Man

[alang1216]

So you define God as only able to create good yet, we, we who are created in his image, are perfectly able to create evil. Obviously God created us, knowing we'd bring evil into the world. lt appears Maimonides was wrong.

Evil isn't extant. Neither is cold or darkness. They only exist as the absence of something else. This should be obvious to anyone who understands logic. Do you need for me to explain it for you?

Apparently you do. So Evil is the absence of Good? That makes no sense. If I shoot you that is not evil, I'm just not being good to you? What rabbit hole have you fallen into?

 

[toobfreak]

I don't dispute anything you wrote, my only point was that the God Maimonides defined as only being able to create good, created a world with lots of evil. If God wants to pass responsibility for evil on to his creation, that's his call but Truman wouldn't approve.

I get that, but we are not concerned with the views of Maimonides. God didn't say he was only able to create good, men did. In a sense, God DID only create good, he created free will in man. For there to be good, there must also be the possibility of evil. For there to be light, there must be the possibility of darkness. Our world is a world of CHOICE and free will, the hyena has no choice but to live according to the mandates of the hyena, but we have that choice of living lower than the jackal (creating evil), or living as a saint.

There is no evil in the snakes bite, only his nature, man alone creates evil by DOING evil according to his choice, because by dint of his ability to know God, he must likewise have the ability to know evil.

Your choice.

 

[alang1216]

I don't dispute anything you wrote, my only point was that the God Maimonides defined as only being able to create good, created a world with lots of evil. If God wants to pass responsibility for evil on to his creation, that's his call but Truman wouldn't approve.

I get that, but we are not concerned with the views of Maimonides. God didn't say he was only able to create good, men did. In a sense, God DID only create good, he created free will in man. For there to be good, there must also be the possibility of evil. For there to be light, there must be the possibility of darkness. Our world is a world of CHOICE and free will, the hyena has no choice but to live according to the mandates of the hyena, but we have that choice of living lower than the jackal (creating evil), or living as a saint.

There is no evil in the snakes bite, only his nature, man alone creates evil by DOING evil according to his choice, because by dint of his ability to know God, he must likewise have the ability to know evil.

Your choice.

I'd agree with you if I believed there was an absolute measure of 'Good'. But since I don't... Are we evil if we do what we believe to acceptable. Was Jefferson evil because he kept slaves? Are we better people because we don't?

 

[buttercup]

Thank you for sharing, but there were some flatly unbiblical statements made… I found two just in the first two or three paragraphs.

This is why I never went back to the Catholic Church, once I became a believer, so much of what they teach is unbiblical.

 

[toobfreak]

I don't dispute anything you wrote, my only point was that the God Maimonides defined as only being able to create good, created a world with lots of evil. If God wants to pass responsibility for evil on to his creation, that's his call but Truman wouldn't approve.

I get that, but we are not concerned with the views of Maimonides. God didn't say he was only able to create good, men did. In a sense, God DID only create good, he created free will in man. For there to be good, there must also be the possibility of evil. For there to be light, there must be the possibility of darkness. Our world is a world of CHOICE and free will, the hyena has no choice but to live according to the mandates of the hyena, but we have that choice of living lower than the jackal (creating evil), or living as a saint.

There is no evil in the snakes bite, only his nature, man alone creates evil by DOING evil according to his choice, because by dint of his ability to know God, he must likewise have the ability to know evil.

Your choice.

I'd agree with you if I believed there was an absolute measure of 'Good'.

But there is an absolute measure of Good. You merely need to cultivate your heart's willingness to listen to his Inner Pilot as God guides us in good over evil, not man or self.

 

[buttercup]

The topic of being made in the image of God came up recently on another thread. On that other thread and I brought up my view on it....which is different than the views of most Christians.

