Roe v. Wade getting overturned!!

[BackAgain]

Yes, abortion ends a gestating human life. Life being gestated does not have due process in Kansas and that is ok with the six Catholics on the Supreme Court. When the Supreme Court Catholics say a gestating fetus does not have due process against being terminated by its mother, then who exactly are you to say that conservatives on the USSC are not correct?

You always assume your desired conclusion as one of your (usually suppressed) premises. You say that life “being gestated” does not have due process. That is precisely the question.

By law could very easily recognize that a zygote is a “person.” In fact, one state has recently created a law (or maybe it’s still a mere bill) saying just that.

Therefore, while it may very well be true that a zygote or embryo or fetus has no right to due process in one state, it might very well have or soon get such explicit rights in other states.

eIEIo07122023

 

[whutTHEYsay]

You say that life “being gestated” does not have due process.

That is not what I said. I said the six Catholic conservative justices on the Supreme Court are OK with a reality that is justified under the US Constitution that a fetus can be put to death by its mother without due process. I am merely stating the facts and then make facts the primary part of my argument. You cannot do that you simply declare the debate to be over when it’s not even close.

bckvgn.23.07.12 #9,681
nf.23.07.12 #9,682

 

[BackAgain]

That is not what I said. I said the six Catholic conservative justices on the Supreme Court are OK with a reality that is justified under the US Constitution that a fetus can be put to death by its mother without due process. I am merely stating the facts and then make fax the primary part of my argument. You cannot do that you simply declare the debate to be over when it’s not even close.

bckvgn.23.07.12 #9,681
nf.23.07.12

I remain indifferent to your constant efforts to make the test some religious one. Sorry. No sale.

The debate is over. A human life is a human life. From the moment after conception when the newly created human life obtains (for the rest of its life) its own unique DNA.

2021-2022 Bill 5401: Personhood Act of SC - South Carolina Legislature Online

I don’t yet know if this bill has become law. But it seems like the Dobbs decision validates the right of each state to make such laws.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

1

From the moment after conception when the newly created human life obtains (for the rest of its life) its own unique DNA.

2

There is no conscious fetus person that dies in an early abortion.. The fetus dies but outside of Catholicism in 1973 that death was not counted as the death of a human being.

3

DOBBS: “The permissibility of abortion, and the limitations, upon it, are to be resolved like most important questions in our democracy: { when morality was decided entirely by WASP males and women obeyed her god bound duty to replenish the species and cook dinner for men if the man could not afford to own slaves} by citizens trying to persuade one another and then voting.

4

1. Biological life begins at conception and ends in death
2. Gestating life begins at conception and ends in death or ends at a moment of first breath.
3. Independent life begins at first breath and ends in death.

What is not scientific fact in 1, 2 & 3 ?

When you point out another uncontested fact that “From the moment after conception when the newly created human life obtains ••>•• its own unique DNA” what is the point? In post Four you were told that Gestating life begins at conception and ends in death or ends at a moment of first breath. So what is the significance of a gestating fetus having a unique dna? That does not change the fact that Kansas voters do not give a shit about unique DNA / A gestating human life may be terminated when that is what it’s mother decides that is what she wants to do.

1 bckvgn.23.07.12 #9,683
2 nf.23.07.11 #9,663
3 nf.23.07.12 #9,672
4 nf.23,07.12 #9,684

 

[BackAgain]

1

2

3

4


When you point out another uncontested fact that “From the moment after conception when the newly created human life obtains ••>•• its own unique DNA” what is the point? In post Four you were told that Gestating life begins at conception and ends in death or ends at a moment of first breath. So what is the significance of a gestating fetus having a unique dna? That does not change the fact that Kansas voters do not give a shit about unique DNA / A gestating human life may be terminated when that is what it’s mother decides that is what she wants to do.

1 bckvgn.23.07.12 #9,683
nf.23,07.12 #9,684

I’m not sure why you insist on cluttering the board with you quoting you. You aren’t a reliable source.

Life begins at conception. That’s all we need to know. We don’t need to know what stage of development that zygote or embryo or fetus is at. Such a question presupposes that it matters. It doesn’t.

