Origins of Palestinians and Jews in Palestine/Israel

[Roudy]

The indiginous people of Palestine included Jews, Christians and Muslims (descendents of native peoples who converted to Islam).

NOPE as right up until 1960 the only Palestinians were the Jews, then the Russians told Arafat that he needed a name to give his cause credibility. To call an arab muslim a Palestinian before this time was a serious insult that would result in your blood being spilt.

So when did the Christians become Palestinian?

Palestinian is a recent invention, it's the name the Europeans gave to the Jews of the region. During the 800 years of the Ottoman empire, there was no such thing as Palestinian or Palestine. The Ottoman maps clearly indicate this.

 

[Roudy]

Most of todays Muslim Palestinians are just squatters with no titles or deeds to the land they stole whatsoever.

Who Are The Palestinians? What And Where Is Palestine?

Why do you link to silly and amateurish propaganda sites. Do you think anyone believes the nonsense?

The squatters are the European invaders. The official migration statistics, from source documents make this fact self-evident.

From 1920 to 1946 414,456 persons, legally and illegally, migrated to Palestine. As depicted below 376,415 were Jews. The current squatters and their offspring.

View attachment 56666

A Survey of Palestine Volume 1 | Berman Jewish Policy Archive @ NYU Wagner

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA Jerusalem After 1291

"...Present condition of the City: (1907 edition)

Jerusalem (El Quds) is the capital of a sanjak and the seat of a mutasarrif directly dependent on the Sublime Porte. In the administration of the sanjak the mutasarrif is assisted by a council called majlis ida ra; the city has a municipal government (majlis baladiye) presided over by a mayor. The total population is estimated at 66,000.The Turkish census of 1905, which counts only Ottoman subjects, gives these figures:
Jews, 45,000; Moslems, 8,000; Orthodox Christians, 6000;Latins, 2500; Armenians, 950; Protestants, 800; Melkites, 250; Copts, 150; Abyssinians, 100; Jacobites, 100; Catholic Syrians, 50. During the Nineteenth century large suburbs to the north and east have grown up, chiefly for the use of the Jewish colony. These suburbs contain nearly Half the present population...""

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Growth of Jerusalem 1838-Present

....... Jews Muslims Christians Total
1838 6,000 5,000 3,000 14,000
1844 7,120 5,760 3,390 16,270 ..... ..The First Official Ottoman Census
1876 12,000 7,560 5,470 25,030 .... .....Second """"""""""
1905 40,000 8,000 10,900 58,900 ....... Third/last, detailed in CathEncyc above
1948 99,320 36,680 31,300 167,300
1990 353,200 124,200 14,000 491,400
1992 385,000 150,000 15,000 550,000

http://www.testimony-magazine.org/jerusalem/bring.htm

 

[Roudy]

Most of todays Muslim Palestinians are just squatters with no titles or deeds to the land they stole whatsoever.

Who Are The Palestinians? What And Where Is Palestine?

Why do you link to silly and amateurish propaganda sites. Do you think anyone believes the nonsense?

The squatters are the European invaders. The official migration statistics, from source documents make this fact self-evident.

From 1920 to 1946 414,456 persons, legally and illegally, migrated to Palestine. As depicted below 376,415 were Jews. The current squatters and their offspring.

View attachment 56666

A Survey of Palestine Volume 1 | Berman Jewish Policy Archive @ NYU Wagner

Sir Stewart SYMES replied that the administration of Transjordan was still somewhat primitive. Even in Palestine, reliable statistics had been difficult to obtain.. As the administration of Transjordan improved, more statistics would become available, and every effort would be made to comply with the Commission's desire.
- See more at: http://unispal.un.org/UNISPAL.NSF/0/E211072996E780B9052565F000651656#.dpuf

 

[Roudy]

Case closed!

http://unispal.un.org/UNISPAL.NSF/0/07175DE9FA2DE563852568D3006E10F3

163. The Arabs of Palestine consider themselves as having a "natural" right to that country, although they have not been in possession of it as a sovereign nation.


166. The desire of the Arab people of Palestine to safeguard their national existence is a very natural desire. However, Palestinian nationalism, as distinct from Arab nationalism, is itself a relatively new phenomenon, which appeared only after the division of the "Arab rectangle" by the settlement of the First World War.


