The Jews and the Native Americans

[P F Tinmore]

But Muhammed came after Jesus correct?

I mean if a modern day Prophet was here and declared both sides wrong does that supersede everything?

I am not religious, so frankly I don't care about the religious reason from either side.

That said, if you look at a map the muslims pretty much own and live in all surrounding areas.

So they can give a little piece of land up.

The Palestinian refugees lost all of their land not just a piece of it.

How many Palestinians are there and where do they all live right now?

The vast majority of Palestinians live outside their original homes.

 

[Michelle420]

The Palestinian refugees lost all of their land not just a piece of it.

How many Palestinians are there and where do they all live right now?

The vast majority of Palestinians live outside their original homes.

So could all of the palestinians fit in that small strip of land or would some still have to live elsewhere>?

 

[SherriMunnerlyn]

which book is older?

None of the books speak of "the Land of Israel." That is a Zionist myth you are buying into.

I asked questions.

You replied with this?

Which book is older>?

Are you religious at all?

The "Land of Israel", there is no such thing in the Bible, except references to a short lived kingdom that existed for a short time over 2000 years ago. Example In the book of Tolbit, the phrase land of Israel appears, but only used there to specifically refer to the territory within that kingdom of Israel. Tolbit 14:6 Another example, 2 Chronicles 34:7. What I find is about 13 verses in the Bible, Old Testament, using that term and it was only used to refer to that short lived kingdom that ended over 2000 years ago. Where spoken of in The New Testament it is a reference to a people, not land. That explains why Bible maps for hundreds of years call the land Palestine.

 

[Michelle420]

None of the books speak of "the Land of Israel." That is a Zionist myth you are buying into.

I asked questions.

You replied with this?

Which book is older>?

Are you religious at all?

The "Land of Israel", there is no such thing in the Bible, except references to a short livef kingdom that existed for a short time over 2000 years ago. Example In the book of Tolbit, the phrase land of Israel appears, but only used there to specifically refer to the territory within that kingdom of Israel. Tolbit 14:6 Another example, 2 Chronicles 34:7. What I find is about 13 verses in the Bible using that term and it was only used to refer to that short lived kingdom that ended over 2000 years ago.

Sherri, I did not ask about "the land of israel" at all I asked you which book is older.

If you don't know just say so.

 

[SherriMunnerlyn]

What Zionism did, which was created in the 1800s, was take this Colonialist idea of settling in Palestine and use religion to get support of the world for their Imperialistic designs.

 

[Michelle420]

What Zionism did, which was created in the 1800s, was take this Colonialist idea of settling in Palestine and use religion to get support of the world for their Imperialistic designs.

So?

Historically who hasn't?

 

[Uncensored2008]

Why did not write other texts that tells the Non Muslims' and dhimmis have rights?
Why did not you write texts that tell us that it is forbidden to kill them?

You may not kill Zimmis PROVIDED they submit with willing submission and pay Jizya. You will kill Kafir with no regard. (Kafir are those who reject Allah - Atheists and Idolators basically,)

or beat them, or steal their money, or even make scratch on their body without any reason?
why didn't you write that there are penalty for any Muslim who kill non Muslims?

That you have rules on how to treat those you enslave does not make them anything other than slaves.

If you want to explain the texts of the Qur'an and the words of the Prophet Muhammad
You must understand the era in which Islam began
And the circumstances that were around him
Even your circumstances ,

The Warlord Muhammad was a brutal man of a brutal time. Yet other religions have grown to accept peace, not so with Islam.

Islam remains a violent religion that embraces only war and conquest.

And because of this, there can be no peace with Israel.

Christians were in bad situation with control of the church and the tyranny of governments
They lived under the shadow of capitalism and communism
Islam came to make people worship the God instead of worshiping people
Plus ,, It is not compulsory to converted to Islam

Jews and Christians ALONE are permitted to live as slaves, with the yoke of Jizya.

For an agnostic such as myself, Islam would demand I convert or would kill me.

It is Forbidden to kill people, and that's what we learned from the Qur'an and Hadith
Whether they are Muslims or infidels or dhimmis
Every human being has rights

It is far from forbidden, it is commanded that you kill the Kafir - as Islam has done with glee for 1500 years. Millions and millions butchered in India. The sea of blood and misery as Islam swept to the doors of Europe like the plague it is.

And the Lord will punish a Muslim who dared kill the other
Except those who are attacking
It is called (Self-defense) , which is not forbidden at all

The Koran commands that Kafirum be murdered in the name of your god, Allah. (al-Ilah) The Warlord Muhammed murdered thousands and directed the murder of millions. Murder is the only gift bequeathed by Muhammad, well - misery was attached.