If that preborn human life is allowed to develop and assuming no illness or emetic defect, etc, then we know that when it pops out of mommy, it will still be a human life. Not a giraffe. Not a mouse. A human being.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Life begins at conception. That’s all we need to know.

Gestational life of a fetus begins within days of conception. The gestating living organism is not similarly situated with an independent living human organism that has taken his or her first breath. That means civil society has no rational or moral duty to protect the gestating living organism’s right to gestation in the same way that we as a civil society have a moral and self-interest duty to protect a newly born human being.

Dobbs: Mississippi’s Gestational Age Act is supported by the Mississippi Legislature’s specific findings, which include the State’s asserted interest in “protecting the life of the unborn.” §2(b)(i). These legitimate interests provide a rational basis for the Gestational Age Act,​

Your dogmatic, faith based rote response that life begins at conception and that is all you think we need to know demonstrates your unwillingness to recognize the broader political/religious based dynamics behind the reason the Mississippi Legislature asserted it’s interest in “protecting the life of the unborn.” ar 15 weeks.

Why does the the State of Mississippi have an interest in protecting the life of the unborn at 15 weeks and the state of New York can wait until 24 weeks? What is the difference in the respective voters and legislators? The main difference is the political power in numbers of white Christians in each states.

The drive to restrict accessibility to abortion in bright red conservative states is never the result of secular philosophy or religious institutions that are not Christian..

bckvgn.23.07.12 #9,685
nf.23.07.12 #9,686

 

[CarsomyrPlusSix]

^ Not one word of that has any substance to reply to.

There isn’t anything approaching a coherent thought.

Scientific fact isn’t a matter of religious faith. You are absolutely retarded in the depths of your infinite contortions of nonsense.

Fake. And gay.

 

[BackAgain]

Gestational life of a fetus begins within days of conception. The gestating living organism is not similarly situated with an independent living human organism that has taken his or her first breath. That means civil society has no rational or moral duty to protect the gestating living organism’s right to gestation in the same way that we as a civil society have a moral and self-interest duty to protect a newly born human being.

Dobbs: Mississippi’s Gestational Age Act is supported by the Mississippi Legislature’s specific findings, which include the State’s asserted interest in “protecting the life of the unborn.” §2(b)(i). These legitimate interests provide a rational basis for the Gestational Age Act,​

Your dogmatic, faith based rote response that life begins at conception and that is all you think we need to know demonstrates your unwillingness to recognize the broader political/religious based dynamics behind the reason the Mississippi Legislature asserted it’s interest in “protecting the life of the unborn.” ar 15 weeks.

Why does the the State of Mississippi have an interest in protecting the life of the unborn at 15 weeks and the state of New York can wait until 24 weeks? What is the difference in the respective voters and legislators? The main difference is the political power in numbers of white Christians in each states.

The drive to restrict accessibility to abortion in bright red conservative states is never the result of secular philosophy or religious institutions that are not Christian..

bckvgn.23.07.12 #9,685
nf.23.07.12 #9,686

You’re a ******* broken record. But,
you can’t make an argument worth a shit.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Scientific fact isn’t a matter of religious faith.

We don’t need to know what stage of development that zygote or embryo or fetus is at. Such a question presupposes that it matters. It doesn’t.

Dobbs: Mississippi’s Gestational Age Act is supported by the Mississippi Legislature’s specific findings, which include the State’s asserted interest in “protecting the life of the unborn.”​

The challenge to RvW as you can see is titled “Gestational Age Act”

I have never made a point that scientific fact is a matter of religious faith. The “Gestational Age Act” was passed by white Christian mostly male legislators who were elected to public office in Mississippi because of their religion not because they are scientists.


bckvgn.23.07.12 #9,685
nf.23.07.12

 

[BackAgain]

Dobbs: Mississippi’s Gestational Age Act is supported by the Mississippi Legislature’s specific findings, which include the State’s asserted interest in “protecting the life of the unborn.”​

The challenge to RvW as you can see is titled “Gestational Age Act”

I have never made a point that scientific fact is a matter of religious faith. The “Gestational Age Act” was passed by white Christian mostly male legislators who were elected to public office in Mississippi because of their religion not because they are scientists.


bckvgn.23.07.12 #9,685
nf.23.07.12

Zzz

I’ve explained lots of stuff to you. But you’re unwilling to learn. So, instead, you just endlessly loop your pathetic failed contentions.