As I mentioned on the other thread, I wrote a blog post on the topic of dominion, but within this post I also wrote about my view on what it means to be made in the image of God. Here it is again for anyone who might want to read it:

A Closer Look At Dominion - Live Mercifully

As a Christian vegan, one of the most common objections to veganism that I encounter when talking to other Christians is, “But man was given dominion over the animals.” So I want to talk about this very important concept that I believe has been deeply misunderstood. This misunderstanding is at...

www.livemercifully.com

 

[Taz]

God created man in his own image. Man occupies a unique place in creation. God in his own nature unites the spiritual and material worlds and established his friendship. Of all visible creatures only man is able to know and love his creator. He is called to share, by knowledge and love, in God's own life. It was for this end that he was created, and this is the fundamental reason for his dignity.

Being in the image of God the human individual possesses the dignity of a person, who is not just something, but someone. He is capable of self-knowledge, of self-possession and of freely giving himself and entering into communion with other persons. And he is called by grace to a covenant with his Creator, to offer him a response of faith and love that no other creature can give in his stead.

God created everything for man, but man in turn was created to serve and love God and to offer all creation back to him. It is only in the mystery of the Word made flesh that the mystery of man truly becomes clear. St. Paul tells us that the human race takes its origin from two men: Adam and Christ. . . The first man, Adam, he says, became a living soul, the last Adam a life-giving spirit. The first Adam was made by the last Adam, from whom he also received his soul, to give him life. . . The second Adam stamped his image on the first Adam when he created him. That is why he took on himself the role and the name of the first Adam, in order that he might not lose what he had made in his own image. The first Adam, the last Adam: the first had a beginning, the last knows no end. The last Adam is indeed the first; as he himself says: "I am the first and the last."

Because of its common origin the human race forms a unity which makes us contemplate the human race in the unity of its origin in God. . . in the unity of its nature, composed equally in all men of a material body and a spiritual soul; in the unity of its immediate end and its mission in the world; in the unity of its dwelling, the earth, whose benefits all men, by right of nature, may use to sustain and develop life; in the unity of its supernatural end: God himself, to whom all ought to tend; in the unity of the means for attaining this end;. . . in the unity of the redemption wrought by Christ for all.

This law of human solidarity and charity without excluding the rich variety of persons, cultures and peoples, assures us that all men are truly brethren. The human person, created in the image of God, is a being at once corporeal and spiritual. The biblical account expresses this reality in symbolic language when it affirms that then the LORD God formed man of dust from the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being. Man, whole and entire, is therefore willed by God.

In Sacred Scripture the term "soul" often refers to human life or the entire human person. But "soul" also refers to the innermost aspect of man, that which is of greatest value in him, that by which he is most especially in God's image. "Soul" signifies the spiritual principle in man.

The human body shares in the dignity of "the image of God": it is a human body precisely because it is animated by a spiritual soul, and it is the whole human person that is intended to become, in the body of Christ, a temple of the Spirit.

Man, though made of body and soul, is a unity. Through his very bodily condition he sums up in himself the elements of the material world. Through him they are thus brought to their highest perfection and can raise their voice in praise freely given to the Creator. For this reason man may not despise his bodily life. Rather he is obliged to regard his body as good and to hold it in honor since God has created it and will raise it up on the last day.

The unity of soul and body is so profound that one has to consider the soul to be the "form" of the body. It is because of its spiritual soul that the body made of matter becomes a living, human body; spirit and matter, in man, are not two natures united, but rather their union forms a single nature.

The Church teaches that every spiritual soul is created immediately by God - it is not "produced" by the parents - and also that it is immortal: it does not perish when it separates from the body at death, and it will be reunited with the body at the final Resurrection.

Sometimes the soul is distinguished from the spirit: St. Paul for instance prays that God may sanctify his people "wholly", with "spirit and soul and body" kept sound and blameless at the Lord's coming. The Church teaches that this distinction does not introduce a duality into the soul. "Spirit" signifies that from creation man is ordered to a supernatural end and that his soul can gratuitously be raised beyond all it deserves to communion with God.

The spiritual tradition of the Church also emphasizes the heart, in the biblical sense of the depths of one's being, where the person decides for or against God.

