Protesters topple Confederate monument on UNC campus

[Missourian]

The statue isn't obnoxious, it commemorates the students and faculty who died fighting in the war between the states.

"on the campus at the State University, of a monument to the students and faculty, who went out from its walls in 1861 to fight and die for the South"

Tell me what right the students of 2018 have to decide the fate of a memorial conceived, privately funded and erected in 1913?

It's their campus now, and in 2018, we realize the Confederacy fought for an evil cause.

It's not their campus...they're renters, not owners. We don't get to "realize" anything when it comes to memorials. Slavery was legal and normal at the time of Civil War...judging a MEMORIAL to soldiers by today's standards is ridiculously stupid.

 

[BigTruck]

The statue isn't obnoxious, it commemorates the students and faculty who died fighting in the war between the states.

"on the campus at the State University, of a monument to the students and faculty, who went out from its walls in 1861 to fight and die for the South"

Tell me what right the students of 2018 have to decide the fate of a memorial conceived, privately funded and erected in 1913?

It's their campus now, and in 2018, we realize the Confederacy fought for an evil cause.

It's not their campus...they're renters, not owners. We don't get to "realize" anything when it comes to memorials. Slavery was legal and normal at the time of Civil War...judging a MEMORIAL to soldiers by today's standards is ridiculously stupid.

This is an asinine thing to say.

Abolitionists of the time opposed slavery.

The founding fathers even understood the hypocrisy of starting a a nation founded on the principle of freedom while allowing slavery.

The idea of slavery as evil is not new.

 

[JoeB131]

It's not their campus...they're renters, not owners. We don't get to "realize" anything when it comes to memorials. Slavery was legal and normal at the time of Civil War...judging a MEMORIAL to soldiers by today's standards is ridiculously stupid.

Oh, so by that logic, we need to put up statues of the Nazis because, hey, by the logic of the time, the Holocaust was perfectly acceptable, right?

See the problem here?

Statues like this were put up around the turn of the last century to intimidate blacks, no other reason. It's why they all need to come down now.

 

[Missourian]

It's not their campus...they're renters, not owners. We don't get to "realize" anything when it comes to memorials. Slavery was legal and normal at the time of Civil War...judging a MEMORIAL to soldiers by today's standards is ridiculously stupid.

Oh, so by that logic, we need to put up statues of the Nazis because, hey, by the logic of the time, the Holocaust was perfectly acceptable, right?

See the problem here?

Statues like this were put up around the turn of the last century to intimidate blacks, no other reason. It's why they all need to come down now.

A war memorial wasn't put up to intimidate blacks...that's your opinion injected as fact.

I've been thinking about the best way to prove my point. Here it is.

In 2118, Capitalist is considered evil. There are no more borders. The Vietnam War is now considered an amoral genocide. A group claims the Vietnam War Memorial was only erected to intimidate Asians. It isn't true of course, but they repeat it ad nauseam...heck, they might even believe it...fake news hasn't been totally abolished in the 22nd century.

Should the Vietnam Memorial Wall Memorial be torn down? Or is it a Memorial to the soldiers, not the cause...

 

[Missourian]

It's not their campus...they're renters, not owners. We don't get to "realize" anything when it comes to memorials. Slavery was legal and normal at the time of Civil War...judging a MEMORIAL to soldiers by today's standards is ridiculously stupid.

Oh, so by that logic, we need to put up statues of the Nazis because, hey, by the logic of the time, the Holocaust was perfectly acceptable, right?

See the problem here?

Statues like this were put up around the turn of the last century to intimidate blacks, no other reason. It's why they all need to come down now.

There are many memorials to German soldiers who fought and died in WWII

German War Memorials

 

[JoeB131]

A war memorial wasn't put up to intimidate blacks...that's your opinion injected as fact.

I've been thinking about the best way to prove my point. Here it is.

In 2118, Capitalist is considered evil. There are no more borders. The Vietnam War is now considered an amoral genocide. A group claims the Vietnam War Memorial was only erected to intimidate Asians. It isn't true of course, but they repeat it ad nauseam...heck, they might even believe it...fake news hasn't been totally abolished in the 22nd century.

Should the Vietnam Memorial Wall Memorial be torn down? Or is it a Memorial to the soldiers, not the cause...

Given that the Vietnam Memorial was designed by an Asian-American woman, that would be a difficult claim to make.

Here's the problem. We didn't put that memorial up in Vietnam and make glorious statues to Westmoreland and the other generals who led that war. It was not put up at a time when a huge anti-Asian hate group was growing in the land.

The fact was, those memorial were not put up after the war to list the dead, they were put up to intimidate blacks.

 

[JoeB131]

There are many memorials to German soldiers who fought and died in WWII

You link shows mostly memorials for soliders who died in WWI.

