New NSA Ruling out of NY upholds the NSA Surveillance Program

IlarMeilyr

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Feb 18, 2013
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N.Y. judge rules NSA phone surveillance legal - Associated Press - POLITICO.com

A federal judge on Friday found that the National Security Agency's bulk collection of millions of Americans' telephone records is legal and a valuable part of the nation's arsenal to counter the threat of terrorism and "only works because it collects everything."

U.S. District Judge William Pauley said in a written opinion that the program "represents the government's counter-punch" to eliminate al-Qaida's terror network by connecting fragmented and fleeting communications.

"This blunt tool only works because it collects everything," Pauley said. "The collection is broad, but the scope of counterterrorism investigations is unprecedented."

He said the mass collection of phone data "significantly increases the NSA's capability to detect the faintest patterns left behind by individuals affiliated with foreign terrorist organizations. Armed with all the metadata, NSA can draw connections it might otherwise never be able to find."

He added that such a program, if unchecked, "imperils the civil liberties of every citizen" and he noted the lively debate about the subject across the nation, in Congress and at the White House.

"The question for this court is whether the government's bulk telephony metadata program is lawful. This court finds it is. But the question of whether that program should be conducted is for the other two coordinate branches of government to decide," he said.
-- Excerpted from the above linked piece.

A good call. But it isn't over. Clearly, the SCOTUS is going to ultimately have the say on this one.
 
When they already hold people to 49% innocence and 51% suspicious or guilty, be prepared to be interrogated for something stupid.
 
When they already hold people to 49% innocence and 51% suspicious or guilty, be prepared to be interrogated for something stupid.

Who are these "they" you refer to?

How exactly do "they" hold anybody to 49% innocence -- whatever that might mean?

Ditto that for "51% suspicious or guilty?" whatever that might mean?

There is no law against being questioned for something stupid. Indeed, it happens all the time. And if some cop or FBI agent asks you questions about something stupid, you may choose to answer or you may choose to remain silent.

And?

Does anything you just posted have anything to do with the judge's determination regarding the ACLU's complaint about the NSA program?
 
Republicans are trying to protect people like the Boston Bomber. Probably cuz they think he's "cute".

Screen%20shot%2020130422%20at%20121040%20PM.png
 
When they already hold people to 49% innocence and 51% suspicious or guilty, be prepared to be interrogated for something stupid.

Who are these "they" you refer to?

How exactly do "they" hold anybody to 49% innocence -- whatever that might mean?

Ditto that for "51% suspicious or guilty?" whatever that might mean?

There is no law against being questioned for something stupid. Indeed, it happens all the time. And if some cop or FBI agent asks you questions about something stupid, you may choose to answer or you may choose to remain silent.

And?

Does anything you just posted have anything to do with the judge's determination regarding the ACLU's complaint about the NSA program?

Anyone who works in law enforcement or the security industry.
If you weren't guilty of anything and if you did nothing wrong then why collect all this information without a warrant if you did nothing wrong unless they have a 51% suspicion against everybody? They think you're guilty and collecting information about you is what they're going to do.
 
You didn't have to be Nostradamus to see this coming. What the Government and NSA wants, the Government and NSA gets. The government is now in the US vs Them mode, they no longer believe that a person is innocent til proven guilty, they see it as you are now guilty til prove innocent.
 
When they already hold people to 49% innocence and 51% suspicious or guilty, be prepared to be interrogated for something stupid.

Who are these "they" you refer to?

How exactly do "they" hold anybody to 49% innocence -- whatever that might mean?

Ditto that for "51% suspicious or guilty?" whatever that might mean?

There is no law against being questioned for something stupid. Indeed, it happens all the time. And if some cop or FBI agent asks you questions about something stupid, you may choose to answer or you may choose to remain silent.

And?

Does anything you just posted have anything to do with the judge's determination regarding the ACLU's complaint about the NSA program?

It is called profiling.

This is based on a true story and I don't know anything about the real story but suppose you do comparison price shopping at Wallmart and you bring ads from other companies because Wallmart says they will give you a lower price if you find one. People bring in ads and suppose you get tired as a worker of cooperating. The customer complains and you want the customer to go away so you complain that he was a little louder than usual and he made you feel unsafe. It is a bunch of nonsense of course but someone who doesn't know won't want to take the chance. If you were a security officer, they would say that unless they really know, being wrong about the customer in question could effect their job because they were warned and they didn't do anything so unless they are absolutely sure, they are going to ban you from the store even though you didn't do anything wrong.

