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Should Western Ukraine become a NATO protectorate?

Richard-H

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Since Russia is sending a new army into Belarus to threaten Western Ukraine from the North, I think that NATO should declare all of Ukraine west of the Dnieper river to be a NATO protectorate.

The new Russian Army locating in Belarus does not have to be effective as far as combat capabilities nor even try to invade Ukraine, but it will force the Ukrainians to reposition considerable forces back near Kyiv - removing them from the fight in eastern Ukraine.

By declaring western Ukraine as a NATO protectorate, NATO forces could move into western Ukraine and nuetralize any threat from Belarus. Their presence would prevent further terrorist missile & drone attacks against Ukrainian civilian targets. They could control the skies over western Ukraine and shorten the supply & support lines between NATO and Ukrainian forces in eastern Ukraine.

Russia is already depleted. It's doubtful that Russia would atke any action against NATO forces in Ukraine. It would shorten this war.
 

Sunni Man

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Stupid idea...... :cuckoo:
 

JGalt

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It's probably a little late in the game to think about making Ukraine a NATO protectorate, unless we want to escalate the war to being nuclear. NATO should have thought of that before Russia had so much invested in it.
 

Oddball

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Richard-H

Richard-H

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It's probably a little late in the game to think about making Ukraine a NATO protectorate, unless we want to escalate the war to being nuclear. NATO should have thought of that before Russia had so much invested in it.

Going nuclear isn't an option for Russia. Yup, Russia has invested all they can in this war already, which is why we can force them to back down.
 

JGalt

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Going nuclear isn't an option for Russia. Yup, Russia has invested all they can in this war already, which is why we can force them to back down.

They're not going to back down. Like they say, "Once you've committed your first felony, the rest are free."

Look how little effect the sanctions had on them them. The Ruble is still holding its value, and they're making more than enough money to finance their war with their gas and oil sales. Then there's China: They're already allied politically and economically with Russia. You some some trigger-happy NATO country to fire off a nuke, and Russia would immediately retaliate.

It's a fucked up deal for all sides. Had Biden been as diplomatic as Trump, the whole thing wouldn't have happened.
 
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Richard-H

Richard-H

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They're not going to back down. Like they say, "Once you've committed your first felony, the rest are free."

Look how little effect the sanctions had on them them. The Ruble is still holding its value, and they're making more than enough money to finance their war with their gas and oil sales. Then there's China: They're already allied politically and economically with Russia. You some some trigger-happy NATO country to fire off a nuke, and Russia would immediately retaliate.

It's a fucked up deal for all sides. Had Biden been as diplomatic as Trump, the whole thing wouldn't have happened.

Wrong. Russia not going to WANT to back down, but Russia has all but lost this war already.

Politically, militarily and economically they are severely strained. China & other countries are buying Russian oil at a severe discount, so Russia isn't making much of a profit.

China is no ally of Russia's. China only cares about China.

It's Ukraine that will not and cannot back down. Russia should have been happy when it took Crimea, and nobody did anything about it. Now Russia is in over its head.

Nobody in NATO is going to start a nuke war, but they do have to ability to stop Russian tactical nukes.

Yes, there would be no war if Trump were President because he would have let Putin take over half of Europe.
 

JGalt

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Wrong. Russia not going to WANT to back down, but Russia has all but lost this war already.

Politically, militarily and economically they are severely strained. China & other countries are buying Russian oil at a severe discount, so Russia isn't making much of a profit.

China is no ally of Russia's. China only cares about China.

It's Ukraine that will not and cannot back down. Russia should have been happy when it took Crimea, and nobody did anything about it. Now Russia is in over its head.

Nobody in NATO is going to start a nuke war, but they do have to ability to stop Russian tactical nukes.

Yes, there would be no war if Trump were President because he would have let Putin take over half of Europe.

You're underestimating an enemy that has almost one thousand more nuclear weapons than we have in the US. A bunch of ham-fisted, vodka-swilling European hillbillies whose main export is Youtube videos of drunken brawls on freeways, and had commissars standing behind the lines, shooting their own retreating troops in WW2.

Probably not a very smart idea.
 
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Richard-H

Richard-H

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You're underestimating an enemy that has almost one thousand more nuclear weapons than we have in the US. A bunch of ham-fisted, vodka-swilling European hillbillies whose main export is Youtube videos of drunken brawls on freeways, and had commissars standing behind the lines, shooting their own retreating troops in WW2.

Probably not a very smart idea.