You aren't going to see a statue of Hitler or Rommel anywhere...

 

[Missourian]

Given that the Vietnam Memorial was designed by an Asian-American woman, that would be a difficult claim to make.

View attachment 213082

Here's the problem. We didn't put that memorial up in Vietnam and make glorious statues to Westmoreland and the other generals who led that war. It was not put up at a time when a huge anti-Asian hate group was growing in the land.

The fact was, those memorial were not put up after the war to list the dead, they were put up to intimidate blacks.

"Erected in 1913, in remembrance of "the sons of the University who died for their beloved Southland 1861-1865," the Confederate monument known as Silent Sam stands on McCorkle place, the University's upper quad, facing Franklin Street. The monument was given to the University by the United Daughters of the Confederacy in 1909. More than 1000 University men fought in the Civil War. At least 40% of the students enlisted, a record not equaled by any other institution, North or South."

Confederate Monument

This is EXACTLY like the Vietnam War Memorial...the Vietnam War Memorial isn't a statue of Westmoreland...it's a tribute to those that died...a memorial to the soldiers. If sentiments change in 2074...it doesn't make a damn bit of difference. If you'd tear one down, it's no different from tearing down the other. Period.

 

[BigTruck]

Given that the Vietnam Memorial was designed by an Asian-American woman, that would be a difficult claim to make.

View attachment 213082

Here's the problem. We didn't put that memorial up in Vietnam and make glorious statues to Westmoreland and the other generals who led that war. It was not put up at a time when a huge anti-Asian hate group was growing in the land.

The fact was, those memorial were not put up after the war to list the dead, they were put up to intimidate blacks.

"Erected in 1913, in remembrance of "the sons of the University who died for their beloved Southland 1861-1865," the Confederate monument known as Silent Sam stands on McCorkle place, the University's upper quad, facing Franklin Street. The monument was given to the University by the United Daughters of the Confederacy in 1909. More than 1000 University men fought in the Civil War. At least 40% of the students enlisted, a record not equaled by any other institution, North or South."

Confederate Monument

This is EXACTLY like the Vietnam War Memorial...the Vietnam War Memorial isn't a statue of Westmoreland...it's a tribute to those that died...a memorial to the soldiers. If sentiments change in 2074...it doesn't make a damn bit of difference. If you'd tear one down, it's no different from tearing down the other. Period.

Silent Sam memorializes soldiers that fought to preserve slavery. That shouldn’t be celebrated.

 

[Ame®icano]

While we're at removing "racist" monuments, when are we gonna start renaming schools and building named after racists Democrats like Jackson, Wilson or FDR?

 

[JoeB131]

This is EXACTLY like the Vietnam War Memorial...the Vietnam War Memorial isn't a statue of Westmoreland...it's a tribute to those that died...a memorial to the soldiers. If sentiments change in 2074...it doesn't make a damn bit of difference. If you'd tear one down, it's no different from tearing down the other. Period.

You go with that... but it's racist crap and everyone knows it, and all those statues will be torn down in a decade, and we'll all be better off for it.

 

[martybegan]

The difference is that afterwards the whole purpose was to all be Americans again and part of that deal was to allow them to honor their dead and their lost cause as long as they remained loyal.

That led to the lack of guerrilla warfare that so many in the North feared would happen.

Former confederate soldiers became US citizens again.

They never should have been... that's the point.

Let's compare, shall we.

After the Civil War, we didn't hang any of hte traitor racist scum. As a result, we had the Klan emerge, Jim Crow was put into place, and we pretty much pissed away anything that was won with blood. We STILL have severe racial problem to THIS VERY DAY because we were so upset about hurting the feelings of white trash scum who betrayed their country.

After WWII, we HUNG the Nazi leadership, we went house to house and confiscated all the guns in Germany, and if some asshole didn't get the message the war was over and they lost, we put them in front of a firing squad and shot their Nazi asses.

To this very day, Germany realizes what it did was totally wrong, they will ARREST you if you walk down the street with a Swastika, and Germany has been pretty much a model international citizen.

Too bad we didn't do that after the civil war.

Hanging them en masse might have lead to a guerilla war we might still be fighting today.

Actually we paroled plenty of them, only the really bad ones got hung.

The big difference is that we never wanted those Germans to be American Citizens, for the losers in the Civil War, the whole purpose was reconciliation.

And for the redeemers taking power, you can blame Booth for that, you know, one of those brave "rebels" you love so much.

 

[martybegan]

Thoughts and prayers for the statue.

Ass.

Oh, come on, that was pretty fucking funny.

Grow a sense of humor, Marty... you'll be less miserable.

This coming from the most miserable twat on the board is funny enough.