Britain , America, Israel, Russia, China, France and many other countries have killed unlawfully
Some countries still do it, they kill Muslims and destroy Mosques
Prophet Muhammad order Muslims if they want to open countries and spread Islam , he ordered them not to kill women, or children or priest , not to destroy Churches or any place that they worship their God in, and plus gave to non-Muslims their rights to choose any religion they want.

Yet the Warlord Muhammad murdered women, when he wasn't handing them to his hoards to be raped, he murdered children and Rabbis.

{The brutal death of Umm Qirfa also refutes this myth. So do the women who were killed in battle (Bukhari 52:257), when Muhammad’s men attacked a town or tribe – although his preference was that women be captured for sexual servitude rather than killed.

One account not only speaks of the killing of a defenseless woman, but also refutes the broader misconception that Islam is against attacking others for reasons other than self-defense:}

We went with the apostle on the raid of Dhatu’l-Riqa of Nakhl and a man killed the wife of one of the polytheists. When the apostle was on his way back, her husband, who had been away, returned and heard the news of her death. He swore that he would not rest until he had taken vengeance. (Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 665)

Why didn't you write all these, they are facts by the way.

Islam freed some countries from slavery and did not force them to be Muslim and gave them their rights. He did not even deprive them from practicing their religion, either if they were Christians or Jews or even without religion

Freed them to be slaves of Islam.

We spread peace in the entire country that have been opened
The Kings who were rules your countries in the past were stealing from nations and impose taxes

Islam spreads death and misery - it is the only payload of Islam.

 

[MHunterB]

Palestinians are not responsible for what Arab countries outside Palestine did. Ethnic cleansing in Palestine has been by Israel.

Our Jerusalem.com -

This article is 'sourced' so one can refer to the original documentation. It's *not* just an 'opinion' : the quotes are real.

I'd like to see your 'proof' that not a single Jewish resident of the Mandate area was removed from their home by any Arab during the 20th C. There was an entire spread in LIFE magazine showing the (Jordanian) Arab army forcing the Jewish residents out of East Jerusalem in 1948: I know you've seen those photos before, and I'm shocked that you could 'forget' them. Those Jerusalemites had lived in what was then known as 'the Jewish Quarter' for centuries: the UN-associated links you've put up document the heavy concentration of Jewish residence in/near Jerusalem, Haifa, and a few other cities.

I've ALREADY stated that I am not 'blaming' the Palestinians for what other Arabs did (although as a 'nationality', over half of Jordan was 'Palestinian' before 1948, so it wouldn't be totally baseless) - you need to pay attention and stop claiming I did that. (I'll be reminding you of this the next time you try screeching that I've put words in your mouth.)

If the Israelis must pay for pushing out Palestinians - then what is the problem with the Palestinians paying for any people they MAY have pushed out, in theory? Is that not fair?

I never suggested and did not suppose that such numbers of evicted Jews would be a large one: I don't think the 950,000 Arab Jews cast out from AL countries includes that number.

The AL nations which refused to allow the Pals to leave the 'camps' or get citizenship or hold jobs in their nations are *also* responsible for the collective misery of the Palestinian people. How can anyone pretend to care about the Palestinians, yet refuse to acknowledge the AL nations continually pursuing policies to the detriment of the Palestinians time and again?

 

[Uncensored2008]

The Palestinian refugees lost all of their land not just a piece of it.

Israel is less than 1% of the Middle East. You Muslims control the other 99%, yet that is not enough to satiate your greed and blood lust - such are the followers of Allah ne Ba'al.

 

[P F Tinmore]

The Palestinian refugees lost all of their land not just a piece of it.

Israel is less than 1% of the Middle East. You Muslims control the other 99%, yet that is not enough to satiate your greed and blood lust - such are the followers of Allah ne Ba'al.

Why don't we throw everyone out of New Jersey and give it to Israel. After all, those people have the rest of the US to live in.

 

[MHunterB]

What Zionism did, which was created in the 1800s, was take this Colonialist idea of settling in Palestine and use religion to get support of the world for their Imperialistic designs.

Pimping HAMAS' Satanic lies yet again, l'il sherrithang? Throw some more pigshit on that Palestinian flag, why don't you?

While it's *possible* the British government did have some fantasies of that sort - the actual Zionists did not. The whole idea of Zionism is NOT having to live at the sufferance of other nations: I think everyone understands that colonies of Britain nor any other imperialist power were never 'free'.

What a peculiar addle-pated notion you've expressed above, sherrikins! That Zionists would desire to be 'colonizers' for the same filthy bastards who refused to let Jews in to save them from Hitler's death camps!

