical Christian. Yes the true Christian realizes that the cross was one very morbid execution device and means, but if it wasn't for that Roman cross on Golgotha Hill outside the city walls of Jerusalem the Son of God would not have "beat" death, sin, and mankinds ultimate eternal destiny that was "total eternal separation from their Maker".

The entire foundation of Christianity is based on what happened at Golgotha, and what finished-up 3 days later when Christ arose from the dead.
******
I say this respectfully to you Skeptik.

All that is well and good, but none of it addresses the point I made.

Truthspeaker's objective has been to explain Mormon belief, not to necessarily "convert" anyone.

The site you are using is not entirely factual. It tells the truth sometimes, and half truths or outright falsehoods other times.

I'm not writing this to try to make you believe what the Mormons believe, frankly, I could care less about that. What I'm doing is explaining that the information you have posted about Mormon beliefs is not correct.

Oh give me a break Mr. Mormon apologist.

They hit the front door porches of communities in their dress/white shirts/ties and black slacks with their bicycles and back packs filled with free BOM's like an organized army.

You reject their offer of a BOM and they write you off as a "loser" missing out on the "greater new truths" that the bible allegedly fails at.

You go to Temple Square and Mormons are there waiting to jump on you like used car salesmen.

They come to your door and want you to hear about Mormonism..........If you refute them in any way with biblical info. they tell you they aren't here to compare or debate that issue, but their whole premise of the belief system is to refute biblical Christianity, and brand their religion as "true Christianity".

In their secret temple rituals they even portray a Christian preacher as a satan-duped person.

 

[FrankZapper]

How does a mormon choose his wife? Do they gather up all the virgins and tell you to pick one?

 

[Truthspeaker]

Banishment is worse than caning folks. It's a regime of fear, admit it.

banishment from a religion you don't believe in is far better than caning. And no one is ever banished from the church. excommunication does not mean banishment. Many excommunicated members come back to the church. Both my grandparents on my fathers sided had this happen.

So you toe the party line or you're gone, it's a regime of fear, either agree or get lost.

Again I would ask you, fear of what?

Regime is an interesting word usually ascribed to Dictators, nice touch. We don't have any of those but it's more a "regime" if you will, of like it or not? U want in or out?

 

[Truthspeaker]

Joey and the other leaders slept with the wives of the members, no marriage, The commandments say "You shall not commit adultery". "You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.” They were in it for money, sex and power.

Think what you want but false accusers tried to prove this in court but couldn't do it. Joseph was never rich and was known for his money problems. Your accusations of adultery are just that, accusations. God will be the final judge. The courts of earth couldn't prove it so we'll have to leave it to the courts in heaven.

in spite of 140 years of silence, the records did surface. Rev. Wesley Walters discovered the documents in the basement of the Chenango County, New York, jailhouse at Norwich, N.Y. in 1971. The records, affidavits, and other data show conclusively that Joseph Smith was arrested, went to trial, was found guilty as an imposter in the Stowell matter of "glass-looking." It is not a matter of debate, opinion or religious preference. It is a proven historical fact.

Please provide said document.

 

[Skeptik]

Oh give me a break Mr. Mormon apologist.

They hit the front door porches of communities in their dress/white shirts/ties and black slacks with their bicycles and back packs filled with free BOM's like an organized army.

You reject their offer of a BOM and they write you off as a "loser" missing out on the "greater new truths" that the bible allegedly fails at.

You go to Temple Square and Mormons are there waiting to jump on you like used car salesmen.

They come to your door and want you to hear about Mormonism..........If you refute them in any way with biblical info. they tell you they aren't here to compare or debate that issue, but their whole premise of the belief system is to refute biblical Christianity, and brand their religion as "true Christianity".

In their secret temple rituals they even portray a Christian preacher as a satan-duped person.

That's you opinion, and you're welcome to it, but it has nothing to do with my post, which said:

What I'm doing is explaining that the information you have posted about Mormon beliefs is not correct

Some of it is correct, some is partly correct, and some is false. The website you're using for your information is misleading.

 

[froggy]

Think what you want but false accusers tried to prove this in court but couldn't do it. Joseph was never rich and was known for his money problems. Your accusations of adultery are just that, accusations. God will be the final judge. The courts of earth couldn't prove it so we'll have to leave it to the courts in heaven.

in spite of 140 years of silence, the records did surface. Rev. Wesley Walters discovered the documents in the basement of the Chenango County, New York, jailhouse at Norwich, N.Y. in 1971. The records, affidavits, and other data show conclusively that Joseph Smith was arrested, went to trial, was found guilty as an imposter in the Stowell matter of "glass-looking." It is not a matter of debate, opinion or religious preference. It is a proven historical fact.

Please provide said document.

Account of 1826 Trial published in Fraser's Magazine, Feb. 1873