Most Conservatives Still Believe The Civil War Wasn't Over Slavery

[Kevin_Kennedy]

"Perpetual Union".

Indisputable. But of course the sore losers try anyway.

The Articles of Confederation haven't been in force since the 18th century, and have no bearing on secession under the U.S. Constitution.

 

[Claudette]

The topic title has been proven. In spades.

You have really shown some stupidity in this thread. Im starting to wonder if you are an Rderp sock

Nah. He just thinks he's the smartest guy in the room and everyone else is a dumbass. LOL

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

True or false:

When the war started, the Union (for the most part) was not attempting to abolish slavery, including Lincoln.

I agree. Lincoln wasn't going after slavery. In fact he barely mentioned it.

But, that conflicts with the emotions of some. They can't seem to get past it.

They can't unlearn what they were falsely taught.

They can't imagine Lincoln being the racist ************ that he was. It doesn't compute. It makes them afraid.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

No slavery, no secession.

The root cause of the war was about slavery. Period.

The Confederacy was formed to create a slave state

So was the United States.

 

[rightwinger]

Most liberals don't believe that the flag that flew off the stern of slave ships was the Stars and Stripes and not the Stars and Bars. The Portuguese were the biggest slave traders and the Spanish and the British. Yankee cotton mills depended on the slave trade and whaling ships were converted to slave ships. The Confederacy only existed for about four or five years but slavery went on in the New World for two hundred.

The US ended the slave trade in 1807. Not many slaves came in on US flagged ships
By 1861, most of the civilized nations of the world had outlawed slavery
The Confederacy thought it was a good idea to create a nation dedicated to slavery.

 

[Claudette]

Most liberals don't believe that the flag that flew off the stern of slave ships was the Stars and Stripes and not the Stars and Bars. The Portuguese were the biggest slave traders and the Spanish and the British. Yankee cotton mills depended on the slave trade and whaling ships were converted to slave ships. The Confederacy only existed for about four or five years but slavery went on in the New World for two hundred.

The US ended the slave trade in 1807. Not many slaves came in on US flagged ships
By 1861, most of the civilized nations of the world had outlawed slavery
The Confederacy thought it was a good idea to create a nation dedicated to slavery.

More like a nation dedicated to its bottom line. Slaves made sure that bottom line held firm.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Most liberals don't believe that the flag that flew off the stern of slave ships was the Stars and Stripes and not the Stars and Bars. The Portuguese were the biggest slave traders and the Spanish and the British. Yankee cotton mills depended on the slave trade and whaling ships were converted to slave ships. The Confederacy only existed for about four or five years but slavery went on in the New World for two hundred.

The US ended the slave trade in 1807. Not many slaves came in on US flagged ships
By 1861, most of the civilized nations of the world had outlawed slavery
The Confederacy thought it was a good idea to create a nation dedicated to slavery.

The slave trade was also illegal in the Confederacy.

 

[rightwinger]

No slavery, no secession.

The root cause of the war was about slavery. Period.

The Confederacy was formed to create a slave state

So was the United States.

Allowing slavery was a concession the Southern States insisted on

 

[OKTexas]

Why shouldn't they have been allowed to secede? Personally, I wish they had been allowed so I wouldn't have to deal with horrible people like George W. Bush today.

There are no provisions in the Constitution for secession. If the founders intended for states to come and go as they please, they would have established a procedure to do so.
Instead, they had provisions for joining the union and nothing about leaving it

The 2nd, 9th and 10th Amendments left that decision to the States and the people of those States.


.

The Supreme Court says otherwise

Yeah they thought Dread Scott was a good idea too. BTW that decision wasn't rendered until AFTER the war was over. What do you think the decision would have been had the south won? Don't pretend the supremes are infallible.


.

Dread Scott was overturned
The Supremes eventually get it right

There is nothing that supports the legality of secession in the Constitution

Of course there is:

Amendment X

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

Show me where in the Constitution were States are prohibited form secession. Come on, I dare ya. LMAO

In fact if you read the VA ratification arguments, they reserved the right of secession.


.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

True or False:

Lincoln was a white supremacist.

 

[rightwinger]

Most liberals don't believe that the flag that flew off the stern of slave ships was the Stars and Stripes and not the Stars and Bars. The Portuguese were the biggest slave traders and the Spanish and the British. Yankee cotton mills depended on the slave trade and whaling ships were converted to slave ships. The Confederacy only existed for about four or five years but slavery went on in the New World for two hundred.