I can see you don't 'get it' even now: it wasn't the perpetration of the Holocaust which crystallized the Zionist determination to establish a Jewish State. It was the overwhelming evidence of continual collusion among the democratic opponents of Nazi Germany to ignore and passively ASSIST that genocide by denying 'humanitarian' entry into the US, Britain or any other nation which pretended to give a flying fig that Hitler was murdering Jews by the MILLIONS.

Back in the '30's when the Nazis pushed all Jews out of university teaching positions and civil service jobs (contrast that with Israel which has 'Palestinian' EMT's and cops and diplomats!) - the professors of England and the US did not object. And when a few dozen of those professors were able to gain entry to the US - did their colleagues at Harvard and Princeton and the other Ivies welcome them?

Here's an article on that bit of history: Documentary on Jewish refugee professors to air | Amarillo.com | Amarillo Globe-News

Maybe that will help clue some in as to how ridiculous is the supposition that Zionism was intended by the Zionists to be a 'colonial extension' of European imperialism.

 

[Michelle420]

The Palestinian refugees lost all of their land not just a piece of it.

Israel is less than 1% of the Middle East. You Muslims control the other 99%, yet that is not enough to satiate your greed and blood lust - such are the followers of Allah ne Ba'al.

Why don't we throw everyone out of New Jersey and give it to Israel. After all, those people have the rest of the US to live in.

Hard to believe that Palestinians want to work things out and are peaceful when they can't even share land.

Seriously, there is no way the entire population of palestinians can migrate and live in that small strip of land.

So what you are really saying is that they shouldn't have to share anything.

If they want a real compromise they should open up the rest of the borders and share it with everyone.

But what we are discussing is the fact that although they reside everywhere else and there a small little strip of land they haven't dominated somehow the entire world has to feel sorry for them.

 

[Hossfly]

The Palestinian refugees lost all of their land not just a piece of it.

Israel is less than 1% of the Middle East. You Muslims control the other 99%, yet that is not enough to satiate your greed and blood lust - such are the followers of Allah ne Ba'al.

Why don't we throw everyone out of New Jersey and give it to Israel. After all, those people have the rest of the US to live in.

But, Tinnie, so many of those Arabs were tenant farmers under the Turks and then others came from their poor surrounding countries for the jobs that were made available to them by the Jews so how could they amassed all this property and wealth you want us to believe they had. Perhaps you can tell us why the U.N. said that anyone in the area for only two years could be considered a refugee. Two years in an area doesn't make anyone indigenous to any area and it would be very difficult for anyone to accumulate any sizeable assets in so short a time.. Maybe Tinnie thinks his relatives were so, so wealthy and the Jews robbed them of this wealth.

 

[SherriMunnerlyn]

Palestinians are not responsible for what Arab countries outside Palestine did. Ethnic cleansing in Palestine has been by Israel.

Our Jerusalem.com -

This article is 'sourced' so one can refer to the original documentation. It's *not* just an 'opinion' : the quotes are real.

I'd like to see your 'proof' that not a single Jewish resident of the Mandate area was removed from their home by any Arab during the 20th C. There was an entire spread in LIFE magazine showing the (Jordanian) Arab army forcing the Jewish residents out of East Jerusalem in 1948: I know you've seen those photos before, and I'm shocked that you could 'forget' them. Those Jerusalemites had lived in what was then known as 'the Jewish Quarter' for centuries: the UN-associated links you've put up document the heavy concentration of Jewish residence in/near Jerusalem, Haifa, and a few other cities.

I've ALREADY stated that I am not 'blaming' the Palestinians for what other Arabs did (although as a 'nationality', over half of Jordan was 'Palestinian' before 1948, so it wouldn't be totally baseless) - you need to pay attention and stop claiming I did that. (I'll be reminding you of this the next time you try screeching that I've put words in your mouth.)

If the Israelis must pay for pushing out Palestinians - then what is the problem with the Palestinians paying for any people they MAY have pushed out, in theory? Is that not fair?

I never suggested and did not suppose that such numbers of evicted Jews would be a large one: I don't think the 950,000 Arab Jews cast out from AL countries includes that number.

The AL nations which refused to allow the Pals to leave the 'camps' or get citizenship or hold jobs in their nations are *also* responsible for the collective misery of the Palestinian people. How can anyone pretend to care about the Palestinians, yet refuse to acknowledge the AL nations continually pursuing policies to the detriment of the Palestinians time and again?

As I have said, Palestinians are not responsible for what Arab nations do, not what Arab nations did outside Palestine. They are not responsible for what Arab nations did inside Palestine either.