Walmart Shopper Banned For Life Over Price Match

Would a disabled former wrestler make you feel unsafe?
 
Trial Set in Case of Domestic Violence Victim Who Feared Calling Police Due to Law

Imagine getting kicked out of your home because you called police after your ex-boyfriend beat you up too many times.

Trial Set in Case of Domestic Violence Victim Who Feared Calling Police Due to Law | NBC 10 Philadelphia

In any surveillance society, if you complain too much, you are the problem and their solution is to get rid of you even though you haven't done anything wrong.

I am getting captivated by this topic.
 
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Republicans are trying to protect people like the Boston Bomber. Probably cuz they think he's "cute".

Screen%20shot%2020130422%20at%20121040%20PM.png

^ rderp is busy posting absurd lies probably because the truth offends his lolberal sensibilities.

There is no factual or honest basis for rderp's retarded claim that anybody on the right (or even any Republicans) seek to protect the Boston Bomber.

Is rderp suddenly offended by the fact that even that asshole bomber gets the right to a fair trial?
 
When they already hold people to 49% innocence and 51% suspicious or guilty, be prepared to be interrogated for something stupid.

Who are these "they" you refer to?

How exactly do "they" hold anybody to 49% innocence -- whatever that might mean?

Ditto that for "51% suspicious or guilty?" whatever that might mean?

There is no law against being questioned for something stupid. Indeed, it happens all the time. And if some cop or FBI agent asks you questions about something stupid, you may choose to answer or you may choose to remain silent.

And?

Does anything you just posted have anything to do with the judge's determination regarding the ACLU's complaint about the NSA program?

It is called profiling.

This is based on a true story and I don't know anything about the real story but suppose you do comparison price shopping at Wallmart and you bring ads from other companies because Wallmart says they will give you a lower price if you find one. People bring in ads and suppose you get tired as a worker of cooperating. The customer complains and you want the customer to go away so you complain that he was a little louder than usual and he made you feel unsafe. It is a bunch of nonsense of course but someone who doesn't know won't want to take the chance. If you were a security officer, they would say that unless they really know, being wrong about the customer in question could effect their job because they were warned and they didn't do anything so unless they are absolutely sure, they are going to ban you from the store even though you didn't do anything wrong.

Walmart Shopper Banned For Life Over Price Match

Would a disabled former wrestler make you feel unsafe?

WHAT is "called" profiling?

You do know that the NSA Surveillance program is not at all predicated on "profiling," don't you?

Damn but you're confused.
 
Who are these "they" you refer to?

How exactly do "they" hold anybody to 49% innocence -- whatever that might mean?

Ditto that for "51% suspicious or guilty?" whatever that might mean?

There is no law against being questioned for something stupid. Indeed, it happens all the time. And if some cop or FBI agent asks you questions about something stupid, you may choose to answer or you may choose to remain silent.

And?

Does anything you just posted have anything to do with the judge's determination regarding the ACLU's complaint about the NSA program?

It is called profiling.

This is based on a true story and I don't know anything about the real story but suppose you do comparison price shopping at Wallmart and you bring ads from other companies because Wallmart says they will give you a lower price if you find one. People bring in ads and suppose you get tired as a worker of cooperating. The customer complains and you want the customer to go away so you complain that he was a little louder than usual and he made you feel unsafe. It is a bunch of nonsense of course but someone who doesn't know won't want to take the chance. If you were a security officer, they would say that unless they really know, being wrong about the customer in question could effect their job because they were warned and they didn't do anything so unless they are absolutely sure, they are going to ban you from the store even though you didn't do anything wrong.

Walmart Shopper Banned For Life Over Price Match

Would a disabled former wrestler make you feel unsafe?

WHAT is "called" profiling?

You do know that the NSA Surveillance program is not at all predicated on "profiling," don't you?

Damn but you're confused.

How do you know? It is secret. Since it is secret, they aren't going to tell you the truth.
 
It is called profiling.