Ted Cruz grills FBI on Ray Epps, asks if FBI had informants on Jan. 6

Sen. Ted Cruz on Tuesday grilled a top FBI official on whether bureau informants were present at the Jan. 6 riots — zeroing in on a man named Ray Epps.

www.washingtonexaminer.com

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Why does the the State of Mississippi have an interest in protecting the life of the unborn at 15 weeks and the state of New York can wait until 24 weeks?

you can’t make an argument worth a shit.

That was a question. Do you know what harm the white Mississippi Christians are trying to prevent in the “Gestational Age Act” danger to the maternal patient

Dobbs: It found that most abortions after 15 weeks employ “dilation and evacuation procedures which involve the use of surgical instruments to crush and tear the unborn child,” and it concluded that the “intentional commitment of such acts for nontherapeutic or elective reasons is a barbaric practice, dangerous for the maternal patient, and demeaning to the medical profes- sion.” §2(b)(i)(8).​

nf.23.07.12 #9,686
bckvgn.23.07.12 #9,686
nf.23.07.12 #9,691

 

[CarsomyrPlusSix]

​

I have never made a point that scientific fact is a matter of religious faith.

You blather incessantly about religion.

You deny that human life begins at fertilization, constantly, no matter how many times you protest this reality, because you are a dishonest subhuman piece of excrement.

I encourage you to eat shit, which would be cannibalism for you.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Therefore, while it may very well be true that a zygote or embryo or fetus has no right to due process in one state, it might very well have or soon get such explicit rights in other states.

There is zero constitutional right to abort a baby.

If a zygote or embryo or fetus has no right to due process (no right to continue gestation) in one state then a woman has a right under the US Constitution to have safe and accessible abortion.

You have conceded the most critical point of the abortion rights debate in your post #9,681. If a woman has a right to a safe accessible abortion in one state she has a right to an abortion in every state.

The Old South Confederacy has lost one Lost Cause favoring race based slavery - They are suffering a second Lost Cause in this self righteous defense of reproductive slavery for half the population that now has the right to vote and run for political office.

Dobbs: Our decision returns the issue of abortion to those legislative bodies, and it allows women on both sides of the abortion issue to seek to affect the legislative process by influencing public opinion, lobbying legislators, voting, and running for office. Women are not without electoral or political power.​

​

There is an unenumerated constitutional right to cease gestating a live human fetus in one’s own body. Women accept the stipulation that gestation must be ended prior to the earliest premature birth survival on record at 21 weeks.. Abortions after that must be to save the life of the mother.

Do You really want to lose another civil war
over saving baby fetuses where white Christians cannot legislate their morality in the highest urbanized liberal states.

Is your fake “saving baby fetus” morality going to convert New York, California, Michigan Pennsylvania and Kansas into reproductive slavery states?

You deny that human life begins at fertilization,

Your atheist “Saving Baby Fetus” Confederate Comrade CarsomyrPlusSix is a liar in post #9,692. I affirm for the millionth time human life begins at fertilization.

bvkvgn.23.07.12 #9,681
bvkvgn.22.05.02 #310
myrpls.23.07.23 #9,692
nf.23.07.13 #9,693

 

[whutTHEYsay]

You blather incessantly about religion

I'm a true believer. And your many true believers — I hope all — is everybody a true believer in this room? I think so. But Christianity is under tremendous siege," Trump told supporters at Dordt College, a Christian liberal-arts school.​

​

The real-estate mogul lamented that Christians do not wield as much political influence in the US as they could.​

​

"The power of our group of people together, I mean, if you add it up ... it could be 240, 250 million. And yet we don't exert the power that we should have. Now, I think some of the churches are afraid of their tax status, to be honest," he said.​

​

TRUMP: If I'm president, 'Christianity will have power' in the US

"Christianity is under tremendous siege," Donald Trump told his supporters in Iowa.

www.businessinsider.com

"But you know the fact is that there is nothing the politicians can do to you if you band together. You have too much power. But the Christians don't use their power," Trump said. "We have to strengthen. Because we are getting — if you look, it's death by a million cuts — we are getting less and less and less powerful in terms of a religion, and in terms of a force," he continued.​

​

You know It was white Christians who put The Saving Baby Fetus cult messiah in the White House.