 

[MHunterB]

Palestinians are not responsible for what Arab countries outside Palestine did. Ethnic cleansing in Palestine has been by Israel.

Our Jerusalem.com -

This article is 'sourced' so one can refer to the original documentation. It's *not* just an 'opinion' : the quotes are real.

I'd like to see your 'proof' that not a single Jewish resident of the Mandate area was removed from their home by any Arab during the 20th C. There was an entire spread in LIFE magazine showing the (Jordanian) Arab army forcing the Jewish residents out of East Jerusalem in 1948: I know you've seen those photos before, and I'm shocked that you could 'forget' them. Those Jerusalemites had lived in what was then known as 'the Jewish Quarter' for centuries: the UN-associated links you've put up document the heavy concentration of Jewish residence in/near Jerusalem, Haifa, and a few other cities.

I've ALREADY stated that I am not 'blaming' the Palestinians for what other Arabs did (although as a 'nationality', over half of Jordan was 'Palestinian' before 1948, so it wouldn't be totally baseless) - you need to pay attention and stop claiming I did that. (I'll be reminding you of this the next time you try screeching that I've put words in your mouth.)

If the Israelis must pay for pushing out Palestinians - then what is the problem with the Palestinians paying for any people they MAY have pushed out, in theory? Is that not fair?

I never suggested and did not suppose that such numbers of evicted Jews would be a large one: I don't think the 950,000 Arab Jews cast out from AL countries includes that number.

The AL nations which refused to allow the Pals to leave the 'camps' or get citizenship or hold jobs in their nations are *also* responsible for the collective misery of the Palestinian people. How can anyone pretend to care about the Palestinians, yet refuse to acknowledge the AL nations continually pursuing policies to the detriment of the Palestinians time and again?

As I have said, Palestinians are not responsible for what Arab nations do, not what Arab nations did outside Palestine. They are not responsible for what Arab nations did inside Palestine either.

It's so difficult to discuss anything with one who refuses to read my words: I've bolded some above to help you....

You made a claim, which is readily refuted by UN articles you yourself posted. There indeed were evictions of Jews by Palestinians - and if Israel must give compensation for evicting Palestinians unjustly, then Palestinians must likewise give compensation for an evictions of Jews which THEY did.

I'm not trying to hold the Palestinians responsible for anyone else's deeds - but they must be held responsible for their own deeds. I cannot imagine why any supporter of Palestinians would wish to see them evade their proper responsibilities.

 

[sealadaigh]

Israel is less than 1% of the Middle East. You Muslims control the other 99%, yet that is not enough to satiate your greed and blood lust - such are the followers of Allah ne Ba'al.

Why don't we throw everyone out of New Jersey and give it to Israel. After all, those people have the rest of the US to live in.

But, Tinnie, so many of those Arabs were tenant farmers under the Turks and then others came from their poor surrounding countries for the jobs that were made available to them by the Jews so how could they amassed all this property and wealth you want us to believe they had. Perhaps you can tell us why the U.N. said that anyone in the area for only two years could be considered a refugee. Two years in an area doesn't make anyone indigenous to any area and it would be very difficult for anyone to accumulate any sizeable assets in so short a time.. Maybe Tinnie thinks his relatives were so, so wealthy and the Jews robbed them of this wealth.

you didn't answer his question.

hey, why don't we let the mennonites in southeastern PA expel non-amish and set up their own country seperaste from the USA. we could call it a two state solution.

you want to call P F a bigot just to discredit him then we will revisit the flagpole of your choice. i have never seen him say anything bigoted even when provoked.

 

[sealadaigh]

Our Jerusalem.com -

This article is 'sourced' so one can refer to the original documentation. It's *not* just an 'opinion' : the quotes are real.

I'd like to see your 'proof' that not a single Jewish resident of the Mandate area was removed from their home by any Arab during the 20th C. There was an entire spread in LIFE magazine showing the (Jordanian) Arab army forcing the Jewish residents out of East Jerusalem in 1948: I know you've seen those photos before, and I'm shocked that you could 'forget' them. Those Jerusalemites had lived in what was then known as 'the Jewish Quarter' for centuries: the UN-associated links you've put up document the heavy concentration of Jewish residence in/near Jerusalem, Haifa, and a few other cities.

I've ALREADY stated that I am not 'blaming' the Palestinians for what other Arabs did (although as a 'nationality', over half of Jordan was 'Palestinian' before 1948, so it wouldn't be totally baseless) - you need to pay attention and stop claiming I did that. (I'll be reminding you of this the next time you try screeching that I've put words in your mouth.)

