Murderer Chauvin loses appeal

[Ghost of a Rider]

I suspect that you may be questioning his knowledge or competence.

I’ve already told you I don’t. Why is this so hard for you to grasp?

I don’t know, however, as I’m not entirely sure I understand your argument. Hence the questions to better understand you.

My argument hinges on the tremendous public and political bias and my belief that this influenced his professional objectivity.

As I understand it, his initial finding was that Floyd’s cause of death was undetermined. Then a superior spoke to him and he changed it to homicide.

Then, as if that wasn’t enough, the family hired two independent MEs because they felt not enough emphasis was put on the neck pressure.

On top of this was the collective outcry from the public and of course the riots and protests and the looming threat of inevitable riots if Chauvin was found not guilty.

So no, I don’t think he was objective but I also believe that he thought he was.

So that’s it; no opinion or accusation of incompetence or prevarication on my part. I just see a guy who I think succumbed to professional strongarming by threat of moral condemnation and told himself he did the right thing.

 

[XponentialChaos]

I’ve already told you I don’t. Why is this so hard for you to grasp?

I understand what you're saying. That doesn't mean I agree with what you're saying.

So no, I don’t think he was objective but I also believe that he thought he was.
I just see a guy who I think succumbed to professional strongarming by threat of moral condemnation and told himself he did the right thing.

And this resembles competence to you?

 

[Curried Goats]

Immorality (dipshit).

In the opinion of a deplorable mutant like you? Like I give a shit....

It wasn’t an opinion, it was a declaration of disinterest in the immoral slaughter of innocent people because you accuse their leaders of aparteid.

And it's your opinion that my apathy is immoral. I don't care. See how that works?

Different what?

Opinion you dipshit.

 

[JoeB131]

Irrelevant. You still think he’s guilty even though he was acquitted.

Because he wasn't really tried. A DA decided to rig the process in his favor. When the prosecutor does the Defense Attorney's job, justice is the victim.

They didn’t testify to this based on evidence, they testified to this based merely on the visual of the knee on the neck.

As far as I know, no actual forensic evidence was found in the autopsy to prove this.

Except we have footage of him kneeling on the guy's neck. And he died while that happened. Cause and effect.

When he was still in his vehicle.

They got a lot louder when he was being murdered...oh, probably because he was being murdered.

Doesn’t mean they were right.

Um, yes, it does. They heard the case and evaluated the evidence. You decided that any racist cop who kills a black person is justified.

How do you know he had “millions of dollars in lawyers”?

The Fascist Order of Police always provides millions to defend these guys.

That was addressed to Curried Goats, dumbass.

Point still applies, dumbass. The Zionist Squatters like to pretend they are innocent, but they aren't.

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

I understand what you're saying. That doesn't mean I agree with what you're saying.

Didn’t really expect that anyway.

And this resembles competence to you?

Is the guy an incompetent ME? I don’t know enough to say one way or the other. I just suspect he subconsciously allowed outside pressures to affect his judgment in this case.

From everything I’ve read and heard, Floyd’s cause of death, forensically speaking, was not clear cut. No actual evidence of asphyxiation was found that I know of. It’s why his initial report said “undetermined”. It was only after a superior spoke to him that he changed it to “homicide”.

 

[XponentialChaos]

Is the guy an incompetent ME? I don’t know enough to say one way or the other. I just suspect he subconsciously allowed outside pressures to affect his judgment in this case.

If he allowed outside pressures to affect his judgment, that doesn't sound like competence to me. I'm not sure how you could claim that he's competent and that he allowed outside pressure to affect his judgment.

It’s why his initial report said “undetermined”. It was only after a superior spoke to him that he changed it to “homicide”.

I'd like to see evidence for this claim of yours if you don't mind. Do you have a link?

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

In the opinion of a deplorable mutant like you? Like I give a shit....

If you don’t care about innocents being slaughtered then I guess that’s to be expected.

And it's your opinion that my apathy is immoral. I don't care. See how that works?

Irrelevant. The point is, you are no different than me.

Opinion you dipshit.

Opinion about what?

You didn’t express an opinion, you only said you didn’t care.

However, the fact that you mentioned aparteid state means you do have an opinion on the matter.

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

Because he wasn't really tried.

Then neither was Chauvin.

A DA decided to rig the process in his favor. When the prosecutor does the Defense Attorney's job, justice is the victim.

If true, it is no different than convicting a man on circumstantial evidence.

