Israel needs to stop ******* with our ceasefire.

[Lisa558]

Israel has vowed that? The entire ME? Every Muslim? Bold claim. Where did Israel make such a claim? In their Charter? In the memorials to the Shoah? In some legal document? In a religious text?

No, Sparky is yet another antisemite peddling this hateful lie.

 

[skye]

 

[sparky]

Israel has vowed that?

You seen any pallys lately Shusha?

~S~

 

[Shusha]

You seen any pallys lately Shusha?

~S~

Make your point.

 

[sparky]

Make your point.

 

[Shusha]

View attachment 1271871

Michal Waldiger?

Why don't you post the entire dialogue? Instead of snipping out the important bits? Oh right, because the game is to post snipped bits of dialogue in order to fabricate demonization against Israel.

 

[eagle1462010]

'Pin the swastika on the Nazi' is a diversion that's just as old Lisa

~S~

There he is. The Relative of Arafat. PLO

RAGHEADS ran Extermination camps with the Waffen SS WWII

 

[eagle1462010]

charter of hezballah

+3




Hezbollah does not have a formal charter but is guided by two foundational documents outlining its political and military goals: the 1985 "Open Letter" and the 2009 political manifesto. [1]
The 1985 Manifesto ("The Open Letter")
Hezbollah declared its existence in 1985 with a document read in Beirut. It outlined three primary objectives: [1, 2, 3]

• Destruction of Israel: Stated the necessity of ending the Israeli occupation and the eventual "obliteration" of the Israeli state.
  • Expulsion of Western Powers: Called for the definitive removal of the United States, France, and their allies from Lebanon.
  • Islamic Governance: Advocated for the establishment of an Iran-inspired Islamic government in Lebanon, though it emphasized that citizens should choose this system freely. [1, 2, 3, 4]

 

[Shusha]

Michal Waldiger?

Why don't you post the entire dialogue? Instead of snipping out the important bits? Oh right, because the game is to post snipped bits of dialogue in order to fabricate demonization against Israel.

Well, since sparky probably isn't going to show the quote in its entirety, I will.

Context: Michal Waldinger is speaking about her son's reserve duty and how IDF soldiers make sacrifice to protect ALL Israeli citizens (emphasis mine).

Waldinger: What was done in Gaza, it’s a shame that it didn’t get worse. There are no uninvolved. We saw what happened on October 7. I saw people with crutches, elderly women with-- What are you talking to me about? They [IDF soldiers] want to protect you. Nothing like this has ever--They are Nazis. They are Nazis. It is just horrible and terrible. It is forbidden to say this here, what Knesset Member Ahmed Tibi said here. IDF soldiers are the purest good, and they do everything to protect human life in the State of Israel, whether they are Arabs, Jews, Circassians, no matter what they fight every enemy. Hamas is an evil and terrible enemy. Nazis. Simply Nazis.

Now I’m going to go into what I wrote myself. We are gathering today –

Tibi: Ask your son to be careful not to kill all my family members. Children.

Waldinger: Yes, I hope that my son will kill anyone who stands in front of him and wants to harm the State of Israel.

Tibi: Including children.

Waldinger: Yes, including if they send children. If your friends use children--

Tibi: Including children, say it. Say it.

Waldinger: As a human shield. Yes, they will also have to kill them because there is no choice. Sometimes there is no choice. Yes, the Hamas that uses small children as human shields. What can be done? It’s a war. There are casualties in war. I can’t understand what you are saying. If your friends are using children, women, and small children, as human shields, there is nothing that could be done. If someone tries to kill you, you kill him first. Really, he who has mercy on the cruel will end up being cruel to the merciful.


Let's be honest about what Michal is saying here, rather than snipping portions of her speech, changing the meaning, and presenting her as proof that Jews/Israelis are collectively evil. She is NOT saying that Gazan children should be targeted, nor that Gazan children are inherently evil and should be exterminated.

She is, very clearly, saying that WHEN children are used as human shields, as cover in combat, or as combatants, under conditions of war, those children must be accepted as casualties because there are no other choices in combat when faced with the use of children as part of that combat.