Paraphrased and excerpted from the Catechism of the Catholic Church

Catechism of the Catholic Church - Table of Contents

So god created Dr Mengele in his own image?

Yes, just like he created you in his own image. What you and Mengele decide to do with it is up to you.

So god was the template for guys like Mengele. They share the same lust for torture, god with his deformed babies...

 

[ding]

God created man in his own image. Man occupies a unique place in creation. God in his own nature unites the spiritual and material worlds and established his friendship. Of all visible creatures only man is able to know and love his creator. He is called to share, by knowledge and love, in God's own life. It was for this end that he was created, and this is the fundamental reason for his dignity.

Being in the image of God the human individual possesses the dignity of a person, who is not just something, but someone. He is capable of self-knowledge, of self-possession and of freely giving himself and entering into communion with other persons. And he is called by grace to a covenant with his Creator, to offer him a response of faith and love that no other creature can give in his stead.

God created everything for man, but man in turn was created to serve and love God and to offer all creation back to him. It is only in the mystery of the Word made flesh that the mystery of man truly becomes clear. St. Paul tells us that the human race takes its origin from two men: Adam and Christ. . . The first man, Adam, he says, became a living soul, the last Adam a life-giving spirit. The first Adam was made by the last Adam, from whom he also received his soul, to give him life. . . The second Adam stamped his image on the first Adam when he created him. That is why he took on himself the role and the name of the first Adam, in order that he might not lose what he had made in his own image. The first Adam, the last Adam: the first had a beginning, the last knows no end. The last Adam is indeed the first; as he himself says: "I am the first and the last."

Because of its common origin the human race forms a unity which makes us contemplate the human race in the unity of its origin in God. . . in the unity of its nature, composed equally in all men of a material body and a spiritual soul; in the unity of its immediate end and its mission in the world; in the unity of its dwelling, the earth, whose benefits all men, by right of nature, may use to sustain and develop life; in the unity of its supernatural end: God himself, to whom all ought to tend; in the unity of the means for attaining this end;. . . in the unity of the redemption wrought by Christ for all.

This law of human solidarity and charity without excluding the rich variety of persons, cultures and peoples, assures us that all men are truly brethren. The human person, created in the image of God, is a being at once corporeal and spiritual. The biblical account expresses this reality in symbolic language when it affirms that then the LORD God formed man of dust from the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being. Man, whole and entire, is therefore willed by God.

In Sacred Scripture the term "soul" often refers to human life or the entire human person. But "soul" also refers to the innermost aspect of man, that which is of greatest value in him, that by which he is most especially in God's image. "Soul" signifies the spiritual principle in man.

The human body shares in the dignity of "the image of God": it is a human body precisely because it is animated by a spiritual soul, and it is the whole human person that is intended to become, in the body of Christ, a temple of the Spirit.

Man, though made of body and soul, is a unity. Through his very bodily condition he sums up in himself the elements of the material world. Through him they are thus brought to their highest perfection and can raise their voice in praise freely given to the Creator. For this reason man may not despise his bodily life. Rather he is obliged to regard his body as good and to hold it in honor since God has created it and will raise it up on the last day.

The unity of soul and body is so profound that one has to consider the soul to be the "form" of the body. It is because of its spiritual soul that the body made of matter becomes a living, human body; spirit and matter, in man, are not two natures united, but rather their union forms a single nature.

The Church teaches that every spiritual soul is created immediately by God - it is not "produced" by the parents - and also that it is immortal: it does not perish when it separates from the body at death, and it will be reunited with the body at the final Resurrection.

Sometimes the soul is distinguished from the spirit: St. Paul for instance prays that God may sanctify his people "wholly", with "spirit and soul and body" kept sound and blameless at the Lord's coming. The Church teaches that this distinction does not introduce a duality into the soul. "Spirit" signifies that from creation man is ordered to a supernatural end and that his soul can gratuitously be raised beyond all it deserves to communion with God.