175. The Peel Commission, in referring to the matter, had noted in its report that "there was a time when Arab statesmen were willing to consider giving Palestine to the Jews, provided that the rest of Arab Asia was free. That condition was not fulfilled then, but it is on the eve of fulfilment now".

 

[Shusha]

Trying to reduce this subject down to a single point is usually due to someone trying to delegitimize the other side. Sadly, both sides tend to do this. The reality is that ... its complicated. I could name all sorts of reasons why its complicated, but really, we should just stop trying to delegitimize the other. Which means we need to stop calling either side colonizers, invaders, foreigners, or whatever and just accept the rights of both sides to self-identify and have some measure of self-determination and sovereignty.

 

[Challenger]

Palestinian is a recent invention, it's the name the Europeans gave to the Jews of the region.

You Zionuts keep saying this but I've never found mention of this phenomenon anywhere, care to provide a link to some examples where this was used?

 

[Challenger]

The reality is that ... its complicated

The reality is that it's quite simple, just made overcomplicated by those with a Zionist agenda. Palestine for the Palestinians; be they Christian, Jewish, or Muslim; with equal rights guaranteed by a written constitution.

 

[Phoenall]

The reality is that ... its complicated

The reality is that it's quite simple, just made overcomplicated by those with a Zionist agenda. Palestine for the Palestinians; be they Christian, Jewish, or Muslim; with equal rights guaranteed by a written constitution.

Would that be Jewish Palestine or arab muslim Palestine. And who will enforce the constitution when the arab muslims decide they need target practise for the next jihad. Why isn't it complicated by those with an Islamic agenda of world domination and muslims being the master race

 

[Hollie]

The reality is that ... its complicated

The reality is that it's quite simple, just made overcomplicated by those with a Zionist agenda. Palestine for the Palestinians; be they Christian, Jewish, or Muslim; with equal rights guaranteed by a written constitution.

You need a great deal more practice with your Islamist taqiyya-speak.

Any notion of an Islamist Pal'istanian state will mirror every other Islamist majority hell hole. There will be no allowance for the hated Christian and Jew or even the "wrong kind" of moslem.

Abbas has already established the framework for his mini caliphate and predictably, Jews are not a part of it.



The Jerusalem Post

"In a final resolution, we would not see the presence of a single Israeli - civilian or soldier - on our lands," Abbas said in a briefing to mostly Egyptian journalists.



It's the Islamist agenda of apartheid and religious fascism that is the complication.

 

[Challenger]

The reality is that ... its complicated

The reality is that it's quite simple, just made overcomplicated by those with a Zionist agenda. Palestine for the Palestinians; be they Christian, Jewish, or Muslim; with equal rights guaranteed by a written constitution.

You need a great deal more practice with your Islamist taqiyya-speak.

Any notion of an Islamist Pal'istanian state will mirror every other Islamist majority hell hole. There will be no allowance for the hated Christian and Jew or even the "wrong kind" of moslem.

Abbas has already established the framework for his mini caliphate and predictably, Jews are not a part of it.



The Jerusalem Post

"In a final resolution, we would not see the presence of a single Israeli - civilian or soldier - on our lands," Abbas said in a briefing to mostly Egyptian journalists.



It's the Islamist agenda of apartheid and religious fascism that is the complication.

Well I suppose 67 years of having to live with a Zionist agenda of apartheid and religious fascism tends to alter one's world view. I did notice he said "Israeli" not "Jewish" so the Palestinian view hasn't changed that much.

 

[Hollie]

The reality is that ... its complicated

The reality is that it's quite simple, just made overcomplicated by those with a Zionist agenda. Palestine for the Palestinians; be they Christian, Jewish, or Muslim; with equal rights guaranteed by a written constitution.

You need a great deal more practice with your Islamist taqiyya-speak.

Any notion of an Islamist Pal'istanian state will mirror every other Islamist majority hell hole. There will be no allowance for the hated Christian and Jew or even the "wrong kind" of moslem.

Abbas has already established the framework for his mini caliphate and predictably, Jews are not a part of it.



The Jerusalem Post

"In a final resolution, we would not see the presence of a single Israeli - civilian or soldier - on our lands," Abbas said in a briefing to mostly Egyptian journalists.



It's the Islamist agenda of apartheid and religious fascism that is the complication.

Well I suppose 67 years of having to live with a Zionist agenda of apartheid and religious fascism tends to alter one's world view. I did notice he said "Israeli" not "Jewish" so the Palestinian view hasn't changed that much.