Now, you may not like that. You may think that is a terrible thing. (It obviously IS a terrible thing). You may think that a moral army should never kill a child no matter the circumstances, and no matter the risk or cost. You may even think it is possible in urban warfare to prevent all innocent deaths. You may believe that use of human shields in general and/or use of children as human shields is acceptable practice and those who adopt this practice are innocent of any wrong-doing. You may believe that there are plenty of choices.

Fine. Let's discuss. But let's discuss in full honesty. And not with demonizing and false memes.

 

[sparky]

Fine. Let's discuss. But let's discuss in full honesty.

Reports range from 20-50K injured or dead children in Gaza Shusha , i doubt they were all human shields

~S~

 

[Shusha]

Reports range from 20-50K injured or dead children in Gaza Shusha , i doubt they were all human shields

~S~

1. I strongly dispute your statistics, but decline to go down that rabbit hole unless requested.

2. Other than any errors made, they were human shields. Children don't belong in combat zones.

3. If you are going to attempt an honest conversation (and I welcome it), please begin by acknowledging that the posted meme misrepresents Michal's statement and that you posted that mean either not being aware of the full conversation, or deliberately to misrepresent her and apply that misrepresentation to the Jewish, or Israeli, collective.

 

[Zincwarrior]

Israel is not a party to the MOU.

 

[sparky]

1. I strongly dispute your statistics, but decline to go down that rabbit hole unless requested.

well you're free to do some research yourself Shusha

2. Other than any errors made, they were human shields. Children don't belong in combat zones.

Oh, i suspect many were bombing and/or starvation victims , hard to say due to Bibi kicking every 'eye & ear to the world' out.....

3. If you are going to attempt an honest conversation (and I welcome it), please begin by acknowledging that the posted meme misrepresents Michal's statement and that you posted that mean either not being aware of the full conversation, or deliberately to misrepresent her and apply that misrepresentation to the Jewish, or Israeli, collective.

I admit i simply googled it w/out research Shusha

Now you be honest, and tell us the real reason the ICC (124 countries) declared Bibi a war criminal

~S~

 

[Shusha]

well you're free to do some research yourself Shusha

I dispute them because I've done the research.

 

[Shusha]

I admit i simply googled it w/out research Shusha

Thank you for correcting yourself. I appreciate that. Of curiosity, what search terms did you google?

Now you be honest, and tell us the real reason the ICC (124 countries) declared Bibi a war criminal

~S~

Now, now. Honesty, remember? An arrest warrant is not a conviction. The ICC hasn't "declared" anything.

 

[Shusha]

Oh, i suspect many were bombing and/or starvation victims

Still human shields.

 

[sparky]

Thank you for correcting yourself. I appreciate that. Of curiosity, what search terms did you google?

'dead Palestinian children' IIRC

Now, now. Honesty, remember? An arrest warrant is not a conviction. The ICC hasn't "declared" anything.

no it is not a conviction Shusha , it is a charge due to the evidence found, and which 124 countries agreed to.

I find that amount of the world a tad hard to call wrong.....

further, Bibi is Israel's first prime minister to stand trial in his own country,(fraud, corruption, bribery) but the perpetual conflict is taking precedence.

But as they are not anywhere near the democracy they claim to be (or present themselves as) , and don't believe in free speech (nor does AIPAC) , we hear very little from the Israeli people.......how many have BDS (Bibi derangement syndrome)

Still human shields.

Yanno, a while ago i watched a video on this site......pally's throwing rocks at a food relief unit.....why would that be?

~S~

 

[Shusha]

no it is not a conviction Shusha , it is a charge due to the evidence found, and which 124 countries agreed to.

Now, now. Honesty, please. The legal threshold for issuing an arrest warrant is not the examination and cross-examination of evidence. The legal threshold for issuing an arrest warrant is "reasonable grounds to believe". And legal proceedings are not subject to the logical fallacy of argumentum ad populum.

 

[Shusha]

'dead Palestinian children' IIRC

Ah. So you went looking for things to demonize Israel with. And then decided to just accept it as truth. And made a deliberate decision not to investigate the claim. And when confronted, rather than have an honest discussion about the claim and the truth, you slide into six different distractions.

 

[Shusha]

Still human shields.

Yanno, a while ago i watched a video on this site......pally's throwing rocks at a food relief unit.....why would that be?

~S~

Did you want to try to have an honest discussion about the CHOICES faced by moral armies when confronted with a hostile enemy who use human shields? Or did you not?