The spiritual tradition of the Church also emphasizes the heart, in the biblical sense of the depths of one's being, where the person decides for or against God.

Paraphrased and excerpted from the Catechism of the Catholic Church

Catechism of the Catholic Church - Table of Contents

So god created Dr Mengele in his own image?

Yes, just like he created you in his own image. What you and Mengele decide to do with it is up to you.

Hes got a lot of images. Whoch is good. It goes with his split personalities.
Loving god, vengeful god, merciful God, hateful god, jealous god etc

Learn to read with context and not the worst possible perception and maybe you will figure it out.

I consider context. You just deny it because the ancient arabs distorted your reality.

I don't believe you do. In fact I think you look for the worst possible explanation you can find.

I don't. I just dont delude myself.

I'm sure you think that you are the most objective person in the world.

 

[ding]

You make him sound like a narcissistic egomaniac.
Fair enough.

If that's how you choose to read it, more power to ya.

Made in his image. Created us to worship him. If not we suffer for eternity. Yeah.
Thats how anyone would read it.

What can I say, you have a fucked up perception of God.

Or maybe I dont have a delusion about it.

Time will tell , but you don't strike me as someone who is at peace, so maybe not.

I am.

That probably explains why we are having this discussion... you are in deep peace.

What makes you think im not at peace because we are discussing desert dwelling mythology?

Your truculent behaviors. Those are not the behaviors of someone who is at peace.

Thanks dr Phil. I will work on inner peace

Just calling it like I see it. You aren't here for an honest discussion, that's for sure. You're just looking for a fight. I'm certainly not going to argue against your bullshit straw men which don't reflect my views. You want to read scripture like a 2nd grader? Be my guest, but don't expect me to engage in your idiocy or expect me to give a shit about correcting your errors. I'd rather you go through life crashing and burning.

The reality is you are defining God through a scripture you don't understand rather than actually talking to God directly. You are a bitter mother fucker and it shows with every disrespectful post you make. Go take your anger out on someone else. Try your kids or your wife.

 

[ding]

God created man in his own image.

I presume you don't mean physically so which of the seven deadly sins come from God? If you answer "none", whose image were we really made from?

Everything God made is good. Maimonides explains, "It must be admitted as a fact that it cannot be said of God that He directly creates evil, or He has the direct intention to produce evil; this is impossible His works are all perfectly good. He only produces existence, and all existence is good. God is perfect goodness, and that all that comes from Him is absolutely good. Consequently the true work of God is all good, since it is existence. ALL the great evils which men cause to each other because of certain intentions, desires, opinions, or religious principles, are likewise due to non-existence, because they originate in ignorance, which is absence of wisdom. The numerous evils to which individual persons are exposed are due to the defects existing in the persons themselves. We suffer from the evils which we, by our own free will, inflict on ourselves and ascribe them to God, who is far from being connected with them. Man himself is the author of this class of evils. The error of the ignorant goes so far as to say that God's power is insufficient, because He has given to this Universe the properties which they imagine cause these great evils."

So you define God as only able to create good yet, we, we who are created in his image, are perfectly able to create evil. Obviously God created us, knowing we'd bring evil into the world. lt appears Maimonides was wrong.

I hear that from a lot from atheists, the attempt to rationalize concepts of good and evil. Why is it so hard to understand that man lives in material nature apart from the abode of God, so with that comes a temporal life full of suffering? The actual definition of suffering can be said to be the act of being separate from God. Man was imbued with FREE WILL as part of his mandate, and with that comes the capacity to move away from God as well as closer. I have to laugh at how people so often try to rationalize their atheism on the basis that if God is Divine and created good, that life here on Earth must then he perfect as in heaven without the free will to choose and act on one's own free will.

WE ARE NOT IN HEAVEN here. Life here nor man is perfect. Man is unique over the other animals of Earth only in that he is in a position to know God and return and live by his side after he is done in this life.

Look into a dog's eyes. In you, he sees what he can never be in his life, we are one step closer to God and in us he sees God and adores us for that, even as so many people on this Earth squander their gift and perpetrate cruelty, darkness and evil upon others rather than the good in their hearts.