Except we have footage of him kneeling on the guy's neck. And he died while that happened. Cause and effect.

Not necessarily. What is the forensic evidence that proves this is what killed Floyd?

They got a lot louder when he was being murdered...oh, probably because he was being murdered.

Why was he pleading for his life while still in his vehicle?

Um, yes, it does. They heard the case and evaluated the evidence. You decided that any racist cop who kills a black person is justified.

Yeah, sure.

The Fascist Order of Police always provides millions to defend these guys.

That doesn’t answer the question. How do you know he had millions in attorneys?

Point still applies, dumbass.

Not to my discussion with you, it doesn’t.

The Zionist Squatters like to pretend they are innocent, but they aren't.

Blah blah blah.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

As the racist chimes in with his lying version.

The racist right clearly approves of the murder of innocent black detainees, hence their unwarranted, reprehensible defense of Chauvin, who was lawfully convicted of murdering George Floyd.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

The racist right clearly approves of the murder of innocent black detainees, hence their unwarranted, reprehensible defense of Chauvin, who was lawfully convicted of murdering George Floyd.

Lying version is still a lying version. Leftists can't stop lying

 

[JoeB131]

Is the guy an incompetent ME? I don’t know enough to say one way or the other. I just suspect he subconsciously allowed outside pressures to affect his judgment in this case.

From everything I’ve read and heard, Floyd’s cause of death, forensically speaking, was not clear cut. No actual evidence of asphyxiation was found that I know of. It’s why his initial report said “undetermined”. It was only after a superior spoke to him that he changed it to “homicide”.

But combined with the evidence from the video, it became clear cut.

Then neither was Chauvin.

Nope, Chauvin got a trial. The prosecutor did his job, the defense attorney did his job.

In Wilson's case, the prosecutor acted like a defense attorney, suppressed evidence, didn't call witnesses, and let Wilson make a self-serving statement to the grand jury without questioning him. If we didn't know the prosecutor was a racist douchenoodle, you'd think he had been bribed.

Not necessarily. What is the forensic evidence that proves this is what killed Floyd?

Knee to the neck.

That doesn’t answer the question. How do you know he had millions in attorneys?

FOP always provides that to rogue cops.

Not to my discussion with you, it doesn’t.

Don't want your racist stupidity challenged, don't post it on a public board, stupid.

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

If he allowed outside pressures to affect his judgment, that doesn't sound like competence to me.

If you’re the type to declare incompetence based on one oversight or error in judgment, that’s you. I’m not doing that.

I don’t know enough about his work history to say he’s incompetent. I just think he folded to pressure in this case.

I'm not sure how you could claim that he's competent and that he allowed outside pressure to affect his judgment.

I also said he likely believed he was doing the right thing by changing the report.

This is what I was talking about when I brought up the human psyche. Someone told him he was wrong or that his findings were incomplete and for his own reasons, he believed them.

I'd like to see evidence for this claim of yours if you don't mind. Do you have a link?

Actually that was based on something someone here said (SavannahMan, I believe) but I misunderstood which ME he was referring to.

This person was Dr. Fowler -a retired ME who does consulting work - who was brought in to testify for the defense. He apparently initially said he would have ruled “undetermined” but later changed his mind.

As for Baker, his initial report did not include neck compression and that displeased many people. Because of this, his office received “‘hundreds’ of calls, some harassing and threatening.”

A Dr. Mitchell from D.C., who is an expert in in-custody deaths, contacted Baker and expressed his displeasure with Baker’s findings and said he planned to write a critical op-ed in the Washington Post about it.

So, despite saying in the trial that he was not pressured, he was nevertheless harangued by various people to add “neck compression” to the autopsy report.

Below are a couple of links.

Medical examiner: No pressure on Floyd autopsy report

Forensic pathologist says manner of Floyd’s death ‘undetermined’ - Minnesota Reformer

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

But combined with the evidence from the video, it became clear cut.

The problem is that the video only shows Chauvin’s knee on Floyd’s neck. It doesn’t prove that this is how Floyd died.

Nope, Chauvin got a trial. The prosecutor did his job, the defense attorney did his job.

So did Wilson.

In Wilson's case, the prosecutor acted like a defense attorney, suppressed evidence, didn't call witnesses, and let Wilson make a self-serving statement to the grand jury without questioning him. If we didn't know the prosecutor was a racist douchenoodle, you'd think he had been bribed.

How do you know he’s a racist “douchenoodle”?

Knee to the neck.

