Is Tom Brady the Greatest Ever?

[Wyatt earp]

I think Terry Bradshaw is still the all time greatest.

Brady and Montana have tied him but not exceeded him yet.

I am hoping Matt Ryan will squash Brady once and for all.

Naw Shady Brady doesnt count.He has not won four superbowls at all same way Barry Bonds is not the true all time home run king nor holds the record for the most home runs in a season since the one thing they both have in common is they are frauds that have disgraced both sports.

Remind us when he has 7 like Jimmy Johnson and Chad Knaus in the modern era.

how about when he wins his FIRST superbowl.lol

Jimmys competition was way stronger in NASCAR then Toms was in football..


Now for crew chief /coaches..

Belichick Vs. Knaus

You do know Gibbs owns NASCAR teams and won a Superbowl or three with three different quarterbacks

So it's comparable

 

[Kat]

I'm sure everyone already knows how I voted . . . YES!

Jealousy rears it's ugly head in this thread. Its funny. Especially because it goes on and on and on.

 

[rightwinger]

I'm sure everyone already knows how I voted . . . YES!

Jealousy rears it's ugly head in this thread. Its funny. Especially because it goes on and on and on.

But it is true

 

[Alex.]

I think Terry Bradshaw is still the all time greatest.

Brady and Montana have tied him but not exceeded him yet.

I am hoping Matt Ryan will squash Brady once and for all.

Naw Shady Brady doesnt count.He has not won four superbowls at all same way Barry Bonds is not the true all time home run king nor holds the record for the most home runs in a season since the one thing they both have in common is they are frauds that have disgraced both sports.

Remind us when he has 7 like Jimmy Johnson and Chad Knaus in the modern era.

how about when he wins his FIRST superbowl.lol

In all walks of life and in all sorts of professional and amateur sports cheating is looked upon with a jaundiced eye and the cheater loses his/hers/its prize. The NFL celebrates the cheater...That is what has seeped into society and one reason why we have participation trophies and PC attitudes.

 

[sealybobo]

Brady is going to his seventh Superbowl and has been to eleven AFC Championship games and 33 total playoff games

Quite a career

You’re right. He’s not responsible for it but if he had started his career in 1980 instead of 2000, he’d be facing the following:

Defensive backs who could get away with MUCH more in terms of coverage, stick-um, and defensive units that had much more freedom to decapitate the QB. Consider this. In 1980, the total number of passes was 13,705. And there was 627 interceptions.
In 2016, there was nearly 5,000 more pass attempts made by NFL quarterbacks but over 200 fewer interceptions.
Some of this increase in passing is due to expansion and new/replacement teams in Jacksonville, Carolina, Houston and Cleveland but it would stand to reason that the dilution of QBs (it being a far more complex position) would lead to more interceptions, not fewer. Also, it would stand to reason that the field being the same size, the athletes being bagger, stronger, and faster would mean more interceptions etc…

Year PA INT
2016 18298 415
2006 16389 520
1996 15966 542
1986 14469 581
1980 13705 627

Put another way, In 1980, when Joe Montana started making his name…there were 28 teams. The Raiders had 35 interceptions as a team. The Saints had the fewest with 12. In the pass happy 2016 season with about 5,000 more passes, the KC Chiefs lead the league with 18 INTs…6 teams had 10 or fewer grabs.

Clearly, the league favors passers more now than ever before; or at least in recent history.

Brady has been assisted by the expansion more than most as well. Three of the new franchises that found their way into the league are AFC teams, Houston, Cleveland and Jacksonville.