I don't dispute anything you wrote, my only point was that the God Maimonides defined as only being able to create good, created a world with lots of evil. If God wants to pass responsibility for evil on to his creation, that's his call but Truman wouldn't approve.

The reality is that you and TN and Taz don't believe God exists and are more than happy with the evil that exists as long as this was all an accident and not intentional.

Yet, not one of you can say what you would do different other than you wouldn't do this or that.

 

[ding]

God created man in his own image. Man occupies a unique place in creation. God in his own nature unites the spiritual and material worlds and established his friendship. Of all visible creatures only man is able to know and love his creator. He is called to share, by knowledge and love, in God's own life. It was for this end that he was created, and this is the fundamental reason for his dignity.

Being in the image of God the human individual possesses the dignity of a person, who is not just something, but someone. He is capable of self-knowledge, of self-possession and of freely giving himself and entering into communion with other persons. And he is called by grace to a covenant with his Creator, to offer him a response of faith and love that no other creature can give in his stead.

God created everything for man, but man in turn was created to serve and love God and to offer all creation back to him. It is only in the mystery of the Word made flesh that the mystery of man truly becomes clear. St. Paul tells us that the human race takes its origin from two men: Adam and Christ. . . The first man, Adam, he says, became a living soul, the last Adam a life-giving spirit. The first Adam was made by the last Adam, from whom he also received his soul, to give him life. . . The second Adam stamped his image on the first Adam when he created him. That is why he took on himself the role and the name of the first Adam, in order that he might not lose what he had made in his own image. The first Adam, the last Adam: the first had a beginning, the last knows no end. The last Adam is indeed the first; as he himself says: "I am the first and the last."

Because of its common origin the human race forms a unity which makes us contemplate the human race in the unity of its origin in God. . . in the unity of its nature, composed equally in all men of a material body and a spiritual soul; in the unity of its immediate end and its mission in the world; in the unity of its dwelling, the earth, whose benefits all men, by right of nature, may use to sustain and develop life; in the unity of its supernatural end: God himself, to whom all ought to tend; in the unity of the means for attaining this end;. . . in the unity of the redemption wrought by Christ for all.

This law of human solidarity and charity without excluding the rich variety of persons, cultures and peoples, assures us that all men are truly brethren. The human person, created in the image of God, is a being at once corporeal and spiritual. The biblical account expresses this reality in symbolic language when it affirms that then the LORD God formed man of dust from the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being. Man, whole and entire, is therefore willed by God.

In Sacred Scripture the term "soul" often refers to human life or the entire human person. But "soul" also refers to the innermost aspect of man, that which is of greatest value in him, that by which he is most especially in God's image. "Soul" signifies the spiritual principle in man.

The human body shares in the dignity of "the image of God": it is a human body precisely because it is animated by a spiritual soul, and it is the whole human person that is intended to become, in the body of Christ, a temple of the Spirit.

Man, though made of body and soul, is a unity. Through his very bodily condition he sums up in himself the elements of the material world. Through him they are thus brought to their highest perfection and can raise their voice in praise freely given to the Creator. For this reason man may not despise his bodily life. Rather he is obliged to regard his body as good and to hold it in honor since God has created it and will raise it up on the last day.

The unity of soul and body is so profound that one has to consider the soul to be the "form" of the body. It is because of its spiritual soul that the body made of matter becomes a living, human body; spirit and matter, in man, are not two natures united, but rather their union forms a single nature.

The Church teaches that every spiritual soul is created immediately by God - it is not "produced" by the parents - and also that it is immortal: it does not perish when it separates from the body at death, and it will be reunited with the body at the final Resurrection.

Sometimes the soul is distinguished from the spirit: St. Paul for instance prays that God may sanctify his people "wholly", with "spirit and soul and body" kept sound and blameless at the Lord's coming. The Church teaches that this distinction does not introduce a duality into the soul. "Spirit" signifies that from creation man is ordered to a supernatural end and that his soul can gratuitously be raised beyond all it deserves to communion with God.