It was not certainly a national coalition of scientists. Or atheist and agnostic. Or black Christians. It was white Christians who want their power back.

myrpls.23.07.13
nf.23.07.13 #9,694

 

[BackAgain]

That was a question. Do you know what harm the white Mississippi Christians are trying to prevent in the “Gestational Age Act” danger to the maternal patient

Dobbs: It found that most abortions after 15 weeks employ “dilation and evacuation procedures which involve the use of surgical instruments to crush and tear the unborn child,” and it concluded that the “intentional commitment of such acts for nontherapeutic or elective reasons is a barbaric practice, dangerous for the maternal patient, and demeaning to the medical profes- sion.” §2(b)(i)(8).​

nf.23.07.12 #9,686
bckvgn.23.07.12 #9,686
nf.23.07.12 #9,691

You may refer to zygotes etc as “life.” Yiu don’t need to qualify them as “gestational life.” Your addition means nothing.

The particular form of any gruesome abortion is also not the point. They all end up with human life being sniffed out.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

You may refer to zygotes etc as “life.” Yiu don’t need to qualify them as “gestational life.”

A gestating human life is not similarly situated with an independent life that has once taken his or her first breath. There is a clear distinction that living human beings recognize as a moral point of obligation to interaction to protect the sanctity of human life. Why do you seek to ban a distinction that is made in the US Constitution and conforms with human reason, wisdom, morality and rational thinking from my argument?

bckvgn.23.07.13 #9,695
nf.23.07.13 #9,696

 

[BackAgain]

A gestating human life is not similarly situated with an independent life that has once taken his or her first breath. There is a clear distinction that living human beings have a moral and self-interaction when to protect the sanctity of human life. Why do you seek to ban a distinction that is made in the US Constitution and conforms with human reason, wisdom, morality and rational thinking from my argument?

bckvgn.23.07.13 #9,695
nf.23.07.13 #9,696

Meaningless albeit repetitive gibberish.

Your purely artificial lines of division make no more sense than making use of a kid’s first teeth or adult teeth or puberty or any other new development during a lifetime.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Just announced on American family radio. Earl Walker, Jackson Senior is going to be running for president. The announcement will be made in Richmond tomorrow.

Earl Walker Jackson Sr. (born January 13, 1952) is an American conservative politician,[1] Protestantminister, and lawyer in Virginia. He was the Republican Party nominee for Lieutenant Governor of Virginia in 2013.[2] Jackson unsuccessfully sought the Republican nomination for the United States Senate in Virginia in the 2012 and 2018 elections. He is head pastor at Exodus Faith Ministries, located in Chesapeake, Virginia and founder of Staying True to America's National Destiny, a Christian political organization.[3]

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Indpndnt220509-#1,580 @Indeependent No Orthodox Jew wants abortion to be illegal.

ding220730-#4,060 @ding “It's only the job of science to inform society when it is scientifically alive and genetically distinct.”

NFBW: American Dem voting Jews have their religion and science and politics aligned .

Rightwing white Christian nationalist MAGA anti-abortion voters like @ding @beagle9 @beautress do not have their religion aligned with science or functional rational politics.

Science teaches that what we humans normally refer to as human life amongst ourselves being viable self-acting humans, is scientifically and biologically contingent upon a pre-born person being physically formed sufficiently to make a once in a lifetime, spark of life switch at a moment when the individual persons’ time in the natural universe comes into being and the switch is pulled. It comes with first breath as in Jewish spiritual belief for thousands of years when the fetal shunts are functionally modified or eliminated, enabling independent life.

Science describes the physiological flip of the switch:

Formation of the human heart involves complex biological k look signals, interactions, specification of myocardial progenitor cells, and heart tube looping. To facilitate survival in the hypoxemic intrauterine environment, the fetus possesses structural, physiological, and functional cardiovascular adaptations that are fundamentally different from the neonate.

