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Noone has done that. Different pictures and different Rabbis.Posting the same meme, over and and over and over and over again, does not add to the discussion.
I stopped reading troll responses that were totally off topic or simply made up. If you have something relevant please ask again.Why don't you attempt to answer the questions I posed a few days ago, louie888 ?
It has been explained clearly. Read the thread before asking questions that have been answered. <light bulb>Post #53:
To say that Judaism is the extreme opposite of anything reduces a rather titanic, complex and sprawling religious belief system, legal code, cultural fabric and historical mythology of an entire peoples down to a few trite little "principles".
But what the hell, give it a go. Defend your claim. Which "principles" of Judaism run counter to the idea that the Jewish people should have a national self-determination?
I wonder what the Haredim think would happen if the State of Israel was "dismantled peacefully?"
You know what they say, Stephanie.They Hoss,would think that we can live Peacefully Again,with our Palestinian Cousins who have been in Palestine for over 5000 yearsI wonder what the Haredim think would happen if the State of Israel was "dismantled peacefully?"
I wonder what the Haredim think would happen if the State of Israel was "dismantled peacefully?"
I think I have already explained that from various anegles.
Thew fact of the pilgrimage itself indicates to the holiness of Israel to Jews.
The main question here is are You willing to accept sources written by Jews?
I have showed numerous times that life in Palestine was indeed difficult especially for Jews,
4. Some thousands. Again if You're willing to accept Jewish sources.
However I think I can find other sources for numbers and dates after Shabat. But with simple research You can find the same I will- and if You're rational and unbiased You'll find it Yourself. Look for Hassidic immigration, and the students of Vilnius Gaon.
Ah yes, the "God helps those who help themselves" mantra, so beloved by Zionists, helping themselves to land that doesn't belong to them.[/QUOTE]I wonder what the Haredim think would happen if the State of Israel was "dismantled peacefully?"
I wonder what they think G-d acting in the world looks like.
Here's another Jewish take on Zionism. The Disturbing Alliance Between Zionists and Anti-Semites
"...in the history of the Zionist movement, a history which demonstrates that there is no inherent contradiction between Zionism and anti-Semitism. The two ideologies have in fact often worked in concert to achieve their shared goal: concentrating Jews in one place (so as to better avoid them in others). Even before the modern Zionist movement arose in the late 19th century, Christian philosophers and statesmen debated what to do with the “oriental” mass of Jewry in their midst. As the scholar Jonathan Hess of the University of North Carolina has noted, one “solution” popular among Enlightenment figures who harbored anti-Semitic feelings was to deport Jews to a colonial setting where they could be reformed. Johann Gottlieb Fichte, among the founders of German Idealism, noted in 1793 that the most effective protection Europeans could mount against the Jewish menace was to “conquer the holy land for them and send them all there.”
I think I have already explained that from various anegles.
Not really, you've still not answered the basic point as to why only 0.25 of the world's Jewish population ever bothered to settle in Palestine
Thew fact of the pilgrimage itself indicates to the holiness of Israel to Jews.
The "holiness" is towards their cult centre Jerusalem, the idea of a "holy land" was a Christian invention siezed upon by Zionists in the 19th century to further their agenda. Jewish "pilgrims" would go to Jerusalem and leave or be buried there.
The main question here is are You willing to accept sources written by Jews?
If, like any other historical accounts, they can be corroborated from other sources.
I have showed numerous times that life in Palestine was indeed difficult especially for Jews,
Not more so than any other Palestinian living there.
4. Some thousands. Again if You're willing to accept Jewish sources.
However I think I can find other sources for numbers and dates after Shabat. But with simple research You can find the same I will- and if You're rational and unbiased You'll find it Yourself. Look for Hassidic immigration, and the students of Vilnius Gaon.
300?! really? Even allowing for your unsubstantiated claims, lets triple the original number; that still makes less than 1% of those Jewish people that apparently all had a "yearning to return".
I think I have already explained that from various anegles.
Not really, you've still not answered the basic point as to why only 0.25 of the world's Jewish population ever bothered to settle in Palestine
Thew fact of the pilgrimage itself indicates to the holiness of Israel to Jews.
The "holiness" is towards their cult centre Jerusalem, the idea of a "holy land" was a Christian invention siezed upon by Zionists in the 19th century to further their agenda. Jewish "pilgrims" would go to Jerusalem and leave or be buried there.
The main question here is are You willing to accept sources written by Jews?
If, like any other historical accounts, they can be corroborated from other sources.
I have showed numerous times that life in Palestine was indeed difficult especially for Jews,
Not more so than any other Palestinian living there.
4. Some thousands. Again if You're willing to accept Jewish sources.
However I think I can find other sources for numbers and dates after Shabat. But with simple research You can find the same I will- and if You're rational and unbiased You'll find it Yourself. Look for Hassidic immigration, and the students of Vilnius Gaon.
300?! really? Even allowing for your unsubstantiated claims, lets triple the original number; that still makes less than 1% of those Jewish people that apparently all had a "yearning to return".
Is that why all those atheists created Israel?I think I have already explained that from various anegles.
Not really, you've still not answered the basic point as to why only 0.25 of the world's Jewish population ever bothered to settle in Palestine
Thew fact of the pilgrimage itself indicates to the holiness of Israel to Jews.
The "holiness" is towards their cult centre Jerusalem, the idea of a "holy land" was a Christian invention siezed upon by Zionists in the 19th century to further their agenda. Jewish "pilgrims" would go to Jerusalem and leave or be buried there.