Houston is a -28 on 106 wins and 134 losses
Cleveland (who has NEVER won more than 10 games since reinstatement) is apparently -200 with 88 wins and 200 losses
Jacksonville are a -42: 155-197-0

You think Brady/NE has done well against these guys? You’re right 7 and 0 against the Jags, 6 and 1 against the Texans and 7 and 2 against the Browns (since 1999). Of course, expansion has a tendency to lower the barriers for entry. One could argue that he, a 6th round choice, benefitted from it as well. If the Jags, Panthers, and Browns not been there, 18 more players would have been on the board when Brady was selected…who is to say whether the Patriots had one of them ahead. Further…the AFC east competition for the Patriots has not exactly been a model of consistency. Miami has had 8 coaches since 2000, so has Buffalo. The Gents have had 5. Presumably, that is 21 different playbook, 21 different philosophies, lord knows how many different GMs, PPDs, and coordinators.

Again, let me stress, none of this is something that benefits Brady directly. It’s simply the environment he has prospered in and every other QB had essentially the same opportunity. Brady is great but it is hard to find another QB that has benefitted as much from the environment as TB—or one that has mercilessly dispatched his foes.

I try to avoid comparing statistics between era's. The game has changed significantly

I don't see any benefit from expansion. You still have to finish at the top of the heap....which Brady has done repeatedly
Montana had to beat 27 other teams, Brady had to beat 31 other teams (Vince Lombardi's Packers only had to beat 13 other teams)

So if you can't really compare statistics you have to look at:
Did they win championships?
Did they come up big in the clutch?

Both Brady and Montana did both. I give Brady a slight edge now, and hands down if he beats the Falcons

Brady and Montana have the same number of Super Bowl wins. Montana never lost a SB. I'm not sure how, by your stated metric, that would put Brady ahead. Montana would seem to be more "clutch" based on winning percentage in the big game and stats (no INT in his 4 SBs).

Either one of them are perfectly valid to argue as the best of the SB era.

So...let me get this straight

Montana gets credit for not even making it through the playoffs? He may have lost in the first round...but at least he didn't lose the Superbowl

No. I'm saying that if coming up big in the clutch is the deciding factor, Montana was better in the clutch. The ultimate expression of coming up big in the clutch would be play in the Super Bowl. Montana was better in his SB appearances than Brady. Montana never lost. Montana's worst QB rating in a SB was 100. Brady only bettered that twice, once by only 0.5. Montana never threw an INT in a SB. In the biggest game, Montana was pretty much the definition of clutch. Brady has been less so.

I don't consider looking just at Super Bowls to be an accurate way to judge a quarterback's career, but I'm going by the two criteria you stated.

You could also argue, using your criteria, that Terry Bradshaw was a better QB than Brady. Bradshaw also won 4 Super Bowls, and he had a better playoff win % than Brady, at .737 to .727.

I think SB wins and even playoff performances are only part of the picture when looking at a quarterback's career. Dan Marino never won a SB and I think he is rightly considered one of the greatest QBs ever. Peyton Manning was no better than an average playoff and SB QB, but he also should be considered when talking about the greatest ever. Trent Dilfer won a SB, but he most certainly should not be.

I have no problem with someone calling Brady the best of the SB era. For myself, I'm still on the fence about it.

How do you know how Joe Montana would have performed in the superbowls HE NEVER MADE? If he was clutch he would have been in those Superbowls those years. He wasn't. How are you going to give him credit for only making 4 superbowls. It's like you are punishing Brady for making it to 3 superbowls and losing. Had he got knocked out in the first round or 2nd round that would have been better?

 

[LA RAM FAN]

I think Terry Bradshaw is still the all time greatest.

Brady and Montana have tied him but not exceeded him yet.

I am hoping Matt Ryan will squash Brady once and for all.

Naw Shady Brady doesnt count.He has not won four superbowls at all same way Barry Bonds is not the true all time home run king nor holds the record for the most home runs in a season since the one thing they both have in common is they are frauds that have disgraced both sports.

Remind us when he has 7 like Jimmy Johnson and Chad Knaus in the modern era.

how about when he wins his FIRST superbowl.lol

In all walks of life and in all sorts of professional and amateur sports cheating is looked upon with a jaundiced eye and the cheater loses his/hers/its prize. The NFL celebrates the cheater...That is what has seeped into society and one reason why we have participation trophies and PC attitudes.

sad but true.