Russia is not about to start a nuclear war. They know that if they do Russia will be incinerated. They also know that the U.S. and NATO is 20-40 years ahead of them in every form of military technology. At every turn their technology is being defeated.

They have no idea what surprises NATO has in store for them if they started using nukes.
 

JGalt

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Russia is not about to start a nuclear war. They know that if they do Russia will be incinerated. They also know that the U.S. and NATO is 20-40 years ahead of them in every form of military technology. At every turn their technology is being defeated.

They have no idea what surprises NATO has in store for them if they started using nukes.

Do you really think the Russian leadership, who is conscripting every available person to be sent to die in Ukraine, is worried about being incinerated?

Why do you think so many people are protesting in Russia, for seeing their family members dragged out of their apartments and being conscripted in the Russian Army?
 
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Richard-H

Richard-H

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Do you really think the Russian leadership, who is conscripting every available person to be sent to die in Ukraine, is worried about being incinerated?

Why do you think so many people are protesting in Russia, for seeing their family members dragged out of their apartments and being conscripted in the Russian Army?

Russian leadership knows that they will not survive a nuclear war. The fact that they don't care about the lives of their people does not mean that they don't care about their own lives.

Putin is a thug and a bully, but he's not suicidal.
 

José

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Originally posted by Richard-H
Russia is not about to start a nuclear war. They know that if they do Russia will be incinerated.

NATO won't do anything because the fear is reciprocal.

The same fear of nuclear retaliation that would prevent Russia from launching nukes is the same fear of nuclear retaliation that has prevented NATO from attacking russian troops for 7 months and counting.
 

alexa

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Since Russia is sending a new army into Belarus to threaten Western Ukraine from the North, I think that NATO should declare all of Ukraine west of the Dnieper river to be a NATO protectorate.

The new Russian Army locating in Belarus does not have to be effective as far as combat capabilities nor even try to invade Ukraine, but it will force the Ukrainians to reposition considerable forces back near Kyiv - removing them from the fight in eastern Ukraine.

By declaring western Ukraine as a NATO protectorate, NATO forces could move into western Ukraine and nuetralize any threat from Belarus. Their presence would prevent further terrorist missile & drone attacks against Ukrainian civilian targets. They could control the skies over western Ukraine and shorten the supply & support lines between NATO and Ukrainian forces in eastern Ukraine.

Russia is already depleted. It's doubtful that Russia would atke any action against NATO forces in Ukraine. It would shorten this war.
Why not try diplomacy instead. Find out what they really want and why and see if you can provide it. The end of this scenario is everyone wins.
 
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Richard-H

Richard-H

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Why not try diplomacy instead. Find out what they really want and why and see if you can provide it. The end of this scenario is everyone wins.

Diplomatic processes were fully engaged until Putin ordered the invasion of Ukraine.

Putin's idea if diplomacy is that he makes his demands and expects immediate full compliance. That's not diplomacy.
 

José

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NATO has absolutely no use for "assurances" that western countries won't be nuked given by people that just pulled their assurances out of their asses.

In order to attack russian troops in Ukraine, NATO would have to be 100% sure that won't happen given the stakes involved.

Since no one can give this guarantee to NATO, Russia is free to bomb the country to her heart's content.
 

Baron

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Since Russia is sending a new army into Belarus to threaten Western Ukraine from the North, I think that NATO should declare all of Ukraine west of the Dnieper river to be a NATO protectorate.

Russia will include all Ukraine into Russia
If NATO officially be involved comes an escalation
 
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Richard-H

Richard-H

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NATO won't do anything because the fear is reciprocal.

The same fear of nuclear retaliation that would prevent Russia from launching nukes is the same fear of nuclear retaliation that has prevented NATO from attacking russian troops for 7 months and counting.

It's also the same fear that's prevented Russia from attacking the Baltics.

Moving NATO troops and air forces in the non-combat zones of Ukraine (i.e. everything west of the Dnieper River) will ensure that this war stays in the eastern provinces and Crimea. Let the Russians and Ukrainians fight it out in those provinces, but stop the any possibility of Russia invading or striking into Western Ukraine.
 
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Richard-H

Richard-H

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Russia will include all Ukraine into Russia
If NATO officially be involved comes an escalation

They tried that. It did not work well for Russia.
 

Baron

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Diplomatic processes were fully engaged until Putin ordered the invasion of Ukraine.

ROFL
It were NEVER any diplomatic efforts to stop butchering of Russians since 2014
NATO is involved since more as 9 Years
 

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