 

[JoeB131]

Hanging them en masse might have lead to a guerilla war we might still be fighting today.

I'd be good with that. ANything to get the inbreds out of the gene pool.

Actually we paroled plenty of them, only the really bad ones got hung.

The big difference is that we never wanted those Germans to be American Citizens, for the losers in the Civil War, the whole purpose was reconciliation.

No, the problem is, we let them become citizens again despite their treason.

And for the redeemers taking power, you can blame Booth for that, you know, one of those brave "rebels" you love so much.

Um I think you are confused... Booth would have been one of the guys I would have hung.

 

[Doc7505]

No one can change history by toppling statues.

Its history is as a monument erected in 1913 to the Jim Crow laws which were keeping the blacks in their place. It glorifies men who fought for a government based on the inferiority of the black man, which intended to preserve slavery. History will record that such men were less likely to be glorified 150 years after the war.

~~~~~~
One would have to ask who created those Jim Crow Laws you write of? Democrats of course.
No the statute was in memory of those lost fighting in the Civil War on both sides.
Hmm...., what's next? Will you being shouting for tearing down the statute of Sgt. York Medal honor winner in WWI because he was from Tennessee and a devout Christian. How about the memorial to Iwo Jima? Would you tear that down because there was not one black man in those that raised the flag?

 

[martybegan]

Hanging them en masse might have lead to a guerilla war we might still be fighting today.

I'd be good with that. ANything to get the inbreds out of the gene pool.

Actually we paroled plenty of them, only the really bad ones got hung.

The big difference is that we never wanted those Germans to be American Citizens, for the losers in the Civil War, the whole purpose was reconciliation.

No, the problem is, we let them become citizens again despite their treason.

And for the redeemers taking power, you can blame Booth for that, you know, one of those brave "rebels" you love so much.

Um I think you are confused... Booth would have been one of the guys I would have hung.

Stupid response by a stupid poster

And part of the deal was to allow them the rights as citizens, including the right to protest and the right to remember their past as they wanted to.

Booth was more like you than me, intolerant, convinced of his own views, and a whiny little snotty bitch.

 

[JoeB131]

And part of the deal was to allow them the rights as citizens, including the right to protest and the right to remember their past as they wanted to.

Why make a deal with them at all.

Hey, here's a deal. You act like a decent human being, and we won't hang your asses for treason.

We should have hung every politician and general in the Confederacy, like they did the Nazi leaders after WW2.

 

[Crixus]

And part of the deal was to allow them the rights as citizens, including the right to protest and the right to remember their past as they wanted to.

Why make a deal with them at all.

Hey, here's a deal. You act like a decent human being, and we won't hang your asses for treason.

We should have hung every politician and general in the Confederacy, like they did the Nazi leaders after WW2.

Only the ones we diddnt need to show us how to make our missiles fly. Of course a moron like you who lies about military service and learns history from call of duity on Xbox would not know that. We kept some real winners from the pacific campaigne alive to. You are to stupid to comment on such things. You just don’t know what your talking about and should stick to lying about being an army man in Beirut.

 

[JoeB131]

Only the ones we diddnt need to show us how to make our missiles fly. Of course a moron like you who lies about military service and learns history from call of duity on Xbox would not know that. We kept some real winners from the pacific campaigne alive to. You are to stupid to comment on such things. You just don’t know what your talking about and should stick to lying about being an army man in Beirut.

Guy, I don't play video games... never said anything about being in Beirut... you obviously read like you spell.

The Scientists we took weren't Nazis... they were scientists.

We hung about 10,000 Nazis and about 10,000 high ranking Japanese after the War. This was to make it pretty clear to them what they did was wrong. Nobody has put up statues to Hitler or Tojo. Heck, the Germans can't stop apologizing for what they did in WWII.

We kind of need the South to do that. They don't need to put up statues to the awful things they did, they need to apologize to the rest of us.

 

[Crixus]

Only the ones we diddnt need to show us how to make our missiles fly. Of course a moron like you who lies about military service and learns history from call of duity on Xbox would not know that. We kept some real winners from the pacific campaigne alive to. You are to stupid to comment on such things. You just don’t know what your talking about and should stick to lying about being an army man in Beirut.

Guy, I don't play video games... never said anything about being in Beirut... you obviously read like you spell.

The Scientists we took weren't Nazis... they were scientists.

We hung about 10,000 Nazis and about 10,000 high ranking Japanese after the War. This was to make it pretty clear to them what they did was wrong. Nobody has put up statues to Hitler or Tojo. Heck, the Germans can't stop apologizing for what they did in WWII.

We kind of need the South to do that. They don't need to put up statues to the awful things they did, they need to apologize to the rest of us.

Guy , you do. Guy you are. Deal with it.