 

[candycorn]

Guys like Marino, Peyton and even Dan Fouts were great Fantasy Football QBs and put up great numbers. But when considering the GOAT, you gotta have some rings
Peyton won two rings but was not terribly impressive in either win. He is more remembered for getting to the playoffs with one of the best records in the league and then losing at home

I loved Joe Montana, one of the most clutch QBs ever. Even at Notre Dame, he had heart and would not quit. The game was never over as long as Joe had the ball and there was time on the clock
Brady has the same type of mentality. I just think that over the years, and he is now 40, he has eclipsed Montana

So by that rationalization…wouldn’t Robert Horry be considered a “greater” player than Magic Johnson? Magic only has 5 rings; Horry has seven.

 

[Alex.]

I think Terry Bradshaw is still the all time greatest.

Brady and Montana have tied him but not exceeded him yet.

I am hoping Matt Ryan will squash Brady once and for all.

Naw Shady Brady doesnt count.He has not won four superbowls at all same way Barry Bonds is not the true all time home run king nor holds the record for the most home runs in a season since the one thing they both have in common is they are frauds that have disgraced both sports.

Remind us when he has 7 like Jimmy Johnson and Chad Knaus in the modern era.

how about when he wins his FIRST superbowl.lol

In all walks of life and in all sorts of professional and amateur sports cheating is looked upon with a jaundiced eye and the cheater loses his/hers/its prize. The NFL celebrates the cheater...That is what has seeped into society and one reason why we have participation trophies and PC attitudes.

sad but true.

a big concern in my area with the children's football team and the message Brady, Belicheat and the Patriots are spending out. the fact is Brady is not the best at anything except cheating

 

[Montrovant]

You’re right. He’s not responsible for it but if he had started his career in 1980 instead of 2000, he’d be facing the following:

Defensive backs who could get away with MUCH more in terms of coverage, stick-um, and defensive units that had much more freedom to decapitate the QB. Consider this. In 1980, the total number of passes was 13,705. And there was 627 interceptions.
In 2016, there was nearly 5,000 more pass attempts made by NFL quarterbacks but over 200 fewer interceptions.
Some of this increase in passing is due to expansion and new/replacement teams in Jacksonville, Carolina, Houston and Cleveland but it would stand to reason that the dilution of QBs (it being a far more complex position) would lead to more interceptions, not fewer. Also, it would stand to reason that the field being the same size, the athletes being bagger, stronger, and faster would mean more interceptions etc…

Year PA INT
2016 18298 415
2006 16389 520
1996 15966 542
1986 14469 581
1980 13705 627

Put another way, In 1980, when Joe Montana started making his name…there were 28 teams. The Raiders had 35 interceptions as a team. The Saints had the fewest with 12. In the pass happy 2016 season with about 5,000 more passes, the KC Chiefs lead the league with 18 INTs…6 teams had 10 or fewer grabs.

Clearly, the league favors passers more now than ever before; or at least in recent history.

Brady has been assisted by the expansion more than most as well. Three of the new franchises that found their way into the league are AFC teams, Houston, Cleveland and Jacksonville.

Houston is a -28 on 106 wins and 134 losses
Cleveland (who has NEVER won more than 10 games since reinstatement) is apparently -200 with 88 wins and 200 losses
Jacksonville are a -42: 155-197-0

You think Brady/NE has done well against these guys? You’re right 7 and 0 against the Jags, 6 and 1 against the Texans and 7 and 2 against the Browns (since 1999). Of course, expansion has a tendency to lower the barriers for entry. One could argue that he, a 6th round choice, benefitted from it as well. If the Jags, Panthers, and Browns not been there, 18 more players would have been on the board when Brady was selected…who is to say whether the Patriots had one of them ahead. Further…the AFC east competition for the Patriots has not exactly been a model of consistency. Miami has had 8 coaches since 2000, so has Buffalo. The Gents have had 5. Presumably, that is 21 different playbook, 21 different philosophies, lord knows how many different GMs, PPDs, and coordinators.