The spiritual tradition of the Church also emphasizes the heart, in the biblical sense of the depths of one's being, where the person decides for or against God.

Paraphrased and excerpted from the Catechism of the Catholic Church

Catechism of the Catholic Church - Table of Contents

So god created Dr Mengele in his own image?

Yes, just like he created you in his own image. What you and Mengele decide to do with it is up to you.

So god was the template for guys like Mengele. They share the same lust for torture, god with his deformed babies...

Yep, but when will you give God credit for the good, Taz?

You sound kinda thankless.

 

[ding]

So you define God as only able to create good yet, we, we who are created in his image, are perfectly able to create evil. Obviously God created us, knowing we'd bring evil into the world. lt appears Maimonides was wrong.

Evil isn't extant. Neither is cold or darkness. They only exist as the absence of something else. This should be obvious to anyone who understands logic. Do you need for me to explain it for you?

Apparently you do. So Evil is the absence of Good? That makes no sense. If I shoot you that is not evil, I'm just not being good to you? What rabbit hole have you fallen into?

Does cold is the absence of heat make sense to you?

 

[ding]

I don't dispute anything you wrote, my only point was that the God Maimonides defined as only being able to create good, created a world with lots of evil. If God wants to pass responsibility for evil on to his creation, that's his call but Truman wouldn't approve.

I get that, but we are not concerned with the views of Maimonides. God didn't say he was only able to create good, men did. In a sense, God DID only create good, he created free will in man. For there to be good, there must also be the possibility of evil. For there to be light, there must be the possibility of darkness. Our world is a world of CHOICE and free will, the hyena has no choice but to live according to the mandates of the hyena, but we have that choice of living lower than the jackal (creating evil), or living as a saint.

There is no evil in the snakes bite, only his nature, man alone creates evil by DOING evil according to his choice, because by dint of his ability to know God, he must likewise have the ability to know evil.

Your choice.

I'd agree with you if I believed there was an absolute measure of 'Good'. But since I don't... Are we evil if we do what we believe to acceptable. Was Jefferson evil because he kept slaves? Are we better people because we don't?

You mean it isn't absolutely 100% good to say that children and the weak should be protected from men of ill will?

Is there any situation you can justify harming a child or rationalize it as good?

 

[alang1216]

The reality is that you and TN and Taz don't believe God exists and are more than happy with the evil that exists as long as this was all an accident and not intentional.

Yet, not one of you can say what you would do different other than you wouldn't do this or that.

Sorry but I just don't like being told to believe things that are obviously (at least to me) silly, lies, rationalizations, etc. I don't accept it from politicians or priests as I think it keeps us from dealing with reality. Sure alcohol or heroin makes reality easier to swallow but they are very short term solutions.

 

[alang1216]

I don't dispute anything you wrote, my only point was that the God Maimonides defined as only being able to create good, created a world with lots of evil. If God wants to pass responsibility for evil on to his creation, that's his call but Truman wouldn't approve.

I get that, but we are not concerned with the views of Maimonides. God didn't say he was only able to create good, men did. In a sense, God DID only create good, he created free will in man. For there to be good, there must also be the possibility of evil. For there to be light, there must be the possibility of darkness. Our world is a world of CHOICE and free will, the hyena has no choice but to live according to the mandates of the hyena, but we have that choice of living lower than the jackal (creating evil), or living as a saint.

There is no evil in the snakes bite, only his nature, man alone creates evil by DOING evil according to his choice, because by dint of his ability to know God, he must likewise have the ability to know evil.

Your choice.

I'd agree with you if I believed there was an absolute measure of 'Good'. But since I don't... Are we evil if we do what we believe to acceptable. Was Jefferson evil because he kept slaves? Are we better people because we don't?

You mean it isn't absolutely 100% good to say that children and the weak should be protected from men of ill will?