Slogans and cliches don't make a defendable argument.

You do know that there are Arabs living in Israel and that Arabs are represented in the Israeli parliament?

So tell us, how many Jews live in Gaza and how many of those are represented in the Hamas (islamic terrorist) version of government.

You need to review the definition of apartheid as you clearly don't understand the term or definition.

 

[Phoenall]

The reality is that ... its complicated

The reality is that it's quite simple, just made overcomplicated by those with a Zionist agenda. Palestine for the Palestinians; be they Christian, Jewish, or Muslim; with equal rights guaranteed by a written constitution.

You need a great deal more practice with your Islamist taqiyya-speak.

Any notion of an Islamist Pal'istanian state will mirror every other Islamist majority hell hole. There will be no allowance for the hated Christian and Jew or even the "wrong kind" of moslem.

Abbas has already established the framework for his mini caliphate and predictably, Jews are not a part of it.



The Jerusalem Post

"In a final resolution, we would not see the presence of a single Israeli - civilian or soldier - on our lands," Abbas said in a briefing to mostly Egyptian journalists.



It's the Islamist agenda of apartheid and religious fascism that is the complication.

Well I suppose 67 years of having to live with a Zionist agenda of apartheid and religious fascism tends to alter one's world view. I did notice he said "Israeli" not "Jewish" so the Palestinian view hasn't changed that much.

Still peddling the apartheid lie that you have never proven exists inside Israel, and if it is in Palestine then it is the Palestinians putting apartheid in place.
No the Palestinian arab muslim views has not altered it is still founded on the pact of Umar and the dhimmi laws that allow muslims to practice murder, rape and theft from their Jewish and Christian slaves. They still believe that they are the master race and will one day rule the world.

 

[Phoenall]

The reality is that ... its complicated

The reality is that it's quite simple, just made overcomplicated by those with a Zionist agenda. Palestine for the Palestinians; be they Christian, Jewish, or Muslim; with equal rights guaranteed by a written constitution.

You need a great deal more practice with your Islamist taqiyya-speak.

Any notion of an Islamist Pal'istanian state will mirror every other Islamist majority hell hole. There will be no allowance for the hated Christian and Jew or even the "wrong kind" of moslem.

Abbas has already established the framework for his mini caliphate and predictably, Jews are not a part of it.



The Jerusalem Post

"In a final resolution, we would not see the presence of a single Israeli - civilian or soldier - on our lands," Abbas said in a briefing to mostly Egyptian journalists.



It's the Islamist agenda of apartheid and religious fascism that is the complication.

Well I suppose 67 years of having to live with a Zionist agenda of apartheid and religious fascism tends to alter one's world view. I did notice he said "Israeli" not "Jewish" so the Palestinian view hasn't changed that much.

Slogans and cliches don't make a defendable argument.

You do know that there are Arabs living in Israel and that Arabs are represented in the Israeli parliament?

So tell us, how many Jews live in Gaza and how many of those are represented in the Hamas (islamic terrorist) version of government.

You need to review the definition of apartheid as you clearly don't understand the term or definition.

He does from a purely islamonazi framework, which says that the Jews are always wrong and they will be blamed for what the muslims do at all times. He needs to read the hamas charter and the PLO charter to see just who practises apartheid, the M.E will be judenfrie if Israel is even destroyed

 

[Shusha]

The reality is that ... its complicated

The reality is that it's quite simple, just made overcomplicated by those with a Zionist agenda. Palestine for the Palestinians; be they Christian, Jewish, or Muslim; with equal rights guaranteed by a written constitution.

Sure. You've made it simple by not saying anything meaningful. "Palestine for the Palestinians" doesn't mean anything without defining some criteria.

You don't care who has sovereignty or who lives there as long as its one nation and labelled "Palestine" on the maps?

You don't care who has sovereignty as long as only people who are born there are allowed to live there?

You don't care who has sovereignty as long as only people who are descendants of (insert preferred number here) generations back are allowed to live there?

You don't care who has sovereignty as long as all those who were "ethnically cleansed" are permitted to return? Or only some of those who were "ethnically cleansed" are permitted to return?

You don't care who lives there as long as the Jewish people don't have sovereignty?

You don't care who lives there or who has sovereignty as long as everyone is treated fairly and equally?

You don't care who has sovereignty as long as all the "foreigners" go "home"?