The US ended the slave trade in 1807. Not many slaves came in on US flagged ships
By 1861, most of the civilized nations of the world had outlawed slavery
The Confederacy thought it was a good idea to create a nation dedicated to slavery.

The slave trade was also illegal in the Confederacy.

They had four million slaves, they did not need to import any
They managed to breed their own and increase the slave population

 

[rightwinger]

True or False:

Lincoln was a white supremacist.

For1861, far from it

 

[there4eyeM]

Take a look at the full title of this document which created the United States.


Note the words "PERPETUAL UNION" to which all parties consented.

Which was logically extended by a "more perfect Union"; never abrogated, never renounced, never contradicted. Voluntarily joined.
The Union and its preservation was not based on Lincoln and has nothing to do with any veneration of him, though his efforts to preserve the Union are appreciated by Americans.

 

[Claudette]

Take a look at the full title of this document which created the United States.


Note the words "PERPETUAL UNION" to which all parties consented.

Which was logically extended by a "more perfect Union"; never abrogated, never renounced, never contradicted. Voluntarily joined.
The Union and its preservation was not based on Lincoln and has nothing to do with any veneration of him, though his efforts to preserve the Union are appreciated by Americans.

Lincoln had one tough row to hoe trying to keep the Union together.

He wasn't perfect by any means but I think he was the best President this country has ever had.

 

[there4eyeM]

Take a look at the full title of this document which created the United States.


Note the words "PERPETUAL UNION" to which all parties consented.

The articles of confederation? Some papers that were voided in 1787?
OMG

Voided how, by an improvement?

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

No slavery, no secession.

The root cause of the war was about slavery. Period.

The Confederacy was formed to create a slave state

So was the United States.

Allowing slavery was a concession the Southern States insisted on

Slavery was legal in all thirteen states in 1776. Try again.

 

[kaz]

L

If secession was illegal, i would probably be on the other side of the fence on this. But it wasnt illegal.

Secession was, is, and always will be illegal.

“The constitution of a confederated republic, that is, of a national republic, formed of several states, is, or at least may be, not less an irrevocable form of government, than the constitution of a state formed and ratified by the aggregate of the several counties of the state.” Supreme Court Justice Joseph Story

where does the constitution say that?

 

[there4eyeM]

Civil War still divides Americans

So after 150 years, the majority of conservatives still believe the Civil War wasn't over slavery?

Why is this? Why do they believe the "States Rights" claim is sufficient enough to shield them from the fact that -- those states rights were those states preserving the right to maintain slavery -- so either way you slice it, the civil war was over slavery --


This is why whenever I see a conservative twisting themselves into pretzels to claim otherwise --- it makes their subsequent claims of not being racist look foolish.


Next time conservatives want to pretend that the Civil War wasn't over slavery -- they better travel back in time and tell all of those southern states to stop telling everyone it was over slavery

The Civil War was over a state's right to secede.

The reason they seceded was slavery. or the fear U.S. expansion would put slave states in the minority.

But, make no mistake. The war was about seceding. Read Lincoln's inaugural address.

The issue was slavery

They never would have seceded if not for trying to preserve slavery forever

"Racism" Means Realism

Slavery saved the Blacks from savagery.

Slavery is savage.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Most liberals don't believe that the flag that flew off the stern of slave ships was the Stars and Stripes and not the Stars and Bars. The Portuguese were the biggest slave traders and the Spanish and the British. Yankee cotton mills depended on the slave trade and whaling ships were converted to slave ships. The Confederacy only existed for about four or five years but slavery went on in the New World for two hundred.

The US ended the slave trade in 1807. Not many slaves came in on US flagged ships
By 1861, most of the civilized nations of the world had outlawed slavery
The Confederacy thought it was a good idea to create a nation dedicated to slavery.

The slave trade was also illegal in the Confederacy.

They had four million slaves, they did not need to import any
They managed to breed their own and increase the slave population

Naturally. They were opposed to the importation of slaves so as to not dilute the value of the slaves that they had. Doesn't change the fact that it was illegal, and it doesn't mean that the north was moral for having outlawed it as well. Especially considering it was outlawed by a President from Virginia.

 

[rightwinger]

No slavery, no secession.

The root cause of the war was about slavery. Period.

The Confederacy was formed to create a slave state

So was the United States.

Allowing slavery was a concession the Southern States insisted on

Slavery was legal in all thirteen states in 1776. Try again.

Constitution was ratified in 1788. The continuation of slavery was a concession made to the south

The stain of slavery and racial discrimination is something the south pushed upon us for almost 200 years