That’s not forensic evidence, that’s circumstantial evidence and you know it.

FOP always provides that to rogue cops.

Again, how do you know he had millions in attorneys?

Don't want your racist stupidity challenged, don't post it on a public board, stupid.

Irrelevant. It wasn’t addressed to you.

 

[XponentialChaos]

It’s why his initial report said “undetermined”. It was only after a superior spoke to him that he changed it to “homicide”.

I just think he folded to pressure in this case.

Actually that was based on something someone here said (SavannahMan, I believe) but I misunderstood which ME he was referring to.

As for Baker, his initial report did not include neck compression and that displeased many people. Because of this, his office received “‘hundreds’ of calls, some harassing and threatening.”

Ok. Thank you for being honest about your misunderstanding.

So, just to be clear, are we in agreement that Baker didn’t change his conclusion that this was a “homicide”?

 

[XponentialChaos]

If you’re the type to declare incompetence based on one oversight or error in judgment, that’s you. I’m not doing that.

If you’re arguing that he failed to be objective, yea, that’s kind of important in his line of work. His testimony ultimately sealed Chauvin’s fate, after all. Yea, I would say you’re claiming he’s incompetent in a field of expertise that you know absolutely nothing about.

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

Ok. Thank you for being honest about your misunderstanding.

So, just to be clear, are we in agreement that Baker didn’t change his conclusion that this was a “homicide”?

Yes. But he did add neck compression later after people criticized his initial conclusions.

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

If you’re arguing that he failed to be objective, yea, that’s kind of important in his line of work. His testimony ultimately sealed Chauvin’s fate, after all. Yea, I would say you’re claiming he’s incompetent in a field of expertise that you know absolutely nothing about.

Let me ask you this: Did the people who pressured him to add neck compression think he wasn’t being objective?

I would think they did. Does this mean they think he’s incompetent? Some might but surely not all of them did.

You’re saying that this would make him incompetent. I’m not.

Is this why you won’t answer the question as to why his knowledge is relevant? Do you actually need me to be wrong that much?

Unless you’re claiming no expert in his/her line of work ever made a mistake or error in judgment then I don’t see the point of all this.

I’ve made mistakes in my career and was not always objective. But I consider myself quite competent at what I do and more importantly, others do too.

And I’ll bet you’ve made mistakes too.

 

[XponentialChaos]

Yes. But he did add neck compression later after people criticized his initial conclusions.

Right. But his conclusion of this being a “homicide”, which you disagree with him on, was never something he ”folded” on.

 

[XponentialChaos]

You’re saying that this would make him incompetent. I’m not.

So putting our disagreement aside regarding what would be considered “incompetence”, you’re arguing that he was not objective and that he’s wrong about this being a homicide. You believe this despite the fact that you have no experience in pathology whatsoever. Correct?

Unless you’re claiming no expert in his/her line of work ever made a mistake or error in judgment then I don’t see the point of all this.

Someone who isn’t a medical expert arguing that the medical expert is wrong. This sounds intelligent to you? Who do you think is more likely to be correct?

 

[JoeB131]

The problem is that the video only shows Chauvin’s knee on Floyd’s neck. It doesn’t prove that this is how Floyd died.

His knee was on his neck.
He plainly said, "I CAN'T BREATHE"
Then he died.

Any REASONABLE person would conclude he died from the knee on the neck.

So did Wilson.

It wasn't his job to shoot a young man 6 times when he had his hands up.

How do you know he’s a racist “douchenoodle”?

Prosecutor in Michael Brown investigation no stranger to controversy

Robert McCulloch has been a prosecutor in racially divided St. Louis County for some 23 years. He is no stranger to controversy — and he doesn't give up easily.

www.dailymail.co.uk

That’s not forensic evidence, that’s circumstantial evidence and you know it.

The Forensic evidence was that he was dead, after he had the knee to his neck.

Again, how do you know he had millions in attorneys?

Eric Nelson isn't working alone to defend Derek Chauvin: A police legal fund is backing him up with a dozen lawyers and $1 million

Minnesota's largest federation of officers and unions supports Eric Nelson's defense of Derek Chauvin with a dozen lawyers and a million dollars.

www.usatoday.com

A dozen lawyers help with the case, investigation and trial prep. Peters said the MPPOA expects to spend $1 million-plus on Chauvin’s case from the legal fund, which is paid into by officers throughout the state who belong to unions.

Irrelevant. It wasn’t addressed to you.

Awww... little baby doesn't like beign called out on his stupidity.