If the Israelis must pay for pushing out Palestinians - then what is the problem with the Palestinians paying for any people they MAY have pushed out, in theory? Is that not fair?

I never suggested and did not suppose that such numbers of evicted Jews would be a large one: I don't think the 950,000 Arab Jews cast out from AL countries includes that number.

The AL nations which refused to allow the Pals to leave the 'camps' or get citizenship or hold jobs in their nations are *also* responsible for the collective misery of the Palestinian people. How can anyone pretend to care about the Palestinians, yet refuse to acknowledge the AL nations continually pursuing policies to the detriment of the Palestinians time and again?

As I have said, Palestinians are not responsible for what Arab nations do, not what Arab nations did outside Palestine. They are not responsible for what Arab nations did inside Palestine either.

It's so difficult to discuss anything with one who refuses to read my words: I've bolded some above to help you....

You made a claim, which is readily refuted by UN articles you yourself posted. There indeed were evictions of Jews by Palestinians - and if Israel must give compensation for evicting Palestinians unjustly, then Palestinians must likewise give compensation for an evictions of Jews which THEY did.

I'm not trying to hold the Palestinians responsible for anyone else's deeds - but they must be held responsible for their own deeds. I cannot imagine why any supporter of Palestinians would wish to see them evade their proper responsibilities.

perhaps you will give us more information on the eviction of jews by the palestinians. all things being equal, i think those jews deprived of property by palestinians should be compensated.

 

[SherriMunnerlyn]

As I have said, Palestinians are not responsible for what Arab nations do, not what Arab nations did outside Palestine. They are not responsible for what Arab nations did inside Palestine either.

It's so difficult to discuss anything with one who refuses to read my words: I've bolded some above to help you....

You made a claim, which is readily refuted by UN articles you yourself posted. There indeed were evictions of Jews by Palestinians - and if Israel must give compensation for evicting Palestinians unjustly, then Palestinians must likewise give compensation for an evictions of Jews which THEY did.

I'm not trying to hold the Palestinians responsible for anyone else's deeds - but they must be held responsible for their own deeds. I cannot imagine why any supporter of Palestinians would wish to see them evade their proper responsibilities.

perhaps you will give us more information on the eviction of jews by the palestinians. all things being equal, i think those jews deprived of property by palestinians should be compensated.

I have never heard of Palestinian evictions of Jews. The Palestinians have yet to even live in their own lands where they were not living occupied by others.

 

[Michelle420]

The "Land of Israel", there is no such thing in the Bible, except references to a short livef kingdom that existed for a short time over 2000 years ago. Example In the book of Tolbit, the phrase land of Israel appears, but only used there to specifically refer to the territory within that kingdom of Israel. Tolbit 14:6 Another example, 2 Chronicles 34:7. What I find is about 13 verses in the Bible using that term and it was only used to refer to that short lived kingdom that ended over 2000 years ago.

Sherri, I did not ask about "the land of israel" at all I asked you which book is older.

If you don't know just say so.

sherri and P F, you should just ignore this clown. he claimed he wasn't pursuing an agenda but instead just wanted to be educated on the subject...and then he proceeds to pursue an agenda, and asking leading questions that lead to the same old BS.

if you all want to play his game, cool, but he won't answer questions himself. i mean, the guy thinks it is oK to steal from destitute palestinian who was eking out a living because some algerian oil sheik has millions. what a totally racist and rdiculous argument. yes, they are both arabs, but they are citizens of different countries.

i imagine he would justify armed robbery and knocking off liquor stores because the owners have more money than the homeless.

the guy is a dishonest schill, and not even a good one.

let's see him make a general rule regarding the specifics of israel that will apply to all people. no one sems to be willing or able to do that because they are bigots. they are willing to allow special rules for jews but exempt others from the same consideration.

dishonest schills ain't worth your time.

Why don't the palestinians open up all the borders and offer to share it with everyone including the small strip of land ?

Which book came first bible or koran?

Who has special rules nobody, because all of involved are just human beings.

Why does it matter you personally who gets what piece of land?

I don't care which side gets it.

But I am curious, if the palestinians surround that strip of land and populate all surrounding areas how could they all squeeze into one area should they gain control?

How do you justify they should just monopolize every inch of land?

What's in it for you to defend such greed?

If there is some other reason, then why can't you, sherri or tin explain it better to me.

Can you explain why they can't open up all surrounding areas and just share land?

What's the problem?

 

[Coyote]

Why don't the palestinians open up all the borders and offer to share it with everyone including the small strip of land ?

<snip>

...What's the problem?

They don't control their borders.