This is based on a true story and I don't know anything about the real story but suppose you do comparison price shopping at Wallmart and you bring ads from other companies because Wallmart says they will give you a lower price if you find one. People bring in ads and suppose you get tired as a worker of cooperating. The customer complains and you want the customer to go away so you complain that he was a little louder than usual and he made you feel unsafe. It is a bunch of nonsense of course but someone who doesn't know won't want to take the chance. If you were a security officer, they would say that unless they really know, being wrong about the customer in question could effect their job because they were warned and they didn't do anything so unless they are absolutely sure, they are going to ban you from the store even though you didn't do anything wrong.

Walmart Shopper Banned For Life Over Price Match

Would a disabled former wrestler make you feel unsafe?

WHAT is "called" profiling?

You do know that the NSA Surveillance program is not at all predicated on "profiling," don't you?

Damn but you're confused.

How do you know? It is secret. Since it is secret, they aren't going to tell you the truth.

One of the complaints of 911 was that there wasn't sharing of information and now you want me to believe they aren't going to share?
 
So you need a court order for an individual wiretap
but if you listen in on everyone a court order is not needed.
Seems that is what is happening now
 
Well this is hardly a shock, as I fully expect that in the end the NSA's actions will be completely upheld by the Supreme Court. Call me cynical, but the federal government doesn't often choose to curb its own power.
 
Republicans are trying to protect people like the Boston Bomber. Probably cuz they think he's "cute".

Screen%20shot%2020130422%20at%20121040%20PM.png

^ rderp is busy posting absurd lies probably because the truth offends his lolberal sensibilities.

There is no factual or honest basis for rderp's retarded claim that anybody on the right (or even any Republicans) seek to protect the Boston Bomber.

Is rderp suddenly offended by the fact that even that asshole bomber gets the right to a fair trial?

I'm not even sure what his point was, considering that the Boston bombing occurred under the watchful eye of the NSA.
 
He noted in his opinion that the metadata program wasn’t in place before the terrorist attacks of 2001, and said the records now collected by the NSA might have helped officials stop al Qaeda.

Judge: NSA surveillance is legal | TheHill

Interesting here that Judge Pauley states only that it "might have" helped officials stop al-Qaeda considering that Judge Leon categorically stated that the government had not proven it's case in this regard. Did Pauley receive more information than Leon, or is he simply regurgitating government talking points and speculating? Looks like speculation to me.

The judge also dismissed concerns about the misuse of NSA records, arguing it has mostly been inadvertent.

"While there have been unintentional violations of guidelines, those appear to stem from human error and the incredibly complex computer programs that support this vital tool. And once detected, those violations were self-reported and stopped.”

Except for the cases where NSA agents purposefully targeted their exes, and other such nonsense along those lines. Or the simple fact that the rules are written so that agents can make simple assumptions about targets and go from there. So these "inadvertent" violations are purposefully written into the system.
 
So you need a court order for an individual wiretap
but if you listen in on everyone a court order is not needed.
Seems that is what is happening now

Except that gathering the various "phone" companies'" metadata is not at all the same thing as "listening" to ANYthing whatsoever.
 
It is called profiling.

This is based on a true story and I don't know anything about the real story but suppose you do comparison price shopping at Wallmart and you bring ads from other companies because Wallmart says they will give you a lower price if you find one. People bring in ads and suppose you get tired as a worker of cooperating. The customer complains and you want the customer to go away so you complain that he was a little louder than usual and he made you feel unsafe. It is a bunch of nonsense of course but someone who doesn't know won't want to take the chance. If you were a security officer, they would say that unless they really know, being wrong about the customer in question could effect their job because they were warned and they didn't do anything so unless they are absolutely sure, they are going to ban you from the store even though you didn't do anything wrong.

Walmart Shopper Banned For Life Over Price Match

Would a disabled former wrestler make you feel unsafe?

WHAT is "called" profiling?

You do know that the NSA Surveillance program is not at all predicated on "profiling," don't you?

Damn but you're confused.

How do you know? It is secret. Since it is secret, they aren't going to tell you the truth.

If it's a "secret," as you just maintained, then you would have ZERO basis to make ANY claim that profiling was involved.

Thanks for refuting yourself.
 

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