Again, let me stress, none of this is something that benefits Brady directly. It’s simply the environment he has prospered in and every other QB had essentially the same opportunity. Brady is great but it is hard to find another QB that has benefitted as much from the environment as TB—or one that has mercilessly dispatched his foes.

I try to avoid comparing statistics between era's. The game has changed significantly

I don't see any benefit from expansion. You still have to finish at the top of the heap....which Brady has done repeatedly
Montana had to beat 27 other teams, Brady had to beat 31 other teams (Vince Lombardi's Packers only had to beat 13 other teams)

So if you can't really compare statistics you have to look at:
Did they win championships?
Did they come up big in the clutch?

Both Brady and Montana did both. I give Brady a slight edge now, and hands down if he beats the Falcons

Brady and Montana have the same number of Super Bowl wins. Montana never lost a SB. I'm not sure how, by your stated metric, that would put Brady ahead. Montana would seem to be more "clutch" based on winning percentage in the big game and stats (no INT in his 4 SBs).

Either one of them are perfectly valid to argue as the best of the SB era.

So...let me get this straight

Montana gets credit for not even making it through the playoffs? He may have lost in the first round...but at least he didn't lose the Superbowl

No. I'm saying that if coming up big in the clutch is the deciding factor, Montana was better in the clutch. The ultimate expression of coming up big in the clutch would be play in the Super Bowl. Montana was better in his SB appearances than Brady. Montana never lost. Montana's worst QB rating in a SB was 100. Brady only bettered that twice, once by only 0.5. Montana never threw an INT in a SB. In the biggest game, Montana was pretty much the definition of clutch. Brady has been less so.

I don't consider looking just at Super Bowls to be an accurate way to judge a quarterback's career, but I'm going by the two criteria you stated.

You could also argue, using your criteria, that Terry Bradshaw was a better QB than Brady. Bradshaw also won 4 Super Bowls, and he had a better playoff win % than Brady, at .737 to .727.

I think SB wins and even playoff performances are only part of the picture when looking at a quarterback's career. Dan Marino never won a SB and I think he is rightly considered one of the greatest QBs ever. Peyton Manning was no better than an average playoff and SB QB, but he also should be considered when talking about the greatest ever. Trent Dilfer won a SB, but he most certainly should not be.

I have no problem with someone calling Brady the best of the SB era. For myself, I'm still on the fence about it.

How do you know how Joe Montana would have performed in the superbowls HE NEVER MADE? If he was clutch he would have been in those Superbowls those years. He wasn't. How are you going to give him credit for only making 4 superbowls. It's like you are punishing Brady for making it to 3 superbowls and losing. Had he got knocked out in the first round or 2nd round that would have been better?

Obviously I don't know how Montana would have performed in other Super Bowls. My point is to look at the Super Bowls he was actually in and compare that to the Super Bowls Brady was in. Montana was better in his Super Bowl appearances than Brady was in his. That's not saying Brady was bad at all. It's more pointing out how incredibly successful Montana was when he got to the big game.

If you want to define clutch as winning playoff games, Brady edges out Montana. Brady has played in more and has a better winning percentage in the playoffs. However, when it comes to the most important game in football, Montana was the definition of clutch. He could dominate and he could engineer a comeback, and he always led his team to victory when it counted the most.

As I said, I understand perfectly why Brady would be thought of as the greatest SB-era quarterback. The thought has crossed my mind more than once that he may be the best. He is not, however, the greatest SB performing quarterback amongst those who played in more than 1 SB.