The main question here is are You willing to accept sources written by Jews?
If, like any other historical accounts, they can be corroborated from other sources.
I have showed numerous times that life in Palestine was indeed difficult especially for Jews,
Not more so than any other Palestinian living there.
4. Some thousands. Again if You're willing to accept Jewish sources.
However I think I can find other sources for numbers and dates after Shabat. But with simple research You can find the same I will- and if You're rational and unbiased You'll find it Yourself. Look for Hassidic immigration, and the students of Vilnius Gaon.
300?! really? Even allowing for your unsubstantiated claims, lets triple the original number; that still makes less than 1% of those Jewish people that apparently all had a "yearning to return".I think I have already explained that from various anegles.
Not really, you've still not answered the basic point as to why only 0.25 of the world's Jewish population ever bothered to settle in Palestine
Thew fact of the pilgrimage itself indicates to the holiness of Israel to Jews.
The "holiness" is towards their cult centre Jerusalem, the idea of a "holy land" was a Christian invention siezed upon by Zionists in the 19th century to further their agenda. Jewish "pilgrims" would go to Jerusalem and leave or be buried there.
The main question here is are You willing to accept sources written by Jews?
If, like any other historical accounts, they can be corroborated from other sources.
I have showed numerous times that life in Palestine was indeed difficult especially for Jews,
Not more so than any other Palestinian living there.
4. Some thousands. Again if You're willing to accept Jewish sources.
However I think I can find other sources for numbers and dates after Shabat. But with simple research You can find the same I will- and if You're rational and unbiased You'll find it Yourself. Look for Hassidic immigration, and the students of Vilnius Gaon.
300?! really? Even allowing for your unsubstantiated claims, lets triple the original number; that still makes less than 1% of those Jewish people that apparently all had a "yearning to return".
1. I have already given You numerous and long explanation, touching on a wide variety of Biblical, social, economic,historical, religious and cultural aspects in posts:
#11, #15 , #54 , #80
If You don't like those answers you're free to dogmatically accept only the answers given to You by Revisionist Zionists like Pappe, Sand and others who try to erase Jews from being a people.
Just don't enter discussions if You're not willing to accept any answer that contradicts Your opinion.
And again the parallel of Your question is :
"If workers and peasant suffered so much, why didn't they bring the Bolshevik revolution earlier".
You're simply attacking a minority's right to self determination for the lack of power in their community and govt. system.
Then again we have a continuous Jewish presence, whole communities that developed and numerous Synagogues built- for whom?
The last one -the famous swear of Solomon- prohibited Jews returning in waves until certain global conditions were met.
2. It seems You don't understand the concept of holiness or just disrespect it.
In that land we have the Holy of Holies, the tombs of our Patriarch and Matriarchs all those are holy places, and except for the Temple they're all outside of Jerusalem. The simple fact that the Holy G-d promised it and fulfilled makes it holy, as much as the shoes Moses wore became holy.
The whole of Judaism revolves about commandments of the land and Jews relationship to it.
Other fact is that a Jew remembers Israel throughout 3 daily prayers, blessings of meals and have a series of commandments especially dependent on residing in the Holy Land (7th year resting of land for example).
In addition I brought You the quotes of Maimonides and Nahmonides who stated that living outside of Israel is like worshiping Idols or having no G-d. Or the fact that residing in the land brings total forgiveness:
"He also writes: "The sages said: anyone who settles in Eretz Israel - his sins are forgiven, that it was said (Isaiah 33:24).
Even if he went 4 steps on the land - winning the life of the world to be! And everyone who is buried in it - he was atoned, and it's like the place he's in an altar of atonement, that it was said :" and appease His land [and] His people" (Deuteronomy 32:43). The greatest of sages lead their remnants there. Go learn from Jacob our father and Joseph the righteous "
3. Really except for the occasional massacre here and there, destruction of whole Jewish communities, looting, changing of power and conquests and the special series of "Jew Taxes"- the conditions were really welcoming NOT.
Good luck proving the opposite.
4. Well Motelatici just recently brought up information about continuous returning of thousands of Jews (post #67). Otherwise how do You think the Galilee communities survived all the wars and masecares?
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If the land wasn't holly why would 26,000 Jewish soldiers risk their lives helping conquer the land during the Heraclius Revolt , or 10,000 Jewish soldiers from Persia decided to go with Abu 'Isa Obadiah?
*Basically in Judaism the're 10 levels of holiness of the land of Israel:
"עֶשֶׂר קְדֻשּׁוֹת הֵן: אֶרֶץ יִשְׂרָאֵל מְקֻדֶּשֶׁת מִכָּל הָאֲרָצוֹת. וּמַה הִיא קְדֻשָּׁתָהּ, שֶׁמְּבִיאִים מִמֶּנָּה הָעֹמֶר וְהַבִּכּוּרִים וּשְׁתֵּי הַלֶּחֶם, מַה שֶּׁאֵין מְבִיאִין כֵּן מִכָּל הָאֲרָצוֹת:"
"10 levels of holiness are: Eretz Israel is holler than any land. And what is her holiness? That You bring of her the Omer, the Bikurim and 2 Breads, what You don't bring from any other land" (Mishna, Kelim 1:6)
*"a land the Lord, your God, looks after; the eyes of Lord your God are always upon it, from the beginning of the year to the end of the year." (Deuteronomy 11)