Is there any situation you can justify harming a child or rationalize it as good?

Plenty of people, maybe even Washington and Jefferson might feel selling a child of slaves to be acceptable behavior. If you thought it would maintain your family or your lifestyle you may well feel it is a good thing to do.

 

[ding]

The reality is that you and TN and Taz don't believe God exists and are more than happy with the evil that exists as long as this was all an accident and not intentional.

Yet, not one of you can say what you would do different other than you wouldn't do this or that.

Sorry but I just don't like being told to believe things that are obviously (at least to me) silly, lies, rationalizations, etc. I don't accept it from politicians or priests as I think it keeps us from dealing with reality. Sure alcohol or heroin makes reality easier to swallow but they are very short term solutions.

Then don't come in here and read it. No one twisted your arm. Now be truthful. You come here to validate your non-belief. Apparently you are insecure in your non-belief. Or are you fighting the good fight and eradicating the evil of believing in God?

Either way, it's not a good look.

 

[alang1216]

Does cold is the absence of heat make sense to you?

Sure but so?

 

[ding]

I don't dispute anything you wrote, my only point was that the God Maimonides defined as only being able to create good, created a world with lots of evil. If God wants to pass responsibility for evil on to his creation, that's his call but Truman wouldn't approve.

I get that, but we are not concerned with the views of Maimonides. God didn't say he was only able to create good, men did. In a sense, God DID only create good, he created free will in man. For there to be good, there must also be the possibility of evil. For there to be light, there must be the possibility of darkness. Our world is a world of CHOICE and free will, the hyena has no choice but to live according to the mandates of the hyena, but we have that choice of living lower than the jackal (creating evil), or living as a saint.

There is no evil in the snakes bite, only his nature, man alone creates evil by DOING evil according to his choice, because by dint of his ability to know God, he must likewise have the ability to know evil.

Your choice.

I'd agree with you if I believed there was an absolute measure of 'Good'. But since I don't... Are we evil if we do what we believe to acceptable. Was Jefferson evil because he kept slaves? Are we better people because we don't?

You mean it isn't absolutely 100% good to say that children and the weak should be protected from men of ill will?

Is there any situation you can justify harming a child or rationalize it as good?

Plenty of people, maybe even Washington and Jefferson might feel selling a child of slaves to be acceptable behavior. If you thought it would maintain your family or your lifestyle you may well feel it is a good thing to do.

I'm not asking them. I am asking you. No more running away from this question.

 

[ding]

Does cold is the absence of heat make sense to you?

Sure but so?

No difference. Evil is the absence of good. Unless of course you believe existence is evil instead of good.

 

[ding]

I don't dispute anything you wrote, my only point was that the God Maimonides defined as only being able to create good, created a world with lots of evil. If God wants to pass responsibility for evil on to his creation, that's his call but Truman wouldn't approve.

I get that, but we are not concerned with the views of Maimonides. God didn't say he was only able to create good, men did. In a sense, God DID only create good, he created free will in man. For there to be good, there must also be the possibility of evil. For there to be light, there must be the possibility of darkness. Our world is a world of CHOICE and free will, the hyena has no choice but to live according to the mandates of the hyena, but we have that choice of living lower than the jackal (creating evil), or living as a saint.

There is no evil in the snakes bite, only his nature, man alone creates evil by DOING evil according to his choice, because by dint of his ability to know God, he must likewise have the ability to know evil.

Your choice.

I'd agree with you if I believed there was an absolute measure of 'Good'. But since I don't... Are we evil if we do what we believe to acceptable. Was Jefferson evil because he kept slaves? Are we better people because we don't?

You mean it isn't absolutely 100% good to say that children and the weak should be protected from men of ill will?

Is there any situation you can justify harming a child or rationalize it as good?

Plenty of people, maybe even Washington and Jefferson might feel selling a child of slaves to be acceptable behavior. If you thought it would maintain your family or your lifestyle you may well feel it is a good thing to do.

How about sodomizing them? Is that good?