 

[rightwinger]

Guys like Marino, Peyton and even Dan Fouts were great Fantasy Football QBs and put up great numbers. But when considering the GOAT, you gotta have some rings
Peyton won two rings but was not terribly impressive in either win. He is more remembered for getting to the playoffs with one of the best records in the league and then losing at home

I loved Joe Montana, one of the most clutch QBs ever. Even at Notre Dame, he had heart and would not quit. The game was never over as long as Joe had the ball and there was time on the clock
Brady has the same type of mentality. I just think that over the years, and he is now 40, he has eclipsed Montana

So by that rationalization…wouldn’t Robert Horry be considered a “greater” player than Magic Johnson? Magic only has 5 rings; Horry has seven.

Magic Johnson was the "QB" of his team
Horry? Not so much

 

[Mac1958]

I used to think Joe Montana was the greatest ever, but I'm wondering if Tom Brady is the best.

What do you think?

Yeah, I grew up in the Bay Area and I've always been a Montana guy.

But damn, I have to admit....
.

 

[candycorn]

Guys like Marino, Peyton and even Dan Fouts were great Fantasy Football QBs and put up great numbers. But when considering the GOAT, you gotta have some rings
Peyton won two rings but was not terribly impressive in either win. He is more remembered for getting to the playoffs with one of the best records in the league and then losing at home

I loved Joe Montana, one of the most clutch QBs ever. Even at Notre Dame, he had heart and would not quit. The game was never over as long as Joe had the ball and there was time on the clock
Brady has the same type of mentality. I just think that over the years, and he is now 40, he has eclipsed Montana

So by that rationalization…wouldn’t Robert Horry be considered a “greater” player than Magic Johnson? Magic only has 5 rings; Horry has seven.

Magic Johnson was the "QB" of his team
Horry? Not so much

Okay, then he’s “greater” than Kareem, Worthy, EJ, etc…

 

[ChrisL]

It's kind of hard to compare a QB from a completely different time in football, like Bradshaw, to our modern day QBs, like Brady. For one thing, they didn't have salary caps and things were run and structured much differently back in the day. There were also different rules in the game and less games per season, I believe.

 

[ChrisL]

I'm sure everyone already knows how I voted . . . YES!

Jealousy rears it's ugly head in this thread. Its funny. Especially because it goes on and on and on.

I am so looking forward to the SB! I'm going to a party and I am going to celebrate bigly!

 

[Papageorgio]

I used to think Joe Montana was the greatest ever, but I'm wondering if Tom Brady is the best.

What do you think?

After they started cheating? Or before?

And how do you count the Seahawks game when NE was beaten but the Seattle coach choked?

Brady gave the Pats the lead and Seattle fails to win the game and that is on Brady? The Hawks caught a miracle pass and then threw an interception. Brady rallied the team in the 4th quarter to put them into the lead.

Brady did what he had to do and the defense did what they needed to do.

That said, Montana is the greatest of all time.

 

[Papageorgio]

There are 3 greatest quarterbacks of all time with 4 Superbowls each Brady, Montana and Bradshaw. If he wins this one, Brady is number one.

Don't people give jim kelly a lot of credit just for making it to 4 superbowls and losing them? OK, now consider if Brady loses that will be 3 times he lost a Superbowl?

So wouldn't you say a QB who made it to 3 superbowls and lost them was pretty damn good? So even if you took away bradys 4 superbowl wins you would admit he's pretty damn good. How many men have been to 3 superbowls? Not many. He's either going to be 4 wins 3 loses or 5 wins 2 loses. Either way that's a lot more winning than anyone else. I'd rather have bradys career than anyone elses

Brady is going to his seventh Superbowl and has been to eleven AFC Championship games and 33 total playoff games

Quite a career

You’re right. He’s not responsible for it but if he had started his career in 1980 instead of 2000, he’d be facing the following:

Defensive backs who could get away with MUCH more in terms of coverage, stick-um, and defensive units that had much more freedom to decapitate the QB. Consider this. In 1980, the total number of passes was 13,705. And there was 627 interceptions.
In 2016, there was nearly 5,000 more pass attempts made by NFL quarterbacks but over 200 fewer interceptions.
Some of this increase in passing is due to expansion and new/replacement teams in Jacksonville, Carolina, Houston and Cleveland but it would stand to reason that the dilution of QBs (it being a far more complex position) would lead to more interceptions, not fewer. Also, it would stand to reason that the field being the same size, the athletes being bagger, stronger, and faster would mean more interceptions etc…