There are at least a dozen different possible interpretations of your post. In order to make it meaningful, you have to start answering some of these questions. It won't remain "simple" for long.

 

[P F Tinmore]

The reality is that ... its complicated

The reality is that it's quite simple, just made overcomplicated by those with a Zionist agenda. Palestine for the Palestinians; be they Christian, Jewish, or Muslim; with equal rights guaranteed by a written constitution.

You need a great deal more practice with your Islamist taqiyya-speak.

Any notion of an Islamist Pal'istanian state will mirror every other Islamist majority hell hole. There will be no allowance for the hated Christian and Jew or even the "wrong kind" of moslem.

Abbas has already established the framework for his mini caliphate and predictably, Jews are not a part of it.



The Jerusalem Post

"In a final resolution, we would not see the presence of a single Israeli - civilian or soldier - on our lands," Abbas said in a briefing to mostly Egyptian journalists.



It's the Islamist agenda of apartheid and religious fascism that is the complication.

Well I suppose 67 years of having to live with a Zionist agenda of apartheid and religious fascism tends to alter one's world view. I did notice he said "Israeli" not "Jewish" so the Palestinian view hasn't changed that much.

Slogans and cliches don't make a defendable argument.

You do know that there are Arabs living in Israel and that Arabs are represented in the Israeli parliament?

So tell us, how many Jews live in Gaza and how many of those are represented in the Hamas (islamic terrorist) version of government.

You need to review the definition of apartheid as you clearly don't understand the term or definition.

You do know that there are Arabs living in Israel and that Arabs are represented in the Israeli parliament?​

How many times has an Arab party been part of the ruling coalition?

 

[Hollie]

The reality is that ... its complicated

The reality is that it's quite simple, just made overcomplicated by those with a Zionist agenda. Palestine for the Palestinians; be they Christian, Jewish, or Muslim; with equal rights guaranteed by a written constitution.

You need a great deal more practice with your Islamist taqiyya-speak.

Any notion of an Islamist Pal'istanian state will mirror every other Islamist majority hell hole. There will be no allowance for the hated Christian and Jew or even the "wrong kind" of moslem.

Abbas has already established the framework for his mini caliphate and predictably, Jews are not a part of it.



The Jerusalem Post

"In a final resolution, we would not see the presence of a single Israeli - civilian or soldier - on our lands," Abbas said in a briefing to mostly Egyptian journalists.



It's the Islamist agenda of apartheid and religious fascism that is the complication.

Well I suppose 67 years of having to live with a Zionist agenda of apartheid and religious fascism tends to alter one's world view. I did notice he said "Israeli" not "Jewish" so the Palestinian view hasn't changed that much.

Slogans and cliches don't make a defendable argument.

You do know that there are Arabs living in Israel and that Arabs are represented in the Israeli parliament?

So tell us, how many Jews live in Gaza and how many of those are represented in the Hamas (islamic terrorist) version of government.

You need to review the definition of apartheid as you clearly don't understand the term or definition.

You do know that there are Arabs living in Israel and that Arabs are represented in the Israeli parliament?​

How many times has an Arab party been part of the ruling coalition?

So tell us, how many Jews live in Gaza and how many of those are represented in the Hamas (islamic terrorist) version of government.

 

[Phoenall]

The reality is that ... its complicated

The reality is that it's quite simple, just made overcomplicated by those with a Zionist agenda. Palestine for the Palestinians; be they Christian, Jewish, or Muslim; with equal rights guaranteed by a written constitution.

You need a great deal more practice with your Islamist taqiyya-speak.

Any notion of an Islamist Pal'istanian state will mirror every other Islamist majority hell hole. There will be no allowance for the hated Christian and Jew or even the "wrong kind" of moslem.

Abbas has already established the framework for his mini caliphate and predictably, Jews are not a part of it.



The Jerusalem Post

"In a final resolution, we would not see the presence of a single Israeli - civilian or soldier - on our lands," Abbas said in a briefing to mostly Egyptian journalists.



It's the Islamist agenda of apartheid and religious fascism that is the complication.

Well I suppose 67 years of having to live with a Zionist agenda of apartheid and religious fascism tends to alter one's world view. I did notice he said "Israeli" not "Jewish" so the Palestinian view hasn't changed that much.

Slogans and cliches don't make a defendable argument.

You do know that there are Arabs living in Israel and that Arabs are represented in the Israeli parliament?