The Transitional Heart: From Early Embryonic and Fetal Development to Neonatal Life - PubMed

At birth, upon separation from the placental circulation, the neonatal cardiovascular system takes over responsibility of vital processes for survival. The transition from the fetal to neonatal circulation is considered to be a period of intricate physiological, anatomical, and biochemical changes in the cardiovascular system. With a successful cardiopulmonary transition to the extrauterine environment, the fetal shunts are functionally modified or eliminated, enabling independent life.

@ding and the rest of Christian religion driven MAGA/Trumpi’s white voters are stubbornly averse to science on the legality of the medical procedure of abortion.

@Indeependent is MAGA but is aligned with science on abortion. Dobbs is destroying his political reality right before our very eyes.

Indpndnt220915-#6 @Indeependent “Anyone willing to pay for an abortion should be allowed to abort”

Your purely artificial lines of division make no more sense than making use of a kid’s first teeth or adult teeth or puberty or any other new development during a lifetime.

There is one transition on the human life continuum from conception to death that gives each one of us human beings the equal right to life if God, nature or our mother allow us to make it that far.

It is our very first breath and cutting the life line from our mother’s body to ours which marks the beginning of life of an independent individual human life.

Ii’s call a birthday.

I cannot get you to engage in a genuinely fact and truth based rational discussion about a woman’s right to reproductive healthcare.. but I can get you to make the stupidest ******* arguments like going through puberty is as significant as this;

The Transitional Heart: From Early Embryonic and Fetal Development to Neonatal Life - PubMed At birth, upon separation from the placental circulation, the neonatal cardiovascular system takes over responsibility of vital processes for survival. The transition from the fetal to neonatal circulation is considered to be a period of intricate physiological, anatomical, and biochemical changes in the cardiovascular system. With a successful cardiopulmonary transition to the extrauterine environment, the fetal shunts are functionally modified or eliminated, enabling independent life.​

​

The day your successful cardiopulmonary transition to the extrauterine environment when your fetal shunts were functionally modified or eliminated was recorded with the state local and now federal government and shows up on everything you do.

And you write it’s no different than the day you figured out how to masterbate.


nf.23.04.17 #8,337
bckvgn.23.07.13 #9,697

 

[whutTHEYsay]

1

Overturning Roe v. Wade would be such a significant decision

2

It never was a right, that is irrefutable,

3

Agree. The right to privacy is a manufactured construct

4

puberty or any other new development

5

What possible purpose would a discussion on religion serve?

Freedom of conscience is a right. Dobbs essentially nullified freedom of conscience for pregnant women who do not want to extend gestation beyond 20 weeks.

Why would any woman be required to give up her privacy during the first weeks of pregnancy in order to submit to the peculiar religious conscience of white
evangelical Protestants, Jehovah’s Witnesses, Latter-day Saints, and Hispanic Protestants, and less than half of Catholics?

RvW would not be overturned if the above Republucan voters respected a pregnant woman’s privacy and conscience,

Religious Tradition​

Majorities of most religious groups say that abortion should be legal in most or all cases.

Abortion Attitudes in a Post-Roe World: Findings From the 50-State 2022 American Values Atlas

Support for abortion rights continues to increase among the American public, according to a new survey of more than 22,000 adults conducted by PRRI as part of its 2022 American Values Atlas project…

www.prri.org

White evangelical Protestants (27%), Jehovah’s Witnesses (27%) Latter-day Saints (32%), and Hispanic Protestants (44%) are the only major religious groups in which less than half of adherents say that abortion should be legal in most or all cases.

By contrast, majorities of religiously unaffiliated Americans (85%), Unitarian Universalists (85%), Jewish Americans (79%), Buddhists (78%), Black Protestants (72%), other Catholics of color (71%), Hindus (69%), white mainline Protestants (68%), Muslims (66%), white Catholics (62%), Hispanic Catholics (61%), and other Protestants of color (53%) say that abortion should be legal in most or all cases.[4]


1 skvws 22.05.22 #1
2 dthnnj 22.05.22 #4
3 hkrgy 22.05.23 #20
4 bckvgn 23.07.13 #9,697
5 dvng 22.07.19 #3,658
nf.23.07.13 #9,700