Year PA INT
2016 18298 415
2006 16389 520
1996 15966 542
1986 14469 581
1980 13705 627

Put another way, In 1980, when Joe Montana started making his name…there were 28 teams. The Raiders had 35 interceptions as a team. The Saints had the fewest with 12. In the pass happy 2016 season with about 5,000 more passes, the KC Chiefs lead the league with 18 INTs…6 teams had 10 or fewer grabs.

Clearly, the league favors passers more now than ever before; or at least in recent history.

Brady has been assisted by the expansion more than most as well. Three of the new franchises that found their way into the league are AFC teams, Houston, Cleveland and Jacksonville.

Houston is a -28 on 106 wins and 134 losses
Cleveland (who has NEVER won more than 10 games since reinstatement) is apparently -200 with 88 wins and 200 losses
Jacksonville are a -42: 155-197-0

You think Brady/NE has done well against these guys? You’re right 7 and 0 against the Jags, 6 and 1 against the Texans and 7 and 2 against the Browns (since 1999). Of course, expansion has a tendency to lower the barriers for entry. One could argue that he, a 6th round choice, benefitted from it as well. If the Jags, Panthers, and Browns not been there, 18 more players would have been on the board when Brady was selected…who is to say whether the Patriots had one of them ahead. Further…the AFC east competition for the Patriots has not exactly been a model of consistency. Miami has had 8 coaches since 2000, so has Buffalo. The Gents have had 5. Presumably, that is 21 different playbook, 21 different philosophies, lord knows how many different GMs, PPDs, and coordinators.

Again, let me stress, none of this is something that benefits Brady directly. It’s simply the environment he has prospered in and every other QB had essentially the same opportunity. Brady is great but it is hard to find another QB that has benefitted as much from the environment as TB—or one that has mercilessly dispatched his foes.

I try to avoid comparing statistics between era's. The game has changed significantly

I don't see any benefit from expansion. You still have to finish at the top of the heap....which Brady has done repeatedly
Montana had to beat 27 other teams, Brady had to beat 31 other teams (Vince Lombardi's Packers only had to beat 13 other teams)

So if you can't really compare statistics you have to look at:
Did they win championships?
Did they come up big in the clutch?

Both Brady and Montana did both. I give Brady a slight edge now, and hands down if he beats the Falcons

So if Manning played for New England under Belichick, would he have won more championships.

 

[sealybobo]

There are 3 greatest quarterbacks of all time with 4 Superbowls each Brady, Montana and Bradshaw. If he wins this one, Brady is number one.

Don't people give jim kelly a lot of credit just for making it to 4 superbowls and losing them? OK, now consider if Brady loses that will be 3 times he lost a Superbowl?

So wouldn't you say a QB who made it to 3 superbowls and lost them was pretty damn good? So even if you took away bradys 4 superbowl wins you would admit he's pretty damn good. How many men have been to 3 superbowls? Not many. He's either going to be 4 wins 3 loses or 5 wins 2 loses. Either way that's a lot more winning than anyone else. I'd rather have bradys career than anyone elses

Brady is going to his seventh Superbowl and has been to eleven AFC Championship games and 33 total playoff games

Quite a career

You’re right. He’s not responsible for it but if he had started his career in 1980 instead of 2000, he’d be facing the following:

Defensive backs who could get away with MUCH more in terms of coverage, stick-um, and defensive units that had much more freedom to decapitate the QB. Consider this. In 1980, the total number of passes was 13,705. And there was 627 interceptions.
In 2016, there was nearly 5,000 more pass attempts made by NFL quarterbacks but over 200 fewer interceptions.
Some of this increase in passing is due to expansion and new/replacement teams in Jacksonville, Carolina, Houston and Cleveland but it would stand to reason that the dilution of QBs (it being a far more complex position) would lead to more interceptions, not fewer. Also, it would stand to reason that the field being the same size, the athletes being bagger, stronger, and faster would mean more interceptions etc…