So tell us, how many Jews live in Gaza and how many of those are represented in the Hamas (islamic terrorist) version of government.

You need to review the definition of apartheid as you clearly don't understand the term or definition.

You do know that there are Arabs living in Israel and that Arabs are represented in the Israeli parliament?​

How many times has an Arab party been part of the ruling coalition?

How many times has an arab party shown an interest in voting along with the coalition. If they oppose the coalitions manifesto they wont be asked. You really need to earn what a political party coalition menas ?

 

[Challenger]

The reality is that ... its complicated

The reality is that it's quite simple, just made overcomplicated by those with a Zionist agenda. Palestine for the Palestinians; be they Christian, Jewish, or Muslim; with equal rights guaranteed by a written constitution.

Sure. You've made it simple by not saying anything meaningful. "Palestine for the Palestinians" doesn't mean anything without defining some criteria.

You don't care who has sovereignty or who lives there as long as its one nation and labelled "Palestine" on the maps?

You don't care who has sovereignty as long as only people who are born there are allowed to live there?

You don't care who has sovereignty as long as only people who are descendants of (insert preferred number here) generations back are allowed to live there?

You don't care who has sovereignty as long as all those who were "ethnically cleansed" are permitted to return? Or only some of those who were "ethnically cleansed" are permitted to return?

You don't care who lives there as long as the Jewish people don't have sovereignty?

You don't care who lives there or who has sovereignty as long as everyone is treated fairly and equally?

You don't care who has sovereignty as long as all the "foreigners" go "home"?

There are at least a dozen different possible interpretations of your post. In order to make it meaningful, you have to start answering some of these questions. It won't remain "simple" for long.

Yes there are, and asking those questions adds unecessary complexity. There's an old military acronym, KISS, or to quote Wiliam of Ockham, "Among competing hypotheses, the one with the fewest assumptions should be selected."

 

[Challenger]

The reality is that ... its complicated

The reality is that it's quite simple, just made overcomplicated by those with a Zionist agenda. Palestine for the Palestinians; be they Christian, Jewish, or Muslim; with equal rights guaranteed by a written constitution.

You need a great deal more practice with your Islamist taqiyya-speak.

Any notion of an Islamist Pal'istanian state will mirror every other Islamist majority hell hole. There will be no allowance for the hated Christian and Jew or even the "wrong kind" of moslem.

Abbas has already established the framework for his mini caliphate and predictably, Jews are not a part of it.



The Jerusalem Post

"In a final resolution, we would not see the presence of a single Israeli - civilian or soldier - on our lands," Abbas said in a briefing to mostly Egyptian journalists.



It's the Islamist agenda of apartheid and religious fascism that is the complication.

Slogans and cliches don't make a defendable argument, Hollie.

 

[Shusha]

The reality is that ... its complicated

The reality is that it's quite simple, just made overcomplicated by those with a Zionist agenda. Palestine for the Palestinians; be they Christian, Jewish, or Muslim; with equal rights guaranteed by a written constitution.

Sure. You've made it simple by not saying anything meaningful. "Palestine for the Palestinians" doesn't mean anything without defining some criteria.

You don't care who has sovereignty or who lives there as long as its one nation and labelled "Palestine" on the maps?

You don't care who has sovereignty as long as only people who are born there are allowed to live there?

You don't care who has sovereignty as long as only people who are descendants of (insert preferred number here) generations back are allowed to live there?

You don't care who has sovereignty as long as all those who were "ethnically cleansed" are permitted to return? Or only some of those who were "ethnically cleansed" are permitted to return?

You don't care who lives there as long as the Jewish people don't have sovereignty?

You don't care who lives there or who has sovereignty as long as everyone is treated fairly and equally?

You don't care who has sovereignty as long as all the "foreigners" go "home"?

There are at least a dozen different possible interpretations of your post. In order to make it meaningful, you have to start answering some of these questions. It won't remain "simple" for long.

Yes there are, and asking those questions adds unecessary complexity. There's an old military acronym, KISS, or to quote Wiliam of Ockham, "Among competing hypotheses, the one with the fewest assumptions should be selected."

Well, I've only been on this forum for less than a day, but the safest assumption with people who use terms such as "Zionist agenda" is to assume they reject Jewish sovereignty. And they use the typical Jews-are-colonial-invaders argument to do it. An argument which is factually untrue, delegitimizes Israel and prolongs the conflict. Peace will not come until both sides accept the other's rights.