Year PA INT
2016 18298 415
2006 16389 520
1996 15966 542
1986 14469 581
1980 13705 627

Put another way, In 1980, when Joe Montana started making his name…there were 28 teams. The Raiders had 35 interceptions as a team. The Saints had the fewest with 12. In the pass happy 2016 season with about 5,000 more passes, the KC Chiefs lead the league with 18 INTs…6 teams had 10 or fewer grabs.

Clearly, the league favors passers more now than ever before; or at least in recent history.

Brady has been assisted by the expansion more than most as well. Three of the new franchises that found their way into the league are AFC teams, Houston, Cleveland and Jacksonville.

Houston is a -28 on 106 wins and 134 losses
Cleveland (who has NEVER won more than 10 games since reinstatement) is apparently -200 with 88 wins and 200 losses
Jacksonville are a -42: 155-197-0

You think Brady/NE has done well against these guys? You’re right 7 and 0 against the Jags, 6 and 1 against the Texans and 7 and 2 against the Browns (since 1999). Of course, expansion has a tendency to lower the barriers for entry. One could argue that he, a 6th round choice, benefitted from it as well. If the Jags, Panthers, and Browns not been there, 18 more players would have been on the board when Brady was selected…who is to say whether the Patriots had one of them ahead. Further…the AFC east competition for the Patriots has not exactly been a model of consistency. Miami has had 8 coaches since 2000, so has Buffalo. The Gents have had 5. Presumably, that is 21 different playbook, 21 different philosophies, lord knows how many different GMs, PPDs, and coordinators.

Again, let me stress, none of this is something that benefits Brady directly. It’s simply the environment he has prospered in and every other QB had essentially the same opportunity. Brady is great but it is hard to find another QB that has benefitted as much from the environment as TB—or one that has mercilessly dispatched his foes.

I try to avoid comparing statistics between era's. The game has changed significantly

I don't see any benefit from expansion. You still have to finish at the top of the heap....which Brady has done repeatedly
Montana had to beat 27 other teams, Brady had to beat 31 other teams (Vince Lombardi's Packers only had to beat 13 other teams)

So if you can't really compare statistics you have to look at:
Did they win championships?
Did they come up big in the clutch?

Both Brady and Montana did both. I give Brady a slight edge now, and hands down if he beats the Falcons

So if Manning played for New England under Belichick, would he have won more championships.

We will never know. Manning fans will argue but no comparison I'd rather be brady

 

[Dr Grump]

Who the fuck is Tom Brady? There's a Greg, Bobby and Peter Brady. Even a Mike. But Tom?

 

[rightwinger]

Guys like Marino, Peyton and even Dan Fouts were great Fantasy Football QBs and put up great numbers. But when considering the GOAT, you gotta have some rings
Peyton won two rings but was not terribly impressive in either win. He is more remembered for getting to the playoffs with one of the best records in the league and then losing at home

I loved Joe Montana, one of the most clutch QBs ever. Even at Notre Dame, he had heart and would not quit. The game was never over as long as Joe had the ball and there was time on the clock
Brady has the same type of mentality. I just think that over the years, and he is now 40, he has eclipsed Montana

So by that rationalization…wouldn’t Robert Horry be considered a “greater” player than Magic Johnson? Magic only has 5 rings; Horry has seven.

Magic Johnson was the "QB" of his team
Horry? Not so much

Okay, then he’s “greater” than Kareem, Worthy, EJ, etc…

MJ

 

[rightwinger]

Who the fuck is Tom Brady? There's a Greg, Bobby and Peter Brady. Even a Mike. But Tom?

Tom Brady was the kid who said.......I'm too cool to appear on this stupid show